Somebody make me feel good, please.

[evil eggplant]

Bush said "Anyone involved" with the leak would be "Dealt with". Now, he reworded the statement. He now says "Anyone convicted" will be dismissed.

And while bush reneges on his promise, melman is out there saying that "We owe karl an apology"

I have this horrible feeling in the pit of my gut that bush and karl are going to beat the rap, and why shouldn't I. Look back, almost to the beginning of the lies and deceipt. Bush telling the nation that there was a connection between Saddam and Niger, when we knew there was no connection.

Look at the DSM.

bush lied to the USA, and he was never held accountable for his actions.

And along comes the rove affair.

The American people never held their president accountable for Iraq. How can we expect justice with rove when there was none with Iraq?

Can somebody please say something to make me feel good?

[jim3775]

1. Bush got his ass handed to him on social security phase-out.

That's always made me happy.

[LSK]

2. Fitzgerald is the only opinion that matters

Everything else is just NOISE.

[wli]

6. where do you think impeachment/etc. hearings are held?

And who owns the voting machines?

[LSK]

9. im not quite certain exactly who arrests the VP

It will be interesting. But my point is that it is Fitzgerald and the Grand Jury who have the FINAL SAY. The RNC noise machine will eventually be rendered irrelevant when indictments get handed down.

[barb162]

16. The RNC will rev its engines if there are indictments IMHO

[GOTV]

15. While the president enjoys the power of pardon...

... isn't it his opinion that finally matters?

[LSK]

18. if Rove is convicted and Bush pardons him

Thats one hell of a campaign issue for 2006. Will the GOP Senate follow Bush down that road?

[wli]

45. why not? Diebold has it in the bag

[insane_cratic_gal]

19. Absolutely not

To pardon Rove or Libby would do irreconcilable harm to the Republicans. Let him do it, I'd stake my house that Dems gets both congress and the White house in 2008

[evil eggplant]

26. If there is a God in heaven

If there is a God in heaven then I pray that you are right

[Lecky]

37. Nope

Public opinion > Bush's

[Moochy]

3. Fitzgerald

Fitzgerald is working in the court of the grand jury, not the court of public opinion.

[Jade Fox]

4. Welcome to DU!!

I know, I know.

[evil eggplant]

27. Thanks

The pleasure is all mine.

[dogday]

5. Have You Seen The Polls Lately?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6862172

Do you think Karl Rove broke any laws in his discussion with Time magazine's Matthew Cooper? * 1273 responses


Yes 94%

No 6%

Republican National Committee Chairman Ken Mehlman says Democrats owe Karl Rove an apology. Do you agree? * 1282 responses


Yes 4%

No 96%

The Senate Foreign Relations Committee is holding hearings today on improving security in Iraq. Do you feel confident this can be achieved? * 1277 responses


Yes 9%

No 91%

Should states be able to devote public money to embryonic stem cell research? * 1283 responses


Yes 94%

No 6%

[crispini]

7. Read my thread on Fitzgerald.

I did about four hours of reading on this guy yesterday and posted it here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4122819

I feel pretty good about this guy. And right now the only opinions that matters are his and the grand jury's.

[evil eggplant]

29. good job

Thanks for digging. I *do* feel a bit better now. Fitzgerald seems to be a straight shooter. Maybe he can get to the bottom of this.

[crispini]

40. Thanks.

IMO, this is our generation's Watergate. All indications are that he WILL indict somebody -- Judy Miller would not be sitting in jail if it were not extremely serious. And if he indicts somebody, there will be a trial and we will BEAT THEM with it and BEAT THEM and BEAT THEM and BEAT THEM. Especially now that the media appear to have their stones back.

Imagine the Michael Jackson trial only starring Karl Rove or Scooter Libby. (!!!!)

Wonder who they'll get to play Fitzgerald in the movie? :D

[Walt Starr]

8. Rove is going down

Fitzgerald is the guy who got Gotti.

[tnlefty]

24. Who in your opinion is Sammy the Bull Gravano?

Who's gonna sing to get the top guy in this matter, or do you think someone(s) already has?

[Walt Starr]

32. Somebody already has

Tenet.

[tnlefty]

36. I was wondering if you thought

Tenet. Or Tenet and Pavitt?

[KharmaTrain]

33. Cough Cough (Judy Miller) Cough Cough

Shhhh...

[tnlefty]

41. Somehow Miller as Sammy the Bull just doesn't do it for me, unless

I remember his account of the situation being that when they were first in prison and in time when Gravano realized that he was gonna be double-crossed by Gotti, he decided to cooperate. I think Miller is up to her neck in the WMD claims she wrote about, but what else did Judy know and when did she know it.

Are you thinking that Judy's gonna have a jailhouse conversion?

[Inland]

10. "Anyone who is a traitor will NOT get his medal" is the next steop

in Bush's lowering of ethical expectations.

[jsamuel]

11. All those things haven't gone away, they have built up like a large tidal

wave. They have added and multiplied each other as the Bush Administration has pushed them away. The wave has gotten so big that we can't take it anymore. The good news, is neither can the media or most of the American people. The courts are on this one. The wave has gotten too big. They cannot stop what they have brought on themselves. There are laws of human nature that cannot be broken and they will be held responsible for their failure to consider their fellow man.

[insane_cratic_gal]

12. Fitzgerald will deal out Convictions

to anyone involved.. Chimp does get to decide who gets Canned and who doesn't. Unless he wants a convict on his payroll.

[Wapsie B]

13. Just read some of the news here EE.

That should cheer you up. Care to comment?

[evil eggplant]

34. uh huh

First, I feel right at home here, among kindred souls, so don't get me wrong, but what happens if karl beats the rap?

We know he's capable of lying to Fitzgerald. We also know that his degenerate boss has changed the wording of a statement he made, essentially breaking his word to the people of the United States.

Mostly, the dreadful feeling was a symptom of melmens comment that we owe karl an apology. In the midst of all that is going on, he can come out and say something as outrageous as that?

So, I'm hoping for the best, but preparing my self for the worst.

Rove beats the rap, bush keeps him on, the press moves on to SCOTUS or the kidnap kid du jour, or some hurricane or something else, and the fact that rove is a rat, and bush lied (yet) again gets lost in the background noise.

Hopefully, the WHPC doesn't lose their newly aquired balls, and keeps the heat turned up.

[crispini]

42. Who cares if Karl beats the rap?

All Fitzgerald has to do is indict somebody.

Just an indictment, probably arriving about October, and there will be a TRIAL.

And it will drag on for months, even maybe up til next spring, and we will be hearing about it every DAY like the Michael Jackson trial and there will be reporters and video of high ranking administration officials going in and out of the courthouse and the administration will get tarred and feathered with the shitstorm of poo that is going to get flung at them by us and by the media and this rolls over into the next election cycle and we take back control of at least the House and yippee! We're in clover! We get to do stuff! We get to hold hearings and investigations!

[Nite Owl]

14. Look at this WH like

a house that is battered by storm after storm. It looks just fine on the outside but the foundation is crumbling. This whole investigation can be the storm that takes them down like a house of cards, it's pinned to everything else especially the DSM. They fixed the facts and this shows how far they would go to bring us to war under false pretenses. Look at the polls, no good news there and he is losing the 'trust factor' now too.


Welcome to DU!

[evil eggplant]

35. Thanks

I hope the foundation is crumbling. Trust me, nobody is more outraged than I am. Maybe *as* outraged, but not *more* outraged.

We all know just how short the attention span of your typical American is. I pray that the WHPC nd the media keep reminding the public about the true nature of bushCo.

Maybe the voters will remember when it's time to vote, taking some power away from the neocons.

Thanks much for the warm welcome!

Cheers

[DanCa]

17. he cant be relected again

If nothing else we got that :D

[DistressedAmerican]

20. Does This Make You Feel Better?

THEY ARE GOING DOWN!!!

[Lecky]

21. I think many people give the current administration too much credit.

These people are not gods or immune to being held accountable. Let's think of the worst case scenario and there are no indictments made, public opinion trumps over all (especially in politics).

The political damage has already been done and it can only get worse at this point.

[Amy6627]

22. I think that this time might be different. The press is not letting this

go (I can't figure out why they suddenly care!). A friend of mine reminded me these things take time. Richard Nixon was re-elected in a landslide during the Watergate investigation. We all need to work very hard at regaining control of either or both houses then we can clean up the WH. Also, keep in mind that the CIA is pissed off and THEY are the ones that want this investigated, and THEY (along with the nation) are the ones that have been severely compromised by this, not just the Dems. If it were just the Dems going after KKKarl, you could forget about anything happening. The repukes are making this a Dem issue in the press, but the people doing the investigation know better.

[barb162]

23. Look, the low point of civilization occurred last Nov. when Bush

got elected. All that is happening now are sideshows that are the results of him being in office. It will be nice if Rove or others get the boot, but by the time justice takes its course, that will probably be the end of the Bush WH term and it won't make a damn bit of difference. The pugs are doing exactly as I thought. They aren't squirming, they are attacking. The pugs are always owed an apology, right? The Dems can never, fucking never, find their voice. This is nothing new at all. Bush was lying before his first election, lied through his first term, lies now. He'll lie the next three years. What's the diff?

[minerva50]

25. I think the people are turning on the Republicans

There have been polls in favor of a Democratic congress. If we can keep the pressure on and take over at least one house in 06, they can start investigations. It won't be easy, though. They'll fight like cornered rats.

[barb162]

47. the last 15+ years they fight like rats and dems fight

like lambs to slaughter

[hiphopnation]

28. i've said it before

you (and I) are simply employing Occam's razor to arrive at this not-to-good feeling of doubt that anyone in the BFEE or anyone aiding the BFEE will be brought to justice until an armed militia storms capitol hill.

i half expect an armed military coup come november of '08 if these criminals foresee a dem candidate taking the presidency. but in many respects, their work is done. they've driven the economy in to the toilet for the foreseeable future, they've perpetuated a state of permanent fear in the people, they've made spying on citizens with no legal justification effectually legal, they've succeeded in stealing two elections while at the same time whipping up a jingoistic furor that not only ignores facts about lack of WMD but has succeeded in convincing the american public that it doesn't even matter that there was no WMD because Saddam was going to attack us anyway, they've whipped up anti-gay, anti-immigrant, and anti-women sentiment to pre-1950 levels and nary a one of them has been brought before congressional hearings or had issues brought to their faces because they've also succeeded in rendering the press pliant, subservient, and ineffective at reporting the truth.

I wish I could make you feel good. I really do. :shrug:

[wli]

46. I have my doubts Dubya plans to step down as well

[Enraged_Ape]

30. Rove had some power over the media, but apparently no more

I don't know how Rove has done it--either through threats of withdrawing access to the administration, actual dirty tricks and blackmail, or what--but Rove so far has been able to drive the American press like a plow mule. Now that HE's in the hot seat, though, it's seeming like it's payback time. I haven't seen the press like this in years.

Also remember that Rove let one of their own (Judith Miller) go to jail to protect his own sorry a$$. I don't think that can be easily dismissed by the members of the press, no matter who signs their paychecks. Miller was always a faithful neocon mouthpiece and she STILL got thrown to the dogs. So much for loyalty.

The chickens are indeed coming home to roost. With a few whacked-out and patently ludicrous exceptions (e.g., Sean Hannity), Rove has lost his massive propaganda machine. Don't worry. Just kick back with a beer and enjoy it.

[gkhouston]

31. "anyone convicted" is a tacit admission that the White House

thinks Rove will be indicted. They may think they can spin and keep Rove at his job while he's on trial and America will just accept that, but I'm betting that's not going to go across any better than the Social Security reforms they've been trying to sell us.

[evil eggplant]

39. "Anyone convicted" may really mean this...

If bush says "anyone convicted" it's a safe bet that rove aint gonna get convicted. bush is the president. He also knows from rove himself exactly what is going on with the investigation.

At one point, bush said "anyone involved". Now he changed the story to "anyone convicted".

You know that bush will only get rid of rove as a last resort. His "anyone convicted" comment is the way out for karl.

bush come out of this as a lying hypocrite, but he gets to keep his brain. The lesser of two evils.

Sorry for being so negative, I really am. More than anything in the world, I would like to come out here and say just how wrong I was.

[countingbluecars]

38. I just keep telling myself

that Judith Miller wouldn't be in jail unless this was a really big deal.

[FreedomAngel82]

43. I think

if Bush changed his wording of what he said back in 2003 this shows a lot. It shows they know they're guilty and can't run away. That's really very telling.

[peekaloo]

44. read this thread

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4128574


Welcome to DU! :hi:

patience, eggplant, patience