Rove, Scooter Libby, and Fleischer Will All Walk Away From This

[Yavin4]

free and clear, and Rove will be by Bush's side as long as Bush is president. Why? Because we live in a Fascist state where laws only apply to people without money and power. The rich and the powerful need Bush to be president, and Bush cannot be president without Rove. Thus, Rove will walk, and the same applies to Scooter Libby and Ari Fleischer.

If they can fix elections results in at least THREE different elections, don't you think that they can make an indictment disappear? The only reason why it even got this far is because they didn't count on TIME magazine giving up Cooper's notes.

I'm sorry to spoil the party here, but you're fooling yourselves if you think that they're going to fire the "architect" of American fascism, let alone have him get indicted.

[eleny]

1. Yes! We Are All Slaves To Bush's Brain! AAAAGH!!!

With thanks to Amazing Stories and Wm. Carter Sawtelle

[buff2]

2. I think we can do without all your optimism

:sarcasm:

[Nightjock]

3. I respectfully disagree Captain Bringdown

[Yavin4]

9. I'm Tired of Getting My Hopes Up

How many scandals have there been? Florida 2000, Enron, AWOL, Bin Laden link, WMDs, Diebold, Ohio 2004, Energy meetings, etc. ALL of them have come and gone, and Bush is still standing.

The Fascists are not going to let the laws get in the way of their goals. Laws are for people with no power and no money.

[wookie294]

22. I like getting my hopes up !!

The scandals may disappear, but they do help reduce the credibility of the Bush administration with the public. For example, a poll yesterday said only 41 percent of the public think Bush is an "honest" man. One big reason for this is the Downing Street Memo and Treason-gate. So, while there might not be prosecutions of these bastards, the public knows something fishy is going on as each scandal comes and goes. The unpopularity of Cheney/Bush in the public makes it easier for Democrats to block extremist legislation in Congress (though not all such legislation is blocked, of course). So, I like these scandal stories even if nobody is prosecuted. Rave on, I say!

[goclark]

31. None of the scandels involved their NEWS CONTROLLER

That is why this one is busting loose.

This one is going to fly, watch.

[FormerRepublican]

4. I disagree...

I think with enough public outrage - and elections coming up in 2006 - BushCo will have to answer for what they've done.

I also think Congress should take a page from the White House and stonewall Bush's agenda until we get answers. Not a single thing gets done until they talk. Heck, we're better off anyway if they can't do anything.

[Yavin4]

5. What Public Outrage?

Where is it? I don't see any. Show me a poll.

And, even if you do find public outrage, so what? They don't care about the public. They don't care if people get upset. They got an illegal war past the American people. They can do whatever they want.

[dogday]

8. Their arrogance will be their undoing.....

Yes they have done a lot of things, never been caught. It only takes one mistake and I think they are human and prone to make a mistake. Once the can is opened, the worms are out.....

BTW Bush's polls are down, the public is in a majority that it feels this President has not been too honest with us....

[GreenPartyVoter]

13. Except that a lot of these cockraoches were there during the

scandals of the Nixon and Reagan admins. Yes, they scurry away when the light is shined upon them, but they always come creeping back.

We need REAL justice this time.

[Patchuli]

11. Welcome to DU FormerRepublican

We're happy to have you (and your optimism) here! I also think that when the average American understands what has been done to this country by these political criminals, there will be plenty of outrage.

I think Americans, regardless of political affiliation, are basically very decent people. I think what is happening is what happened when folks realized what was happening in Viet Nam. The difference here is Bush has pissed off the world at U.S. and squandered young Americans' and innocent Iraqis' lives. Not to mention, squandering the surplus treasury he found when he moved his squalid contingency into power. Or should I say, when the SCOTUS put him in power?!

Either way, glad you are here! :hi:

[writes2000]

6. So your advice is to give up and squelch all hope for the future?

No thanks.

I'd rather continue to spread the word about the injustices I see. Have a great day.

[GreenPartyVoter]

7. If you are right, we may need a Bastille day of our own

[Yavin4]

10. Yep. That's Our Real Future

If you want to stay here in the U.S., that's what it will take to dislodge the Fascists from power.

[GreenPartyVoter]

I worry about it. I really do.

[Lex]

12. Tell it to Fitzgerald. nt

[Yavin4]

14. You Don't Think That They Cannot Get To Him?

Please. They can get to him. They can make his life very uncomfortable if need be. He's a nothing burger to them. These are the people that made Paul Wellstone and Carnahan disappear just before their Senate elections.

[Lex]

19. They would've ALREADY gotten to him if they could. nt

[Yavin4]

27. You Forget . They Were Counting on Miller and Cooper To Take The Fall

Miller and Cooper were both supposed to go to jail to protect them. They were blind-sided by Time Magazine's release of Cooper's notes. Until now, Fitzgerald wasn't a problem, but now that he is, he'll either won't indict or he'll be dealt with somehow.

[Lex]

29. What? Why not just "get to" the Prosecutor if they are so damn powerful?

I'm not buying the twisted logic here.

[K-W]

15. Here is the problem with your reasoning.

America may be facist depending on your definition, but even if it is, it isnt run by Bush. The politicians have to suck up to even more powerful people in our society.

Bush, Rove, Fliescher, etc are expendable, at the end of the day they do not call the shots and will be sacrificed if they are seen as liability to the people who bankroll the party.

[Yavin4]

21. Rove Is Not Expendable. The Powerful Need Someone That Can

convince the masses to vote against their own best economic and political interests. That's the key to making Fascism work. Fascism is a governing philosophy that only benefits a minute portion of the population. Thus, the powerful need to finese their message in order to get the masses to sign on.


Rove does this better than anyone else on the planet. He can make people without any money and no power vote for policies that ONLY benefit people with massive amounts of money and power. Look at Iraq, you have military families supporting Bush even though they're dying, getting mutilated, and facing BK due to extended stays. Meanwhile, Halliburton is literally stealing billions of dollars.

[K-W]

25. Rove is playing the same propaganda tricks that have been used for decades

He is not the first, last, or best.

But yes, he is valuable, but the moment he becomes more trouble than he is worth he will be out on the sidewalk.

Also, be careful not to mistake the massive advantages that servents of the powerful have with some kind of incredible aptitude. Rove's main advantage is the machinery he is given access to.

Remember Nixon. He was a very valuable political operative who was very politically successful for a time. But when the powers in his party decided he wasnt thier future, bam.

[hiphopnation]

26. Here's where I part ways with you.

I agree with your original assessment, but I do not feel that Rove is seen through the eyes of the power elite in the repuke party as being completely untouchable.

Don't you think there is an army of disinformation rove-bots waiting, indeed, salivating to take his place, to pick up where he left off? Rove could walk away now, enjoy a cooshy retirement doing lecture gigs at Bob Jones and someone would pick up where he left off. That's my feeling, anyway.

edit: grammar

[hiphopnation]

16. I hate to say it

(and I mean I HATE TO SAY IT) but I'm inclined to agree with you.

What's more, and this is the feeling I've been having more often, of late, is that what if Karl Rove is fired? Impeached? Driven out of town? All of which I find to be highly unlikely scenarios, but...what if? Then what? KKKarl's work is done. He got * "elected" twice. He's helped the NeoCon bunch get a strangle hold on the dissemination of information via MSM. I think Rove is more expendable than some would care to admit. I have visions of reams of eager, young, republican disinformationalist rove-bots waiting to take his place.

In any case, I agree with your assessment; If Rove can help get this illegal, unjust, and completely fabricated war past the American public with a minimum of resistance what makes anyone think that this complicated matter of the leak of a CIA operative is going to bring Rove down?

Like I said, I do hate to say it, but I agree with this assessment.

[gkhouston]

23. I remember people making similar arguments back in '73

They were wrong.

[hiphopnation]

28. Nothing would give me greater pleasure

than to be proven wrong in this case. I'm simply employing Ockham's razor to arrive at my healthy dose of skepticism.

:scared:

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

17. Has Wolfowitz been mentioned at all? Has he been called to testify?

Wolfowitz was replaced by Bush in his position at the State Department. Among all of Scooter Libby's associates, Wolfowitz was probably the closest person to him. Libby was a successful lawyer until his former law professor Paul Wolfowitz offered him a job in the Reagan State Department. Libby therefore owes his career in government to Wolfowitz. Libby worked for Wolfowitz between 1981 and 1985, after which he returned to private practice. A few years later, Libby again served as Wolfowitz's assistant (this time at the Pentagon) from 1989 to 1993. After Tenet resigned, it was rumored that Wolfowitz would be appointed to take his place as head of the CIA. But that suddenly fizzled out. I was a bit surprised at Wolfowitz' sudden departure from the Bush Administration and his nomination to head the World Bank. I just wondered if Wolfowitz might have had access to Powell's dossiers about Wilson's trip to Niger and whether he's even been called to testify.

[Sparkle]

18. ..

[Zen Democrat]

20. "The Architect" has more enemies than friends.

[Lexingtonian]

24. that part is OK with me

As I see it, the material result of the leak on the victim(s) was to change the career focus of one moderately important person in the CIA from one semi-important set of tasks to a different kind. That's not exactly a tragedy.

The other part of the story is all the mendacity and betrayal. The appropriate price to pay for that is loss of credibility and trust in the perpetrators by their Believers. The important thing that can be achieved via this inside-the-Beltway chattering class sillyness is for the Republican Believers in 'the Heartland' to give up their foolish faith in the Bush Administration.

That's where Democrats can make Rove pay the price for all the vileness. All this throwing up dust is about hiding White House immoralism from their own supporters, because the last great pillar that the True Believers have for their ideology- which shields the specific policies from question- is the supposition of the Perfect Morality of the West Wing.

All this other babble- fascism, conspiracy, retaliation- seems pretty overblown and just so much magical thinking to me. Before you ask. I subscribe to the belief that we are in the process of grinding down Republicans by little pieces, one policy and one Belief at a time. None of this blowing up the Death Star with an X-wing fighter that gets a lucky hit stuff, as most of the people screaming about the different calamities and scandals seem to embrace.

[PurityOfEssence]

30. The future of the Republic depends on verifiable voting

Even with a toadying, captive and outright functionary press, voters will not stand for this crap. The problem is "voting"

As Jeb Bush so charmingly put it in the '02 Gubernatorial Primary: "What is this problem Democrats have with voting?"

These people ARE being fought, and the disgust factor is palpable. Perhaps they will all walk, but as long as it's in the public eye, it'll disgust anyone with any sense of decency. Mixed bag though the human creature is, this does not sit well with most.

[Catholic Sensation]

32. you're wrong about only people without money being subject to laws

Bernie Ebbers' 25 year prison sentence kind of undercuts your rant just a little bit.

[Tommymac]

33. You are only spoiling your own party...

This is serious business, not a game or a party.

Rove is just a public servant - a powerful one, but just a servant.
We still are a Nation of Law - the rethugs have twisted it to be sure - but there are still loyal, determined patriots in the Criminal Justice system who take their profession and responsibility seriously - regardless of their political beleifs. And those day to day patriots will see Justice served.

[KittyWampus]

34. THAT'S RIGHT! Curl Up Into A Fetal Position DU'ers & Stop Trying

because history show that hubris NEVER brings down tyrants.

Oh Wait!

Yavin must've never read Shakespeare or history.

[Name removed]

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