Pretend for a moment you are an independent voter.

[marshmellow]

You are not a yellow dog democrat but someone who floats in the middle. The group that really matters on election day.

Are you voting for Dean after no less than ten thousand commercials tell you that "gay rights will be his top priorty" or 20 thousand commercials telling you "he will raise your taxes to give money to welfare mothers"?

Or perhaps you will have an opportunity to vote for Kerry but will be told 30 thousand times on TV that "Kerry can't be trusted to protect Americans from Al-Quada", or 40 thousand commercials that "Kerry will take money from the middle class and give it to the teacher unions".

Or maybe Clark is the nominee and 50 thousand commercials will tell you he is "unstable and might start a world war" or 60 thousand times you will be told "Clark will secretly meet with Hillary to establish his policies"

Can the independent voter withstand the barrage of crapola to vote for a democrat?

[noiretextatique]

1. only if they have brains

i am going to go out on a limb and assume they do.

[union_maid]

2. Presumably those ads won't exist in a vacuum

Democrats have to get their message out, too. Obviously, from my avatar, I think that Clark is by far the best to do it, but each has his strong points. A good campaign is absolutely necessary to win, though. Everyone should take a good look at Gore's 2000 campaign and not do any of it. I never entertained the idea of NOT voting for Gore, but there wasn't a single moment in his campaign that would have convinced me to go for him if I wasn't politically committed to the ideals of his party.

[renie408]

3. If I am like two of the Independents I know

I am voting for Edwards because he wants to return the focus of this country back to growing a strong and vital middle class. And he has plans that will insure my kids and will allow them to go to college if they work hard enough. I am also thinking Edwards because of any of the candidates, he is the least waffling, most sincere and most trustworthy, something that after having been lied to and basically gang banged by Bushco for four years is vitally important to me.

[KaraokeKarlton]

4. Well, I don't have to "pretend"

Because I'm a registered Independent who does "float the middle". I support Howard Dean. There are many, many more people just like me who also support him. I've talked to many at meetup and online. There is no reason at all to worry that Dean won't appeal to swing voters, because he already does.

[KaraokeKarlton]

7. Oh...and when the negative political ads hit in my area

I turn off the TV until after the election. I can't stand them. Rabid negative ads intended to promote hatred are a huge turnoff to people like me. As long as Dean runs ads that tell people about what he's done and what he wants to do, he will do great. And if Bush runs anti-gay ads it will help Dean. That's what happened here in Vermont when Ruth Dwyer and the "take back vermont" campaign pulled that crap. It turned off people so badly that even those who opposed Civil Unions became much more tolerant of the idea and eventually the bill got the support of the majority of voters. Ironically, if Bush tries to make the election about gay rights, not only will he lose miserably, but he will actually do A LOT to further the gay rights cause.

[Northwind]

5. I AM an independent voter

I despise party affiliation and the entrenched 2-party system in this country. Best thing that could happen is for the parties to lose their official status within the government.

I am not centrist, however, I am independent left, socialist when you get right down to it.

I am voting for Dean. I will not vote for any of the other Dem candidates.

NBD in '04.

[WillyBrandt]

11. And you are wrong

"I am voting for Dean. I will not vote for any of the other Dem candidates."

The world will thank you for your righteousness, and the next wave of dead American soldiers will surely thank you for your purity.

[quaker bill]

6. It will be the same no matter

who we nominate.

Will it be tough on the nominee? Sure.

There is no candidate that the wingnuts will not try to do this to.

The only way to avoid it is not to go to the dance. (Al Sharpton, with apologies)

This is an untenable premise for analysis. So, we must back our candidate. We need to pick someone who can play hardball (the real thing, not Tweety) and give as good as He/She gets.

As they say at the pentagon "it is a target rich environment". We need someone who can take advantage. It ain't gonna be pretty.

[Orangepeel]

8. only if we reach them in other ways

We have to talk one-on-one to our family, friends, neighbors and coworkers. We have to knock on doors and talk to strangers. We have to make phone calls. We have to run an old-fashioned grassroots campaign (maybe one built on "mousepads, shoe leather and hope").

[the_real_38]

9. Most independent voters these days....

... are turned off by the harsher political aspects of the process. They tend to view government as a venue for solving problems. That's why the Bush administration has tried so hard to frame the War on Terror as the big problem (they've failed so miserably domestically with the economy), and as themselves as the ones with the solution. If we (Democrats) can produce a candidate with a credible vision for solving problems and getting the country moving forward again, Bush will go down in flames.

But I don't Dean is that man - it seems like he's better at talking s*** (to the angry base) than with the policy - where he's said outrageous, un-Democratic things like cutting Social Security and Medicare, and raising the retirement age, could be on the table.

[passthecorn]

10. Positive v. Negative

Dean is galvanizing the democratic (esp. DU'er) base right now with: I hate Bush, he's a jerk, he's killing the country, etc. But in the general election, in order for the democrat nominee to prevail, he/she will have to take a page from Clinton's playbook. A lot more "Don't Stop Thinking About Tomorrow" and a whole lot less Bush = Fascism. Clinton made his point about Bush I's weaknesses without making you think he was evil dressed in a nice suit.

The alternative is that the negative continues to be emphasized and the progressive left claims a moral victory for not backing down.

[WillyBrandt]

13. I'm biased, true.

But this why I like Clark.

His history makes Bush like a dumb phony without having to go harshly negative near election time AND without him having to take centrist or conservatives positions himself.

The bifecta!

[newyawker99]

14. Hi passthecorn!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[KaraokeKarlton]

12. Dean isn't looking to "cut Social Security and Medicare" or

"raise the retirement age". Dean DOES want to make adjustments to certain social programs to make them work better and be more effective. For instance, Dean has been a long time champion for moving away from institutionalized care and allow the elderly and disabled to receive care in their own home as a first option, not last. He began to do this in Vermont and it is a lot cheaper and lowers the cost of long term care. As far as Social Security, he wants to change the payroll tax cap (I think that's what it's called) and would like to see Social Security allow people to have more room to have more money for their retirement, to make it a real "retirement plan" rather than not enough to even barely scrape by with. You really shouldn't listen to decade old quotes that have been snipped to make what he said sound a million times worse than what he actually said and believes.

[LWolf]

15. Easy.

Having been an independent voter for 25 years until last February, when I joined a party to participate in the presidential primary.

I will vote for the candidate of my choice. Negative campaign ads serve no purpose other than to reduce the level of respect I hold for the opposition. As an independent voter, I would never, never have voted for GWB. The question would have been the dem or another 3rd party candidate. In the presidential election it would always have been the dem, even before the debacle of 2000 and the last 4 years.

But for the average "swing" voter...I guess it depends on how we counter the attacks.

[AP]

16. Apparently Ind's broke Dem almost 2:1 in 2000, despite barrage of crap

Of course, national security is the factor, the influence of which is hard to predict.

I think that if the I's get worked up about the economy, Dems get them. If they get worked up about national security, Repubs get them.