Randi Rhodes is really depressing and upsetting me

[CatWoman]

she's talking about the inhumane treatment and rape of young children BY THIS GOVERNMENT.

"The Rape Rooms are Closed" my ass!!!!

I loathe Bush. I positively despise his sorry ass.

[wtmusic]

1. Be glad she's talking about it

Might help get it stopped (it is pretty fucking depressing to think about though)

[abluelady]

4. How?

What can we do? This is so disgusting. There are just too many disgusting things going on because of this administration.

[wtmusic]

13. All we can do is make it public

and make it as public as possible.

Yes it's disgusting. Everyone in the country should know the disgusting acts our administration is trying to sweep under the rug. It's the only way things will change.

[FreedomAngel82]

19. Even if it's public

so what? What are the republicans going to do about it? Nothing. So what.

[wtmusic]

24. I don't believe that many Republican constituents

have any clue what's going on, and I don't believe fundies approve of pedophilic rape, no matter the circumstances. 2006 elections are 16 months away. If those videos go public, they will *have* to do something about it.

[Horse with no Name]

2. I've been following this all weekend

and it kills my soul. I feel that we are in such an abyss that we will have a hard time ever crawling out of.It's not even partisan..I want SOMEONE...ANY PARTY... with integrity that has seen these photos to stand up and TELL EVERYONE that they have.:cry:

[FreedomAngel82]

20. It's not going to happen with the controlled republican government

No way in hell.

[w8liftinglady]

64. That's what kills me-

Democrats and republicans alike have seen these photos,correct?(In the armed sevice committee?)Where is the outrage?

[Tigress DEM]

97. I don't think DEMs have been allowed to see these tapes....

As part of a court record, there could be severe limitations on who gets to view it at all.

[classof56]

3. You're not the only one. I'm sitting here feeling absolutely sick.

What the HELL has happened to our country? How can ANYONE support and defend our "good Christian president" when he is allowing these reprehensible actions to take place on his watch? Words have long since failed me to describe how I hate this evil little miserable excuse for a human being!

I want my country back!!

Tired Old Cynic

[earth mom]

45. WWJJ?

That's the question these so called good Christians need to ask themselves. Because turning their backs on this is also a crime! If ANY of them know about it and are shrugging their shoulders...
there is no way in hell they will EVER end up going through those pearly gates they so love!!!

:grr:

[classof56]

73. I have given up on mainstream "religion"

I no longer attend the Southern Baptist Church I was going to for quite awhile, and I had a Catholic priest pronounce me a heretic, so I just give up. Still love my God, trust him and have faith that he means what he says, but I no longer have any faith in 99% of the Christians I know and have been associated with for most of my life. Would Jesus torture or condone torture? If he would, then my faith has been in vain.

Tired Old Cynic

[Tigress DEM]

88. Recovering Catholic who went to Baptist Sunday School....

I've been blessed with a "take what I like and leave the rest" attitude for a long time, but eventually I dived off the mainstream bus after a while too.

Dad was Methodist and Mom was staunch Catholic, so at 10 years old I "chose" to be Catholic... and the Parish I was a member of was really a good place to be, very progressive California Catholic Parish. I grew up with Vactican II and the Charismatic Renewal - which was a lot to do with Christ saying that the faithful should not argue among themselves over triffles, but concern themselves with the business at hand - feeding Christ's sheep and loving one another as Christ loved us.

Christ would be standing up and telling those who are harming these little ones that they are bringing upon themselves the worst kind of judgement and those who hide their faces he would chastise to look and speak up and never quit until things change.

Christ said, "Suffer NOT the little ones" and he didn't add - unless they belong to people in a repressive regime... then go ahead treat them like trash. Only "retardicans" can get that out of God's word.

[fob]

5. Then it's bush* that's depressing you, let's not pin bush* crime family

doin's on one of our own.

I understand the sentiment of your initial statement, I just wanna make sure the reality of it stays pinned on the perps.

:grouphug:

[Beaver Tail]

6. Rape?

Need a link to a reliable source please.

If there is no link to a reliable source yet we HAVE to be careful. If we can’t prove it Republicans will rip Democrats apart regardless if it is true.

[CatWoman]

8. WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT??????

:grr:

either tune in or use google.

[Beaver Tail]

10. Been away for the weekend. This is new news to me

[CatWoman]

12. !

http://www.therandirhodesshow.com/live/node/324

[Beaver Tail]

18. Thank you

We need those photos and vids relased NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[CatWoman]

23. see also

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1646517

[cornermouse]

14. Here.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4184847

[converted_democrat]

16. This has been known about for months, no one denies it......

Most of the Senate has seen it. Videos still photos the works, it all happened. The question is when this stuff is going to be released. The administration is snubbing it's nose at a court order to turn over the photos.

[Just Me]

25. I cannot tell you how much I want that judge to slap,...

,...this gawddamn administration down for contempt!!! EWWWW I wish Rumsfeld and the USAG were under threat of imprisonment for contempt!!! :grr: These people are contemptuous of our Constitution, our laws, our judges, our representatives, our country, our people and they deserve to suffer EVERY legal consequence that can possibly be waged against them!!!

[converted_democrat]

27. I agree with you completely...........

I wish the judge would smack them with contempt charges.

[earth mom]

46. What judge will go against them?! The only person I see standing up

to them is Conyers!

He is the bravest soul I've seen!

[Tigress DEM]

90. DEMS speaking up.... ALL Except Zell Miller of GA

This is recent and it isn't about the tapes specifically, but the DEMS are demanding themselves to see full disclosure (edit - about torture in Abu Ghraib) Even at their level they are being denied. I don't know who among the DEMs has even been allowed to see the tapes. I suspect none, although they have heard about them, I'm sure.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A624-2004Jun23.html

<snip>
"We're being stonewalled," said Sen. Richard J. Durbin (D-Ill.). "I think it raises questions about the integrity of this administration. I think they have got to be open and honest with the American people so we can put this shameful chapter of Abu Ghraib behind us," he added, referring to abuses of detainees at the U.S.-run prison in Iraq.

Sen. Edward M. Kennedy (D-Mass.) accused the White House of orchestrating "a cover-up" on the issue.

Sen. Charles E. Schumer (D-N.Y.), said: "These documents raise more questions than they answer." Arguing in defense of the administration, Sen. John Cornyn (R-Tex.), also a member of the judiciary panel, said the release of all documents dealing with U.S. interrogation techniques would "provide a road map to our enemies" and endanger national security. He described the Democratic move to force disclosure of more documents as "a political ploy to try to score points in an election year."

Full transparency does not always serve the country's best interests, "especially when it involves lives, especially when it involves our young people overseas," said Judiciary Committee Chairman Orrin G. Hatch (R-Utah).On the final vote, all Republicans voted against the proposal, while all Democrats except Zell Miller (Ga.) supported it.

[kster]

76. I'm afraid

"legal" with this corrupt bunch will not work. Because this group has no problems walking on either side of the line,that makes it impossible to get them using the laws that we all live by.

[merh]

30. This was reported last year and glossed over by the MSM.

Hersch said that if we knew what the videos and the audios and the images reflected, we would be sickened.

He didn't lie then and we aren't telling lies now. Google is your friend.

:hi:

[fooj]

33. Not. In. Our. Name.

Period!

[merh]

34. NOT IN MY NAME!

:mad:

:cry:

[flyarm]

42. here enlighten yourself!!

got from someone else's post sorry i don't know who..to give credit ..but thank you to who originally posted this!

Editor and Publisher: Abu Ghraib Photos Show...
on Sat Jul-23-05 09:02 PM

...little boy rape. I'm so goddamned proud of my government now. How about you?

Pentagon Blocks Release of Abu Ghraib Images: Here's Why
by Greg Mitchell
http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_di...

NEW YORK So what is shown on the 87 photographs and four videos from Abu Ghraib prison that the Pentagon, in an eleventh hour move, blocked from release this weekend? One clue: Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld told Congress last year, after viewing a large cache of unreleased images: "I mean, I looked at them last night, and they're hard to believe.” They show acts "that can only be described as blatantly sadistic, cruel and inhumane," he added.

<...>

"’If these are released to the public, obviously it's going to make matters worse,’ Rumsfeld told the Senate Armed Services Committee. ‘I mean, I looked at them last night, and they're hard to believe.’

<...>

A military report about that abuse describes detainees being threatened, sodomized with a chemical light and forced into sexually humiliating poses.

<...>

In the same period, reporter Seymour Hersh, who helped uncover the scandal, said in a speech before an ACLU convention: “Some of the worse that happened that you don't know about, ok? Videos, there are women there. Some of you may have read they were passing letters, communications out to their men….The women were passing messages saying ‘Please come and kill me, because of what's happened.’

“Basically what happened is that those women who were arrested with young boys/children in cases that have been recorded. The boys were sodomized with the cameras rolling. The worst about all of them is the soundtrack of the boys shrieking that your government has. They are in total terror it's going to come out.”

[flyarm]

44. Sodomizing Children. For Freedom.

Daily Kos: Sodomizing Children. For Freedom.

Sodomizing Children. For Freedom.
by Hunter
Fri Jul 22nd, 2005 at 17:02:20 PDT
Following up on Kos' post, below; we already have some idea of what the Abu Ghraib images in question show, though we don't know precisely which ones are in the queue to be released. The images, according to those lawmakers who have seen them, paint a picture of torture at Abu Ghraib far, far worse than most Americans have yet been willing to admit. Via the Boston Herald, May 8th, 2004:


Signaling the worst revelations are yet to come, Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld said the additional photos show "acts that can only be described as blatantly sadistic, cruel and inhuman." <...>

The unreleased images show American soldiers beating one prisoner almost to death, apparently raping a female prisoner, acting inappropriately with a dead body, and taping Iraqi guards raping young boys, according to NBC News.

Republican Sen. Lindsey Graham of South Carolina said the scandal is "going to get worse" and warned that the most "disturbing" revelations haven't yet been made public.

"The American public needs to understand, we're talking about rape and murder here," he said. "We're not just talking about giving people a humiliating experience; we're talking about rape and murder and some very serious charges."


And from investigative reporter Seymour Hersh:


The women were passing messages saying "Please come and kill me, because of what's happened". Basically what happened is that those women who were arrested with young boys/children in cases that have been recorded. The boys were sodomized with the cameras rolling. The worst about all of them is the soundtrack of the boys shrieking.

Note these links are from 2004. We've known about the additional abuse cases for over a year. And yes, the rest of the world already knows.

Update <2005-7-22 20:41:35 by Hunter>: In reference to a number of posts below... To be honest, I don't even care if this effort looks partisan anymore. If being anti-child-sodomy is now considered the partisan position, then I'm going to be the biggest f---ing partisan on the planet, and to Hell with anyone who isn't.

I'm tired of all of it. Just tired. I'm tired because the rest of the world has known this for a year, and we refuse to discuss it in this country. And in truth, we can't discuss it in this country without the (heavily censored) pictures, because without the pictures, the horrible, horrible actual pictures, the loathsome, brick-stupid f---ing news media doesn't see a story. And without the pictures, every bloated, pill-popping, corpse-like Rush Limbaugh clone in America will continue to claim it's all lies, all exaggerated, all phony.

Because, God f---ing knows, we would never even abuse even an inanimate Koran, and God help you if you report such a thing without the very pictures to see it happening before your eyes.

So here are the pictures. See it happening. So defend it, Rush. Go ahead and f---ing try. Maybe at some point, in this country -- maybe not now, maybe only after the most partisan, dishonest sacks of crap among us find themselves rotting deep under the ground, their much-sought Rapture having wholly abandoned them -- we will again be able to find some small shared moral base, some small point of humanity on which we can all agree, before God and country, this thing was wrong.

I won't hold my breath.

[Tigress DEM]

92. IF this were still MY Country, the OUTRAGE would be that this was...

allowed to happen at all. And those that know, I am sure ARE OUTRAGED, but SO MANY just CAN'T believe it. Bush hides the truth and they look the other way.

If a Democratic President had allowed this on HIS/HER watch, those videos would have been playing in church basements across the country within 30 days of the revalation... probably less.

[libnnc]

17. you need a link?!?

Ever heard of Seymour Hersh? where the hell have you been?

Here:

http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/?040510fa_fact

[Kraklen]

21. Here's a photograph of US troops raping Iraqis.

If you were having trouble believing that's rape, pretend they're doing it to your kids.

[RatRacer]

35. Um, while that's degrading and humiliating

...that isn't rape. And any real rape victim will tell you that being forced to pose naked in a photo and being raped are not the same thing by a long shot.

[Kraklen]

36. Really?

If I stick a gun in somebody's face, somebody who's been locked in a cell for god knows how long, and then I force them to commit sexual acts, that's not rape?

[RatRacer]

38. Just going by the picture you posted

...that wasn't rape. I subsequently have read the New Yorker article and see what you were alluding to though.

[Kraklen]

39. One more question.

Which one are you, Uday or Qusay?

[RatRacer]

41. Some of this is news to me

I honestly did not realize that people had been forced to commit sexual acts until I read the New Yorker article. I've only sparsely kept up with this and thought that the extent of it was degradation and humiliation such as the photo you posted. And while that is detestable, forcing people to perform sexual acts is quite a notch above that, wouldn't you agree?

[Kraklen]

43. Why is it news to you? I find it hard to believe...

that anybody hasn't seen these photos.

I find it impossible to believe that anybody thinks that the above photo is not a sexual act. I just don't believe it.

Here's some more.

[RatRacer]

48. I haven't seen them all

For instance, the one you just posted I had not seen.

But the original one, while humiliating, isn't what most people would call as sexual act. Now, some of the things described in the New Yorker article such as forced masturbation and having someone else kneeling in front of them...that's the kind of thing that most people think of when you say "sexual act" or rape.

[Kraklen]

50. Well now you've seen two

..pictures of U.S. troops raping Iraqi captives.

You can say that's not a sexual act all you want, I'm sure Saddam will come up with creative excuses for his rape rooms too, but you're not fooling anybody but yourself.

[RatRacer]

58. Exaggerate much?

I'm sorry. The human pyramid shot would be considered by MOST people to be humiliating and degrading and inexcusable, but they would not call it rape. Rape has a very specific connotation to the average person and that doesn't fit the description. "Sexual act" might be a term some would ascribe to that photo, but even then the majority would expect to see some actual sexual activity going on, not just a human pyramid of naked men.

Even our laws have such distinctions. If a guy forces a woman to pose naked with other women, he's not going to be convicted of rape no matter what you may think of it.

So, drop the Saddam comparisons and talk like a reasonable person.

[libnnc]

61. so this is just about semantics to you, right?

Parsing words...that kinda thing?

A little off topic -- Why don't you have a profile?

[RatRacer]

65. No.

When I first started reading, someone had a link to a photo they claimed was one of rape. What I saw was a human pyramid of nude men. That's sick and disgusting and evil. But to my mind, it wasn't rape. Yes, it all falls under the more general categories of torture, evil, degradation and so on, but rape is a very specific and rather volatile accusation and to me that picture didn't back up such a claim.

I have since read the article and realize there are other photos that supposedly do show such things.

Off-topic: I never fill out internet profiles on message boards. Call me paranoid.

[Tsiyu]

87. There's rape. There's rape of the soul

The intent is to humiliate through forced sex and nudity. It IS the same thing Saddam did. Exactly the same.

In my opinion, anyone who excuses or dimisses or makes light of what our "civilized" nation has done to POWs should be incarcerated immediately as either a mentally ill person or one who collaborates with evil. This is not what our Constitution dictates as "American behavior."

I am disgusted with those who allowed this, those who participated in this and even more so with fellow Americans who try to minimize the horror of it. I imagine if these were photographs of American POW's some of my fellow Americans might become suitably outraged??

[Just Me]

54. STOP MINIMIZING TORTURE!!!

JUST FUCKING STOP IT!!!

[RatRacer]

60. What minimizing?

Simply because I distinguish between rape and forced nude posing? Do you honestly not see a difference?

And to be clear, making such a distinction is not declaring that either is acceptable. Not by a long shot. It's just being clear on what is actually happening. There is a difference between being raped and being forced to pose nude in degrading ways, even though both are evil.

[Just Me]

63. They are both acts of torture. Agree? n/t

[RatRacer]

66. Yes. Absolutely.

I didn't mean to imply otherwise. But there are degrees of torture, are there not? I mean, no one wants to be tortured in any fashion but some things are to varying degrees worse than other things. That's the only reason I was making the distinction. We should be clear as to what exactly is going on.

[Just Me]

69. All torture is a crime against humanity.

All torture is a crime under U.S. law.

All torture is a crime under international law.

Let's be clear on the foregoing and refuse to peddle with those who approved this shit.

[bvar22]

82. Hey...those are just fraternity pranks.

Haven't you ever "let off a little steam"---From the Rush Limbaugh school of Excellence in Propaganda!

I think the apologist for torture above wants to argue that since there was "no penetration" there was no rape.(Which IS bogus, but may be legal. AFAIC, FORCED Sexual Humiliation and Abuse is RAPE.

The Senate (repubs AND Democrats) withheld the pictures of actual penetration and the photos of child torture. Those are the ones that were supposed to be release on the 22nd.

[flyarm]

47. well from what sy hersh has said the worst

part is hear a boy child screaming while be sodomized!

a child..a child for god sake..and on air america today they said children as young as 10 were abused!

10 think about your ten year old...i told that to friends yesterday while their children played in the pool..think about it being your child..your precious little child having what i have read ..a flashlight shoved up there bottom...just think about it!!

i cry everytime i think about it...my child when ten was playing little league..not being sodomized by the american government!

[Tsiyu]

85. Nice of you to give a damn

Lots of folks are gonna play stupid on this one.

[janx]

86. There was rape and there was murder. There was sodomy.

There is at least one photo of guards posing with a dead body. Have you not seen that?

[libnnc]

37. you'll get your *proof* soon enough, honey...

THERE ARE PHOTOS.

And I'm not too tickled about the human pyramid, either...:nuke:

NOT. IN. MY. NAME. :nuke:

[flyarm]

49. not in my name either...

but it seems cheney is hell bent on blackmailing congress to give abuse a pass !
i hate these mfers!!

i have never hated before..but i truely hate these bastards and those who follow them blindly!

what if it was there child next!

maybe then they would know the abuse their government commits in their name!

but i wouldn't even wish that upon my worst enemy!!

[RatRacer]

52. I'm not either

It was never my point to dismiss the degradation and humiliation such as that human pyramid. But, honestly, I've not been following this story as closely as some others. I've heard bits and pieces and was under the impression that it was all things along the lines of that pyramid shot or the one with Ms. England pointing to some guy's genitals. That made me mad enough. But I'm only now hearing of what some of the photos contain.

[Just Me]

56. IT'S CALLED TORTURE,...T-O-R-T-U-R-E!!!

:grr:

[RatRacer]

62. I GET THAT

What was being discussed what whether the human pyramid was rape or not. Please read the posts before going batshit.

[tnlefty]

71. A Belated Welcome to DU RatRacer!

I understand that you're getting it now, and there is no excuse for any of this. :hi:

[trekbiker]

72. I agree with you RatRacer...

it is possible to be outraged and disgusted but also remain rational.. The photos I've seen were TORTURE. This admin coldly calculated what thier base (Dittoheads, Freepers, Fundies, Neocons, etc) could accept. I'm convinced this war criminal administration has been doing their utmost to control the issue and what really needs to come out is all the photos and videos or whatever else is hidden. Even the whacko right will have a hard time processing enough "cognitive disconnect" to rationalize these crimes. This goes to the top, or at least very near it.

[noamnety]

94. It is a sexual assault

If I were attacked on the street by a stranger and he ripped my clothes off, it would be sexual assault. There's no debate on that.

The definition of rape (from dictionary.com) is: The crime of forcing another person to submit to sex acts, especially sexual intercourse.

So it comes down to whether or not naked people piling on top of each other is, in your mind, a "sex act."

If you read that a school teacher had forced a child to undress and the teacher laid down naked on top of them, would you consider that a sex act?

Or just "degrading" and "humiliating"? There's your answer.

[PassingFair]

98. We are going "batshit"

...because this is OLD INFORMATION.
Do you NEED to SEE the phosphorus light tubes being INSERTED to cry foul?
We are batshit because this testimony is out there.
You are just ONE of HUNDREDS OF THOUSAND of individuals who has failed to avail himself/herself of the truth.

Sorry to "pile" on you here, but some of us are "batshit crazy". This criminal adminstration, abetted by the US populace has made us this way.

[Tsiyu]

84. Dude, wake up and smell your country's vile stench

Don't play stupid here.

[tridim]

7. I think it's a natural human reaction to say what she's saying

I certainly want everyone to know that *I* don't support what BushCo is doing. Unfortunately I don't have a radio show to announce it. The world needs to know that BushCo is the evil entity in this country, not the majority of Americans.

[flyarm]

51. the world does know..its only

ignorant americans who are clueless!

[Just Me]

9. It's evil, human evil, to allow such things to happen and go so far,...

,...as to cover it up rather than end it. The BushCo/neoCON cabal are just fucking evil. Period.

[tmooses]

11. I think it's important to release these pictures. Not for sensationalism

(which I'm sure some will use them for) but because we need to know as a country what can happen in situations like this, so we can move to
prevent it from happening again. The excuse that it will incite violence doesn't fly. What about congressmen who advocate bombing Mecca and not even reprimanded by their party?

[Lydia Leftcoast]

15. Yes, and if we had a free press, this kind of news would be

front page headlines, and every newspaper in the country would have banner headline editorials calling for the entire Bush administration to be impeached for war crimes.

Back in about 1979, I read a book called The CIA and the Cult of Intelligence, and it pointed out that the purpose of secrecy was to keep America's misdeeds secret from the American people. Take, for example, the overthrow of the democratically elected Arbenz government in Guatemala in 1954. Everybody in Guatemala knew what really happened. The Soviets knew what really happened. The Europeans knew what really happened. Only the average American believed that Arbenz was a "Communist" who had been overthrown by "freedom-loving" military officers.

The political climate is different now, but one thing remains constant: the average American knows nothing of the country's misdeeds, and any attempt to educate them leads to charges of anti-Americanism, aiding the enemy, ignoring worse deeds by other countries, or ignoring the good things about this country.

Granted, people do not want to believe that their country is capable of evil, and if the propaganda system is efficient, they are shielded from any hint of evil. I had relatives who spent WWII in Germany, living on the eastern edge of the country in a small town that had escaped bombing. They were so insulated from the truth that they didn't know Germany was losing the war until they saw the refugees streaming past their door fleeing the Soviets.

Our people are so distracted by celebrity gossip and sports and true crime reports, all of which are intellectually and emotionally easier to absorb than stories about the sins of one's own country, that the government doesn't even have to censor the news. All it has to do is make sure that the major media are thoroughly in the hands of neocon allies and that dissenting voices are characterized as "fringe" or "anti-American."

[ChiDem]

74. Right on.

[The Jacobin]

22. I have to agree.

I have been really upset by all this. I have had to step back for a few days and just listen to music and hug my kids.

I can't take all the lies and hate pouring out of this administration. Even worse is the apologists. Christ. I can't take those.

[fooj]

26. I've got some strong feelings about this...

Those ratbastards can stall all they want...people KNOW what they are attempting to hide. This is no secret.

The bottom line is what is wrong is wrong. Period. No getting around it. I am so sick of their sanctimonious BS...lying bastards can rot in hell as far as I'm concerned. They have put EVERY AMERICAN in jeopardy by their divisive, partisan bullshit and I've had just about enough. They (all repubs) must shoulder the responsibility of sitting back, DOING NOTHING, and silently watching as their party sold out to the imposters that run The White House. Our House. They are not fit to call themselves Americans, IMO. This isn't just about the politicians in DC. This is about all Americans who aided and abetted these evil, maniacal monsters and I don't believe that their participation in all of this madness should bear no consequence. Actions have consequences. Every spineless repub in this country owns this bullshit. That's right. Ownership. They OWN this EVIL. Now what are THEY going to do about it?

Peace

[Just Me]

28. Yet, Republicans minimize this absolute horror, this awful evil,...

,...every chance they get!!! Yeah, I have strong feelings, too!!!

I AM PISSED OFF!!!! The Republicans DON'T EVEN CARE TO TAKE STEPS TO STOP THIS MORAL AND LEGAL OUTRAGE AGAINST HUMANITY!!! Nope, nope, nope. They just want to minimize it,...just like freakin' Nazis.

DAMNIT!!! :argh:

[realFedUp]

40. Republicans don't care about little "others" getting raped

a whole discussion about racism here....

[flyarm]

53. they are

nazis..they are just filthy disgusting nazi's!

[flyarm]

55. i wonder...

if this is why they don't approve of abortion...then they would have less children to starve , abuse and sodomize!

[libnnc]

29. Yes AND...

The sick fucks who are committing these crimes at Abu Graib are wearing THE UNIFORMS OF THE USA -- they are representing you and me --whether we like it or not. And the suits on Capitol Hill continue to enable this evil and continue to allow this barbarity to be done IN OUR NAMES!

I have fucking HAD IT! :nuke:

NOT. IN. MY. NAME!!! :nuke:

Release the goddamned photos. :nuke:

[fooj]

32. It's time to raise holy hell!

I'd have to go with this being our duty as Americans.

This is not about fucking politics anymore. This is about the honor, integrity and most importantly, the well-being of our beloved country. These evil madmen have taken over our government and are trying to destroy the very fabric of our Republic. These imposters have an agenda and patriotism isn't on it. I'm scared as hell right now but I won't cower to these ratbastards. They have unlawfully occupied OUR HOUSE. This is our Country, damnit! America is our home. It is our responsibility to protect and defend it in times of crisis. It is our responsibility to put an end to these horrendous, inhumane acts. So...

Let's start screaming!!!!!

:spank:

We will not tolerate this type of behavior from our government.

Not. In. Our. Name.

Period.

[Tommymac]

31. This will make you sicker...

American soldiers wearing The Pigman's 'Club Gitmo" t-shirts.

DU thread over the weekend here.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=4173752

[CatWoman]

57. I saw that earlier

and was struck by the fact that they are ALL white.

[Rainscents]

67. There is one black guy in the back with orange hat... It looks like to me,

he may have been ask to participate even though he didn't want to... Just for the photo op.

[Tommymac]

83. Yeah...funny ain't it?

People always dance around the fact bigotry is alive and well in America - and that a big part of The Pigman and other's of his ilk's appeal is to white, blue collar men. Wonder why that is....

Growing up in the rural South in the late 60's and 70's, It was always made apparent to me that the 'new' Democratic party of Johnson and Carter and McGovern did not represent White Men; that I was really misinformed to believe that the Democratic party had my best interest at heart. At that time most were Wallace 'Dixiecrats'...and later they formed the nucleus of the new Rethuglican party.

[mvd]

59. Oh my - thanks for bringing this to our attention!

The lies and the cover-ups so far have been making me think about Canada. And dreaming of America going its separate ways if they steal another election. But if this story grows, and the Democrats don't raise hell and the media covers it up, I will not be part of a country whose government does this! :grr: :argh:

[w8liftinglady]

68. They used children to get parents to confess

It's a good thing the Geneva Convention doesn't apply to Us.

Where do they try War Criminals these days?

[SunDrop23]

70. Heads need to ROLL, no more bullshit.

Dammit enough is enough.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

75. I am very new. Who is Randi Rhodes?

thanks.

[CatWoman]

77. here

http://www.therandirhodesshow.com/live/

[Catchawave]

78. She has a radio show on Air America Radio. n/t

[FourStarDemocrat]

80. Randi Rhodes is a progressive talk radio show host on Air America Radio

Her show is on daily from 3-7:00 pm. It can also be streamed on the net. check out http://www.therandirhodesshow.com/ and http://www.airamericaradio.com

[byronius]

79. I remember the original Sy Hersh interview with Randi over a year ago.

His descriptions of the video made me pull off the road. There are indeed many Republicans who would not find this objectionable, because they possess thirteenth-century belief systems and a well-maintained wall of ignorance. Torture is logical to many conservatives.

Given what we know as fact, and given what we originally knew of these facts, we can extrapolate (or is it interpolate?) that much, much worse things have happened and are happening. Rumsfeld originally filled the military prison positions by looking through US prisons for guards with severe disciplinary problems. Now, he's getting what he asked for. Psychotics in charge of the asylum.

Every conservative is now a criminal. Every Republican is guilty of Treason. Ignorance is not a defense, especially not now, at this late date. They all flock around their beautiful madness as it pulls the world over the edge. And the funny part? They kind of want it this way. It's characteristic of conservatives to be secretly full of guilt and desirous of death and/or punishment. They know what they've done. They know.

There is no more bridge between the left and right. It has been burned to ashes by their acts. If my two children are not to pay the price, then you and I must strive harder to stop these MADMEN.

This is my two hundredth post. Greetings to the Magnificent Democratic Underground. Skinner -- you're a damned hero.

[LittleClarkie]

81. Will we ever see the photos that were supposed to come out July 22?

Or will they stonewall until Bush is out of office.

[Peace Patriot]

89. On November 2, 2004, the TV networks, acting in concert, falsified the

exit poll data (Kerry won), "adjusting" that data to fit the official result (Bush won), thus depriving the American people of major evidence of election fraud, and dampening protests and calls for investigation. The TV networks, acting as one, were complicit in creating the illusion that Bush won. They even fooled me for a couple of hours.

Knowing this, it is no surprise that the TV networks and other news monopolies--war profiteers, all--would suppress information, such as torture photos, just as they suppressed information that all of the Bush Cartel's claims about Iraq WMDs were false.

What we are dealing with is relentless, 24/7 propaganda and disinformation, and an Iron Curtain over any real news. Americans are among the most poorly served people on earth, as to real news, and are certainly among the world's most disenfranchised citizens.

It is something of a miracle then, to come upon the following two stats (among many, many others like them):

58% of Americans opposed the Iraq war BEFORE the invasion. Feb. '03.
and
63% of Americans oppose torture UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES. May '04.

A big majority of Americans were against the war BEFORE all the lies came out. Their instincts were peaceful and they didn't buy Bush's B.S. And a big majority of Americans oppose torture--and have maintained their sense of justice and ethics and lawfulness--despite the relentless Bushite fearmongering. And there are similar stats--way up in the 60% to 70% range--of disapproval of every major Bush policy, foreign and domestic.

This is not a stupid, callous, uninformed people. This is a DISENFRANCHISED people. The will of the majority is being ignored. It was clearly thwarted on Nov. 2. There is no "consent of the governed" and no legitimacy in these Bush Cartel actions. But lobbying Bush's "pod people" in Congress to represent the majority --or lobbying the scared Democrats (many of them)--is something of a hopeless cause. The "pod people" are not going to change. (See below. They have assured re-election, by means of their buds at Diebold and ES&S.) The Democrats said nothing about the torture during the election (to my amazement), and of the war they said that they would run the war more efficiently, not that it was wrong.

People nevertheless made an act of faith in them, that they would behave differently--and lawfully--and tried their damnedest to throw the Bush Cartel out and put the Democrats in. (For instance, the Dems blew the Bushites away in new voter registration in 2004, nearly 60/40. And all those people were not flocking to the Dem Party to vote for Bush!) (Just one of many mind-boggling election stats.)

The people were crushed. The people who stood in ten hour lines to vote. The thousands of volunteers. All the young people, voting for the first time. All those non-voters, voting for the first time. All those determined Gore 2000 voters, getting all their non-voting family members, friends and co-workers to register and vote for the first time. All the Nader voters compromising their souls and voting for the Democrat THIS TIME. Crushed. Bushwhacked. Poorly informed about the devil machines.

What I am getting at is that there is a practical, doable SOLUTION to having a government that is blatantly violating federal and international law--a government that appointed the torture memo writer, the man who justified all this, Alberto Gonzales, as chief law enforcement officer of the U.S. of A.; a government that slaughtered over 100,000 people in Iraq; a government that is out of control.

We still have the power to fix it. We can't undo all the harm, but we CAN change the direction of government, and bring it back in line with the will of the people. We have one last chance to do so.

The answer to the stink in Washington DC is restoring our right to vote, by throwing Bushite electronic voting machine companies--Diebold, ES&S and brethren--out of the election business NOW--or, at the very least, achieving some measure of election transparency and verifiability with paper ballot backups, strict auditing, and no SECRET, PROPRIETARY programming code owned and controlled by major Bush donors and campaign chairs! (...jeez!).

Paper ballots, and hand counts at the precinct level is the best solution. But where that is not yet doable, we must get as much transparency as possible, by whatever means.

The place where we can get this done is in state/local jurisdictions, where the authority over election systems still resides, and where ordinary people still have some influence. The bipartisan corruption in the electronic voting business at the state/local level is daunting, but it is nothing compared to the bipartisan corruption in Washington DC, and it is local and therefore much more fixable.

Join your local election reform group--or start your own--and help get this done. Our vote is absolutely essential and fundamental to achieving "consent of the governed." Without it, we have no say in DC or anywhere else. We must get that power back while we still have the chance.

See the DU Forum "2004 Election Results and Discussion" for information and action ideas:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topics&forum=203http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topics&forum=203

[Tigress DEM]

96. IMPEACHMENT Weekend, DC and other hotspots - 9/24-26/2005

Need another million or so of the Disenfranchised to show up and holler real loud - "WE ARE SICK AND TIRED AND WE AREN'T GOING TO TAKE IT ANY MORE!"

Impeachment of all these war criminals will go some way to showing we are serious about vote reform too... not to mention how much it will scare the lesser snakes into respecting the Will of THE PEOPLE.

[Name removed]

91. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[sintax]

93. If you haven't already could you put up a link

to the Herald report she was referring to. I'd like to get a copy of it.

Her show tonight was pretty intense and for me infuriating.

[osaMABUSh]

95. There will be no outrage - many Catholic priests got away with

sexually assaulting American children so what make us think Joe Sixpack will care if Iraqi teens are molested?

[AuntiBush]

99. It's not Randi that's depressing you: It's the Evil GOP Bastards

actions. Be thankful we have the couragous Randi Rhodes getting us the truth. The truth hurts. You can thank Bush & CO for this vile crap.