Hillary vs. the Xbox: Game over

[ConfuZed]

By Steven Johnson,

Dear Sen. Clinton:

I'm writing to commend you for calling for a $90-million study on the effects of video games on children, and in particular the courageous stand you have taken in recent weeks against the notorious "Grand Theft Auto" series.

I'd like to draw your attention to another game whose nonstop violence and hostility has captured the attention of millions of kids — a game that instills aggressive thoughts in the minds of its players, some of whom have gone on to commit real-world acts of violence and sexual assault after playing.

I'm talking, of course, about high school football.

I know a congressional investigation into football won't play so well with those crucial swing voters, but it makes about as much sense as an investigation into the pressing issue that is Xbox and PlayStation 2.

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-johnson27jul27,0,1432940.story?coll=la-news-comment-opinions

[K-W]

1. Snap, excellent point. I grew up in the video game age,

and football players were always more aggressive violent and even more sexually aggressive than any gamers I knew.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

2. I was both and am nothing like you indicate.

[Melodybe]

5. She's already alienating the youth vote so she'll lose in 08

She wants us to have more republicans in office, that's her plan.

[K-W]

12. I never said you were. EOM

[Ian David]

3. Something needs to be done about THIS game, too...

[xilet]

4. What about the problem though.

Without something like football to express their primal tendencies where do you think many of those kids would end up?
Just sayin.

[HockeyMom]

7. Well, as the mother of a daughter who played

Ice Hockey on a boy's team (yes, checking), I wonder what she would think of THAT?

As far as those video games, we knew one boy growing up who was very much into those violent video games.

Where did he end up? In the MARINE CORPS! His Dad is an NYPD and he wants someday to join him (if he survives Iraq/Iran/who knows).

[WilliamPitt]

6. I'd like to see video games eliminated completely

Not because of their content, but because of their existence and impact. I am not a big fan of anything - anything - that causes young people to zone out for hours at a time while staring at a screen. We're fucked up enough on this because of television.

I feel bad for whatever children I may have someday. The new bitchin' vid game will come out around Christmas, and they'll be all over me to get it for them. Gonna get them jobs instead. :)

[Tux]

8. I agree

Let's ban what we don't like.

RW radio.
RW News
Christian radio/TV
TV
Films
Books
Music

Hell, let's make thoughtcrime illegal. All hail the Party!

Easy solution: don't buy them. Not that hard, was it?

[ibegurpard]

9. I'd like to see a return of Prohibition

Alcohol is a worthless, completely detrimental influence on society.

[WilliamPitt]

11. Ah. A gamer.

:)

[VelmaD]

13. People are going to scream at you on this one.

I'm not one of them. I played video games when I was a kid. And my 6 year old nephew plays them now. But not to excess. I worry about kids who sit in front of the tv all day and never go outside and never get any exercise and never get socialized by actually interacting with other human beings. And you can't tell me that shit doesn't desensitize them. There's a world of difference between Pac-Man and the latest FPS.

I got a compromise for ya...get your kids an old Atari 2600. ;)

[WilliamPitt]

14. I'm sure

Eliminating them completely was, of course, hyperbole. But I don't like them at all. I used to teach, remember. I can't tell you how many kids got into grade trouble because they were gaming too much. I see parents out with kids, and the kids are zombified by those little hand-helds.

[K-W]

19. I agree to an extent.

But I dont think the issue is the games really. I played alot of video games growing up(and watched alot of tv). But I also went to alot of museums, read alot of books, spent alot of time outdoors, played alot of sports, spent quality time with my family, etc.

The problem, as I see it, is more that parents are concerned with occupying thier children in the most efficient way rather than in an enriching way that takes alot more effort.

[VelmaD]

22. That reminds me...

about a month ago I was at a meeting and there was a kid there...probably about 10 or so. He played on a handheld all the way through the speakers with the volume left on and loud enough that you could hear it over the people talking. It was infuriating. Bad parenting and bad manners and just...argh!

The whole point of letting 'em out in public before they're fully formed is so that they can interact with other people. Learn how to be part of human society. Parents are just enabling anti-social behavior so they don't have to "deal" with their kids.

Can you tell I have a lot of opinion on this topic? :)

[rman]

35. And of course the parents are without blame,

got to get the government to help them raise their kids, because parents are powerless against video games.

[carlvs]

24. I am not going to scream...

Unfortunately, DU rules prevent me from stating what I will do (one hint - the initials for the action are I. L. ...:evilgrin:)

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

16. Yeah, non-gamers are solving world peace in their spare time.

:sarcasm:

Listen, EVERYONE finds some way to zone out for a couple of hours here or there. With video games, children are constantly developing problem solving skills and sharpening their critical thinking ability. Plus the interactive stories some video games have certainly can spark a child's imagination in a positive manner.

Are they better than, say, reading? No. But they are quite far from being valueless. I've been playing video games all of my life and I'm doing quite well for myself. In high school, I was a three sport athlete, ranked in the top 10% of my class, and lead a respectable social life, all while playing video games. Like anything else, it's a parent's responsibility to teach their child to be well balanced individuals.

On edit: Oh, I was VP of my class too, and then President of my fraternity in college.

[WilliamPitt]

20. I hear you

but the problem with vids is the same problem with TV: It becomes the babysitter. I agree, however, that it is the parent's responsibility.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

23. I don't disagree that it becomes the babysitter at all.

Parents will use anything as a babysitter if need be. Parents will just drop their kids off at sports practice or music lessons to get them out of their hair for a while. Having coached youth sports, I can't tell you how many times I've sat with kids for an hour or so, just waiting for their parents to come pick them up (had no car to give them a ride). And yeah, a lot of it does have to do with the need to work more and make a living.

That said, I wouldn't say video games themselves are the problem. It's overworked or disinterested parents that are the problem.

[ikri]

33. It becomes the babysitter

So yet again we have Democrats finding an interesting issue and missing the point entirely.

Here is the perfect opportunity for Democrats to crusade for fair pay and fair working hours to enable parents to actually spend time with their kids instead of using the tv/dvd/console as the babysitter.

But no. Instead of pointing out how some games are great for developing problem solving skills and hand-eye coordination they're complaining about a hack that let's people see a sex scene in a game aimed at adults, a hack that breaks the license agreement and absolves the producers from responsibility.

Maybe the government should just develop games by themselves. Oh hang on, They Do!.

[annabanana]

21. let me know when the event is imminent...

because I would looooove to watch you be a daddy


(mother of teens)

[eablair3]

26. Ah, ... a fascist

>>>>>>>>>I'd like to see video games eliminated completely

Not because of their content, but because of their existence and impact. I am not a big fan of anything - anything - that causes young people to zone out for hours at a time while staring at a screen. We're fucked up enough on this because of television.

I feel bad for whatever children I may have someday. The new bitchin' vid game will come out around Christmas, and they'll be all over me to get it for them. Gonna get them jobs instead. :)<<<<<<<<<

**********

Not content to act in his own way and to raise his own (possible future) kids the way he wants, he wants to control how others act and how others raise their kids.

Sounds like another Jerry Falwell and the Moron Majority.

[Name removed]

27. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[eablair3]

28. Yup, .. I did

"you're dumb"

what a lucid and thoughtful reply. It shows your intelligence. Wow.

(but, in truth, it was in a little fun way, ..unless you're truly serious and believe that Hilary should get legislation passed to eliminate video games)

[jpgray]

29. Says a guy who pisses away hours watching guys throw balls around on TV

Are you also for banning televised sports? There's an instance of zoning out for hours in front of a screen. But of course I'm forgetting--your mindless, passive, couch-potato vegetations which lack even the rudiments of interactivity that games possess are somehow holier, right?

:)

(and no I don't play video games. I'm sure the prejudice came easily to you though, you good progressive you :*)

[Zhade]

31. Nicely fucking said!

Sports are FAR more passive than video games, yet sports fan always get a pass while gamers - who actually actively use their brain during their hobby (although I'm sure stats fans do that) - get pissed on here.

Oh, the sheer irony of it all!

[jpgray]

32. I was being snarky--there is some interactivity in TV sports

It can be a social affair for one thing (but so can video games), and analyzing the strategy or the mechanics of a play can involve complicated brain activity (but so can video games, and with greater variety and intensity). I think Will is picking on video games because he doesn't understand them and hasn't made an attempt to--it's easy to argue that something is worthless when you haven't bothered to examine if it could have any value.

[WilliamPitt]

37. I am fully aware of my rank hipocrisy in this matter

Changes nothing, dammit.

:)

[jpgray]

40. Yeah--I'm glad you didn't take my snark too seriously

Just as you can be too obsessed with TV sports spectating, you can get too involved in videogames to the detriment of other things. But enjoying either of these things in moderation seems pretty harmless to me.

[Zhade]

30. Thank goodness there are intelligent activists who happen to game...

...who will never let that come to pass.

I make no excuse for my hobby, and just shake my head at people who don't get how involving and interesting it can be. Your loss, IMHO.

[rman]

34. Don't forget movies, TV, books

I zoned out on SF books for years on end, staring at paper...

Do you really think the government has more of a responsibility wrt raising kids, then parents do?

[arwalden]

36. Man o man.

I'm sorry you live in such a dark and cynical world.

<< I feel bad for whatever children I may have someday. >>

Me too.

[SheepyMcSheepster]

38. just like anything it is about moderation

i have been a gamer since nintendo.
i spent hours playing "the legend of zelda" and was mystified by how engrossing the experience was.

i also did lots of other things as a youngster.
i played sports and skateboarded (alot) and found that i liked playing music.

as i have become an adult my love of video games is still there.

i enjoyed a modification for a game so much (half life) that i did what i could to be come involved with a mod team.
i met and became good friends with many very talented people all over the world (austrialia, england, spain, germany, sweden).
i learned alot about them and their culture and shared lots of laughs.
they helped me get a grasp on using the tools required.
i learned how to make models using 3dsMax and i became proficient at using photoshop to make textures and skins. this photoshop experience as been great as i can carry it over to other projects in my life.
i learned a great bit about team dynamics and how to go about organizing and communicating with various members of a team who have different talents.

sometimes i do feel a bit guilty for spending a few hours on a video game (my obsession at this point is City of Heroes) but i try to balance it out by doing other more creative things. i continue to play and create music and i have become more interested in making graphical art via photoshop.

my point is an interest in video games doesn't necessarily lead to a life of sitting in front of a screen being passive.
my interest in video games has opened up a world to me. it is why i have a cable modem and it is one of the reasons i am here reading DU.
as with anything that can be time consuming or resource intensive. moderation is the key.

(

[Susang]

39. What about the growing body of evidence

That indicates they may make children more intelligent? :shrug:

[Johonny]

10. They

I believe congress did pull Professional Football to Congress for some hearings this year already. So your point is off the mark. Sports have been fair game in congress for a long time. High school sports are generally regulated at the local level and thus congressional oversight would not have a huge impact.

[Shadowen]

15. I played (and still play) violent video games.

Used to go into a screaming frenzy with a flak cannon on the Sewers map in the original Unreal Tournament.

Yet I dislike so much as hunting gophers, as my dad often did and invited me to do with him.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

18. hehehe, love the flak cannon.

Like I said above, you can scapegoat anything you want. It all comes down to whether or not a child is taught to think for themselves and become well balanced people. Video games, television, books, movies - none of it makes a person do anything.

[oasis]

17. Sitting on your ass working a joy stick vs. rigorous athletic activity.

Brilliant analogy.:think:

[snot]

25. I got desperate enough for entertainment as a kid to start reading--

--even War and Peace, though 90% went right over my head.

I wonder whether Johnson's book takes into account how much kids lose out on by reading so little.