Let me get this straight. Guns don't kill people - people kill people.

[tk2kewl]

But software steals files.

Got it.

[Psephos]

1. You nailed it perfectly. n/t

[Squatch]

2. Actually, software can.

Automated Data Mining and all that.

[tk2kewl]

3. it still needs to be installed and configured by a person

somewhere along the way as far as i know

[ComerPerro]

6. Yeah, someone programs it

[tk2kewl]

8. programming software is akin to building guns

deploying or using software to steal is akin to using guns to commit crime

[ComerPerro]

9. Well, I meant "Someone tells it to steal"

[Squatch]

29. Only if the guns have some sort of AI...like the ones in Aliens.

[tk2kewl]

30. And software has artificial intelligence?

P2P file sharing software has no artificial intelligence.

[Squatch]

31. Walk me through this, if you please...

how is using a gun to commit a crime like programming software to steal.

In both cases, it's actually the person breaking the law, not the software nor the gun.

Oh...and my response was just a really bad attempt at humor. Sorry.

[tk2kewl]

33. that is exactly my point

the court found that the software manufacture was culpable. if that is true so is the gun manufacture. it is both or neither.

[Squatch]

34. What court...I feel like I'm getting into a conversation a little late...

[tk2kewl]

35. SCOTUS decision on P2P file sharing

[DefenseLawyer]

4. But if you use a gun to kill someone,

saying "The Gun Did It" is not a very promising defense.

[tk2kewl]

5. not as a defense but as another culpable party

that is how the supremes saw the P2P case

[ComerPerro]

7. That's the OP's point, I believe

[htuttle]

10. It's like suing the gun companies for a murder

After all, guns are DESIGNED to kill. Production and sales of guns ENCOURAGES people to use them, right?

[tk2kewl]

11. Yep. Copyrights are more valuable than human lives, I guess.

[Deep13]

15. Well, yeah! It's cash isn't it?

[Misunderestimator]

16. Yeah... nuclear bombs don't kill either. We should let everyone have them

and just trust them to act responsibly.

[ThomWV]

12. If A Drunk Driver Runs Over Someone Is It The Car's Fault?

Just to make a point.

[SheepyMcSheepster]

13. LOL, excellent!

[etherealtruth]

14. Wonderful n/t

[July]

17. And condoms cause sex.

Clean needles spread disease.

And honesty threatens national security.

[tk2kewl]

18. Stop. You're going to make my head explode!

:grr:

[July]

21. Ummm . . . don't forget your condom, then? nt

[tk2kewl]

22. LOL

:P

[Beaverhausen]

19. I am sick of people who steal music trying to defend what they do

get over it...you are stealing if you use this software to "share" files.

What do you do for a living? Can I come and steal whatever it is you do/make/serve?

[tk2kewl]

20. Relax there, Beaverhausen. I am not defending anyone other than

the software manufacturers (what I do for a living). If a person steals, I don't have a problem with them being held accountable. The point is that you can't hold the producer of software responsible for someone using it to steal -- just as you can't hold the gun manufacturer responsible for someone who uses a gun to kill. Its not either or. It's both or neither.

[hfojvt]

23. "well, handguns are made for killin'

they ain't no good for nuthin' else
and if you like to drink your whiskey
you might even shoot yourself"

Does the software have non-stealing uses anymore than a radar detector has non-criminal purposes?

Actually, one of my favorite scenes in a movie is when somebody shoots a gun in the air to defuse a violent situation. Still, their primary purpose is to provide their owner with lethal force.

[Deep13]

24. Yet, I've never killed anyone with mine.

Only an idiot would shoot a gun in the air. That bullet will drop with nearly as much force as when it left the barrel and land half a mile away. Frankly, one does not need a gun to kill himself with whiskey.

[cire4]

25. You can test drive a car....Why not test drive an album?

Many people download music purely for sampling purposes. CD prices are so damned expensive these days that it only becomes rational to shell out the 15 dollar asking price if you know that you are going to like the CD. And the only way to determine that is to listen to the songs before you buy it, which is what music downloading enables one to do. If the rest of the songs are good, then you can rest easy knowing that your money will be well spent. If not, then you saved yourself from buying a product that you would not have liked.

I have bought many albums that I never would have considered buying had file sharing not been possible. Alternatively, I have also refrained from buying many albums because the songs just did not warrant the asking price.

I will support file sharing until the record companies can come up with a better way to allow consumers to sample albums before purchase.

[Deep13]

26. Sure, the dealer ought to have samples ...

... but they are not that expensive. A new record in the '80s was like $12 (when a candy bar was $0.35) and that only had 40 minutes of music. And it sounded like crap and scratched easily.

[cire4]

27. Dealers usually have samples of the really popular albums...

And those albums can be listened to ahead of time at retailers like Virgin, Tower, or even Best Buy. But the vast majority of albums for sale are sample-less. Or they only have samples for the first few weeks after release and then they sell them off...

And $15 is a weeks worth of food for a poor college student like myself. I can't waste that ;-)

[Beaverhausen]

28. Can't you go to itunes or something similar and pay for a cut or two

If you are "sampling" a few songs you like from a CD but not buying the whole thing then you should at least pay for the tracks you sample. What are they, 99 cents each?

[cire4]

32. Yes, for some albums you can....

But record companies do not always allow that. If you go to itunes or a similar pay-downloading service, you will find that you are refrained from downloading individual songs from certain albums. They make you pay for and download the entire album instead, even if all you really want is one or two songs. Thus, for these ablums, it is no different from buying the CD.