Question-Was Valerie Plame the real target of Rovegate?

[ribrepin]

I don't know if this has been discussed before or not.

I kept thinking all day about why they would go after an editorial in the New York Times. Let's face it--the only people paying attention this stuff at the time were folks like us. Everybody else was busy waving the flag. Why call attention to this editorial?

But if the real target was valerie Plame, it makes sense. Some people in CIA were fighting going to war in Iraq. Do you think Valerie was leading the charge? Take down Valerie's network and there is no data coming in to contradict the neocons. Snap of the fingers and off to war we go.

Food for thought.

[Mythsaje]

1. I keep bringing it up...

I think that's EXACTLY the case...or, rather, it's part of the case. They wanted Wilson taken care of too, but Plame's a big part of it as well...IMO.

I think that's the REAL story and the Wilson thing is a red herring. He's taking the heat until Plame is called in front of the Grand Jury and tells what SHE knows.

[ribrepin]

4. It never occurred to me before today

I could never figure out why they made such a big deal about this one editorial. There were lots of damaging editorials written by important people and they mostly ignored them. You ignore stuff you don't want to call attention to.

Makes sense if they really wanted to take down the opposition in the CIA.

[galloglas]

2. Was Plame the target??

Just posted this elsewhere, but I think we must have had the same tought. Plame is the one in the CIA who forced the Administration to "fix the facts" around to fit the policy. Correct?

Is it a different story if the real target is Plame?

Bear in mind that she was not just any old covert op. She was the head of the WMD desk... the one that George Tenet would have to deal with to make sure the WMD excuse was a "slam dunk"... and Plame could not provide evidence of WMDs. Because there was none.

So Plame would not, could not, validate the wishes of Cheney or Bush to claim that there was reason to believe that Iraq had WMDs.

Indeed, Joseph Wilson did the leg work. And he wrote the article about the Niger yellowcake. But was it his idea? Or was it hers, and Joe agrees?

Also, WMDs include more than nuclear devices. Plame would validate no type of WMDs for Iraq. And that is a deadend for casus belli.

So could the actual target be Plame? Even if the Cheney/Bush thought was that Plame put Wilson up to writing the article because she could not?

[ribrepin]

11. It makes sense that Valerie Plame was the real target

It made no sense to go after this one editorial. For God sakes, Brent Scowcroft and Anthony Zinni were writing editorials against this war.

These are not stupid people and they know public relations. Ignore the article written by a nobody and it goes away. They chose not to. I think they found a way to take down the network that was standing in the way of their glorious war.

[Tom Kitten]

3. how about blind lashing out rage ?

They got their asses scooted into the OvalOffice through out and out bullydom, why would you think they would want to change their colors?

This regime and its supporters are beyond borderline, they're downright sociopathic...mass murder is a gleeful fantasy with most of them...

[ribrepin]

7. They pretty much ignored the editorials written by people from

Bush I administration. The public didn't know Joe Wilson from John Doe at the time. Why go after this guy? No one would have paid any attention to this editorial if they hadn't gone after his wife.

The CIA wasn't going along with the WMD argument. Take down network and no more information coming in to contradict them. Problem solved.

I'm tired so maybe my tinfoil hat is a little too tight. Peace.

[ladjf]

15. So far, everyone post in this thread has made great sense

including yours. Rave on friends.

[gumby]

5. Randi Rhodes was hot on this topic today.

You can listen to an archive at http://whiterosesociety.org

[ribrepin]

8. I listened to Randi today, so maybe that's where I came up with the idea

[mrdmk]

6. Yes and no, Valerie Plame was damaged because she was

Joe Wilson's husband. There was an attempt and still is to this day to damage Joe Wilson just on general principle (or G.P.). Then there is anybody else who were thinking about coming out and entering the debate of going to war in Iraq.

The Bush Jr. Administration did not want a debate for the simple reason that they could not win. These people consider themselves to be right at all times and will win at all cost. They do not care who gets hurt or killed, just as they go one winning hence, stay on top in power where they think they belong. That is what this group is all about.

These people do not care but for anybody but themselves, everyone else can go to hell!

This is the most destructive group of people in the world.

[Bucky]

10. Wilson's "husband"? Clearly you're destroying the institut'n of marriage

That was a gotcha

[mrdmk]

16. Dam, that is what I get for taking time from D.U. to go to dinner

Can't even do an edit now. Better watch your back Bucky (idle threat).

[KT2000]

13. Agree with you

if we think back - it was a headlong rush to war. They were busy trying to stop inspections and the UN from taking the lead. Time was of the essence. The "sixteen words" were getting media play and that had to stop.

The message to DC Insiders even thinking about opposing the war was played out in the Wilson/Plame smear. Simply - you and your career will be over and we will stop at nothing to accomplish that AND we will get away with it.

Destructive is right.

[Bucky]

9. Wow. I'd not thought of that. I only thought they were careless & stupid

I'm pretty much anti-conspiracy & anti-tinfoil, if only because they rely on ridiculously convoluted plotlines. It's an Occam's Razor thing. But this makes sense, really. We're still only hearing a fraction of the damage Karl and Scooter did with their phone calls. They didn't out an agent, they destroyed one of the Agency's leading cover companies that allowed operatives to go into the Middle East and ask the right questions.

Between the Ahmad Chalabi coziness--despite most of official Washington knowing Chalabi was at least chummy with the Iranians--and the "inadvertant" outing of Plame and her cover company, someone's managing to make it a LOT tougher for us to fight bin Laden and his deadly mischief. I won't say it's deliberate yet, but it sure smells funny.

[Old and In the Way]

12. There's been some great research on this here.

Check this out....yeah, I'm pretty sure Ms. Plame has some very damaging things on this administration....

AMERICAN JUDAS
Selling the Security of America and the World for 30 Pieces of Silver
By
Robert Paulsen
Compiled From the Research by Posters on “The Plame Indictment Threads”
At democraticunderground.com
1st Edition


A. Introduction

This paper is intended as a supplement to The Waterman Paper and an exploration into Goal #3: Why Cheney Exposed Plame. It involves researching possible connections between businesses connected to Vice President Dick Cheney that may be associated with the sale of WMD components to countries in the Middle East and Asia.

In addition to reviewing known information regarding the “leaking” of CIA operative Valerie Plame’s identity and the nature of her work, there will be an overview of A.Q. Khan’s network of nuclear proliferation, a listing of compromising positions involving financial ties in Cheney’s past and finally an exploration into possible links connecting Cheney to nuclear proliferation markets for profit.

All evidence shall be cited in a source guide available upon request.

B. Valerie Plame’s “Sting Operation”

On July 14,2003, Robert Novak exposed Valerie Plame’s identity as a CIA agent in his syndicated column. He sourced his story to two senior White House officials.(http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0602/p08s02-comv.html ) It is important to understand that, as Plame’s husband, former Ambassador Joseph Wilson says, “Compromising the officer means compromising a career, a network, and every person with who the officer might have ever worked. Slips of the tongue cost people their lives.”(The Politics of Truth by Joseph Wilson, p. 13.)

More here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x66773

[mrdmk]

17. Where did this chart come from? This is hardcore!

link
http://s93118771.onlinehome.us/DU/Plame/PlameFlowchart.htm

[melissinha]

14. Like some have said.. Randi has it...

ABSOLUTELY.... Wilson/PLame is the red herring, the true target was Brewster Jennings and Associates and the entire network of contacts and all the work they were doing with respect to the proliferation of WMDs.... looks like they were getting close to the administation, so the administration calculatedly revealed PLame's identity under the guise of retaliation, when in fact, her outting would do so much more. But it will be literally impossible to prove the "knowingly part" because haphazard remarks which can lead any mediocre reporter to the facts cannot be construed as intentional UNLESS there are documents that SPELL it all out... and lets face it... Rove is not as stupid as Nixon...

No amount of circumstancial evidence, motive and opportunity will awaken the press to turn against its slave master. THey also don't like to be outanalyzed by amateur reporters... The only thing that has proven to get the Press' and Adminisration's attention is public opinion polls.

I have been trying to piece together an argument all day and have come to the conclusion that no sound arguments will cause the MSM to shake.... but...more subjective arguments seem to fair better. I say we shake the "credibility" and "trust" trees... we undoubtedly can PROVE that the administration has "flip flopped" and currently the case for mistrust is strong.... we need to work on this.... ...the MSM responds to raw emotion... LEts give it to them...