DLC jockeying to create 3rd party?

[thefloyd]

I had a 4 hour drive today through Mid Missouri so the dial was cram packed with fundie radio. A thought hit my mind all of a sudden. Does anyone believe the DLC in the future would break off and create a third party?

[Lorien]

1. Seems to me

that they are more interested in a one party system.

[FreedomAngel82]

4. They want to take over the DNC

I believe they tried with Terry McAullife and then when he retired they tried to put someone in but the DNC committe was smart and elected Howard Dean thank goodness. I think that one guy from Texas was a DLCer because of some things he said and I had a really weird feeling dealing with him and didn't trust him at all. :shrug: I've read that McAullife catered to corporations and they gave money to him last election cycle and all that and now with Dean he's loyal to the people and has been I think since he got into politics (from what I've read and seen of him). My dad once made an interesting point and he said he thought the democrats (me the DLC) wanted Kerry to lose so Hillary could run and win in 2008. I remember reading an interview with Kerry's ex-wife Julia last late November or in December and she was talking about how Kerry wanted to go after the SBVT guys but the DNC (McAullife running) didn't let him and they also didn't let any Bush bashing happen at the convention. Remember Al Sharpton went away from the script he gave the DNC. I think now that Dean is running the DNC it will be harder for the DLC to take over the party because I don't think Dean will let them. I believe Dean actually does listen to the people. I don't see how the DLC could form a third party and have anybody elected since mostly our government is a two-party system.

[expatriot]

2. look at these Congressional scorecards....

I put together the following thread yesterday... please take a look...... (text reprinted here, but for links to work go to original thread)

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=1976988&mesg_id=1977058


I put all these scorecards in an Excel and sorted by Party and found the averages and then I took the 18 DLC Senators (listed below) to find their average. There is a substantive difference between the GOP and all Democrats on these issues. I have seen the union scorecards and know there is substantial difference on that as well, just haven't crunched the data yet (actually, on the SEIU scorecard for last year, all 18 DLCers scored 100% but there were only three votes recorded).
Oh, and I included Jeffords in with the Dems (he caucuses with us).


NEA 2004 Congressional Scorecard
http://capwiz.com/nea/scorecard/?chamber=S&session=108&...
GOP AVG 29
DEM AVG 88
DLC AVG 90

2004 League of Conservation Voters (LCV)
http://www.capwiz.com/lcv/dbq/vote_info/?offset=0&lengt...
GOP AVG 11



DEM AVG 74
DLC AVG 65

2004 NARAL
http://www.vote-smart.org/issue_rating_detail.php?sig_i...
GOP 5.9
DEM 81.5
DLC 68.9

2004 ACLU http://action.aclu.org/site/VoteCenter?page=congScoreca...
GOP 13
DEM 68
DLC 67

-------------added later, see Post #3 in original thread---------------

I am working very fast, must go to work.... i found this and crunched it quickly

Peace Action 2003:

GOP: 1.43%!
DEM: 85.6%
DLC: 73.33%

http://www.vote-smart.org/issue_rating_detail.php?sig_i...

dont know what votes are included... no time now.... must go to work. bye

on edit: know there are at least 10 votes included since Joementum got a 10 per cent rating.... no argument from me there... he's as close as you can get to a neocon foreign policy wise without being a Republican. But w/o Joe's low score, the rest of the DLC would look even better. okay... to WORK!

---------------------------------


NEA:
DLC
Mark Pryor (D) 85% 85%
Max Baucus (D) 85% 85%
Hillary Clinton (D) 85% 85%
Herbert Kohl (D) 85% 85%
Thomas Carper (D) 85% 85%
Joseph Lieberman (D) 88% 88%
Blanche Lincoln (D) 90% 90%
Dianne Feinstein (D) 90% 90%
Bill Nelson (D) 90% 90%
Evan Bayh (D) 90% 90%
Mary Landrieu (D) 90% 90%
Ben Nelson (D) 90% 90%
Kent Conrad (D) 90% 90%
Tim Johnson (D) 94% 94%
Debbie Stabenow (D) 95% 95%
Byron Dorgan (D) 95% 95%
Maria Cantwell (D) 95% 95%
John Kerry (D) 100% 100%

[thefloyd]

3. I could not agree more

Excellent write up.

[expatriot]

6. thanks, but if you don't mind me asking....

...what led you to think that they might form a third party?

[thefloyd]

8. I was listening to a radio

program and there were people calling in and talking about frustration with both parties and a third party revolution was in order. Got me thinking about all the blogs I read about the DLC, how Cons moved to the
far right and liberals want to move left. Think of all the wide open space in the middle probably filled with people frustrated with both parties. I like peddling in theories too much BUT condsidering I have hardcore Attention Deficit disorder I am not surprised....

[expatriot]

10. Okay, I see your reasoning now but what makes this country a

two party system.. is that winner takes all...

this is how I see the political situation in a nut shell

Think of the political spectrum in the United States as a bellcurve. Where the middle bulk of Americans is right there plop in the middle, who do not get their information from anywhere besides the corporate media and the stereotypes echoed in the media, etc. These are the people who have little interest in politics, etc. As you move to each extreme, the right and the left... this is where ideology starts increasingly becoming a factor over corproate influence, etc. This is the activist base of both conservatives and liberals. On the ends of the spectrum are the activists, the ideological starting point and soul of the political parties. Now while both parties must start from their base, the contest is for the center. and when one party moves towards their base the other party will try and take advantage of it and push to gain the ground in the center being conceded. So they are like sumo wrestlers throwing all their weight against eachother for the center. Now the harsh reality is that perhaps that the center is not where we want it to be. Like only 18% of Americans self-identigy as liberals but like 36% self-identify as conservative. of course, this is self-identification and doesn't mean anything in terms of real political beliefs but thereis some truth to it. Now this is not to say we should concede and let them define the center, it is a two front war. It is all about messaging.... we need to continually work to educate Americans on their interests and the interests of the community and about the dangers of conservativism, I have to go to bed... so tired can't finish thought. night

[FreedomAngel82]

5. Sorry all that is just a foreign language to me

Can you explain it?

[expatriot]

7. sure, sorry....

First off, large interest groups very commonly publish "congressional legislative scorecards" to measure how legislators in the Congress vote on the issues that are important to them. So, for example, the NEA (National Educators Association) will make a list of let's say 10 votes that they felt really affected education that year. Then each time a Senator or Representative votes "with" the NEA on an issue, they get a certain percentage (If their were 10 votes scored that year, each "right" vote would get ten percent).

So interest groups that are aligned to your values (here I chose to look at the NEA (public education), the League of Conservation Voters (environment) the National Advancement of Reproductive Rights of America League (choice) the ACLU and Peace Action.


The higher the score the better on these issues. Look how low the GOP is on the scale (remember - 0 equals voting AGAINST the group's stances on issues all of the time - 100% equals voting WITH the group's stances all of the time) my point is that the DLC average is MUCH closer to the Democrat average than they are to the Republicans... so much so, that equating DLCers to Goopers is quite unfounded.

NEA 2004 Congressional Scorecard
http://capwiz.com/nea/scorecard/?chamber=S&session=108& ...
GOP AVG 29
DEM AVG 88
DLC AVG 90

2004 League of Conservation Voters (LCV)
http://www.capwiz.com/lcv/dbq/vote_info/?offset=0&lengt ...
GOP AVG 11



DEM AVG 74
DLC AVG 65

2004 NARAL
http://www.vote-smart.org/issue_rating_detail.php?sig_i ...
GOP 5.9
DEM 81.5
DLC 68.9

2004 ACLU http://action.aclu.org/site/VoteCenter?page=congScoreca ...
GOP 13
DEM 68
DLC 67

[firefox]

9. No way.

The two-party system is exactly what the fascists want along with throwing out any call for a majority in all elections. We have a system designed by the powerful. That includes the Federal Reserve as a private central bank. It includes a medical system where people with insurance get cheaper rates than those that pay cash. It includes a controlled media. We have a drug war to build a police state and drive up prices for the benefit of the CIA. But most of all, it demands a two-party system.

The purpose of the DLC is to weaken the Democratic Party, so that the real hard-core fascists can have the Republican party destroy the Constitution and pursue global domination.

We are slaves to the corporations and the government is the overseer. I could be wrong, but does it not seem that some "astute" member of Congress would say something along those lines? I would not be surprised if they call for a reduction in the minimum wage.

[athlon]

11. Please---do it