"Choose Life - Your Mother Did"

[demgurl]

I saw this on your mini-van (in NC yesterday). I can only imagine you did not mean to be cruel or offensive but I would love to address your bumper sticker.

There are so many things I could say to you and I wish to do so calmly so I do not offend you. First of all, there are many people who wish their parents had not made that choice. There are actually times when I wish my Mom had not made that choice as well. It is a mute point because if she had, I would not be here and would not even know about her 'choice'. Fine I am here and am enjoying life but as a fetus, I would not have known what was going on and merely just ceased to exist.

On a more personal level, you must know my mother. When I saw your bumper sticker I immediately thought of that old tune "Killing Me Softly". To make a personal statement as you did, you must know my Mom and that she truly did choose life.

A few years ago my Mom gave me a gift of a book. The book was titled "To My Daughter, With Love". It is printed with all sorts of questions for your Mom to answer so that you can truly get to know her better. It is a neat book and my Mom answered every one of the questions. For instance, on page 40 it asks "My truly private thoughts:".Here is the answer she gave: "was to grow up and leave home (my Mom's place as she took me home at 12 years old).

Page 41 continued this answer when the question was asked, "My deepest, darkest secret:". She answered "Even if I had to get pregnant, I would - just to get away."

See, some people will get pregnant to just get away. They may not love the child and since that is a tool to get away from their family adoption is not an option. SOME UNWANTED PREGNANCIES ARE NOT UNPLANNED!

What does all of this have to do with abortion you may ask. My Mom did not have an abortion so this should be of no concern to me. Wrong! This has to do with choosing life - what my Mom did. You are right, my Mom chose life, just not for me. I was always an afterthought for my Mom. She got divorced and was a single Mom from the time I was 4. Luckily we had a ton of pushover relatives that my Mom could aptly use for babysitters as she furthered her social life. Yes, she chose life and quite an active one at that. She chose a social life.

Yes, my Mom was quite the role model. I remember when she went to a meeting and left her boyfriend to babysit me. I still remember her boyfriend pulling on the shirt collar and trying to peer in while saying how much I had grown and to let him take a peek. I told Mom soon as she got home and to her credit she did throw him out. Of course, she did keep those naked photos of her and him. The photos I found about three years later of my would be abuser and my naked mother. It is abhorrent what he would have done if he could but not so much to get rid of those wonderful picture keepsakes of their relationship.

And, of course, there was the time my Uncle came on to me. It took me six years to convince her it happened and she only gave in because I had a couple of friends in the room and that would be the socially correct thing to do in front of them. My Uncle, of course, denied it and Mom stuck by him! I then said I could produce a witness. When she went back to him he went from saying it NEVER happened, to saying that IF it had it was all a misunderstanding. This from a guy who said he wished we were alone in a bar in Montreal and me in my black leather boots. I told him I am his niece and he said he was lonely!!! I pressed her that I would get my witness so he would have to fess up and even though my friends were there she finally snapped at me and said, "I will probably never speak to my brother again, isn't that enough for you?"

Oh I could go on and on about stories of my mother but I was in a great mood before I started to write this. The way my mother chose (her own) life, I may as well have been put up for adoption or aborted. Right now I am in the middle of a lawsuit against my mother. My family all started it against her (ten of them) and then they finally convinced me to join. I have now done the reverse of what some people do. I have aborted a living breathing human being from my life. A person who was so toxic that it could have only poisoned me and those around me. My 'mother' chose her life and I chose her death from my life anyway.

To the person with the bumper sticker on her car : You could not have been more right when you said my mother chose life. By aborting her, I have now also chosen life.

[NMDemDist2]

1. wow

:hug:

[demgurl]

19. Thanks , AZ.

[mcscajun]

2. Wow. A courageous post.

Thanks for sharing.

:hug:

[demgurl]

20. Thank you, cajun.

[jmm]

3. Whenever I see that bumper sticker I think

choose is the key word. My mother had opinions to choose from but the idiots who put that on their cars want move back wards more than twenty five years and deny me those same options.

[Dawgs]

5. Exactly, it's hard to tell whether this person is pro-choice...

or anti-choice.

[DoYouEverWonder]

4. Too bad god didn't

My mother had three miscarriages and I've had two.

Did you know that 50% of all pregnancies end in miscarriage? I guess god just don't think life is so sacred or he'd have designed us to have a better success rate.

[demgurl]

24. DoYou....

I am sorry for your losses. I have never had a miscarriage but my sister-in-law had three herself. I know it is very hard. That is one of the reasons my husband and I waited so long to announce our pregnancy. We read most miscarriages occur in the first three months and we could not deal with the pain of announcing our pregnancy to everyone and then going through such a loss. My thoughts are with you.

[DemBones DemBones]

6. I'm sorry for your pain. I hope you are

receiving counseling.

[demgurl]

13. Thanks Dembones, but no.

I have never had a day of counseling in my life. Eventually I should and my husband encourages it saying I have so many issues from my Mom but he also says he is amazed at how well adjusted I turned out. The hardest part is getting through the lawsuit against her right now. My Great Uncle died about 2 1/2 years ago and for some unknown reason he left my Mom in charge of the estate. Before he died my Mom had problems and people were suing her for money. Since he died she has gone on two cruises and bought a $70,000 convertible! By the way, the rest of us have yet to see a dime from the estate.

[Yupster]

7. Wow -- so much pain

I hope you're doing well and receiving all the help that you need.

Best wishes.

[demgurl]

14. Yupster....

I will get help eventually but I wish these people would just leave the choice to the people who want it. We will not force them to do anything, why do they insist on having someone's body changed physically for nine months and then psychologically for who knows how long. People should not force their beliefs on other people especially when they are trying to make their beliefs law. Everyone that comes into this world does not have a Mary Poppins upbringing.

[kineneb]

8. well, so did my mom, but...

we never bonded. My dearly departed grandparents raised me, for which I am extremely greatful. If I had lived with my mother and stepfather, I would have probably killed myself in my teens. I have overcome a lot of anger and am friends with my parents, but I will never be as close to them as I was to my grandparents.

Hang in there. Sometimes you have to "divorce" your toxic parents, because they Really Were Not Parents.

And Papa - I miss you. Happy Fathers' Day.

[demgurl]

15. kineneb, hugs to you.

I am so sorry you miss your Papa. I am sure he is with you in spirit. It is truly wonderful that your grandparents were there for you.

[Warren DeMontague]

9. Actually, my mom met me in DC last year for the big pro-choice march

along with several other members of our extended family.

[demgurl]

16. impeach, it is all about choice and you and your Mom ...

make that clear together. It is great that she would go to these events with you and fight for women's rights.

[Warren DeMontague]

28. We had three generations there. And, BTW, I'm a man.

I do consider abortion a woman's right in that it involves her body and is ultimately a decision between her and her doctor, however, I also frame reproductive and other privacy rights in a larger, non gender specific context. Women certainly bear the brunt of the agenda that the control freaks and religious right crowd wish to impose, but it reaches into everyone's privacy and personal lives- men, women, gays, straights, everyone.

Fighting against the forces that would tell consenting adults what they can or cannot do with their own bodies is everyone's battle.

I was very proud to be a part of that march.

[demgurl]

32. Good to have men on our side, impeach.

Your Mom raised a great man. I really respect the way you think and am happy you are on our side. Thank you.

[supernova]

10. So sorry for all your troubles, demgurl

:hug:

I hope you can find peace at some point.

[demgurl]

17. Thanks, supernove, I have already found some peace.

I have a wonderful husband that I was best friends with for EIGHTEEN years before marrying! I have two great kids. I have the best life. My Mom lives in a different country and if it were not for this lousy lawsuit, I would not even think of her at all. It does hurt when I have to find information for the lawyer and the hurt all sort of surfaces.

Right now I am hurt but I more pity my Mom than anything else. She has chosen a very materialistic lifestyle. Last year, in a a province in Canada, she put in a marble dance floor in her back yard! Yes, a place that is cold and snowy about six months out of the year and she puts in a dance floor in her back yard. Her friends are not real and when her money goes so shall they. She has managed to put a wedge between anyone left in our family since she has been withholding an estate from us and we believe she has embezzled money that should have gone to us.

I often think of her on holidays and how lonely it must be to not be called by your only daughter or your only two grandsons. How must it feel to wake up on Christmas morning with no family gifts even though your family is out there. She tries to fill her empty life with possessions. Sooner or later that just does not work any more. She has led her life in this way.

I have a husband who adores me. There has hardly been a single day since my children were born that they did not take an afternoon nap with me. We play, we have fun and we all love each other. Just as she created her life, I have created mine and I can not imagine a situation where I would be happier. I am a lucky person.

[brooklynite]

11. The irony of the "Choose Life" bumper stickers...

is that the people who have them almost never want you to be able to "choose"; they want to ban the choice completely.

[demgurl]

26. Brooklyn, I could not have said it better myself.

[bvar22]

12. Great add on sticker.

Choose LIFE.
Your Mother did.

Note under windshield:

The World would be better off
if your Mother had chosen differently.

[demgurl]

18. bvar, I told my husband the same thing.

we were talking about it last night and I said there are many people with whom we would be better off if their parents had not chosen life. You are so right.

[flvegan]

22. I LOVE your avatar.

Not much in line with the post, but I just wanted to say that. I'd like to see THAT on a bumper sticker.

[bvar22]

25. Thanks. I stole it from:

http://www.legitgov.org/peaceprotests.html

I had to use CorelDraw to make my own to reduce it to an avatar.

[flvegan]

31. Would you be offended if

I stole/borrowed it from you? I just changed over to Conyers, but I'd really like to use that one in the future.

[bvar22]

36. Help yourself.

I would love to see thousands of them everywhere.
ANYTHING that might help to recover our Democracy.
Thanks

[Toots]

21. SOME UNWANTED PREGNANCIES ARE NOT UNPLANNED!

Not a really good sound bite for Pro choice Movement. :shrug: Sounds like you could be saying some people want to get pregnant with the idea of aborting later.

[demgurl]

23. Toots...

Nah never meant that people would get pregnant with the idea of aborting later. What I meant was there are so many unwanted kids in the world that perhaps abortion would have been better for some of them. I am not sure anyone has ever gotten pregnant with the express purpose of getting an abortion later.

As someone who has had an abortion, I do believe choice is important but I found this bumper sticker about MY mom's choice was offensive. Just as I find my own mother's choice offensive. I always had the idea that I was such an inconvenience for her. You know, I once told her that my husband had been laid off and that I thought within two months we would be homeless. I was just sharing with her, I did not ask for help and nor did I hint. Her reply was that she did not have any extra money as she was spending $70,000 putting in a dance floor in her back yard. I really let her have it. I said the only thing I wanted to do was share some of my thoughts and worries and never asked her for a single dime. She stood there speechless and then asked what I would like her to say! Incredible.

If I am here I am here and I am making the best of the life I have. If she didn't want me she never should have gotten pregnant in the first place. And when she did get pregnant maybe she should have thought over whether she wanted the responsibilities of a child.

I am not suicidal and I enjoy my life very much so please do not get me wrong. Am I happy to be alive? Very much so. I love my husband and kids more than I ever thought possible. Do I think she should have not gotten pregnant or had an abortion?(in either case I would not be alive) Yes, I think having me was the wrong decision for her.

So the next time someone is 'pro-life' and they say to you that if your mom had an abortion you would not be alive, go ahead and honestly tell them that some folks are alive and happy but still feel their parents made the wrong decision. Whatever my mom did, she made a choice and that is something that should not be taken from any of us.

[progressivebydesign]

27. Though I was loads of fun, my parents life would have been easier w/o me.

Sad truth. they couldn't afford another kid. they say I was fun to have around as a kid, but if they didn't have me, they wouldn't have missed me.

[demgurl]

34. progressive...

sometimes people who are money poor have much richer lives with their family than someone that could afford another child. I hope this was true in your case.

[FreedomAngel82]

29. Oh wow

There are stories of that out there like yours. So many. Young women throwing their babies away in a garbage dumpster etc. and having no life to give to their children because they were forced to have their children. This is why it's so important to understand other resources and abortion.

[Chichiri]

30. My response to that saying:

My mother is pro-choice. And thank GOD she is, because, unlike you, I don't have to spend my entire life wondering whether or not I was really wanted.

[Warren DeMontague]

33. I'm sorry about your story, demgurl.

To your deep credit, it really sounds like you have taken a healthy approach towards creating good boundaries-- and moving away from the past.

[demgurl]

35. impeach, I have truly tried.

Perhaps growing up that way made me see what really mattered in life and turned me into a better person then I could have been otherwise.

There will always be people who we will never understand like the way I can not possibly understand a person supporting *. This is how I feel about my mom. I will never truly understand her.

Life hands us a lot of good and bad things. We all have a choice to let it destroy us or to take something from it and build an even better life and outlook. I did not share my story for pity or sympathy from anyone. I wanted to share my feelings of how I felt when I saw this bumper sticker.

I really love this board and the people who co-exist with each other. The people here are strong, wise and passionate. I am glad to have found a place with people who mostly share my values.

[noiretextatique]

37. i can relate

some don't understand that merely breathing isn't living. people do the best they can from where they are in consciousness...this is how i came to grips with growing up in my family, and still being engaged with my family members.

[elehhhhna]

38. We don't all get the parents we deserve,

I have a real corker of a mother, myself.

Best to you demgirl.

[NMMNG]

39. Kudos to you demgirl

People assume that because a woman chooses to give birth to her child and raise it that she has done better than the woman who gave it up for adoption, and far better than the one who aborted it. Some children who grow up abused might beg to differ, sadly.

[demgurl]

43. Buffy, thank you.

I think the one thing I learned after rehashing all of this old stuff is that my Mom chose life and so have I. She just chose a very different one. I could have been defeated by being raised by someone like that but I chose life and have lived it to the fullest. I guess even though the bumper sticker was intended one way, I have still followed what it said and sort of gone with the choice my mom did. That choice just had nothing to do with the subject of whether or not to have an abortion.

The one thing others should learn is that it is not only the person making the decision that has to live with it, there is a ripple effect. Your family friends and, most importantly, the child all have to live with your decision. Not all children are adopted and not all children are wanted. The ripple effect on a child brought into a world when someone does not want them and can not afford them can be life altering for that child.

Choice is very important and I hope we never lose that choice. Someone who does not know you and may never be in your shoes should never have the option of taking away your choice.

[NMMNG]

47. Bingo

I was the product of an unplanned pregnancy. My parents were 16 when I was conceived, and it was 5 years before Roe v. Wade would make safe abortions legal. Therefore my parents took the shotgun marriage route, to be followed three years later by the divorce route. My mom remarried and it wasn't until I was 9 that I found out that "Bob" wasn't my real dad but my stepdad. And if my real dad hadn't sent me a Mickey Mouse watch in the mail for my birthday it may have taken me even longer to find out! Marriage #2 disolved and led into marriage #3.

My mom and I didn't get along well when I was a child and teenager(don't even ask how I got along with the stepdads). Now that I'm an adult we are on friendlier terms and she freely admits the biggest problem was that she was young and horribly inexperienced. By the time she was 19 she had two kids, and she had her 3rd at age 24. She spent several of those years raising them by herself (and another few with an alcoholic second husband who wasn't much help).

She'd dropped out of school when she found out she was pregnant with me (after all, in the late 60's pregnant whores couldn't possibly continue to go to school!). Therefore she had to get her GED, then go to night school to get her LPN in hopes of raising us with any acceptable standard of living. To this end, she went on welfare for several years, as much as she disliked the idea.

If I'd been conceived after 1973 it is possible I may have been aborted. I can't say it is a choice I would hold against a 16 year old girl facing the above scenario.

[Qanisqineq]

40. My mom wishes she hadn't chosen life

She got pregnant with me during her senior year of high school. It was in 1973 - the same year as Roe v. Wade - but she would have gotten pregnant just a month or so after it passed and abortion wasn't readily available to her. So she did the "right" thing and married my father.

Growing up I constantly heard, "I wish you'd never been born", "I never wanted you", "I never would have married your dad if it hadn't been for you", and so on. The latter statement hurt the worst because my dad is the sweetest, kindest man you'll ever meet. But my mom wants the dashing, sophisticated man that will sweep her off her feet and take her dancing and to ballets, the fairy tale in other words.

This made me afraid to have children, I was afraid I'd resent them, too. So, in my early twenties I got pregnant twice, both times by an abusive boyfriend that I was too afraid to leave but didn't want to be stuck with forever. And I didn't choose life. I had an abortion each time and I don't regret it for a minute. Not even now that I have an ovarian disease and will most likely never have children of my own. I'd do it all over again.

Even to this day, my mom will tell me I made her life hell and apparently still am according to an argument two weeks ago. Sometimes I wish she hadn't chose life either.

[demgurl]

44. Qanisqineq....

:grouphug:

I am so sorry to hear about your story. It is a shame the way it effected you. Do you think you ended up with an abusive boyfriend, in part, because of your mother? I imagine hearing that all your life made you have such low self esteem that you didn't think you deserved anything better than an abusive boyfriend. Be careful of patterns and falling back into abusive relationships. It is so easy to get caught in one and so hard to get out.

I ma sorry about your abortions and the fact that you may never have children. I have also had an abortion but I was able to go on and have two wonderful kids. I do not think someone is human if they do not admit there are one or two times when they resent there children but for me those times are few and far between. Every once in a while your kids are going to drive you crazy but the trick is just holding on and getting past it.

I think your Mom has a lot of issues and I believe instead of dealing with the choices she made (IE. marrying your Dad), she blames you. I know she is still blaming you instead of taking responsibility but I hope you realize what she has done is no fault of yours. You are blameless that she did not get her wonderful life she always dreamed of. I hope one day she sees what a strong wonderful child she has raised and tells you she is proud.

[MojoXN]

41. I'm one of the few, the proud...

The pro-choice adoptees. I was adopted at nine days of age. I never knew my biological parents, nor do I particularly wish to.The only thing relating to my birth family that I wish that I had knowledge of is my medical history. My adoptive parents are my family, for better or worse, and that is that.

I do not believe that life begins at conception. I do not believe that life begins at birth, for that matter. Though I recognize no clearly defined boundary, I'm generally with the Chinese on this point; life begins soon after birth. In their tradition, one month after. I would say that that is too rigid a cutoff, but the concept is similar.

My ideas are a function of my personal theology. I neither expect nor encourage others to agree with my point of view. Rather, I would encourage everyone to develop independent conclusions. That's one thing that I've noticed about anti-abortionists; they are totally convinced that they are morally correct, and make no room for other opinions. Most of them are not as I am, i.e. adoptees. If anyone has the so-called 'right' to be pro-choice, it's me.

MojoXN

[demgurl]

45. Mojo, I had never heard that viewpoint before.

I am not sure I totally agree - at least not with the one month part. For me, both of my son's lives began at birth when they placed them in my arms. That is also the moment my real life began. Everything up until then was just practice. I say this as someone who did have an abortion a long time ago and have never regretted it for a moment. When my sons were born this whole new feeling came over me and it was wonderful.

I do respect what you said and I really like your attitude about your adopted parents as well as your birth parents.

I do believe you are right in how rigid the 'pro-lifers- are in their views. It is funny how many of them have come over to pro-choice when they have an unwanted pregnancy.

[Hello_Kitty]

42. Forced birthers can be so exasperating can't they?

By saying choose life, your mother did, they are implying that mothers always have had a choice. I was adopted in 1968 prior to Roe v Wade so there's a very good chance that my birthmother simply couldn't arrange an illegal abortion. Also, what's the point of that idiotic slogan when the goal of the anti-abortion movement is to deprive women of that choice. As if you can compel unselfishness.

[geniph]

46. My mother didn't HAVE a choice!

She had 15 pregnancies in 13 years. No one does that by choice. Choice was never available to her. The only thing she could do when faced with yet another pregnancy was to try to miscarry, which she did, 9 times. She didn't have birth control. She didn't have legal abortion. She had only the most primitive of folk knowledge of how to induce miscarriages. Sometimes it worked. Sometimes it didn't, and she had no choice but to be held hostage to the pregnancies and the 6 children she could not afford to raise.

No one should ever have to carry an unwanted pregnancy to term. If we were truly a humane society, we'd make sure there WERE no unwanted pregnancies. Every child born should be a wanted child.

By the way, I'm the last one - I'm one of the ones who was too stubborn to miscarry. Do I feel glad my mother "chose life"? No. Because it wasn't her choice. It just happened. Would I have been happier had I been a wanted child? Absolutely. I was an unwanted child, and never, ever forgot it.

[Nailzberg]

48. Key word - "Choose"