WE WERE CARDED IN TEXAS FOR COLD MEDICATION!!!

[dogday]

They wanted the following information-New Law starts tomorrow

1. Driver's License Number
2. Social Security Number
3. Home Phone
4 Address
5 Work Phone


Surprised they did not want to check for recognition marks or eye scan or something.....

[KarenInMA]

1. You gave out your Social???

Never EVER do that!! For an OTC purchase???

[dogday]

3. If you want cold medication you have too

we did not give out information today, we were told it is starting tomorrow and that is the required information by state law. Can't get the medication without that information... It is terrible....

[Reciprocity]

34. Make up your SS number.

I would never give that out. I thought it was against the law for businesses to ask for it.

[proud2BlibKansan]

54. It's not the businesses asking for your social

It's law enforcement.

[Reciprocity]

65. Makes no sense. I'm not required to give a cop my SS if I'm pulled over.

[proud2BlibKansan]

68. Yes I don't like this part of the law either

But I believe they are using SS to track meth makers, as they do travel from state to state to get the ingredients.

[alarimer]

71. Like they would give their real SSN

What stupid bullshit.

[proud2BlibKansan]

75. I wondered that also

But I don't understand well enough how this national prevention program is designed to know if they can get away with giving a fake number. They do have to provide an ID as well, like a driver's license. So it's not like they can be truly anonymous, unless they have a fake ID.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

98. You've put your finger on it.

I work for a company that has to have it's HAZMAT(oxygen) truck drivers go through Homeland Security. It used to be instantaneous. Our most recent driver took 2 months to go through the process.

Now, what's a terrorist going to do? Go through a 2 month process or... steal the fucking truck!

This is all bullshit.

[liveoaktx]

80. Found the bill-it doesn't say that the Social Security number is

required.

http://www.capitol.state.tx.us/cgi-bin/tlo/textframe.cmd?LEG=79&SESS=R&CHAMBER=H&BILLTYPE=B&BILLSUFFIX=00164&VERSION=5&TYPE=B

What it does say

Sec. 431.413. PEDIGREE CONTENTS. (a) A pedigree must
include all necessary identifying information concerning each sale
in the product's chain of distribution from the manufacturer,
through acquisition and sale by a wholesale distributor or
repackager, until final sale to a pharmacy or other person
dispensing or administering the drug. At a minimum, the chain of
distribution information must include:
(1) the name, address, telephone number, and, if
available, the e-mail address of each person who owns or possesses
the prescription drug, except common carriers and logistics
providers;
(2) the signature of each owner of the prescription
drug;

[knitter4democracy]

86. They honestly called it "pedigree"?

Seriously? Like we're all dogs or something?

[Kathy in Cambridge]

13. Can you imagine them doing that up here?

I can't-people would bitch about invasion of privacy.

[KarenInMA]

27. Ha! That would never happen here...

[Kathy in Cambridge]

48. I guess we're Un-'Murikan

:eyes:

[Mairead]

64. Roit. But because of some similarly nitwit drugs law, we have grocery

clerks carding folk in their 60s who're buying a bottle of wine or six of cider.

[jmm]

59. I wouldn't put it past them to do that up here

Years ago a boss asked me to go to the nearby KMart ad buy WD-40. The cashier tried to card me and when I spoke to the manager she told me I was gonna use it to get high. I informed her that I didn't work at KMart so if I wanted to get high I could afford something better. Against my better judgment I got my ID but I ended up walking out of the store when the cashier demanded my social security number.

I doubt it was legal but this did happen in MA.

[proud2BlibKansan]

60. There are some federal regs addressing this:

Methamphetamine is a Schedule II narcotic under the Controlled Substances Act (CSA), Title II of the Comprehensive Drug Abuse Prevention and Control Act of 1970. The chemicals that are used to produce methamphetamine are also controlled under the Comprehensive Methamphetamine Control Act of 1996 (MCA). This legislation broadened the controls on listed chemicals used in the production of methamphetamine, increased penalties for the trafficking and manufacturing of methamphetamine and listed chemicals, and expanded the controls of products containing the licit chemicals ephedrine, pseudoephedrine and phenylpropanolamine (PPA).

The Methamphetamine Anti-Proliferation Act was passed in July 2000. The act strengthens sentencing guidelines, provides training for Federal and State law enforcement officers on methamphetamine investigations and the handling of the chemicals used in clandestine meth labs. It also puts in place controls on the distribution of the chemical ingredients used in Methamphetamine production and expands substance abuse prevention efforts. Sections of the act relating to the distribution of drug information and Internet advertising were removed.

http://www.house.gov/larsen/meth/stats.htm

[proud2BlibKansan]

30. You will have to as well

if you want to buy cold meds. I believe this is national legislation.

[K8-EEE]

2. I Know It's Annoying BUT....

my neice lives in rural NV and the stories of the meth abuse and how it's poisoning the kids and the homes and streams and EVERYTHING...the crime and all, something has to be done about it. I don't know exactly WHAT but it seems like they haven't been putting NEARLY as much into this as they have agains the war a freaking medical marijuana!

[KarenInMA]

4. To bad.

There's no reason to track people who buy cold meds.

Sieg Heil my friends. :mad:

[LSdemocrat]

5. Cold medicine can be used to make Crystal Meth

[dogday]

7. We got one box

and why do they need all of that information. SS? Work phone?

[TwilightZone]

26. Yes, but if you bought small quantities at numerous different locations,

no one would know you were buying it for making meth.

The point of asking for the information is to look for patterns and to discourage people from making meth in the first place.

[proud2BlibKansan]

28. To keep track of who is buying meth ingredients

They are creating a national database. I live in a two state area and meth makers here travel from pharmacy to pharmacy, back and forth across the state line to get enough cold meds to make meth.

Before they clamped down on sales here, you couldn't find cold meds. The meth makers would go in a store and buy every cold med they had. So I would rather give my name, etc and be able to buy the meds than to find out the store is once again sold out of them.

[KarenInMA]

9. And Windex can be used as mace. Should we start tracking

people who buy that?

You could smother someone with a diaper. You could beat someone upside the head with a frying pan. You can make a BOMB out of gasoline. Clearly these things all need to be tracked and registered.

This is outrageous. This will be overturned.

[XanaDUer]

21. Stab someone with a knife

Lots of dangerous products out there. I am tired of this nonsense.

[proud2BlibKansan]

33. Does making mace result in

houses being blown up? Neighborhoods catching on fire?

I take it making meth is not a problem where you live?

[KarenInMA]

You can't possibly be in favor of this.

This isn't the way to stop meth use, by hassling people with the flu.

Just off the top of my head, I'd say oh... More drug officers, harsher penalties and more drug education would be more effective.

[XanaDUer]

39. And looking into the root causes of drug addiction

as opposed to hassling citizens about OTC drugs.

[TwilightZone]

41. They're not trying to stop meth use.

They're trying to stop meth production.

The easiest way to stop production is by cutting off supply. Without production, there is no use.

[KarenInMA]

44. This won't stop meth production.

won't even come close. They'll buy it from a different state, then send someone in w/ a clean record to get it, they'll steal it, they'll buy small quantities, they'll use something else (more harmful).

Or they'll just walk in, kill the guy at the drugstore, and take whatever they want.

These laws don't do anything but lead to more violence.

[TwilightZone]

52. Sorry, but that's not accurate.

Pharmaceutical pseudoepedrine is the cheapest, most readily available source for one of the compenents of meth production. Cutting off that source makes it harder and more expensive to make. Make it costlier to make, and it becomes less popular.

In states where laws have already been in place, Iowa for example, both the usage and production of meth is down.

And, as far as meth laws endangering "the guy at the drugstore", you don't see many pharmacists getting killed over morphine or any of the other "recreational" drugs readily available at pharmacies.

By the way, the "guy" at the drugstore is more often a "gal".

[proud2BlibKansan]

56. Independence, MO was known as the

'Meth capital of the US' about ten years ago. But they clamped down on the sale of the ingredients and increased criminal penalties. Now it is not near the problem it once was in Independence. So these prevention programs DO work.

[proud2BlibKansan]

45. It is a HUGE problem here

Houses and entire neighborhoods have been blown up. Now meth making has moved to the rural areas. The meth cookers drive to pharmacy after pharmacy, vacating the shelves of every cold med for miles. So folks in small towns have no cold meds at all available. So did we here in the city until local laws were passed to regulate the sale of meth ingredients.

I am an old hippy pot smoker. I think the drug war is a waste of time. But meth falls in to a totally different category. It is an incredibly dangerous drug. Fools who cook it are literally playing with fire. If I smoke a joint in the privacy of my own home, that is none of my neighbor's business. But if my neighbor cooks meth in his home, that is my business because he is putting me and my property at risk.

[K8-EEE]

92. It's Poisoning Waterways, It's Very Very Destructive

Regardless of whether you USE it if your community is rife with it, you're in danger of being poisoned.

[Mairead]

73. And even MORE effective path would be de-criminalisation

Let people fry their brains down to the size of a peanut if they want to. It's like wearing a helmet while biking: folk shouldn't have to bother if they've nothing to protect.

[Heddi]

101. PSEUDOPHEDERINE DOES NOT BLOW UP HOUSES

or catch neighborhoods on fire.

There is NOTHING you can do to pseudophederine to make it flammable aside from just setting it on fire.

There are other things, VERY legal things used to make meth. It is THOSE things--not the cold medicine--that causes the damage.

Other things used to make meth:

coleman fuel
lye
iodine
ethanol

THOSE are the chemicals that, when mixed, become bombs in the basement. NOT the pseudophederine.

Why aren't you ID'd and cross-checked when you try to buy THOSE things?

SHit--you could go and buy ALL of those things AT THE SAME TIME, and you would only arouse suspicion if you attempted to buy 2 boxes of Sudafed :eyes:

[sakabatou]

14. There must be cold meds that dn't have that ingrediant

[KarenInMA]

16. What I mean is,

I don't care. Let the kids make Meth. Darwin theory.

[proud2BlibKansan]

35. And if they lived next door to you,

and their house blew up and yours caught on fire, would you still say let the kids make meth?

I have been advocating legalization of marijuana for years now. I think the drug war is a waste of time and resources. But this meth problem is very different. Meth is dangerous, and not only for those who make it and use it. We have had several exposions here and neighboring houses were damaged as well.

[proud2BlibKansan]

36. double dupe

oops

[proud2BlibKansan]

37. dupe

[KarenInMA]

40. Lol- you really mean that!

I agree, Meth is a problem.

But this isn't a solution. this won't stop people from making/using meth.

And if I lived near a Meth House, I would be calling the police every 15 minutes until they took it down.

[proud2BlibKansan]

51. And you don't think that has been tried?

This is such a huge problem the cops can't keep up with it. A new fad is to put meth labs in the trunks of cars. So those idiots are putting everyone in every car around them at great risk in the event of a minor fender bender. It is really scary stuff. And as I said in another post, before we had laws to clamp down on the sale of meth ingredients, it was often impossible to buy cold meds, as the cookers would buy every package in every store for miles.

[Reciprocity]

38. And water is in most liquid drugs. Should we be carded for that?

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

42. They use water as well...

[leesa]

15. Annoying? Why do they need this info? I use Pseudophedrine to

help my migraine/sinus headaches. Will I have to worry that my doors will be busted down because I bought one bubble-pak too many?

[Media_Lies_Daily]

20. Welcome to a Brave New World.

[XanaDUer]

22. Discover the Neti Pot

and fuck this shit.

Google "neti pot".

Clears the sinuses without the feds coming down on you (yet).

[proud2BlibKansan]

23. Meth labs are a huge problem here in the midwest too

So this legislation doesn't surprise me at all. I also think if you want to complain about this, you should be blaming the drug dealers and meth lab makers rather than the govt.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

29. Same thing in the South as well. Bad problem.

[Heddi]

100. It's not the cold medicine that's poinsioning the streams & burning houses

it's the OTHER, VERY LEGAL toxic substances that are poisioning kids & streams.

Like:

Coleman's Fuel
Iodine
Lye
Ethanol

THAT is what is so fucking poisioning. Not the pseudophederine.

Why aren't we being carded to buy THOSE things in addition to the cold medicine????????????????

[hippiechick]

6. Indiana's starting that, too ...

... trying to get a grip on Meth ingredient purchasers ... supposedly ...

:shrug:

[Sgent]

8. Delete

[yellowdogintexas]

17. yeah but you would have prescription for the morphine, I would

assume.

[XanaDUer]

10. Oh yes

now you have to take a slip from the shelf and go to the pharmacy to get your nasal decongester.

[Maple]

11. You'd have to buy it in bulk

for it to be used for crystal meth...not a package or two at a time.

We are now doing this in Canada, but you don't need a prescription nor do you need to give out any information.

Usually they just put it behind the counter, and you have to ask the druggist for it. Same for codeine and sometimes rubbing alcohol.

[yellowdogintexas]

12. this should only be true for Sudafed; if it is mixed with anything

else I don't see how the meth people could make use of it. Used to be you could buy Sudafed in bottles of 100 at Walmart; that hasn't been possibly for several years. The grocery stores have been keeping it underlock and key for at least 2 years, and even the blister pacs are not available in as large a quantity as formerly.

I noticed at Costco there is a new decongestant that is similar but has been altered so it is not suitable for Meth cooking..it is a slightly different chemical combination ...

Pure Sudafed is highly prized by the meth cookers.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

24. Multi-ingredient products containing pseudophedrine don't require all....

...of the identification procedures unlees you buy more than two boxes of whatever it is you're buying.

[alarimer]

69. they do here

They put Claritin-D behind the counter (which is what I use). It has a small amount of pseudoephedrine in it along with Loratidine. So I am fucked too but no way in fucking hell I am going to be treated like a fucking criminal because I have a Goddamn allergy. So I will use something less effective until they change the formulation or whatever. Fuck this fucking treating us all like criminals. It is BULLSHIT!!

[TwilightZone]

18. Welcome to the anti-meth campaign.

This will shortly be the norm pretty much everywhere.

[Sgent]

19. Your Social?????

That's weird, seeing how at the same pharmacy I could get morphine w/o a social.

Hell, I used to buy medical grade cocaine legally all the time w/o a social (Cocaine is a schedule II drug, and is used in some eye surgeries, at the time I was working with at a surgical center).

[Fiendish Thingy]

25. SS# is bad, but otherwise a good idea...

As a teen drug counselor, I can tell you that meth use is out of control, and IMO, second only to alcohol in the damage a substance wreaks on the users, their families and communities. Meth labs, once busted, have to be dismantled and cleaned by HazMat teams- and that's if they don't explode and burn to the ground first.

California has some restrictions on how much you can buy at one time, and some individual retailers have rules on buying only when the pharmacist is on duty.
The chemical in question is psuedophedrine, aka Sudafed, but also found in most any medication that is a decongestant.

perhaps someone enterprising drug company will create a safe and effective decongestant that can't be used to make meth...

[KarenInMA]

31. I disagree. I won't even give my

zip code to the people at Radio Shack. There is NO reason for me to have to give you even my name, if I want to buy a non-prescription drug from a pharmacy.

Do you think this will stop meth addicts? they'll just steal it.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

50. Bed and Bath or Linens n Things asks for your phone number

I'll give them my zip-it's for marketing purposes-but phone number? No bleepin' way.

[Gormy Cuss]

67. The revolution started in MA

Karen and Kathy, I agree with both of you. There would huge consumer opposition in the fine Yankee bastions. Supermarket loyalty cards were resisted the strongest in New England because of privacy concerns.

You are wise not to provide the phone #. Aside from the obvious use of giving them permission to telemarket you, they use it to reverse ID you in national marketing databases so that even if you're paying by cash they can create a customer profile.

When asked for a zip, I quote another zipcode in the same market area but not my own, because that's really all they're after. I don't mind supporting general marketing data collection but I'll be damned if I'm going to help them create a dossier on me.

The Texas law sounds over the top. California and other states where volume purchases and product location are restrictive are much less intrusive.

[Mairead]

72. I smile sweetly and murmer 'My number is ex-directory' (nt)

[KarenInMA]

89. I look straight at them and say "no". Or, "No offense is

intended, but that's not your business."

[ScamUSA.Com]

105. same here.

my zip code is "cash"

[Kerrytravelers]

32. Can you go online and order medications?

Hell, get an out of state friend to stock you with medications by sending you stuff through the mail.

Hell, I'd smuggle it in. Tape a W sticker to the inside of your car window when crossing state lines and they'll never question you!

[alarimer]

85. I just googled Claritin D

And got a bunch of sites to order it from. i don't know about Sudafed.

[nosmokes]

43. you'd have needed a doc's scrip in oregon

with our new asinine anti-meth law. or at least an asinine portion of our anti-meth law. first off, you need a quantity of psuedoephedrine to make it worthwhile to cook a batch of meth. one or two or even twenty single boxes of sudafed ain't gonna be worth the time and energy involved, you need hundreds. but not to worry, with CAFTA on the books now i'm sure the central american countries will be as eager as the mexicans were to start thir own labs to supply the market here, but if you have allergies and no health insurance in oregon, oh well. be prepared to either suffer for 9 mos of the year or pay lots of money to a doctor to get that box of sudafed that you used to be able to just pick up and pay and go.

[Technowitch]

As others here have noted, I think it's illegal to ask for SSN

Law could be challenged on that basis.

[seabeyond]

46. 43 and i am carded for cigs. never on the cold medicine,

only buy for kids and havent bought since winter

[Reciprocity]

47. Can someone post a link?

I find news stories but nothing official on this new law. I want to know what info the store can ask for. This SS thing is unnerving.

[dogday]

49. Here is something I found

June 29, 2005 - Los Angeles Times (CA)
Buying Cold Pills? Fill Out This Form
Riverside County Sets The Bar Higher In The War Against Ingredients For Methamphetamine
By Stephanie Ramos, and Hector Becerra, Times Staff Writers
Return to Drug War News: Don't Miss Archive

Consumers who buy popular cold remedies in Riverside County would be required to give their names, addresses, and telephone and driver's license numbers to store clerks for law enforcement inspection under a sweeping rule aimed at illicit production of methamphetamine.

The ordinance, unanimously approved Tuesday by the Board of Supervisors, will take effect if given final approval in the next 30 days.

The law would be the toughest of its kind in California. It comes as both Congress and the state Legislature are considering bills that would restrict the sale of medications, such as Sudafed and Nyquil, that contain the drug pseudoephedrine. It is among the ingredients used in makeshift laboratories to create methamphetamine.

Critics of the proposals say they would inconvenience law-abiding customers - and pose a threat to privacy - and might have only a minimal effect on the illicit drug traffic.


http://www.november.org/stayinfo/breaking3/WarOnMeth.html

[XanaDUer]

55. A line from that article

Methamphetamine also suppresses sexual inhibitions, and health officials have said it is a major factor in an increase in sexually transmitted diseases, including hepatitis and HIV/AIDS...

I remember a similar argument about Black men abusing cocaine at the turn of the 20th century and ravishing innocent fair-haired white women under the influence of cocaine.

Sounds like same circus, different clowns.

[proud2BlibKansan]

53. Dangers posed to kids living in meth lab homes:

Until recently, clandestine methamphetamine production was viewed as a victimless crime. Law enforcement and child protective services personnel typically failed to treat as victims the children found living at or visiting illegal methamphetamine laboratory sites. They rarely interviewed these children as potential witnesses, evaluated them for physical or psychological damage, or ensured that they were placed in proper and safe environments.1 Now, as more and more children are found living at home-based labs, law enforcement, medical, and social services professionals are showing growing awareness of the enormous physical, developmental, emotional, and psychosocial damage these children may incur.2

Children who live at or visit these sites or are present during drug production face acute health and safety risks, including physical, emotional, and sexual abuse and medical neglect. The manufacture of methamphetamine may involve hazards such as fires and explosions. The age-related behaviors of young children (such as frequent hand-to-mouth contact and physical contact with their environment) increase the likelihood that they will inhale, absorb, or ingest toxic chemicals, drugs, or contaminated food. Their physiological characteristics (such as higher metabolic and respiratory rates and a developing central nervous system) leave them particularly vulnerable to the effects of toxic chemical exposures. Exposure to drugs and alcohol before birth places infants at increased risk for neurological abnormalities and respiratory problems, which may be compounded by ongoing environmental exposures.

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/ovc/publications/bulletins/children/pg1.html

[XemaSab]

111. I agree with everything you're saying here

and I'm sorry you're getting piled on.

Meth is dangerous for children, communities, and the environment in a way that pot is not, and I think any measures should be taken to shut down meth labs.

All these people pouting and moaning about how it's suddenly overly onerous to buy sudafed... I have little sympathy for. If you've got chronic allergies, getting a standing perscription with 20 refills should be easy. And when the 'scrip runs out, the pharmacist can easily call the doctor and get it renewed. I'm on a bunch of meds and it happens to me all the time, and it's not a big deal.

It's a hassle, but it's less of a hassle than having your house blown up by a tweeker.

[Journeyman]

57. Why not take those meds behind the counter? . . .

Require a prescription for meds with pseudoephedrine or the like. There are plenty of alternate cold remedy methods. People can use those or get a 'script. Hell, get a 'script anytime you see a doc, so you can buy the medication and have it ready for if you do get sick. There'd be the added bonus -- at least for law enforcement -- that if someone got multiple 'scripts they could be busted for doctor shopping along with meth production. Yeah, hit 'em with the ol' Rush Limbaugh Offense (one of many, I might add). That'd put an end to the problem.

[AlienGirl]

79. I don't want to have to go to the dr. for every cold I get

Doctor visits are expensive, and I get a *lot* of colds. (I'm catching one right now, in fact.) I wouldn't want to have to go get a prescription every time I need Sudafed.

I think keeping it behind the counter and limiting the quantity that can be purchased per sale is an acceptible compromise.

Tucker

[Journeyman]

84. That's part of the present problem, though. . .

even though sales are limited, those who seek to abuse it buy it from multiple sources, effectively skirting the quantity limitation rules. Under your proposal, intrusive carding is a given, because your method doesn't differ from what's being implemented today.

If it's a danger and needs to be controlled, then let the government prove its case and implement the controls. A citizen's personal problem with cost and inconvenience would be immaterial, were the government to prove its case. Recent history is rife with drugs that were once easily available but are now under extensive control.

There are plenty of other cold remedies available. They may not be as effective, they may not give you the "rush" you seek, but if the ephedrine and pseudo- drugs were unavailable, those would be your options and you'd have to live with it.

We either deal with society's problems direct, or we flounder and see society erode.

[KarenInMA]

87. What if you don't have insurance?

[libnnc]

58. I'd rather they take it off of the market altogether

than have to give all that info out.

There's got to be another way to "meth-proof" our over the counter meds.

[yellowdogintexas]

61. from Michigan: Law bans sale of Sudafed to minors

Law bans sale of Sudafed to minors

The goal is to hinder meth production

July 21, 2005

ASSOCIATED PRESS

LANSING -- People who want to buy Sudafed and other cold medicines will have to prove they are at least 18 when a new law intended to crack down on methamphetamine production takes effect in December.

Gov. Jennifer Granholm signed a law Wednesday that requires customers to show photo identification before buying some cold and flu medicines. It is aimed at restricting pseudoephedrine or ephedrine, the key ingredient to make methamphetamine, commonly known as meth.

Beginning Dec. 15, anyone under 18 will be prohibited from buying products with pseudoephedrine or ephedrine as the sole active ingredient. The law also will limit adult customers to two packages, or a maximum 48 tablets or capsules, in a single transaction.

Stores that do not keep the restricted drugs behind the counter or in a locked case will have to keep a log of every buyer's name and date of birth. Medicines kept on regular store shelves will need to be equipped with an antitheft device and be monitored by video.

The law will not apply to products intended for children under age 12, some liquid medicines if pseudoephedrine is not the only active ingredient and those products that have been prescribed.

"These bills place commonsense limits on the ingredients needed to produce this highly addictive illegal drug," Granholm said in a news release.

The legislation -- sponsored by Sen. Patricia Birkholz, R-Saugatuck Township, and Rep. Rick Jones, R-Grand Ledge -- received overwhelming support in the Legislature. Several other states have restricted access to cold medicines, either by allowing only pharmacies to sell drugs with pseudoephedrine or making retailers lock up the products or sell them from staffed counters.

The number of illegal meth labs has jumped significantly in recent years. The Michigan State Police reported that 18 meth labs were seized in 1999. That number grew to 209 in 2004. This year, 120 labs have been identified and busted.

Chronic abuse of methamphetamines can lead to psychotic behavior, including intense paranoia and hallucinations. The chemicals used to make it are explosive and toxic and can harm the environment.

[yellowdogintexas]

62. from Texas: Lawmaker wants to ban drugs like Sudafed

Jan. 10, 2005, 11:51AM

Associated Press

RESOURCES
• Complete coverage: See more stories and resources on the 79th Texas Legislature from the Houston Chronicle.
AUSTIN - A state senator who wants to eliminate from the market drugs that contain mainly pseudoephedrine has introduced a series of four bills for returning lawmakers.

Under the legislation by Sen. Craig Estes, no one would be able to buy drugs like Sudafed in Texas. But he said consumers could still buy other congestion remedies containing the decongestant, as long as it is mixed into capsules and cough syrups.

"We hope the general public will realize that a little inconvenience will go a long way," Estes, R-Wichita Falls, told the Scripps Howard Austin bureau in Monday's editions of the Abilene Reporter-News.

In Oklahoma, passage of state legislation last spring that banned store sales of popular medications like Sudafed and Claritin-D that contain pseudoephedrine, the main ingredient in methamphetamine, was credited with reducing the number of methamphetamine labs during the first six months of 2004.

Police and prosecutors have been "inundated by meth abusers and cookers" who have crossed into Texas after Oklahoma outlawed over-the-counter sales of pseudoephedrine, the main ingredient in methamphetamine production, Estes said.

Restricting sales of common cold remedies that contain the illegal drug's key ingredient could aid in the fight against drugs, said Capt. Doug Kunkle of the Texas Department of Public Safety in Austin.

"It will really reduce the amount of meth they will cook here," Kunkle said. "Anything that can bring us relief ... will be helpful."

DPS officials and other law officers, in a 12-month period that ended in May 2004, busted 934 labs. That number represents a 167 percent increase over a 12-month period ending in December 2002.

"This is drug that is terribly addictive and leads to death and destruction of family and property," Estes said. "It's an overwhelming problem."

The 79th Legislature opens Tuesday.
ADVERTISEMENT
Return to top


The Houston Chronicle is now half price for new subscribers!

Houston Chronicle e-Edition
Free 3-day sample

[liveoaktx]

66. Is it THIS bill?

http://www.capitol.state.tx.us/tlo/79R/billtext/SB00066F.HTM

IF so, it looks like retailer participation is voluntary.

What store was this? Maybe it was that store's policy because they're afraid of being sued

[liveoaktx]

74. Another bill by Van de Putte

http://www.capitol.state.tx.us/tlo/79R/billtext/SB00112E.HTM

SECTION 4. Subchapter C, Chapter 481, Health and Safety
Code, is amended by adding Section 481.0771 to read as follows:
Sec. 481.0771. RECORDS AND REPORTS ON PSEUDOEPHEDRINE.
(a) A wholesaler who sells, transfers, or otherwise furnishes
pseudoephedrine to a retailer shall:
(1) before delivering the pseudoephedrine, obtain
from the retailer the retailer's address, area code, and telephone
number; and
(2) make an accurate and legible record of the
transaction and maintain the record for at least two years after the
date of the transaction.
(b) The wholesaler shall make all records available to the
director in accordance with department rule, including:
(1) the information required by Subsection (a)(1);
(2) the amount of pseudoephedrine delivered; and
(3) any other information required by the director.
(c) Not later than five business days after receipt of an
order for pseudoephedrine that requests delivery of a suspicious
quantity of pseudoephedrine as determined by department rule, a
wholesaler shall submit to the director a report of the order in
accordance with department rule.
(d) A wholesaler who, with reckless disregard for the duty
to report, fails to report as required by Subsection (c) may be
subject to disciplinary action in accordance with department rule.

[alarimer]

63. ALL cold medication?

Or just that with pseudoephedrine?

Most of the sudafed and products containing it are off the shelf and behind the counter. Why do they need so much information? So they can give it to police??? I need to know this. I live in Texas and this is pissing me off. My SSN was removed from my insurance ID and student IDs for privacy reasons (also a new state law) so why would they need a SSN to buy cold meds? I guess we're all meth addicts until proven otherwise. I hope someone sues these fuckers.

[ohio_liberal]

70. Oh fuck that

Anyone needs a box of OTC meds, PM me and I'll send it to you. They're not asking us for this bullshit info here yet in Ohio.

[ellie]

112. I was carded once at the

Meijer in Rossford, OH when I bought my beloved Advil Allergy Sinus, the only thing that gets rid of my sinus headaches. It has 30 mg of pseudoephedrine HCL in it. But only once and only at that store. I have not had a hassle at any other place around town I bought it at.

[Reciprocity]

76. With the clot the drug industry has,

you would think this would have never been made a law.

[Moosepoop]

109. I've been thinking about that

Here's my uneducated guess as to why Big Pharma hasn't squeezed the government on this (though they are on record as being "against" these types of measures):

The patent on psuedoephedrine ran out a long time ago. The market is flooded with super-cheap generic versions, such as store brands.
A box of Dollar General's "DG" brand psuedoephedrine is one dollar, similar pricing can be found among Wal-Mart's "Equate" brand, and so on. These are the ones being purchased (and stolen) in high quantities. Big Pharma stopped seeing much profit from this ingredient, so it's no skin off their corporate asses if people can't get the cheap stuff any more. Now I expect Big Pharma to unroll "new", patented products that are readily accessible, but expensive because they're "new".

At the same time, they get to be seen "objecting" to the government's implementing of these laws, thereby causing confusion regarding the idea of the pharma industry being in bed with the gov't. Actually, it's a win-win situation for both bushco* and Big Pharma -- one gets to invade privacy yet some more, and the other has a platform for introducing new, expensive products to meet the sudden "need" for them. I think they drafted these meth laws together. :tinfoilhat:

[Pirate Smile]

77. This has been going on for quite a while in Iowa. You have to show

your ID - mine is my drivers license. They do a search on how much you have purchased in the past month and if you have bought anything within the past 24 hours because there is a limit to how much allergy/cold medicine you can buy in a month - it is a measurement of whatever it is they use to make meth with from the antihistamines. You can only buy one box in a 24 hour period.

They have all the medicine over a certain limit behind the pharmacist's counter - even the cold medicine my daughters take when they get sick - Children's Triaminic Nighttime Cough and Cold - is behind the counter.

You have to pay for it at the pharmacy.

It is quite a shock the first time. It makes you feel like a criminal for having allergies.

It is going to be interesting this winter when everyone gets a cold because the hubby and I will need non-drowsy during the day, nighttime stuff for at night, the girls take the liquid, my son will only take the chewable pills.

It is a pain but I guess I understand why they are doing it. It is a huge problem.

[pitohui]

78. get used to it

being sick is a crime in this country

it's all about price support for the mexican drug cartels

didn't like local meth producers cutting into their take

texas should be ashamed

[SammyWinstonJack]

81. Guess I won't be buying any cold medication.

I'm not giving out my social security number. :banghead:

[liveoaktx]

83. See # 80-that doesn't appear to be in the bill

I did a word search in the bill, there's no requirement for social security. If I have to get Nyquil, etc, I'm going to print out the bill before I go and insist that I don't have to give out social security number, since it's not only apparently NOT in the bill but not supposed to be used for ID purposes.

[SammyWinstonJack]

95. Thanks for that info!

[cquik18]

82. Don't feel too much like the Lone Ranger...

they're doing the same thing in Tennessee...the official story is that people who make meth are using cold medicine as an ingredient...only difference is that they don't ask us for a phone number...big a copycat state Tennessee is, they'll probably wind up doing the same thing before long....

[Fuzz]

88. Yay, can't wait for my chip implant.

Lord knows I need to be protected from myself!

:rant:

[WhiteTara]

90. welcome to the New World Order

and you will say "Seig Heil"

[WhiteTara]

91. I just got it about the rants about the

non efficacy of Echinacea and vitamin c! Don't use something that will work and give up your "pedigree". Jeez they are so diabolical. Keep on using herbals. They aren't magic bullets, but taken consistently and early in the illness, they are both effective.

[pinto]

93. sounds a little overzealous. TX law requires only a photo ID and signature

Sec. 486.014. PREREQUISITES TO SALE. Before completing an
over-the-counter sale of a product containing ephedrine,
pseudoephedrine, or norpseudoephedrine, a business establishment
that engages in those sales shall:
(1) require the person making the purchase to:
(A) display a driver's license or other form of
identification containing the person's photograph and indicating
that the person is 16 years of age or older; and
(B) sign for the purchase;
(2) make a record of the sale, including the name of
the person making the purchase, the date of the purchase, and the
item and number of grams purchased; and
(3) take actions necessary to prevent a person who
makes over-the-counter purchases of one or more products containing
ephedrine, pseudoephedrine, or norpseudoephedrine from obtaining
from the establishment in a single transaction more than:
(A) two packages of those products; or
(B) six grams of ephedrine, pseudoephedrine,
norpseudoephedrine, or a combination of those substances

http://www.capitol.state.tx.us/cgi-bin/tlo/textframe.cmd?LEG=79&SESS=R&CHAMBER=H&BILLTYPE=B&BILLSUFFIX=00164&VERSION=5&TYPE=B

scroll way down, it's in "Subchapter C - Over-The-Counter Sales"

[Name removed]

94. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Bouncy Ball]

102. Ok Seeker and what do you propose progressives like myself

who are living in Texas do? Huh? Just go take a flying leap?

This is OUR state and the freepers can't fucking have it.

[FreedomAngel82]

96. Seriously?

For cold medicine???

[Ilsa]

97. I'd drop the medication and leave if someone asked me

for all of that shit for a $5 OTC purchase. Its not worth it. I'd rather suffer.

[napi21]

99. I understand your concern, but don't you realize that your ins. co

uses your SS # as your account #? Every health insurance I've ever had used my SS# as my account, and that info is already at your pharmacy if you've ever had a prescription filled under an insurance company benefit.

This is happening becaue a few nuts found out they can use an ingredient in these meds to make meth. You really need to stop blaming the gov't and your pharmacy for what these idiots are doing.

[Bouncy Ball]

103. Ok I hope you still have that atitude when there is a crazy law

for something you want to buy. My husband and daughter use Claritin to control their allergies and thus keep from getting sinus infections all the time. They've tried every prescription med in the world, through our doctor, and none of them have helped except the medicine in Claritin. For my husband, Actifed also helps a lot. I'll be damned if he's giving out his SS# to buy a box of **over the counter** allergy pills so he can fucking breathe.

If you actually think meth producers won't find a way to keep producing meth, while law-abiding people with allergies and colds get penalized, I've got some land to sell ya.

If meth labs are such a huge problem, there needs to be a concerted effort in law enforcement to bust and break up meth labs as fast as they start. If it's a huge problem, it should be a huge priority to police departments. Make it a hassle to start up a meth lab, make it incredibly hard, due to the police knocking on your door every time you even start one.

But doing this won't make it incredibly hard for the meth producers. The big labs most likely don't buy their stuff retail, anyway! ("It fell of the back of a truck, officer.")

Mark my words, this will do nothing to slow down meth labs.

[napi21]

104. I realize why you're upset, but why so much about your SS#?

Look at your health ins card. Read your ID#. I bet it's your SS#! Your pharmacy already has it!

Sure, it's going to take you a few more minutes to get your OTC meds, but really, what's the big deal?

I don't know much about met labs, and really don't care to either. I have heard meth is a BIG problem though. If these nuts are using allergy and cold pills as a cupply source for one of the necessary ingredients, the authorities (whoever they are) ARE putting a strong arm on their supply. Nobody's telling you or your hisband you can't have them, they're just trying to make sure whoever buys them isn't running a meth lab.

You're being way to critical here.

[dogday]

106. What health card?

You assume we have insurance which is the wrong assumption. I think it is alot of information to buy a package of allergy tabs. I would worry that the day is coming that they will require a DR.'s prescription. Then what wonderful advice will you have for me?

[Moosepoop]

108. Insurance companies are moving away from using SS #s

Yes, insurance providers have traditionally used a person's SS# as his/her ID# on insurance cards. But that is changing, due to concerns of identity theft. My family has Blue Cross insurance through my husband's employer, and B/C recently changed that policy and issued new cards with different ID#s on them to all their policy-holders.

[Bridget Burke]

107. Down in Michoacan, the cristaleros are happy

The Narcocorridos now have lyrical subjects beyond polvo blanco y yerba mala. Certain Mexicans have always been happy to take make money off Gringo weakness.

Seriously, the SS# request is excessive. I'll find out next time I buy my generic Sudafed--the most side-effect-free remedy I've found for allergic rhinitis.

[SheepyMcSheepster]

110. do you have to supply SS# to buy a gun?

just curious.
thanks