Husband Charged With Having Sex With His Wife

[ls317]

LINCOLN, Neb. - A 22-year-old man faces criminal charges in Nebraska for having sex with an underage 13-year-old girl, although he legally married her in Kansas after she became pregnant.

The man’s lawyer said the couple, with their families’ support, “made a responsible decision to try to cope with the problem.”

Matthew Koso, 22, was charged Monday with first-degree sexual assault, punishable by up to 50 years in prison. He was released on $7,500 bail pending an Aug. 17 preliminary hearing.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8716780/

[coloradodem2005]

1. Sex before they got married?

This is fucked up.

[TheFarseer]

13. OMG, that's classic!

[coloradodem2005]

14. What?

[TheFarseer]

33. I just mean that was a good joke

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

2. Man charged with underage sex after a child's fucked up mother let her

marry the adult male that impregnated her

[ls317]

6. Makes You Wonder

Any person that calls them selves a parent and lets there 13 year old daughter marry a 22 year old.They need the sh*t beat out of them

[johnfunk]

90. The parents let a pedophile marry their daughter

Send the parents and hubby to Gitmo. What they did to that child is sexual terrorism.

[helderheid]

155. NO KIDDING

If my 13 year old daughter got pregnant by a 22 year old pediphile, you can bet letting that child molester marry her would be the very LAST thing on my mind. Now castration... that would most certainly seem more a more appropriate action to take.

[ret5hd]

3. now now...you shouldn't try to mislead like that...

he's charged with molesting a 13 yr old ...BEFORE he married her AFTER he got her pregnant...the fact that he is NOW married to her hardly vindicates him, does it? Really, DOES IT???

[ChairmanAgnostic]

5. Kansas allows 13 yr olds to MARRY?

No wonder they teach creationism there.

[Nevernose]

12. She was fourteen when she got married

Thirteen when she got pregnant. That just makes it SOO much better, doesn't it?

[me b zola]

37. Still...fourteen & married?

What the F is wrong with Kansas :grr:


And this girl's parents should be in jail with the pediphile :nuke:

[Media_Lies_Daily]

52. If this shocks you, don't look too closely at your family tree...you may..

...find some things you don't like going back into the early history of the U. S. and other countries. Getting married at 13 or 14 was not out of the question in most U. S. states prior to the 20th century. Some of that had to do with the fact that people just didn't live as long back in the 17th and 18th centuries, and some of it had to do with marriages arranged by parents.

Some states...like Kansas...have yet to change their laws to match changing attitudes about the age at which one can marry. Most of those states don't change laws unless something comes up to challenge it, or some politician thinks he can score points on one or more issues.

[REP]

137. I've Got 400+ Years of Family Data - No 14 Year Old Brides In It

Marrying at age 13 or 14 may have been accepted among some social subsets in past centuries, but it certainly wasn't the norm. Additionally, during those past centruies, women were regarded as property. Maybe these are two notions that we as a society can let go of now.

[Nikia]

154. My female ancestors didn't marry as little girls either

They tended to marry in their late teens and twenties. My father's parents married at 19 and 20. My mother's parents married at 23 and 30. My great grandmothers all married after the age of 18.
Incidently, few of my female ancestors died in child birth. I think that being 20 instead of 12 gave them an advantage in surving giving birth.

[etherealtruth]

161. yeah , I've got women in my family tree ...

...that weren't able to vote, own property, testify in court ... Thankfully some societies correct abominations!

[helderheid]

164. AMEN

[etherealtruth]

162. yeah , I've got women in my family tree ...

...that weren't able to vote, own property, testify in court ... Thankfully some societies correct abominations!

[Throckmorton]

139. Connecticut would possibly allow a 14 year old to marry

The child in question would need both parental permission and the permission of the Probate Judge in the town where the marriage was to be performed.

13 is the actual minimum age to consent to sexual relations, but there is a limit on age difference of the parties involved to no more than 730 calender days.

There is no age difference limit for marriage, although I can't see a judge agreeing to too much of an age difference, if he allows it at all.

At age 16, the person only requires the OK of a parent or a Probate Judge to marry.

[me b zola]

145. Then, what is wrong with Connecticut?

How old is the thirteen year old giving consent to have sex with? If it is with a fourteen year old, then so be it. Children experimenting with sex is normal. It happens for different people at different ages. The key, though, is it not to be a predatory experience---with say a nineteen or twenty year old.

But marriage is a different subject. That is a life long legally binding contract that a fourteen year old is not developmentally capable of making or handling. This does not even speak to the fact that fourteen year bodies are not ready for childbearing, and if she is married she will most likely want a baby doll--I mean baby.

[Throckmorton]

146. Please see second line of my post

A maximum of 730 calender days (2 years).

Did you even read my post?

To marry at 14 (or 15) you need the consent of both a Probate Judge and a parent.

[coloradodem2005]

7. Why are people so fucked up?

Why?

[helderheid]

165. sick people among us

[Son of California]

4. I'm sorry

But I don't feel bad at all for these sickos.
this is the kind of under-age-cousin-fucking culture we are sworn to fight as liberals.

[HockeyMom]

10. Sounds like Jerry Lee Louis

Married his 13 year old COUSIN. Until recently, I believe, it was legal for 14 year olds to marry in La. They just raised the age to 16 from what I read.

Sorry, Red Staters, but you think WE are crazy?

[helderheid]

159. You don't feel sorry for that girl?

:wtf:

[TheFarseer]

8. Is it legal to marry a girl you knock up in Kansas

regardless of age? Do you get a choice of go to prison for statutory rape or marry her?? Did he forcably have sex with her to get this conviction? I'm guessing he's not an investment banker hillbillie pedophile. His parents are sure to be thrilled that they're moving in (if he gets off the charge) There are so many things wrong with this. ARGH!

[proud2BlibKansan]

31. They need parent permission

and her mom gave it.

[tocqueville]

9. what's the difference between Kansas and islamic states ?

both allow marriage of underage girls...

[Fescue4u]

41. Actually I think its 9 year olds

But you have to tell everyone that you are a prophit and that God said its ok (or something like that)

[ComerPerro]

142. What the difference between fundie Christians and fundie muslims?

The religion that they pretend to embrace.

[deadparrot]

11. Since when are 13 year olds allowed to marry?

Crimeny.

[ls317]

17. No Kidding

Damn.....

[MountainLaurel]

20. If their parents approve

Then there's no problem in the eyes of the law, in too many states.

[deadparrot]

21. How awful.

Thirteen...that's younger than my baby brother. :puke:

[Media_Lies_Daily]

53. As late as the 19th century and early 20th century in most states in...

...the U. S., marriage at the age of 13 was legal.

[deadparrot]

101. I knew that,

but I thought it was pretty much prohibited until the age of 16 in the mid-20th century.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

15. This country has a long history of 13 and 14 year old girls marrying.

Not saying it's right or wrong, just noting the history.

[Lilith Velkor]

96. This planet has a long history of 13 and 14 year old girls marrying.

What you said.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

132. And getting pregnant.

What I said.

[Lilith Velkor]

141. And raising their kids alone in a society that always blames the victim

I'm just saying.

[coloradodem2005]

16. What the hell would a 22 year old guy want with a 13 year old girl?

:puke:

[annabanana]

18. Oh I think he made that abundantly clear.......n/t

[coloradodem2005]

19. It went over my head.

[SlipperySlope]

22. 21-yr old men w/ 14-yr old women was recently NORMAL

My Grandfather was born in 1919.
My Grandmother was born in 1926.

They were married and had their first child in 1940, when she was 14 and he was 21.

Very similar ages to the case under discussion...

[Fiona]

24. Same here...

Grandfather born in 1899, grandmother in 1908. Married in 1922 when my grandmother was 14 and grandfather was 23.

They had a long, happy marriage and five children.

[FiveGoodMen]

32. Glad someone finally spoke up.

For all of you who are NOT young-earth creationists: you do realize that for most of human history, puberty signaled the beginning of mating behavior, don't you?

Do you really think cave people grunted at their children to wait several years until they were 'adults' and could be married in the church?

I don't have a thing for young girls and I'm not arguing that it's a good idea in this day of extended education, etc. for people to marry so young. But the notion that it's perverse or unnatural is just ridiculous!

[Pithlet]

35. 13 year olds aren't mature

I find your outrage at people who are disgusted by this to be ridiculous. Adults have no business having sex with 13 year old children. It is rape. I don't care if it's been happening for most of human history. All kinds of horrible things have been happening for most of human history. I don't care if someone's great great grandma married their great great grandpa and had 20 babies together. It changes nothing. I'm not saying you have to share in my outrage. But people who are repulsed by such examples of statutory rape aren't overreacting, for crying out loud.

[FiveGoodMen]

36. Statutory means

that someone made a law against it.

There have been laws against things like alcohol, inter-racial marriage, etc. etc. That didn't actually make the outlawed thing wrong.

Now, no one should be surprised if violating such a law gets them into trouble. But that doesn't make it crazy or unnatural. And it doesn't make it REAL rape. (I don't know the facts of this case; I just mean in general.)

I'm not arguing that marriages that young are a good idea, but nature clearly intended sex as soon as sex was possible. We would likely have died out if not for that (remember: average life-spans used to be much shorter).

Thirteen-year-olds in many cultures (mostly older ones -- see 'shorter life-spans') are adults.

I think yours is a knee-jerk reaction.

[Lindacooks]

43. 'Nature' intended a lot of things.

Including our lifespans to be about 40 years, and for disease to naturally control population by killing off huge numbers of people in a short amount of time. Because 'nature' intends it doesn't mean we have to think it's moral.

With the way our culture is set up, 13 year olds are NOT adults - not even close. And we, as a culture, have decided that children who are that young are not mature enough to have sex. The guy violated the law, and he should be in prison.

[FiveGoodMen]

44. So how do you decide what's moral?

[Lindacooks]

102. Common sense.

This country, and many countries around the world have decided that children need to be protected by an adult until they are 18 years old. Since our lifespan has increased so much due to modern medicine, we have decided that kids who are 15, 14, 13, are not responsible enough or mature enough to have sex.

[ultraist]

49. Right. Our culture has changed greatly over the last hundred years

The argument that, 'it was normal a hundred years ago, so it's ok today' is fallacious reasoning.

Human lifespan has increased drastically and we are NOT the society we were a century or more ago.

[fujiyama]

149. A hundred years ago

child labor was legal and quite common.

I'm surprised anyone would defend child marriages.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

58. He didn't violate the law in the state in which he got married, did he?

[ultraist]

Yes, he did violate Kansas law

He married her AFTER he got her pregnant.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

66. Show me the law.

[ultraist]

83. Post 70 or look it up yourself!

[Lindacooks]

103. Yes he did.

He had sex with a 13 year old girl. That was against the law.

[FiveGoodMen]

76. Here's what bugs me about your post:

"The guy violated the law, and he should be in prison."

What if Bush outlaws giving to PBS or drinking (again) or belonging to the Democratic party?

Lots of bad laws get made by reactionary lawmakers. An automatic 'lock-em-up' attitude fits in better with the right than the left.

Again........not assuming the situation in the article was a happy one, but locking everyone up isn't the answer either.

[Lindacooks]

108. Your arguments aren't logical.

The vast majority of people think, correctly, that 13 year old girls (they're almost ALWAYS girls) should be protected and should not be having sex. The consequences are vast, from post traumatic stress syndrome to getting pregnant. Have you ever seen a 13 year old pregnant girl????? Their bodies haven't even finished growing, and they're making another person. It's very hard on them physically, and devastating emotionally.

Grow up.

[ISUGRADIA]

124. Ding, Ding, Ding CORRECT!

Complications are much more likely when a girl has a child than an adult woman.

[Yupster]

129. When a thirteen year old is pregnant, should

she have to say who impregnated her so the man can be prosecuted if it's statutory rape?

There are law suits against Planned Parenthood currently on that point.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

50. Oh yeah, the way things were 100 years ago is the way things should be

You want to know what else happened 100 years ago? Well let's see...women were treated as property and not allowed to vote...children were beaten...wives were beaten...whites openly discriminated against blacks...


We are moving forward as a society. We now know that children are not mature at 13. So why do you insist on living by the rules of 80 years ago.

[FiveGoodMen]

71. sigh

See post 59.

Not just 100 years but all of the last million.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

116. Some girls start menstruating as early as 10. Do you want 20 year olds

having sex with 10 year olds? Girls have been recorded as having their periods as early as 4...according to you, a 20 year old having sex with a 4 year old would be ok because since she has begun to mensturate she is now an adult.

[LisaL]

119. It's absolutely true.

Because a girl is menstruating, doesn't mean she is an adult and should start popping out those babies.
It's ridiculous to even suggest such a thing.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

122. The youngest mother in the world started mensturating at 3.

She had the ovaries of a grown woman and had developed breasts and other sexual characteristics. According to some here, that makes her fair game, right?

http://www.snopes.com/pregnant/medina.asp

[antigone382]

127. Yes, and for all of the last million, women have been treated as property.

Though there are exceptions, in most cultures it was an older man marrying a young girl, and she often had little say in the matter. Also, for all of the last million years, women have been dying in pregnancy and childbirth. Now, a lot of that had to do with poor hygiene and medical ignorance, but you can't tell me that young girls marrying and bearing children before their bodies were physically ready didn't also play a major role.

Yes, we've had child-brides for all of human history (or at least all of patriarchal human history), but take a look at human history and tell me if it's a path we really want to continue down. It's a path that also includes genocide, slavery, and ruthless autocrats. None of these are noble, even though they have often been cloaked as perfectly normal, long-standing institutions; neither is the practice of marrying off young girls (or young boys for that matter, in the instances where that occurs), even ones who think they are willing.

In this case, the best option for everyone involved would have been for the girl to have an abortion, but I'd wager that in all likelihood somebody's distorted concept of the "right-to-life" (whether it was the girl, her parents, the man, or a combination of them all), led them to conclude that it would be better to put a thirteen-year-old through an enormous physical risk, and then thrust the responsibilities of wife-and-motherhood on her when in all probability she doesn't even know who she is, than to abort, or at least put up for adoption, this fetus whose life will probably be miserable.

[LisaL]

40. Exactly. Saying-well, my grandma and grandpa did it, so it

must be fine doesn't really cut it. If you grandma or grandpa owned slaves, would it be fine for some guy to get some slaves today?
A lot of things done in the past are not acceptable today, and with good reasons.

[FiveGoodMen]

46. You actually think that's a fair comparison?

Two people deciding to marry v. someone owning someone else?

[SemiCharmedQuark]

51. This wasn't 2 people deciding to marry...it was parents pushing their kid

to marry to avoid embarrassment or hell or whatever.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

56. You seem determined to push your value systems onto people that....

...lived and died long before any of us were born. Not every young couple HAD to get married at a young age...some were actually mature enough to make those decisions with the blessings of their parents.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

114. This couple lived and died before we were born?

What the hell are you talking about?

[helderheid]

171. are you fucking KIDDING ME??

[FiveGoodMen]

Where do you read that?

"After the girl became pregnant, her mother gave permission in May for Koso to take the young woman to Kansas, which allows minors to get married with parental consent."

...and...

"Koso’s lawyer, Willis Yoesel, said the girl’s mother and Koso’s parents approved of the marriage. He said the girl’s father has not lived with the family for some time."

I have no idea what really happened or what these people are like. I'm not suggesting that any of this was a good idea. But you seem to be adding things to the story that are not in the article.

In any case, isn't it better to see if the marriage works out now that it's done?

[ISUGRADIA]

125. Sorry, but the mental quivalency between a 13yo and 23 yo

is a wide gulf. Society's values change but adult-child sex is just pervy.

[electron_blue]

55. bingo

I bet 100 yrs ago a 21 yr old marrying a 13yr old was a lot like ownership

[FiveGoodMen]

59. Because of the inequality between the sexes

that might be true.

Still, we evolved to mate at a certain age just like we evolved digestive systems capable of eating the kinds of food that were available.

It might be undesirable in a modern civilized society for young people to mate, but it can't really be that bad from a biological point of view -- it's how evolution fine-tuned us for a million years or more.

[electron_blue]

117. I disagree

with what you said about it not being that bad from a biological point of view.

Actually I think a good argument can be made from a biological point of view that more women and more babies will survive over generations, thus increasing dramatically the global population, if girls/women have babies at older ages (such as 19-20 or older) and not when they are first physically able to (such as 12-13 or even 8-9). In fact, it's exactly what has happened over the last 100 yrs.

Besides, at some point we as society have to decide whether we will allow the biologically-driven urges to override the best interest of the children.

(Gawd, now I sound like Rick Santorum, gag)

[Nikia]

156. I think that it is bad from a biological point of view too

It is well known that young girls do not survive childbirth as well as adult women. In addition, the babies are less likely to survive or have problems. This continues to be a problem in the third world.
Even if a woman is destined to die at age 40, if not before then, she can easily have multiple children if she starts having children at 20 instead of 12. If she starts at 12, she is more likely to lose her first children or die in childbirth.
A man choosing a young girl and having complete control over her sexually is a good biological strategy for him though because it assures him that the child is his. It is not in her best interests biologically. An adult male having sex with a young female has always been about control. Our more egalitarian society realizes this and that is why there are statutory rape laws.

[Clark2008]

184. I guess... but I'm 35 and in two weeks I could become pregnant

just as pregnant.

And probably still have a healthy child. Not probably... more than likely.

Evolution is changing.

BTW, my first child was at 29.

[Fiona]

64. believe me

nobody ever owned my grandmother.

[LisaL]

75. Wasn't wife considered property of her husband not so long ago?

[FiveGoodMen]

78. Some places, yes, some places no but you're changing the subject

[LisaL]

81. No, I am not changing a subject.

Just because something was accepted years ago, doesn't mean it still has to be accepted today.

[FiveGoodMen]

85. Not just saying it was accepted.

Saying we, as a species, evolved for it.

[LisaL]

92. Is pedophilia something our species evolved for?

Well, that's news for me.

[FiveGoodMen]

97. If it evolved, it wasn't pedophilia

That's just a legal definition that's been recently tacked on.

Look: in posts 22 & 24 two DU members said their grandparents married that young and did well.

You've just called their grandparents pedophiles without knowing anything about them. Doesn't anyone feel a little bad about that? I'd want to kick your ass!

This is the kind of one-size-fits-all and damn-those-who-won't-obey-me attitude that's common among the religious right.

[LisaL]

100. If you don't like the definition of a pedophile, it's not my fault.

I didn't come up with it.
:spank:

[Lindacooks]

128. Just ignore him. I did. It's much easier!

[Niccolo_Macchiavelli]

199. shagging a teen isn't pedophilia

that would be shagging a pre-teen.


No matter the stance the idiot could have used a condom at the very least.

[helderheid]

167. 157

[mixedview]

73. individuals who have gone through puberty are both adults

from a biological perspective. As long as a female can produce eggs and a male can produce sperm they are biological adults.


Statutory rape is complete bullshit - an unfair and harsh punishment for what is natural - not pedophilic - behavior for teens and young adults. They are going to do it anyway - no law is going to stop them - and it is completely unfair that the boy is the one who has to pay the price (and such a high one - rape) for a mutual and consentual act.

[LisaL]

79. So, as long as she gone trough puberty, she is an adult?

So, can she get a driver's license? Can she get a good paying job to support that baby? Can she legally drink or smoke? No! So, what kind of freaking adult is she at 13?
:eyes:

[mixedview]

88. an adult from a biological perspective - 18 is just some arbitrary

age some politician pulled out of his ass to determine what an "adult" is.

People mature at different ages, and their sexual activity (as long as it's consentual) is no business of the government.

[LisaL]

89. People mature at different ages?

At 13, she is unable to drive, drink, smoke, or support that baby.
21 year old man has no business messing with her. Is there some shortage of 21 year old women I don't know nothing about, so he must mess with a 13 year old little girl?

[mixedview]

99. It's not our place to say

I hate to break this to you - but most older teen guys/early twenties think the HS girls - including the freshmen (who are usually 14) are HAWT - and vice versa. This is usually about sex and short term relationships - not lifetime committments. And 21 year old women are usually looking for men in their upper twenties or older - not some 21 year old guy who is still a boy in her eyes.

Just a fact of life people. Older men, younger women. Fact of life.

[helderheid]

168. 157

[Yupster]

126. My greatgrandfather came to this country

a married man with his wife and newborn.

When his wife died soon after, he did what any other man would do in his position.

He brought her younger sister over and married her. They had three more kids.

[SoCalDem]

194. Consider how life was back then..and the lifespans

teens in an isolated rural area, would be "betrothed" by families, to enhance the land holdings and perhaps "join" farmlands.. Girls often did not go to school past 6th grade, so a wedding soon afterwards might not have been so odd.:shrug:

[SemiCharmedQuark]

47. Oh yeah, and people used to beat their children senseless as well

If they did it 100 years ago, it must be right.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

60. And that has what to do with getting married at a young age?

[SemiCharmedQuark]

118. It has to do with the "it's ok because we've done it for years" bullshit.

That is total crap, and absolutely no reason to continue behaviors.

[FiveGoodMen]

61. See post 59 re: evolution.

This is not just about cultural standards. It's also about biology.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

120. Biology would have some girls begining their periods by age 9

And according to you, they'd then be ready for marriage.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

54. My 3rd great grandfather was born in 1797 and my 3rd great....

...grandmother was born in 1801.

They were married on Feb 15, 1814.

He was 17 and she was 13.

[xmas74]

136. Mother was 15 and father was 21

when they had me in the mid-seventies. They married when my Mom turned 16.
The comments on this thread make me feel like shit. They make me feel like so many on DU think I am white trash and that I don't deserve to be here.
(btw-my parents were married in a blue state-Illinois. They drove there from Wisconsin).

[Niccolo_Macchiavelli]

201. bwah don't give shit about it

your ancestors don't determine if your white trash. Only you do.


When the feelings are there, and yes it just happens that people fall in love for people that are too poor, too young, too weird, "wrong" skinned too.

Love happens, shit happens... if he's only a pussyhunter he'll gonna pay a long time, if its love they both got their chance to prove it.

[xmas74]

210. If he were a "pussyhunter" he never would have married

her. I think that he has proven that he wants to be involved in their lives. I am worried about the ramifications of his possible inprisonment on his unborn child. I believe that we might have doomed this child to a life of poverty by taking away their father. He wants to be a father-let him! It's better than so many others are doing right now.
I still think that the prosecutor is using this as an election year issue (since I believe that he was up for reelection in '06). At least this "boy" has owned up to his actions. Maybe sleeping w/ someone who was underage was a poor judgment decision but he is trying to do something about it. He wants to be a part of her life and the life of his child. I think that his wanting to stay in the picture offers this child a chance at a better life than if he had abandoned the mother (which is much more common nowadays).

[NoQuarter]

23. Is it possible

to change one's birth certificate to remove Kansas as one's birth state? Creationism as science, child mothers/brides (with parental blessing)... what an embarrassment.

so overcome with humiliation, I can no longer spell

[doodadem]

25. This same thing recently happened in Fresno

I think the girl was 15 when preggers, 16 when married. Guy was early 20's. He was not convicted. And actually, the pictures/interviews with the couple--they were hopelessly in love.

[sweetheart]

26. Does that law apply to Emancipated Minors?

I thought that all minors who became "married" automatically had
"emancipated" status. ?

[Nevernose]

27. The crime was committed before she got married

The man had sex w/ an underage girl, then she got pregnant, and then they got married.

[sweetheart]

30. Well, ain't that a crime from the age of reason

In them olden days, that she was pregnant before would have been lost
data in a shotgun wedding... but not anymore with DNA testing and all.

If he loves her, and she him, they should leave them alone. All the
police nazis will achieve is to fuck up a kid, costing taxpayers lotsa
money in the long run.

[Jacobin]

28. Oh my. A fundie's brain twister

what to do what to do......

[ls317]

29. Calling all Kansas Residents

Can someone pls provide some type of clarity of what the law reads on this issue?? In the State of Kansas

[ultraist]

48. Kansas law, as per the article

Kansas law, however, sets no minimum marriage age, although case law sets the minimum age at 14 for boys and 12 for girls. The marriage must be approved by both parents or guardian, or by a district court judge, said Whitney Watson, spokesman for Kansas Attorney General Phill Kline. A judge also must approve if only one parent approves.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

62. Looks like that satisfied the law in Kansas, doesn't it?

[ultraist]

67. No, he had sex with her BEFORE they married

Did you read the article? He married her after he got her pregnant.

Kansas needs to update their laws on marriage!

[Media_Lies_Daily]

69. What law did they break in Kansas?

[ultraist]

72. Rape

Read the article. I posted the Kansas statute that stipulates having sex with someone under 14 is rape. He had sex with her when she was 13.

[proud2BlibKansan]

34. Now where is ole double L phiLL ??

That is our AG here in Kansass. PhiLL Kline. He's the one who was trying to get access to private medical records and has been trying to shut down women's clinics across the state. He claims the clinics are not reporting children being raped.

Hey, PhiLL, you missed one!!!

[Media_Lies_Daily]

65. When did the word "rape" get mentioned in this story?

[ultraist]

70. According to Kansas statute, he did rape her

http://www.ageofconsent.com/kansas.htm

Statutes:

21-3502. Rape. (a) Rape is:
(1) Sexual intercourse with a person who does not consent to the sexual intercourse, under any of the following circumstances:
(A) When the victim is overcome by force or fear;
(B) when the victim is unconscious or physically powerless; or
(C) when the victim is incapable of giving consent because of mental deficiency or disease, or when the victim is incapable of giving consent because of the effect of any alcoholic liquor, narcotic, drug or other substance, which condition was known by the offender or was reasonably apparent to the offender;
(2) sexual intercourse with a child who is under 14 years of age;

The article states that he got her pregnant when she was 13.

[proud2BlibKansan]

91. Didn't have to say the word

She was 13. He had sex with her. That's rape in most states.

[LisaL]

104. What exactly do you think they are charging him with?

Did you not see he is charged with sexual assault?

[meg]

38. Very misleading title

Should be adult male impregnates young teenage girl then marries her in a poor attempt to cover up his crime and maximize her pain.

[Deja Q]

39. Yeah but that'd take up too much space! And it got your attention too...

:D

[WillyT]

42. Dontcha Just LOVE... The Sanctity Of Marriage ???

:rofl::evilgrin::rofl:

[dsc]

45. This kind of thing happens all too often

and is prosecuted all too rarely. I taught our school's fifth period class, an afterschool class for students who would have been one credit shy of graduation but for that class. The vast majority of the students in that class were females and the majority of them had become pregnant during a semester of their high school years thus failing enough credits to need that class. I don't think a single one of those students had been impregnated by a younger person and a couple had been impregnated at below 16 by men in their 20's. IMO those men should have been jailed. Sadly all too often they just get off scot free.

[proud2BlibKansan]

95. This is a problem where I work also

Men in their 20s and 30s are dating girls still in middle school. Our middle schools are now posting security guards at the side doors to keep the girls from ditching school to see their 'boyfriends'. The men pull up to the side door and sit there like vultures. My friend who works in a middle school says it is just repulsive, that they have a line of cars sitting on the street by the side door nearly every day. She said it reminds her of johns waiting for hookers.

[dsc]

138. and they should be treated at least as badly as Johns

Why not take their cars away from them? Jail them? Incidently your situation actually sounds worse in that at least I work at a high school.

[proud2BlibKansan]

160. The school district is aggressively addressing this issue

At the middle school where this is a problem, cops now circle the school at dismissal time. They can't arrest these men for just picking up these girls, but the cops' presence has helped intimidate the men. Since most are probably illegal anyway, they tend to stay away from large numbers of cop cars.

[dsc]

163. I am glad they are doing something

It is so aggravating to hear of this and hear the usual we can't do anything.

[me b zola]

183. Have they contacted the girls parents?

My grandaughters are too young for school. But when that day comes if my son ***ever*** got a phone call from their school that grown men were involved with his daughters those preditory creeps would soon lose ***all*** desire to seek out my grand daughters **ever** again.

[proud2BlibKansan]

189. I don't know

Good question - these girls are Hispanic and in that culture, this is far more acceptable. So I don't know if contacting the parents would help other than informing them that what is acceptable in Mexico, etc can be illegal in the USA.

[me b zola]

191. To some degree it is more acceptable in the Hispanic comunity

But the fact that these guys are waiting for them at school may be an indication that this is not family approved behavior.

My son is Hispanic and he and his father (who was born in MX) would never let a grown man near my son's half sister. It really does depend upon the family and the situation.


What a crazy world we live in. I fear for all three of my Grand-babies.

[Judi Lynn]

200. That's creepy, and it'd be comical, if it weren't so bad for the kids.

Looking back at other older males I've known who have tried to connect with people far away from their own age group, it was ALWAYS the case that they were simply primitive, socially retarded, and couldn't keep up with the others of their own age.

A man like that would eventually bore a girl senseless, after the novelty wore off. Intelligent girls aren't interested in backward folks in the first place. Those people are old, large babies. Life's already challenging without having to be emotionally strong enough to compensate for their infirmities! They're a burden. Emotional vampires. The "vultures" image is right on target.



I "knew" a man who admitted he spent his lunch time in the summers parked near city pools watching the young female kids. As soon as he said that I never saw him as a viable person again, as if we had a carrot working among us.

Follow them back to their own environments, you'll see they have no power there. None. They are very limited.

[mixedview]

57. It should be illegal - but I'm tired of those yelling "pedophilia "

everytime an older boy (because that's exactly what he is) has sex with a younger girl. Maybe he is very immature and she is very mature. I've known teenage girls who look like they're 25, and I I've known 18-20something boys who looked like young teenagers.

It is completely normal from a biological and psychological perspective for older boys to want to have sex with younger girls and vice versa, as long as they are post puberty, there is nothing pedophilic about it - even though the Nancy Grace's of the world would make us think this is such an abnormal thing.

Sheesh. To pretend this is not something that happens everywhere in America everyday.. I went to HS in NYC and I clearly remember the freshman girls chasing the older boys (18+) with cars who were not even in HS but used to show up after school - the cool guy drug dealer types. It is a two way street - it's not like the boys are just going after them and raping them - c'mon now.

To me, the age of consent should be 16. And if the boy is within 4 years or so - like say a 15yr old with a 19yr old - it shouldn't matter - that is not rape no matter how much some moralists on the right and left want to say it is. That is reality and human nature.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

63. Oh come off it, every responsible parents knows that

even if a 13-year-old girl gets a crush on an older male, she's not ready for a relationship that could lead to pregnancy.

And yes, there is something creepy about a 22-year-old guy who is lusting after 13-year-olds. It's highly unlikely that he has found his soulmate and more likely that he's scared of women his own age and maybe has dominance issues so that he can perform only with someone whom he sees as decidedly inferior and non-threatening.

What happened in earlier times is not relevant to today.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

68. Yeah....all that biological stuff should be treated as if it doesn't exist

[Lydia Leftcoast]

74. I take it that you are neither female nor the parent of a daughter

or else you wouldn't say such things.

I get an uncomfortable sense of "But the little ____ wanted it" from you.

[ultraist]

77. Yeah, all that misogynistic cultural stuff should be treated as if...

it didn't exist. :eyes:

[LisaL]

87. What biological stuff?

What, there were no 21 year old women around for him to breed with?

[mixedview]

93. in general, men are not attracted to women their age and vice versa

and I'm sure any scientific study would show this.

Women tend to choose older mates. Men tend to choose younger ones. This is true across cultural and racial lines.

Just a politically incorrect fact of life - human nature often is.

[ultraist]

94. BS! What a lame justification for rape

In the United States, rape is the most serious form of sexual assault punishable by law, but the definition of what constitutes rape varies from state to state. C 1 Changing Attitudes
As women gained greater legal protections under civil rights laws and acquired more political equality, traditional rape laws came under attack. Beginning in the 1960s, members of the women’s movement assailed many of the assumptions on which rape laws were based. For example, they criticized the fact that rape laws were preoccupied with protecting men from false accusations. According to these activists, the laws not only failed to adequately protect women, they often did women harm. Citing research indicating that women who resisted rapists were more likely to incur serious physical injury, reformers called into question the appropriateness of the utmost resistance doctrine.

C 2 Legal Reforms

In the 1970s most states began to change their laws concerning rape. Many states redefined rape and eliminated some of the common law doctrines and their biases against victims. Beginning with Massachusetts in 1968 and Tennessee in 1971, most states have ended the requirement—usually extremely difficult to meet—that a complainant, or alleged rape victim, produce corroborating evidence to the crime. Some states have passed laws enabling males to press charges of sexual assault

III Types of Rape

As attitudes about sexuality and gender equality continue to change, lawmakers and legal reformers struggle to redefine what behaviors constitute rape. Some argue that rape should be defined as any nonconsensual sexual intercourse, without any special requirement to prove use of force. This proposal has been highly controversial. However, as a result of changing societal perceptions, laws now prohibit several different types of rape.


D Statutory Rape

Sexual intercourse with a person who has not reached the age of consent is known as statutory rape. The age of consent for sexual intercourse varies depending on state law, but is no higher than 18 in any state. Under most state laws, the younger the victim is, the greater the punishment. Statutory rape laws traditionally treated men or boys as the prospective offenders and young women or girls as prospective victims. However, some jurisdictions have enacted gender-neutral statutory rape laws. States also typically treat sexual intercourse as rape if the victim is considered incapable of giving consent for a reason other than age. For example, if a person has sexual intercourse with someone who is drugged or asleep, or who is mentally retarded, that person may be found guilty of rape.

[mixedview]

107. As I stated in another post - I think statutory rape is complete

bullshit, designed to punish the boy, in what is a consensual and mutual act.

Yes - punish the real rapists - those who force sex on another person without their consent - not teenagers and young adults having consensual sex - which they are going to do anyway - regardless of how much some on the right and left want to scream about it. Make all the laws you want, it's not going to stop horny kids for doing what they've always done.

[LisaL]

109. A child can not consent to sex.

According to the law.
So, if you don't like it-too bad.

[blonndee]

115. I'm with you, FWIW. And I had sex at a VERY young age...

willingly. Now that I'm an adult I realize I was not capable at 14 of making a responsible decision to have sex with a 21-year old.

And I also agree with the people who say it's just plain CREEPY for a guy of that age to have sex with a little girl. What's wrong with him that he can't get with someone closer to his own age? That's the question that should really make people think about this situation.

I'm not for legislating morality or interfering in people's sex lives, but for the love of god, a 13 year old? I don't care how freaking "mature" she may be (which I allow, girls are often more mature than boys of their own age), that's no excuse for this shit.

[helderheid]

157. when I was 13 I had consensual sexual contact with a man in his 30s

I didn't know any better and I was curious about sex - he ended up stalking me and as I grew older and DID know better, I realized he was a pedophile and I had been molested. For YEARS I blamed myself for what happened. To make it worse, I had my first orgasm due to our contact. I was filled with shame for years. There is NOTHING natural about an adult lusting after a child.

[helderheid]

173. too scary to touch? I WAS that 13 year old girl.

[Anarcho-Socialist]

175. I'm sorry to hear about your abuse

I hope you've managed to make a good life for yourself the best you can. It can't imagine what it's like to have that experience hanging over you.

[helderheid]

176. thanks

I'm okay now.

I really appreciate the reply. I spent a very long time hiding from this. Your compassion means a great deal to me. Thank you.

[helderheid]

180. going to bed but I wanted to thank you for understanding.

[Anarcho-Socialist]

206. You are very welcome

:hi: :hug:

[Misunderestimator]

207. So sorry, helderheid... that sort of thing happens far too often.

Definitely not your fault. :hug:

[helderheid]

169. 157

[Warren DeMontague]

182. 18 & 17 is one thing;

22 and 13 something entirely different.

[LostinVA]

214. I know the law in NC used to be there couldn't be more than

a certain numbers of years between the two for it to be statutory rape. Say, a 19-year-old boy having sex with a 17-year-old girl. I think it was three years. I personally think that's a good rule of thumb.

[LostinVA]

213. Not anyone I know

I'm 40, and all of my friends, coworkers, and family members tend to marry people close to their own age. We would probably disown a family member who was 22-years-old and impregnated and married a little girl.

[LisaL]

98. The guy is a pedophile by definition.

He is at least 16 year old and five years older than his victim-he is a pedophile.
Whether you like it or not.

[ultraist]

105. That's true

The American Psychiatric Association defines Pedophilia:

A pedophile is a person who over at least a 6 month period has recurrent, intense sexually arousing fantasies, sexual urges, or behaviors involving sexual activity with a prepubescent child or children (age 13 years or younger). The fantasies, sexual urges, or behaviors cause clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning. The person is at least age 16 years and at least 5 years older than the child or children. Not to include an individual in late adolescence involved in an ongoing sexual relationship with a 12 or 13 year old (straight or gay). Individuals with pedophilia generally report an attraction to children of a particular age range. Some individuals prefer males, others prefer females, and some are aroused by both males and females. Pedophila involving female victims is reported more than pedophilia involving male victims.

Reference; Diagnostic And Statistical Manual Of Mental Disorders, 4th Edition, American Psychiatric Association, 1994.

[Yupster]

131. A 13 year old girl is

pre-pubescent?

[mixedview]

110. legally and politically, but not according to science. /eom

[LisaL]

111. Science? You haven't provided any links to your theories.

Where did you get this info? Websites promoting pedophilia because it's all so natural?

[mixedview]

112. biological fact - do you understand why females produce eggs

and males produce sperm? Do you know why nature causes these things to happen ? Hmmmmm. I wonder why nature does this... why nature turns on all of those hormones and prepares the body for reproduction. Hmmmmmm.... :eyes:

[LisaL]

113. Reproduction? So, 13 year old should be reproducing cause

nature says so? What rock did you climb out from?

[mixedview]

123. No, I don't think a 13yr old should. But I don't think

it is my business or the business of the state to criminalize consensual sexual activity - activity that is biologically normal and inevitable - no law will ever stop it. This is a victimless "crime". I feel the same way about marijuana use and prostitution. Regulate it, but don't criminalize something that normal human beings are going to do anyway, something they willfully engage in.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

198. Victimless? Bullshit! This is pediophelia. She Is a CHILD and she is

a VICTIM.

[ultraist]

121. According to your premise...

It's ok for a 12 year old girl, who has started her period, to have sex with a 50 year old man. And to that I say, DISGUSTING!

[LostinVA]

212. 22 is not being "an older boy"

It's being a young man. An adult. My niece is 14-years-old, and she is a child. Any 22-year-old man who wants to f*ck a kid is sick. This is pedophilia -- I disagree with the poster up thread on this. And rape. Not "statutory" rape, that's an 18-year-old having sex with a 17-year-old, but rape. A 13-year-old kid cannot give educated consent.

People go to prison for this. And should.

And, for the record, I know the family tree on both sides of my family back +200 years, and there are NO child brides. That only happened in very specific cultures and areas. This was NOT the norm in most Western European countries or the US.

[mixedview]

217. When Britney Spears came out she was a kid - under 18 -

She was dancing around on MTV with her sexy school girl outfit.

And we all wanted to f--k her. Especially because she was under 18. The whole 'fresh, ripe, virginal, jail bait' thing.

If this guy is a pedophile, then most normal males are also.

Everyone wants to pretend this isn't a fact of life - that teenage girls aren't attracted to older boys/young men and vice versa - and that they don't act on it some of the time.

It's complete bullshit that this poor guy has to pay for normal youth behavior.. for consensual sex.. and such a high one - rape for crying out loud. This is why I am a libertarian - I can't see this type of injustice and just smile it off. Bullshit.

Whenever people start screaming about 'the children' or about the private sex life of others - it is a TELLTALE sign of another agenda. Because it is NEVER really about the children.

[shimmergal]

80. Recent research shows that

human adulthood isn't really achieved until around age 25. Before that age, people lack the ability to weigh long-range consequences, and several other markers of maturity. I daresay most parents who've raised children to that age and beyond know this! Also, backing up folk wisdom, young women tend to reach the final stage of mental/emotional adulthood at a somewhat earlier age than young men do.

So, if she's too young to get married, maybe he is too. Maybe 25 should be the minimum age for marriage! And what about army recruiters going after 18-year-olds? Are they (the 18-year-olds) really able to understand the consequences of enlisting?

The fact is, 18- and 21- year-old adulthood are mostly legal artifacts. I don't know what the answer is, but unfortunately a certain number of 13-year-olds are going to have sex regardless of the law. It's not always less problematic if their partner is also a 13 or 14 year old, either. Put two clueless adolescents together and they're also ripe for problems. The biggest continuing problem in this case (assuming there was no force or deception to the sex) is, actually, the pregnancy. The early or forced marriages from 100-years-ago were a way that society evolved to deal with such cases. We've tossed out this solution but haven't come up with any substitute, except jail for the man, which doesn't really solve anything.

[ultraist]

86. The RAPE is a real problem in this case

According to Kansas statute, he raped her. She was only 13 and he was an adult of 21.

It sounds as though he groomed her, as molestors do with their victims, so it appeared to be consentual. This is why we have rape and molestation laws. So ADULTS understand that pushing a CHILD into having sex with them is wrong.

[coloradodem2005]

177. "Groomed"?

[ohio_liberal]

82. Ok, so when I was 22

sex with a 13 year old did not seem like a good thing.

[lukasahero]

140. Bless your heart

Some common sense appears in this thread. For whatever reason, be it a lack of physical attraction to a child or a mature understanding that the grown up in any situation should be more responsible than said child. Thank you for that.

[More Than A Feeling]

84. Going by the letter of the law

if what he has done is proved or he pleads guilty, then he should be punished.

Now, depending on the interaction between the girl and the boy, and what their parents have to say, would I give him the maximum, if I were judge? Most likely I would not.

The fact that he married her, and her parents consented, and (hopefully!) she consented, weighs in his favor, IMHO.

[Warren DeMontague]

106. Goodness, Gracious, Great Balls Of Fire!

...sorry, I don't know what hit me, there.

[kestrel91316]

130. I smell a pedophile apologist on this thread.......PHEW-EEEE

[mixedview]

133. To all the moralists: So, Elvis was a pedophile and a rapist ?

Besides, the cameo beauty was only fourteen when they met during Elvis' famed tour of duty in Wiesbaden, West Germany, in 1959. There had been times at first when the ten years between them seemed insurmountable. At twenty-four, Elvis was already a legend, and he was naturally confused about his feelings for the ninth grade student living overseas with her mother and Air Force captain stepfather. 'We had a very romantic relationship,' says Priscilla, 'but Elvis was always conscious of the age difference. He didn't want `jail bait' to dampen his image, and he was protective of throwing me to the media. He also knew he would be leaving Germany and didn't want to hurt me.'

http://www.rom101.com/storyview.jsp?storyid=463

[SoCalDem]

190. Since you mentioned it, YES..

Elvis picked the "bud", then waited for it to flower (or did he?) and because he was rich and famous, the media treated it all like a "true romance", he got away with it.

He groomed Priscilla, and her parents "sold" her to him..

[mixedview]

192. and all the guys who thought Britney Spears was HAWT when at age 16

she appeared in the 'baby one more time' music video ? They had pedophilic lust in their hearts too ? Because I can remember very clearly when that video came out, with little Britney dancing around in her sexy school girl outfit - well many of the guys I knew - young and old, men of all races - thought it was hot, hot, hot.

Seriously, I'm trying to understand this. Any guy who has ever fantasized about 'naughty school girls' - is a potential pedophile and/or potential child rapist ?

[SoCalDem]

193. Why do you think the producers put out that stuff?

To appeal to men's lustful side.. Most guys look, but do not touch.. That's the difference:(

Not difficult to understand..

[mixedview]

196. That's not what I'm asking. I'm not asking about 'lust' in general.

I'm asking if you and those on your side of the argument think "naughty school girl" type fantasies involving underaged/adolescent girls - the type of fantasies many adult males had about an underaged Britney Spears and other so-called "pop-tarts" - indicate some type of latent pedophilia/child rape desires ?

What about adult males who look at sexual images involving females of legal age marketed to look much younger than 18/very adolescent - for example, the "barely legal/teen" genre of mainstream porn ? Is this some type of latent pedophilia/child rape desire ?

[SoCalDem]

197. Could be..

:shrug:

[mixedview]

202. If so, then perhaps most of the male population should be jailed then,

or at the very least, undergo court ordered treatment for pedophilia/child rape thoughts. We must show them pictures of high school girls and see if they are even slightly aroused by it - if so, they are pedophiles. We must confiscate any Britney pictures they may have, or any "barely legal" porn they may have. We must ban all pre-18 sexy Britney videos from MTV - it's kiddie porn.

After all, we don't want all of those dangerous males out there secretly harboring impure thoughts about adolescent females. It's criminal, and we must eradicate this normal biological tendency in males to be attracted to post pubescent females - even females 18-21 are not safe - they are still too desirable - we can't risk it - we must make sure men only date women their age - we must make a law that only people of the same age can have sex - this is the only way to save society...

:sarcasm:

[norml]

134. It's being covered by The Washington Post, The New York Times

and it's being covered in Jamaica and South Africa.

By tomorrow it will be getting even more coverage.

The right wing media whores are already picking up on it.

This was never just a local story.

It's big and it's going to get bigger.

I'm talking media circus and Court TV big.

Maybe even made for TV movie big.

We'll see.

[LittleClarkie]

135. Well hell, if it was good enough for Jerry Lee Lewis

All they had to do was head south. No probs.

[norml]

143. Just a local story my ass! This is getting world wide coverage.

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Man Charged With Having Sex With 14-Year-Old Wife
WNBC, NY - 1 hour ago
... Matthew Koso, 22, was charged Monday with first-degree sexual assault, punishable by up to 50 years in prison. He was released on $7,500 bail pending an Aug. ...

'Pedophile' weds pregnant girl, 13
Australian, Australia - 1 hour ago
... with the problem". Matthew Koso, 22, was charged with first-degree sexual assault, punishable by up to 50 years in prison. He was ...

Nebraska man charged with having sex with 13-year-old wife
CourtTV - 2 hours ago
... Matthew Koso, 22, was charged Monday with first-degree sexual assault, punishable by up to 50 years in prison. He was released on $7,500 bail pending an Aug. ...

Man Charged With Assaulting Young Wife
WIBW, KS - 2 hours ago
Matthew Koso married the girl, who's also from Nebraska, in. ... Koso is free on 75-hundred-dollars bail to await a preliminary hearing August 17th.

Should Husband Be Prosecuted For Premarital Sex With Child Bride?
Nebraska StatePaper.com, NE - 3 hours ago
... The groom, Matt Koso, was a special education client when he was in school. He is now 22. ... If convicted, Koso could face a sentence of one year to 50 years. ...

Man is a husband, and a pedophile to same girl
KTVO, MO - 3 hours ago
... But Matthew Koso's attorney says Koso and the girl -- with the support of their families -- "made a responsible decision to try to cope with the problem.". ...

Man Charged With Having Sex With 14-Year-Old Wife
Louisville Channel.com, KY - 3 hours ago
... But Matthew Koso's attorney says Koso and the girl -- with the support of their families -- "made a responsible decision to try to cope with the problem.". ...

AROUND THE NATION
NorthJersey.com, NJ - 4 hours ago
... Matthew Koso, 22, was charged Monday with first-degree sexual assault, punishable by up to 50 years in prison. He was released on $7,500 bail pending an Aug. ...

Man Charged With Having Sex With 14-Year-Old Wife
NBC 10.com, PA - 4 hours ago
... Matthew Koso, 22, was charged Monday with first-degree sexual assault, punishable by up to 50 years in prison. He was released on $7,500 bail pending an Aug. ...

Husband charged for having sex with underage wife, 13
Chicago Tribune, United States - 6 hours ago
... Matthew Koso, 22, was charged Monday with first-degree sexual assault, punishable by up to 50 years in prison. After the girl became ...


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[norml]

144. You might remember Falls City from the 1999 movie Boys Don't Cry.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0171804/

[VelmaD]

147. I can't believe some of you people...

are defending this guy. 21 year olds should not be having sex with 13 year olds. Period. At worst he raped a child and at best he took advantage of someone who is not old enough to have an equal relationship with an adult.

He's a sick fucker and anyone who thinks what he did was ok is a sick fucker too.

So what girls that young were married off in the past. Are you actually defending the old system where girls were married off against their will to men old enough to be their fathers? Is that what you would want for your mother or sister or your own daughter?

I cannot believe this shit.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

148. Thank you Velma for stating my opinion on this to a tee!

She was a Little Girl when he RAPED her, dammit! She is still a CHILD!!!! Let's see these people be so blaise about it when it's their child!!!!

[ProfessorGAC]

150. Nor Can I

Good rant, Velma. Someone in another thread actually suggested the umbrage was rooted in puritanism. I guess one has to be a puritan to object to statutory rape.
The Professor

[VelmaD]

152. I am in a high-rant mode...

and DU has been a target rich environment the last couple of days.

Thank you kind sir for the compliment. :)

[Bucky]

151. VelmaD speaks for me

My ancestors used to own slaves, kill Indians to take their land, kill Irish to take their land, kill Cro-Magnons to take their land. I don't consider any of it appropriate behavior. Well, maybe the thing with the Cro-Mags--they were right bastards. But the rest... huh uh.

[VelmaD]

153. hey...no Crog-Magnon bashing...

but otherwise thanks. :)

[helderheid]

158. THANK YOU. See my post 157

I hope she can get some counseling - I feel so sorry for her. I cannot fathom being pregnant at that age. What is WRONG with some of these DUers???

[helderheid]

166. Take it from someone who knows.

[helderheid]

170. 157

[proud2BlibKansan]

174. Amen VelmaD

My sentiments exactly.

[LostinVA]

215. Hey, it's in the Old Testament!

If a guy rapes a single woman, he has to marry her to make it right. This is just good old time religion. <gag>

[helderheid]

172. I WENT THROUGH THIS !57

[Old and In the Way]

178. As a father, I can only imagine how I'd have reacted to a 22 YO

having sex with my 13 YO daughter. I probably wouldn't be looking for a legal redress of the situation. It's the emotional maturity, not the physical maturity.

[Warren DeMontague]

179. There's no point in having an age of consent

if it's not going to be enforced.

(Edit: Also, it looks like the Law in Kansas re: 12 and 14 yr olds getting married is horribly fucked up... of course, this is the place where 1/3 of the people apparently believe that the Bible has the best Scientific explanation for how life developed on Earth. So, once again, there is your heartland "values and common sense" in action.)

Now I don't think, for example, that the 18 year old HS senior who has sex with his 17 yr old girlfriend- and her parents decide to report him- should be thrown in jail and considered a "sex offender", as happens in some places...

THAT SAID, 22 & 13 is quite a bit different; there's something wrong there.

And, for the record, there was probably something wrong with Jerry Lee Lewis, too. To boot, a lot of fucked up behavior used to be the norm in places like the American South.

[Anarcho-Socialist]

181. I hope he is given due process and if he's guilty

he should go to jail for life. It's pretty sick.

13 year olds aren't mature enough to understand the emotional ramifications of sex. When I was 13, I certainly didn't and I'm very glad that nothing like that happened to me.

No adult should be going with a child. What would any adult want from being with a 13-year old? What could a 22 year old possibly have in common with a 13-year old? There is something wrong with anyone who lusts after a child still in biological development.

[mixedview]

195. what would be sick is to destroy this kid's life for no good reason

Maybe he did something immoral, but not criminal. No rape took place. The only real rape that will take place is when he is sent to prison (but of course society does nothing about prison rape - it's quite ok for a guy to be raped in jail - not a peep out of anyone right or left about the human rights of male prisoners).

There needs to be a movement in this country to protect boys - nobody is standing up for them.

you wrote: "What would any adult want from being with a 13-year old?"

Why do 40yr old rich guys seek out 18yr old models ? Because males tend to find younger females sexually appealing, pretty, submissive, demure, angelic, etc. And some girls/women find older men to be exciting, interesting, important, dominant, confident, etc. It has little to do with 'what they have in common' or 'emotional ramifications' or any of that. Dominance chases submission and vice versa - it is a basic dynamic of sex/mating, and is true for most animals including humans.

[Catrina]

185. Looks like the man may

have had some problems ~

Should Husband Be Prosecuted For Premarital Sex With Child Bride?
Nebraska StatePaper.com, NE - 3 hours ago

... The groom, Matt Koso, was a special education client when he was in school. He is now 22. ...

Seems there's more to the story that we are not aware of .....

[loudsue]

186. Last weekend I went to a 50th Wedding Anniversary Party.....

My friends, who were having the 50th wedding anniversary were 65 and 75 years old. They were married when she was 15, and he was 25.

Their first son was born when she was 16. They are remarkably "in love", 50 years after the "event". They danced, kissed, and had the time of their lives at the party. It was really beautiful. The "best man" and "maid of honor" at their wedding were there... they're married, too, still. There were over 70 guests at the party, from all over the world: England, Canada, and many of the 50 States.

Many people, especially from more rural areas, married young 50 years ago. In fact, when I was in high school, a couple got married (back in 1967... 38 years ago) when they were Juniors, and that was in an urban area. They are still married today, and have 4 grown children.

Even today, people in rural areas often mature faster, and marry younger, simply because there is an environment of stability and support and tradition that CAN support that.

I cannot IMAGINE a young, urbanite girl marrying young, and making a happy life out of it, but that doesn't mean it can't happen. I also can't imagine a 25 year old or 21 year old man being SERIOUS about a girl that young. But that doesn't mean it can't happen.

Love is a strange thing. And sometimes, that's exactly what it is: LOVE. I don't mean TeeVee love...I mean REAL, crazy, tie-your-shoes-together-in-a-knot, gonna-make-a-life-of-it love.

There are also sick people in this world. But I've travelled to 3 continents, and have worked for long periods in 35 States, and I've found that MOST of the REALLY BAD things in life (except for losing members of your family), happen on TeeVee. In REAL life, most folks are pretty much just trying to do their best, and make sense out of things. Most folks just AREN'T THAT BAD!

:kick::kick::kick:

[SoCalDem]

211. The sad thing is this..

when the guy is that much older, he has experienced a lot more life than the girl who is barely more than a child..By "marrying her" at such a young age, she never gets to experience CHOICE..She is literally taken from her Mom & Dad's house as daughter, and tossed into a role of wife to "whomever"..

Girls of days gone by did have lots of household experience because life was fairly rural, and chores were done by everyone, but I would suspect that lots of young girls led pretty dismal lives, loaded with lots of children and hard work..(not that some did not also enjoy parts of their lives). I would guess that if they had been asked at say, the age their husband was when they married. "Would you have rather waited to marry?"..the answer would have been yes!

[loudsue]

216. Well, again, it depends on the person.

The woman I'm speaking of had a terribly abusive mother, and the mother & father had divorced, and the father moved out of state. My friend did, as you suggest, have lots of household experience, and LOVED being a stay-at-home mom with her son when she married. She talks about those days with a great deal of love in her eyes.

She says that she was "born to be married" and "born to be a mom", and to her, she has had the life she always dreamed of. And the man she married....who ALSO grew up in the same small rural town, didn't have many more experiences than his bride. Lots of hard work on the farm, church activities, tinkering with cars and tractor equipment to keep it all running.

She was glad to get away from her abusive mom. From the stories I've heard, who wouldn't be? Her mom was a terrorist.

In the many years they have been married, they have had many expansionist experiences - TOGETHER - that have been fun and exciting to them: they've travelled together, started businesses together, and generally just made "a life".

I asked her, about 10 years ago, if she ever missed out on having a "normal" teenage, early adult, single life. She ADAMANTLY says "Oh no! I would have HATED that!"

I've asked her husband in the past if he didn't think she was too young for him at the time.... (He was VERY handsome...actually, he still is, at 75 years old! ) , and he says, "yeah, I thought about it ... for about 2 minutes! But I wasn't gonna live another day in this world without her. That smile of hers was all that mattered, once I met her. She was like a star that came out of heaven." Then he added: "Talking to her wasn't like talking to a 15-year-old...she had real good common sense, and a great sense of humor. She was real mature. She was real smart, too. My whole family loved her like she was one of us." They're still very close to all of his brothers and sisters, who were all at the 50th wedding anniversary party... the ones that are still alive.

I'm not disputing the fact that bad stuff CAN happen under these circumstances. Especially in today's modern world. But, I'm also not disputing the fact that I see how it can happen in a good way for everyone, given the right individuals. I mean, how can I look at this couple, and deny what I know and see?

It's kind of like the issue of gay people making their own choices: who in the hell am I to say that "it's always wrong, no matter what". Or to say: that person wasn't REALLY gay the day they were born...it was a "problem" with 'SOCIALIZATION'. It's just not true.

People are as varied as snowflakes...each one is different from the other, and each one is special in their own way. We tend to "pre-judge" based on our own subjective experience, but a little humility reminds us that OUR OWN subjective experience is not, necessarily, someone else's reality.

This woman (who I have been very close to for many, many years), whose anniversary party I went to, as a child, was OBVIOUSLY not protected by her parents. But there was a young man, who was totally crazy about her, that has protected her for 50 years now. And it has been a blessing for them, for their son, and for all of us who have known them.

:kick::kick::kick:

[EFerrari]

187. Jesus Christ on a trailer hitch

How old is HER MOTHER?

And what do we know about this 21 year old KID? Sure, he's "legal" but he's still a KID.

Where were the ADULTS in this situation?

My community started calling me "mamita" when I was BORN, and I ovulated at ten. But the adults around me knew to take care of me, not to have sex with me or to marry me off.

:nuke:

[norml]

188. Family Surprised That Son, 22, Charged Over Pregnancy Of Wife, 14

Family Surprised That Son, 22, Charged Over Pregnancy Of Wife, 14
Kosos Family Is Supporting Couple With Baby On Way

POSTED: 5:53 pm CDT July 27, 2005
UPDATED: 6:48 pm CDT July 27, 2005

FALLS CITY, Neb. -- Nebraska Attorney General Jon Bruning said Wednesday that the marriage between a 22-year-old man and a 14-year-old girl is “repugnant."

Tuesday, Bruning filed charges against Matthew Koso, of Falls City, Neb. Bruning said Koso began a sexual relationship with the girl when she was 13. After the girl became pregnant, her mother gave permission in May for Koso to take her daughter to Kansas, which allows minors to get married with parental consent.

Koso faces a charge of first-degree sexual assault, punishable by up to 50 years in prison. He was released on a $7,500 bond.

Koso’s mother said her son was just trying to do the right thing. Peggy Koso said her son and daughter-in-law are staying with her. Peggy Koso said the couple is the picture of happiness.

Koso's parents, with his attorney at their side, said Wednesday that the young couple had been friends for years. They became sexually involved about a month before she got pregnant.


snip


http://www.theomahachannel.com/news/4778303/detail.html

[Ganja Ninja]

203. It wasn't that long ago that 13 year old brides were common.

My grandmother was born in 1900 and was married at 13. They were happily married for over 70 years until she died.

While I think it's wrong that this girl was having sex and got pregnant, the fact that the couple is now married makes this arrest seem a little heavy handed to me. If the state they live in is willing to recognize their marriage then it should be recognized by any state they travel to.

[tx_dem41]

205. I wouldn't call arresting an adult who raped a 13 yo girl...

"heavy-handed".

[Beaverhausen]

208. only a hundred years ago...by the way women were given the vote in 1920

lots of things have changed since then. people are living longer, our culture is very different than when our grandmothers married.

[Solly Mack]

204. Unfucking real

People are defending the rape of a child because the rapist married his victim.

Unfucking real.

[Wish Upon A Star]

209. Misleading title

I actually laughed when I saw this. Now that I have read this I feel bad for laughing over a pedophile. This is truly sick.