cure for autism?

[proud2BlibKansan]

Tests reveal 'trust in a bottle' hormone

Finding could offer benefits but also opportunity for abuse

Wednesday, June 1, 2005 Posted: 6:07 PM EDT (2207 GMT)

(AP) -- Swiss and American scientists say they have successfully manipulated subjects in an experiment to take risks they might not otherwise take by giving them a squirt of the hormone oxytocin to stimulate trusting behavior.

Their finding could have beneficial applications in treating mental disorders, but they acknowledge the possibility of abuse.

"Of course, this finding could be misused," said Ernst Fehr of the University of Zurich, the senior researcher in the study, which appears in Thursday's issue of the journal Nature. "I don't think we currently have such abuses. However, in the future it could happen."

Other scientists say the research raises important questions about oxytocin's potential as a therapy for conditions like autism, in which trust is diminished.

more

http://www.cnn.com/2005/HEALTH/06/01/trust.hormone.ap/index.html

[Demeter]

1. Not Even Close

After reading this article and refering to my 22 years of living with an autistically impaired child, I have to say that the usefulness if any of this hormone is unproven as well as unlikely. Autism is a description, like rheumatism. There are so many symptoms that fall into that catchall term, not all of which manifest in each sufferer, and for which no cause has been conclusively found.

While this hormone may provide some relief to some symptom, it constitutes no cure. Stem cells have a better chance, if applied early to repair or replace the damaged structures of the nervous system. Genetic therapy (once the causes have been confirmed) is another likely source of cure. But this is not the silver bullet. I doubt that autism has a silver bullet, though, going by the stunt my daughter just pulled, I sure wish it had.

[proud2BlibKansan]

3. I was pretty surprised

when my local TV news opened up this story with this tease. Thanks for your response. I agree but I don't live with an autistic person. So I don't have the voice of authority you do.

I do think this drug may help relieve some of the negative behaviors but is it a cure? I doubt it.

[Karenina]

29. I got a kid with it...

and these companies can STUFF their DRUGS up their asses. Our kids are NOT guinea pigs.

[proud2BlibKansan]

36. Amen to that

What I find sad is many horrific emotional disorders can be treated and managed well with drugs. But we have gone way overboard with medication.

[In_The_Wind]

2. once again doctors are only treating the symptom not the cause

This is only treating an obvious symptom of autism not the true cause of the behavior.

[proud2BlibKansan]

4. But if it works

it could be a great help to autistics. Insulin doesn't cure diabetes but it sure prevents a lot of problems.

[In_The_Wind]

11. I'm all for help from the medical community but we should exercise caution

I've read reports that some cases of autism have been caused by childhood vaccinations.


I have friends who are special ed teachers. I think they are some of the most compassionate, wonderful people I've been lucky enough to know. Without them so many special needs children would never be mainstreamed.

Some of the sweetest people I've known were Aspies. Of course I would like to see them have a life with less problems when there is help.

[Name removed]

23. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[proud2BlibKansan]

35. The vaccine link is interesting

Many parents swear that was the cause of their child's autism. But research can't make a connection. The most popular theory links mercury in the vaccines to autism. Now mercury is being taken out. Interesting since the drug companies that make the vaccines swear there is no connection to autism. One of those things that make you go hmmmm.

[Birthmark]

5. Others have pointed out that this is no cure.

So I'll move on to a more interesting question that my wife and I have discussed recently, regarding our own teen-age austistic son. The question is, "Would it be morally right to 'cure' our son at this stage?" He already has a personality. Do we have the right to inflict a new one on him just becuase it would make our lives somewhat easier; or even in the belief that it would make his life better in some way?

IMPORTANT NOTE: Our son is a very high-functioning autistic. So I probably have more leeway to consider this type of question than those whose autistic loved ones suffer more severe symptoms.

[proud2BlibKansan]

6. As a special ed teacher

I say yes, anything we can do to improve the quality of life should be done.

[Birthmark]

7. I think in most cases, you are right.

But I think in the cases of the high-functioning, I'm not so sure. Do they get a say in what happens to them? At what point do we the draw the line?

EDIT: By the way, special ed teachers have my gratitude and respect. My son has had several teachers that were instrumental in his development and have benefitted him (and his parents) tremendously. Thanks for your hard work! :)

[proud2BlibKansan]

8. I can't help but think of

deaf children and cochlear implants. I am shocked by the members of the deaf community who oppose the implants. They also point to 'high functioning' deaf persons who communicate well with sign language.

I think we could be headed down the same path if we oppose treating autistics.

[Birthmark]

9. Don't get me wrong. I don't oppose it.

I just think that in some cases it may not be as simple as saying, "Okay, he's autistic. Let's cure him!" I'm mainly talking about autistics that are already high functioning and adults or older teens. Certainly, I'd want to see any younger autistic children cured if possible.

[proud2BlibKansan]

10. I understand your point

but let me ask you this: If something could be done to improve your child's quality of life, increase his level of functioning and independence, would you oppose it?

Both of my kids are ADHD. I realize this is not the same as autism, but if they could have a treatment that repaired their brains, I would be all for it. They are both independent adults and I don't worry too much about the negative effects of ADHD anymore. But the idea of eliminating it entirely is too tempting to resist.

[Divernan]

12. You love your son the way he is now, and change does not appeal to you.

However,would you trade places with your son? Would you give up the life you've led, to lead his life? If he could have the opportunity to go to college, date, marry, have his own family, wouldn't he have a fuller life? Who among us would choose to be autistic, even high functioning, given the choice?

Sadly, this is an academic argument for now.

In your situation, if your son is high functioning, he is probably either living with you, or in a group home, and possibly holding down a job which gives him satisfaction. I have worked closely with families of adult autistic children. For those families like yours, there can be very mutually loving relationships. The rough part comes as the parents age and have no one trustworthy willing to become guardian, when the parents die or are too frail to handle all the responsibility.

[Feron]

14. I am an Aspie

and if given the choice i would stay this way. True i am different from what is considered "normal" ,but that doesn't mean that i lead any less of a rich life. It is a false assumption that a child diagnosed with Asperger's will never marry, have a career, go to college, etc. Some of us cannot do those things ,but that doesn't mean that their lives are by default unhappy and empty. Parents need to stop living vicariously through their children.

I can understand why deaf parents would not want to give their child cochlear implants. Society teaches that you must conform to this idea of perfect; however if you don't match it, then you are broken and must be fixed. Autistics and deaf people aren't broken, just different. How boring it would be if everyone were the same!

Anyway, the only real cure for autism would be abortion. An autistic brain is physically hardwired differently than a normal one. While therapies may help improve function, there will never be a magic pill.

In summary, "Do not fear what you do not understand."

Here's a link that some might be interested in: http://www.aspiesforfreedom.org/

[proud2BlibKansan]

20. I cannot imagine why a parent would ever refuse

cochlear implants for their deaf child. That is just crazy to me.

But I do understand why an adult would not want them and I understand why an adult Aspie would want to stay that way.

[proud2BlibKansan]

21. Thanks for the kind words

We don't hear them often enough.

[Demeter]

13. I Truly Doubt That Your "Personality" Would Change From A

true cure--you would just gain added functionality, and lose a lot of stresss and anxiety. The trouble with today's purported "cures" is that they aren't. They do want to bend the personality to cover up the brain disfunction--if they cannot directly train the brain.

[bloom]

33. I was thinking recently

about my daughter who can have a 4.0 in college majoring in Mathematics - but with limited social skills and her cousin who has always had great social skills - but who is flunking out.

People have posted polls about this in the past - if you had to choose - what would you choose - academic or social skills?

Of course it would nice to have both. Not everybody does though. I guess we just make the best of it.

If I could make things like interactions for her easier I would - but you always to know - at what price?

[ProfessorGAC]

15. I Have A Republican Cure For Autism

Ignore it. Let 'em die.

That ought to do it.
The Professor

[KamaAina]

16. Like most things repuke, it won't work

We do not have a shortened life expectancy. Some of us have been trying to hammer this point home to agencies such as Autism Socety of America, which focuses heavily on services for children and then acts as though we fall off the edge of the earth when we turn 21.

[ProfessorGAC]

17. Why Do You Hate America?

I'm really a repuke mole infiltrating you heathens and traitors. Believe that?
The Professor

[KamaAina]

18. I'm not convinced that not 'trusting' is a symptom of autism

The experiment didn't measure how the subjects given oxytocin interacted with other people, merely how suggestible they were to offers of money management, etc.

For the record, I am a preson with autism, and I do try to avoid suggestibility to ads (especially telemarketers and infomercials!) whenever possible. The scientific thing to do at this point would be to stick a bottle of oxytocin up my nose and see what happens -- but I've got news: ain't happenin'!

[proud2BlibKansan]

37. The few autistic kids I have worked with

had trouble forming bonds and communicating. They were very difficult to build trust with. So I can understand the trust connection. I don't know if I would call lack of trust a symptom but it does seem to be a common characteristic.

[MN ChimpH8R]

19. I too am an Aspie

I got a double whammy - gifted and Aspergers. The first was discovered early in life because I was so precocious; I didn't get an Asperger's diagnosis until three months ago - in my mid 40s. For me, life has been a very mixed bag. I had no academic problems - though I hated school and dropped out when I was 15 because I couldn't deal with the social end of school. I eventually wound up going to college, where I was a Phi Beta Kappa, and attended an Ivy League law school, where I did very well.

However, with my complete lack of social intuition I was never able to hold a permanent job in the legal profession, which is intensely social, at least in private practice. I have only been successful working as a law clerk to judges, where I only have to deal with a handful of people and have a lot of autonomy.

I have been an "oddball" and a loner my whole life. I have never had a date, much less a relationship, because I don't understand body language, eye contact or being social for its own sake. I can only communicate openly to people I have known for a long time and can trust and I tend to be brutally honest and frank. Asking me to go up to someone I don't know, introduce myself and make small talk is like asking me to speak fluent Japanese - I don't even have a clue of where to look for a clue. I deal with everything hyper-rationally - like Spock or Data - and don't have emotional responses to much of anything but purely aesthetic experiences like music and film or abstract issues like politics.

Therapy has helped, but there are clear limits on what I will be able to overcome. I've known I was "different" since I was a small boy, and if there had been something to lessen the effects of Aspergers on me I would have been all for trying it. But Aspergers was only recognized about 10 years ago by the US mental health establishment.

I don't know whether I'd want to try something like this or not. Not because I like my life as it is, because it is at best something to be tolerated, but more because of the fear of change. I am used to the way I am, even though I am very alone. Aspergers and autism are, recall, neurological conditions having to do with brain "wiring" - they are not psychological. Neither are they something that can be "cured" like the flu or a broken leg.

Wow, was that ever an Aspie sounding post. :P

[faithnotgreed]

22. hi MN

i have studied a bit about aspergers as i have a loved one who has it. i know exactly what youre saying when someone wants you to small talk or do the socializing that society or family expects is usually quite difficult.

your post was plain spoken and engaging. didnt sound like aspergers at all! just teasing of course

and i find this article stating they have a possible cure for autism to be ridiculous. there are many symptoms and making someone more trusting wouldnt cure much of anything

were glad youre here... keep posting.

[MN ChimpH8R]

24. Thanks for the kind words

:blush: :toast:

I really enjoy DU and wish I'd found it sooner. But ya won't get me away now.:)

[faithnotgreed]

26. glad to hear it! i dont know your interests but your screen name alone

means you should fit in everywhere here

[bloom]

34. I think there are a lot

of Aspies around. Some may not know it. :)

I may be one - or not - I share a lot of the characteristics. I've investigated it a lot because of my daughter.

:hi:

[EFerrari]

30. A very fine Aspie sounding post.

Beth, wife to a very fine Aspie. :hi:

[ultraist]

31. Welcome to DU MN!

:hi:

[TrogL]

25. I'm too trusting as it is

I'm an Aspie and I often get out-maneuvered by socializers into trusting people whom I shouldn't.

I just got off the phone with a bill-collector who conned me out of agreeing to pay $600 dollars.

[dogday]

27. I have an Autistic Sister who is 45 Years Old and She Is My Best

Friend. When she was born, she never cried, she was 5 when they finally potty trained her. She could not speak until the age of 14 when she just started talking, she made alot of improvement at that point.

She has always lived at my Father's and she was always in her room tapping. She has to stay busy doing something. My Dad found a wonderful Group Home for her and now she works and live with others just like her and she is doing great.

She is my best Friend and I don't think I would want her to change, I don't know if she would want it or not, but could ask her and find out.

Thanks for the post on this!

[Deja Q]

28. Autistics, et al, are fine. Our "society" is the one at fault.

Don't change us by doping us with chemicals that fuck with our minds.

Change society to make life reasonable. Don't kill us to fit your environment. Not when you claim to be a "culture of life".

[bloom]

32. There is a post in LBN about treating autism

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1518642

Treating autism 'right the first time'

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/medicalnews.php?newsid=25494

"Autism therapy is bedeviled by unpredictable outcomes. Even with the best behavioral treatments, which are the only ones to have been scientifically demonstrated to work - says Laura Schreibman, professor of psychology and director of the Autism Research Program at the University of California, San Diego - some children improve dramatically, some only somewhat and others not at all....
----

Though it seems to only apply to young children.

I think the oxytocin trust test was interesting - seems to only apply to direct contact with people. It's difficult to know the ramifications. Seems worth testing - just to see - people who don't mind being guinea pigs - that is.

And like TrogL mentioned - more "trust" may not be "better" for everybody.

[proud2BlibKansan]

38. I don't know

As a teacher, the first thing I do is build trust. If the kids don't trust me they are much harder to teach. The most difficult kids I work with are the autistic kids because they are so hard to establish relationships with.

So I think the ability to trust would change things pretty dramatically for autistic kids at school.