What the HELL is Christian Rock?

[Ruffhowse]

I see all these groups with vaguely Christian symbolic names putting out amateurish rock music while the zombies look on. It's so weird. Isn't the whole point of rock music pretty much against the philosophy these born-agains espouse anyways? Why do they feel the need to co-opt it? Aren't their Pat Boone and country records enough? What's next, Christian pornography?

[TWiley]

1. It is stinky music.

I had to attend a Christian rock concert held at a Union Hall about a year ago. All I can say is that it was truly embarrassing. For some reason, they felt they really had to let the demons out that night. I never saw a group of people work so hard at being so worldly.

The musicians tried to act like genuine rock stars while their music was really really bad. The "worship" they demanded and received was enough to drive this soul right into the parking lot.

A friends husband who played in the band saw me leave and quizzed me about his performance. Not immediately receiving the desired response, the subject turned to salvation; mine of course.

It was a very uncomfortable experience.

[orion9941]

2. And on the seventh day...

god said 'Thou shalt rock out with thy c*ck out!' So let it be said so let it be done. And the self indulgent - self important white upper middle class children heard this and said...dude!

[Swamp Rat]

25. Excellent, Your Dudeness!

Party on, dude!

[Warren DeMontague]

3. "Christian Porn"

No, No, That's too much.

Is nothing sacred?

By which, I mean, please don't screw up Porn like that.

[REP]

4. Here's Some:

Behold, thou art fair, my love; behold, thou art fair; thou hast doves' eyes within thy locks: thy hair is as a flock of goats, that appear from mount Gilead.
Thy teeth are like a flock of sheep that are even shorn, which came up from the washing; whereof every one bear twins, and none is barren among them.
Thy lips are like a thread of scarlet, and thy speech is comely: thy temples are like a piece of a pomegranate within thy locks.
Thy neck is like the tower of David builded for an armoury, whereon there hang a thousand bucklers, all shields of mighty men.
Thy two breasts are like two young roes that are twins, which feed among the lilies.
Until the day break, and the shadows flee away, I will get me to the mountain of myrrh, and to the hill of frankincense.
Thou art all fair, my love; there is no spot in thee.
Come with me from Lebanon, my spouse, with me from Lebanon: look from the top of Amana, from the top of Shenir and Hermon, from the lions' dens, from the mountains of the leopards.
Thou hast ravished my heart, my sister, my spouse; thou hast ravished my heart with one of thine eyes, with one chain of thy neck.
How fair is thy love, my sister, my spouse! how much better is thy love than wine! and the smell of thine ointments than all spices!
Thy lips, O my spouse, drop as the honeycomb: honey and milk are under thy tongue; and the smell of thy garments is like the smell of Lebanon.
A garden inclosed is my sister, my spouse; a spring shut up, a fountain sealed.
Thy plants are an orchard of pomegranates, with pleasant fruits; camphire, with spikenard,
Spikenard and saffron; calamus and cinnamon, with all trees of frankincense; myrrh and aloes, with all the chief spices:
A fountain of gardens, a well of living waters, and streams from Lebanon.
Awake, O north wind; and come, thou south; blow upon my garden, that the spices thereof may flow out. Let my beloved come into his garden, and eat his pleasant fruits.
(Song of Solomon)

[Warren DeMontague]

5. You better not let Pat Robertson know about that.

Between that and the stuff about camels, needles, and rich people.. he's liable to plum flip out.

[Warren DeMontague]

8. Anyway, that's why I prefer the Tao Te Ching

because the Bible has too many dirty parts.

[Warren DeMontague]

9. Oh, and one more thing...

The Song of Solomon is the Old Testament, which would technically make it Jewish Porn, IMHO.

[REP]

13. Leviticus is Old Testament

You know, the part about hares chewing their cud, not wearing mixed fibers and God hating gays? (It's also the part that makes me a bastard!) A lot of Xians read that part, so I think we can include the Song of Solomon as Xian porn.

[Warren DeMontague]

16. Ah, but it's just another case of them co-opting someone else's material

Hell, it can be argued they 'borrowed' big chunks of the Jesus narrative from the legends of Dionysus, Osiris, etc. etc.

Of course, who was it who said "immature artists borrow; mature artists steal"

And don't feel too bad. I committed a Levitican abomination with a shrimp burrito just this afternoon.

[REP]

17. Uhm

I'm trying to imagine how one can lie with a shrimp burrito. Were your flowers upon you?

[Warren DeMontague]

20. It was a beautiful thing we shared.

Lets leave it at that.

[REP]

21. UNCLEAN! UNCLEAN!

(Unless you washed your hands.)

[TWiley]

103. How fair is thy love, my sister, my spouse ??

How fair is thy love, my sister, my spouse! how much better is thy love than wine! and the smell of thine ointments than all spices!

Whoops, I guess Solomon did not get the Bible tract that was handed to me last Friday. If he were a modern day fella, it sounds like he would be messing around with his sisters panties !

[zanne]

50. I saw a girl at a department store last week...

She was wearing shorts that showed part of her butt cheeks, a top so small they could barely contain her breasts and a small gold chain with a cross resting upon her huge silicone-augmented boobs. What the hell does that mean? Has the cross taken up another meaning when I wasn't looking?

[TWiley]

102. Bless her little soul !

I would take a look at her butt cheeks, and thank God for it as well. Now that is GOOD meditation !

[sandnsea]

132. Madonna ring a bell?

Sometimes people have a short memory, or selective..

Jesus Is Just All Right With Me...

[keopeli]

6. I was once in a Christian Pop Quartet.

In the last 20+ years, Christians have embraced "rock" and "pop" music as long as the lyrics are God centered.

When an artist's lyrics don't focus enough on specifically God centered lyrics, they reject the artist. They did this with Pat Boone and with Amy Grant.

It is a genre in which you either qualify as explicitly Christian or you are not part of the group. That's what makes it Evangelical in nature.

Because of the lyrical limitations, most artists avoid the genre. Of course, some of us are turned off by the strange atmosphere in the room.

[Jamastiene]

7. I thought

images of blown up children from the "war on terror" was right wing "Christian" pornography already. They sure seem proud of what they are doing.

Christian rock is an odd thing when you think about it. Other than liberal Christians, most of the churches seem to be against rock music altogether. I still have nightmares about Stryper. I can't believe how popular they were. I lived through the horrendous 80's and that band more than any other sticks out in my mind at least visually. Those boys looked more like girls than any of the hair bands. Normally, I wouldn't look at it as a bad thing if a guy looks like a girl when he's all dressed up, but mixed with Bible quotes, it just sorta left a bad taste in my mouth. I just didn't get them.

[orion9941]

10. For a lomg time...

I used to think that Stryper was a new form of toilet paper that came out in the 80's. As it turns out I wasn't too far from the truth.

[Jamastiene]

19. They would have been perfect for that actually.

Designer ass wipes, that they were.

[Cary]

11. Personally I prefer lubavitcher rock.

They're much more "with it."

[Warren DeMontague]

12. What are you talking about? These gents are ALL man:

They have covered themselves with STRIPES so you don't forget who they are.

Anyway, to be fair, a lot of 80s hair bands looked like that-- with the added irony that the whole scene seemed to espouse a pretty homophobic attitude. (At least the secular glam metal scene, I can't speak for the smaller, nascent Christian glam metal scene, although my spidey sense tells me it would be at least as bad or worse) Not that I would really know. I pretty much missed that boat; I spent the early 80s listening to the Dead, and R.E.M. before anyone knew who they were... it wasn't until college that I ran into people who listened to that poop, and I was dumbfounded by it.

[Jamastiene]

14. LOL

Yeah, they are all man all right, weird man at that.
:rofl:

[nookiemonster]

15. The "Yellow and Black attack"!

ROFLOL!!!!

[GreenPartyVoter]

107. I loved those guys when I was a teen. Saw them in concernt, got their

autographs.

[Warren DeMontague]

122. Well, hey, aesthetic appreciation is nothing if not subjective.

My first concert was Lou Reed. Overall, my taste hasn't changed a whole lot since I was 16.

[hexola]

42. Churches are embracing youth and their culture...

Many of the churches in my area (the ones with the $$$$) have setup music clubs for the youth - nice places - nicer than most of the clubs that secular bands play...they just dont sell alcohol...only coffee and juice. But stacked with technology - video screens, nice house PA systems, big stages, nice rooms...

I dont get the idea that they are against rock music - from a strictly musical point of view (loud guitars etc...) - just against negative lyrics and anti-chritian themes...

[Lexingtonian]

68. our local megachurch is doing that

Doing their sad best to try to seal their kids off from the Modern world and become part of a Christian subculture/subsociety that really doesn't exist in public life here in New England. (Well, there is a PAX-TV affiliate. For late nights when you really have a need to see hottie Rexella Van Impe's latest hokum, Joel Osment's con artistry in action, John Tesh vacuating nice music of any spirituality it might have, or nature photos of parts of Idaho you'll never visit.)

About half of the congregation (the Bush loving clique that runs it is migrants from the Corn Belt) is vehement in pushing this stuff- like building a massively expensive gymnasium into the building about as large as their 'sanctuary'. The other half of the congregation is subdued and passively or unhappily going along with it- just withholding money from it, as much as they dare.

The kids themselves have caught on that they're going to be ghettoized in a new way though, I hear. They'll figure out some way of bearing the public idiocy with a smile and vanishing out the back doors when no one's paying attention, though, no doubt about that.

[The Stranger]

84. "negative lyrics and anti-chritian themes..."

These people pretend to be "Christian", but they stand against everything their supposed Savior espoused:

1. They support war;

2. They support state killing;

3. They support the destruction of the poor;

4. They hate and ostracize those that are not like them.

Their hands-raised, eyes-closed, swaying "worship" is a drug, not a religious experience, or a meaningful theology.

[Swamp Rat]

18. Faith + 1

:D

[pointblank]

30. Probably my favorite South Park episode!!

The part where Cartman makes them pose for the picture is hilarious...Can you say Creed? :rofl:

[Chovexani]

109. That episode was awesome

Especially when Cartman flips out at the end. :D

[LosinIt]

22. ask Lou Gramm, formerly of Foreigner

after his rehab in the early 90s and then a bout with a serious brain tumor, he has seen the light of Jesus. I tried to get a link from an article in the Rochester, NY Democrat and Chronicle from July 28th, but you had to pay for it because it has been archived. Damn.

[Touchdown]

100. Oh' will he ever sing "Dirty White Boy" again?

:rofl:

[progressivebydesign]

106. Rick Derringer is a major born again...

.. you can't even stomach any articles about him anymore, it's almost unreadable.

[HysteryDiagnosis]

23. It's the rock of ages..... or so I've heard.

[obreaslan]

You take a band that sounds like Air Supply, and remove all of the soul.

:)

[hexola]

24. "Jars Of Clay" are pretty good...and what about Jerry Garcia....?

Jars - saw them...they were much better than expected. Good songs, good performers.

As a rock musician myself...from a macro-view...Rock and Roll has always been soft-pedaling Christianity...at least some of it...

Take a look Jerry Garcia's reperoire - the king of the hippies..."Brothers and Sisters" "Midnight Moonlight" and many more are christian songs...

The newer, "praise" bands - can be annoying - but some are legit and sound pretty good.

I occasionally see a local band called "Emberfall" that plays Christian-ish music...

http://www.purevolume.com/emberfall

[KittyWampus]

110. Thanks! What's Next? Ridiculing Gospel? Guess Not Since It's Associated

with Black America and DU'ers wouldn't want to be PC.

[Chovexani]

113. Sure why not

99% of contemporary gospel singers completely suck. They can't get through a song without resorting to the sort of vocal gymnastics that would make Mariah Carey proud, and most of them can't even sing to begin with.

They're also unbelievably tacky.

-C.

[KittyWampus]

115. maybe you mean 99% of who gets PLAYED in Payola system? Cause

college radio plays some outSTANDING stuff from gospel singers and groups that I've never heard of before.

[Warren DeMontague]

127. No, clearly artists like Amy Grant and STRYPER should be off-limits

from any sort of "ridicule", just because they have -at one time or another- worn the mantle of "Christian Rock".

:eyes:

And speaking of Gospel, I'm a huge fan of the late Pops Staples. But he never seemed like he was shoving anything, like his beliefs, down anybody's throat. That's a lesson, or perhaps a style, that the African American Christian Community seems to have embodied in a large part....

but for whatever reason it often flies right over the collective heads of certain other would-be "Christians".

[Le Taz Hot]

135. Oh, please!

There's a HUGE difference between authentic gospel music (Mahalia Jackson, Willie Mae Barret and the Barret sisters, the Staple Singers, etc.) and the cacophony that passes as Christian rock. It's on a par with "smooth jazz" and "new age" (elevator music for yuppies). A lot of music, including and especially the aforementioned, is just shit.

[Warren DeMontague]

123. Jerry played those songs because he loved them, IMHO

I saw a lot of JGB, and never got the feeling he was shillin' for any particular stripe of ideology or religion, certainly not Christianity. "Brothers and Sisters" can be interpreted in a lot of ways; the 'faithful' could be considered the hippie community just as easily as the christian community. As for Midnight Moonlight, (great song, BTW) if ol' Jer' had really wanted people to get the "Christian" references in the lyrics, he probably wouldn't have sung them so fast!

And if you look at the Dead's work as a whole, if any philosophical river of thought is represented in the lyrics, it's Taoism IMHO. Shit, parts of "Ripple" are taken directly from the Tao Te Ching.

[Warren DeMontague]

126. Here's my take: There is an overlap between what I consider to be

the core truths of TRUE Christianity; i.e. do unto others, treat your neighbor as yourself.. and the core truths of many faiths, paths, or roads (so MANY roads, remember?) like Buddhism, which emphasize the commonallity of all consciousness and compassion towards all sentience. That those core messages turn up in both what I consider "enlightened" or "illuminated" rock-and-roll, like the Dead's, and in what I consider TRUE Christianity (and something which has been on sadly short display in the so-called "Christian" community at large in the US, of late) doesn't mean that Rock and Roll is "soft-pedaling Christianity". Christianity doesn't have any singular claim to kindness, or treating people decently, or looking into your neighbor's eyes and seeing yourself there.

In fact, it's my opinion that "Christianity" as an entity (if you can consider it one) largely bungled a big portion of the message when they added "treat your neighbor as yourself, but you have to believe in Jesus to get into heaven, or to even get to that place of I am You as You are Me as We are He and We are All Together". One of the driving forces behind some of the best rock-and-roll, IMHO, has been the drive to find alternate spiritual routes, ones which touch on kindness, compassion, and karmic equivalence between beings, yet don't depend on dogma, rigid belief structures, or a specific brand of sectarianism.

Again, everybody has their own path, but to assert that rock and roll is somehow inherently "Christian" just because certain core truths turn up in both rock and roll and Christianity, is poor logic.

[izzie]

26. Who knows the ones living next door to me just shoot off guns all the time

Rock would be better on the ears.

[tx_dem41]

27. "Isn't the whole point of rock music pretty much against the philosophy ..

...these born-agains espouse anyways?"

I'm not sure I buy that statement. Rock, and music in general, is an artistic statement of the personal beliefs of the artist. So, I'm not sure I buy your self-defined limits on "what is rock?"

[hexola]

37. Rock and Roll has always soft pedaled Christianity...IMO.

Ozzy Osbourne:

Time will tell on their power minds
Making war just for fun
Treating people just like pawns in chess
Wait 'till their judgment day comes,

Now in darkness, world stops turning
Ashes where the bodies burning
No more war pigs of the power
Hand of god has struck the hour
Day of judgement, god is calling
On their knees, the war pigs crawling
Begging mercy for their sins
Satan, laughing, spreads his wings
All right now!

Eric Clapton

If I can reach the stars,
Pull one down for you,
Shine it on my heart
So you could see the truth

Sublime

Oh the path is there for those who want to,
pay the price of loving you,
in more ways than one.
Wrapped around your finger,
but I think my time has come,
but I never can be too sure,
cuz I like to have a little fun.

=======================================

...one gets the idea...

[tx_dem41]

43. I'll guess we'll just ignore Dylan, U2, and Van Morrison et. al. then.....

:eyes:

[hexola]

45. elaborate?

are you agreeing with me, or was this for the post above mine?

[tx_dem41]

46. For the post above mine....and also for yours.

I'm just questioning the generalization that you made in your OP and that the other poster continued when siting 3 song passages.

You just can't generalize about an art genre, IMO.

[hexola]

51. Well - its just that - a generalization...still confused...

Im confused as the aritists you cite would tend to support my generalization...(I cited the 3 songs)

Dylan has written tons of Chirstian stuff...

U2:

Strung out like a guitar
Maybe you can educate my mind
Explain all these controls
Can’t sing but I’ve got soul
The goal is elevation

Van Morrison

Could you find me?
Would you kiss-a my eyes?
To lay me down
In silence easy
To be born again
To be born again

Dylan:

When He rose from the dead, did they believe?
He said, "All power is given to Me in heaven and on earth."
Did they know right then and there what that power was worth?

[tx_dem41]

55. Now I'm confused! LOL....

You just made my point (thanks for doing the heavy lifting on lyrics). You seemed to say in the OP that rock was by its very nature anti-Christian.

Help! Its too early in the A.M. I guess.

[hexola]

58. Oh no - Rock is pro-christian...that was my point...

I used the term "soft pedaling" - i.e. not an obvious appeal, or not as in your face as "christian" bands...

Yet, still there...

[Warren DeMontague]

131. Containing roughly analogous messages is not the same thing as promotion:

See post #126

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=4293135&mesg_id=4298784

[Warren DeMontague]

130. Dylan made it pretty well known when he converted to Christianity

nothing "soft-pedaled", or particularly surprising, there.

Personally, in terms of Dylan, I'll take this line:

She talks to all the servants
about man, and god, and law
everybody says
she's the "brains" behind Paw.

[charlie]

59. I can

Disco blew a river of chunks and I don't mind saying so.

[tx_dem41]

60. And, I don't mind you saying so!

:)

[ClintonTyree]

28. A way for Rockers without enough talent........

to make in in REAL Rock and Roll to play to sold out concerts and pick up the christian groupies who may have a temporary lapse of faith.
At least that's how I've got it figured.

[MADem]

62. I think you hit the nail on the head

That was my take as well.

[H5N1]

119. That's it: a way for second rate musicians to get laid

I used to book bands. These clowns are phony as
a four dollar bill. They just wanna Git 'r Done!

[Warren DeMontague]

138. Of course, since they're having sex with the "abstinence only" pledge gang

I'd imagine nobody knows diddly jack shit about birth control.

[Tesha]

29. Bad. (NT)

[porphyrian]

31. Niche market.

Once certain denominations declared rock music satanic, there opened up a huge market for teens who wanted that rock sound without the threat of eternal damnation (or parental beatings). Thus, this awful shit was born unto the world. Capitalism wins again, and those involved are too stupid to realize it, except, maybe, for the bands.

[Hubert Flottz]

32. They found out that some good old Black Sabbath on 78 speed,

charms the church snakes better than Amazing Grace!

[sendero]

33. A prime example of an oxymoron

.... after spending years denouncing it they are trying to co-opt it.

[GreenArrow]

34. it's a diabolical ploy

to steal souls.

[hexola]

35. its really about marketing...and the music isnt that bad...

You make it sound like Christians are incabable of making good music...

15 years ago you would have been right...

Check out Bubby Fann - the Jadah Prayze - great album...

http://www.gospelflava.com/reviews/bubbyfannjudah.html

Now - Third Day and Delerious - they do sort of stink, and reek of repackaged Christian-ized pop...so I am not in total disagreement.

[OrlandoGator]

36. The weirdest thing is the audience...

Eyes closed, hands up to the sky...they indeed look like freaking zombies.

[hexola]

38. I guess you never saw The Grateful Dead...(nt)

[OrlandoGator]

40. They were stoned, not pretending to be possessed by the glory of Jesus.

Subtle difference.

[tx_dem41]

48. One man's "ganja" is another man's "Jesus"

Six of one, half dozen of another.

[OrlandoGator]

53. Difference is, when you're stoned you're not pretending.

n/t

[tx_dem41]

56. We could argue that point.

But, we really shouldn't. :)

Oh...Geaux Tigers! Beat dem' Gators! ;)

[OrlandoGator]

118. It's going to be hard now that my Dolphins have your coach.

n/t

[tx_dem41]

133. I think LSU is going very very far this year...

stacked at RB and WR...QB has experience now. Watch out! :)

[Warren DeMontague]

128. You had to be there. Either you've experienced the kind of transformative

power with mass consciousness the Dead had (on a good night) or you haven't.

But it had nothing to do with any particular brand of religion, IMHO, and it really wasn't about the drugs, either.

And most importantly -and this is a distinction lost upon many "Christians"-, I have absolutely NO desire to go door to door with copies of Europe '72, trying to convince other people to see things my way.


Hey, to each his own.

[KittyWampus]

112. Bwahahah.... So Many Fond Memories Which I've Retained Since I Rarely

dropped acid.

[Warren DeMontague]

129. Yeah, and I've retained a good chunk of my cerebellum

by not subscribing to any rigid dogmas or belief systems.

Again, to each his (or her) own.

[ToeBot]

39. What it is exactly I couldn't say, but trust Time-Life to find enough...

songs to cobble together a "greatest hits" collection. Making yet another piece of shit to whore endlessly all over their cable channels. I don't think I've seen a more frightening and disturbing commercial. It's like a glimpse into some bizarre alternative dimension, a 45 second episode of the Twilight Zone. Is this the face of rapture? I'll take the Rock and Roll alternative: Tequila shooters in the cheap seats then face down in the gutter puking my guts out, just to get up and start all over again.

If they are going to heaven, I'd rather end up in hell.

[SheepyMcSheepster]

41. it might be "christian" but it sure isn't "rock"

there is nothing "rocking" about it.

it's like Big Bird trying to be a gangsta, it just doesn't work.
the two things are total opposites to begin with.

we have a few christian rock/contemporary stations in my area. when i have the radio scanning around i can tell it's on the christian station just by hearing smallest snippet music. it just screams lack of creativity and faux emotion.

now there are a few groups out there that don't completely suck. jars of clay for example. but overall i find most artist billed as "christian" to be talentless hacks when comes to actually writing and putting out respectable music.

[toddaa]

44. Check out Blackhouse

Old School Industrial noise (ala Throbbing Gristle).

http://www.humboldt1.com/%7Eblackhouse/index.html

Makes NiN sound like Pat Boone.

[Cocoa]

47. to each his own

if they like it, who cares why?

[tx_dem41]

49. Exactly! n/t

[Bassic]

52. My band once opened for a Christian rock band a few years back

They basically play rock with Christian subjects (for example : Creed)

I reaaly felt uncomfortable though because the five of us (my band) were pretty much the only ones who weren't freak ass religious freaks. We don't have much of them in Québec, and they are mostly harmless, but they are still freaky. We had to put up with prayers before and after the show and people asking us what faith we followed and whatnot.


Just plain freaky.

[powergirl]

54. A SOUTHPARK EPISODE DID A GREAT JOB ON THIS ONE

Cartman started up a Christian rock band. All he did was change out words to "secular" songs. For example, the lyrics to Three Times a Lady were changed to "Once, twice, three times Jesus" As I am sure you can imagine, the lyrics became pretty ribald when the words to some gangsta rap songs were altered.

Also Cartman observed the album covers of Christian Rock bands necessitate the members standing in the woods looking in different directions. It's a great episode! :evilgrin:

[Lydia Leftcoast]

64. I'm not enough of a South Park viewer to know if Cartman is a regular

character, but there is actually a "Christian" singer named Carman who gives me the creeps. He sings about people being damned to hell, and he really looks evil himself--not in this picture, but in his videos, which I have sometimes caught on public access TV.

[charlie]

94. Man, that guy's a hoot

Champion

...When He said, "By His stripes they're healed," the devil shook!
He screamed, "Sickness is my specialty. I hate that healing junk!"
God said, "You shut your face, I wrote the book!"
Then the Father looked at His only Son and said,
"You know the rules.
Your blood will cleanse their sins and calm their fears."
Then He pointed His finger at Satan and said,
"And I know you know the rules.
You've been twisting them to deceive My people for years."
Satan screamed, "I'll kill you Christ! You'll never win this fight!"
The demons wheezed, "That's right, there ain't no way."
Satan jeered, "You're dead meat, Jesus, I'm gonna bust you UP tonight!"
Jesus said, "Go ahead, make my day!"
The bell rang, the crowd cheered, the fight was on...

...

Sunday's on the Way

...A tranquilizer and a horror filck, couldn't calm Satan's fears.
So Saturday night, he calls up the grave, scared of what he'd hear.
"Hey, grave, what's going on?"
Grave said, "Man, you done called me twice,
and I'll tell you one-more-'gin, boss, the Jew's on ice."
Satan said, " Man grave, you remember when,
Ol' Lazarus, was in his grave.
Everything was cool then four days later...BOOM,
Ol' Lazarus, he was raised...

[jonnyblitz]

57. i ask the same question about "conservative" punks!!

they came out of the woodwork prior to the last election. :wtf:


http://www.conservativepunk.com/index.asp

http://www.anti-anti-flag.com/index.php

http://www.gopunk.com/PostNuke/

http://punkvoterlies.blogspot.com/

[tx_dem41]

61. Hasn't "Oy" music been around for years? n/t

[charlie]

63. Hasidic punks?

Just tweakin' you. It's spelled Oi :)

[hexola]

65. Matisyahu - Hasidic Reggae Superstar!

http://www.hasidicreggae.com/index.php

[charlie]

67. Gefilte is de healin' of de nation, mon

Fun link, thanks!

[tx_dem41]

66. Doh! Somebody send coffee...stat! n/t

[jonnyblitz]

72. oi is skinhead music and not all skinheads are right wing.

i have queerskin friends even.the commie skinheads are known as "redskins". the neo-nazi skins get all the publicity..and of course there are the SHARPS who are blatently anti racist whose main mission is to counter the racist skins..but most people automatically assume skinhead =neo-nazi. not true.

[hexola]

73. What is "straightedge"?

Does that genre still exist? or is that old school...?

[charlie]

76. Neither fish nor fowl

Don't know what you'd call dope, drink, and tobacco-eschewing vegans -- not conservative, except maybe in a generic sense.

[jonnyblitz]

80. no sex before marriage, no drugs, no cigs , no drinking...vegan

if i remember correctily. they draw big black 'X's on their hands..i never paid much attention to them. I may be giving an inaccurate stereotypical rendition of them. i should google and get it more accurate..hehe

[hexola]

82. I think Henry Rollins claimed to be "straightedge" (nt)

[jonnyblitz]

87. fugazi is supposed to be the straightedge band that started it all

i didn't know about Henry Rollins...he doesn't seem like it to me. i am sure he likes sex before marriage. just a hunch..but who knows..hehe :hi:

[hexola]

88. perhaps back in the Husker Du days...and Fugazi does rock...

Those guys used play one of our local clubs regularly...too bad I was too much of hippie to dig it back then...

[jonnyblitz]

90. i never listened to fugazi all that much tho i listened to minor threat

i think rollins is from DC though he ended up in CA with black flag(black flag WAS from CA right?). I know i heard him mention minor threat lots so that is why i am not quick to doubt perhaps he is/was straightedge. i was on a navy ship in those days so i didnt follow all of this closely so i could be inaccurate.

I am getting old. sigh.

[Warren DeMontague]

137. Hmmm. Thinking back to my youth, one out of five aint bad...

I mean, I was never big on the cigs. :D

[Chovexani]

111. Yeah wtf is up with that?

Talk about totally missing the fucking point.

Woo..yay establishment! :wtf:

[jayfish]

69. I Think Everyone Is Missing The Point Here.

I don't think Ruffhowse is talking about the overt "look we're xtian" groups of the past. These new groups are subtle in their proselytizing and actually make good enough music to get a lot of airplay. I'm talking about bands like POD or Crossfade or Shinedown or any of the hidden Christan "rock" bands hiding in ambiguity.

Jay

[charlie]

71. Yeah, POD does pretty decent nu metal

Shocked the shit out of me when I learned they were first and foremost a Christian band (though they're coy about admitting it).

[hexola]

77. Agree - but that "ambiguity" is in a lot of mainstream rock and roll...

...Since the begining!

Not just some of these new bands...

[charlie]

79. Sure, there's always been Christian sentiments

in music, but I wouldn't call it Christian rock any more than I'd call Robert Johnson's stuff Satanic (or standard-issue metal bands, for that matter).

[The Stranger]

86. They have tried to co-opt modern music, but there are brass knuckles

inside the velvet glove. It is sheer proselytizing, and mass movement funded and guided by the extreme Right Wing.

They are too stupid to understand issues, so they are fed the drug of Jesus and told what to think.

[jayfish]

95. They Are Doing A Pretty Good Job Of It.

I'm like you in that I don't think it's as innocuous as some would like to think it is. Rap and hip-hop might have roughed rock music up a bit, but this stuff threatens to put it out of it's misery.

Jay

[WI_DEM]

70. Oh, who cares?

if young christians want to groove to christian rock music. It's no skin off my nose. Certainly nothing to get my undies in a bind over. Besides they won't be any kind of competition to the Stones or any other rock act.

[sam sarrha]

74. a band with a drummer.. approved by Jesus

[GreenPartyVoter]

75. Some of the bands, like King's X, Iona, and Pillar, are pretty good. And

King's X is pretty vague lyrically too boot. I prefer that to the Bible thumping music these days.

[charlie]

81. King's X is only 2/3 Christian nowadays

ever since Doug came out and got the royal fundie treatment.

[GreenPartyVoter]

92. If he says he's Christian then he's Christian. The fundies aren't the ones

who get to decide that.

[charlie]

96. Yeah, but he bailed

He's not a Christian anymore. They broke his heart.

[GreenPartyVoter]

101. I am sorry to hear that but in many ways I can't blame him.

[theboss]

78. I used to really like Petra when I was about 13 or 14

I also liked Stryper, but it was pretty obvious pretty fast that they were just faking the Christian part of their act.

Michael W. Smith was never really "rock," but he was certainly talented enough to have a crossover career. He did make a minor crossover effort in the early 90s.

There were a bunch of other bands that were popular with the kids at Church Camp and Teens for Christ. I was never liked most of them though.

I know DC Talk was big in the mid 90s with the kids in my mom's Sunday School class. Christian Rap just seemed weird to me though.

[lonestarnot]

83. a BIG rock with a Christian on it?

[goodboy]

85. any music that makes dorkie kids do this>>>>

<>

[nonincriminatin]

89. C.R.

It's ersatz noise.

[Lengsel]

91. So much . . .

Well, I guess our party isn't as open-minded and accepting as we thought. I'm not sure why bashing Christians is acceptable. Then again, most people don't like people who think differently and have differing interests.

There are a number of amazing christian bands. You should probably get out more.

Comeback Kid
Norma Jean
Extol
Lengsel
POD
Figure Four
As I Lay Dying

etc.

[GreenPartyVoter]

93. Welcome to DU. I am only familiar with POD but I agree they

are a good band.

[jayfish]

98. I Don't Mind The Music Portion...

of the songs (some of it is quite good). It's the subtle proselytizing that bugs me. BTW since when do 10-20 people talking about music represent the ideals of all Democrats. That's one beautiful thing about being a Dem; I don't have to agree or walk in lock-step with any ideal.

Welcome to DU.

Jay

[Lengsel]

104. it's not just

Well, it's not just talking about music that bugs me. I've been reading this site for a long time and I always see Christian bashing. People pretend to be bashing only the right-wing Christians but I perceive that they are not being all that honest. It seems as if bahsing Christian ideals, music, and lifestyle is in vogue on this site and I can't figure out why it's a good thing. If I came here bashing Muslims or Hindus or their music then people would call me a racist or idiot.

[jayfish]

117. You Are Confusing Race And Religion.

The two have little to do with each other. Race is genetic, religion is a choice. In all frankness, even though I don't, I have as much right to bash Christians as they have to bash people who, lets say, have an abortion. Religion is a lifestyle choice.

Jay

[Chovexani]

114. We're not bashing Christians

Just their shitty music.:P

(I've heard all those bands and they suck too, sorry)

[Norquist Nemesis]

97. Answer: Another way to make big $$$$$

The market segment of Christian anything has exploded and savvy people are tapping into it.

[shrike]

99. To me, the best Christian music is the old-time country

You know, "Lonesome Valley" and all that.

And gospel, and the old spirituals, of course. A blues singer/guitarist named Willie Johnson did a instrumental number, "Dark was the Night, and Cold was the Ground," which he based on Baptist church music. Song's been used in two movies, including "Paris, Texas."

Although I have heard some good Christian rock. I don't pay much attention to the new bands, but I liked Jars of Clay's "Flood."
For me, it's got to be a good song: I mean, there are plenty of horribly mysogynistic songs out there -- Stay with me, by the Faces -- which I like anyway because they rock so well. If the song's got good lyrics, good melody and beat, then I'll listen to it.

[progressivebydesign]

105. My husband worked with a well known Christian "rock" guy..

.. and he was so fed up with the whole Christian music biz. He said that the people in that genre, the suits, are so uptight and zombie like that if you accidentally let a swear word out, they become inconsolable. He said it's very restrictive and anti-creative It's a wierd wierd scene.

[Chovexani]

108. Absolute crap

But you know what's even worse than Christian rock?

Christian rap.

Oh, and for the people who think I'm Christian bashing, I will be the first to point out that Pagan rock is pretty fucking terrible too, with the exception of the Pagan goth bands.

[TWiley]

125. C (for Christian) + Rap = CRap !!

Can you imagine the lyrics?

We hate fags
We hate liberals
We hate all democrats
may they burn in hell

Gawd hates jews
we hate them too
they should move in with the Catholics
way out in timbuck tu

Jesus was a patriot
now i suffer brain rot
let me kill a muslim for Christ
and fry his ass with beans and rice.

bla bla
and I could go on and on

[trogdor]

116. It's like jumbo shrimp.

Or chocolate-flavored milk.
Or butter-flavored popcorn.
Or cheese-flavored macaroni.
Or meat-flavored spaghetti sauce.

This is rock-flavored Christian pap. I've heard it, and yes, it sucks.

[Arkansas Granny]

120. Actually, I find "Christian Rock" a little disturbing.

It almost seems like the Evangelicals, especially, are trying to establish a cult by appealing to teens and young adults via music, video games, etc. Various Evangelical churches in our area are constantly advertising these alternatives to "popular culture", but I'm not convinced it is necessarily a good thing. I think they are being trained to just drink the kool-aid and don't ask questions. They will be told what to think and how to act and anyone who disagrees is a sinner and is going straight to hell.

[nemo137]

121. Don't knock it until you have some good examples.

Five Iron Frenzy (I'd recommend getting either their live album or "Our newest album ever"), put out some of the best nerdy Christian ska music ever, before breaking up two years ago. Infact, they put out some of the best nerdy ska music ever.

[JohnLocke]

124. Total shit (nt).

[TimeChaser]

134. Well, according to Jack Chick

they're all run by Satan.
:silly:
http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0034/0034_01.asp

[MrSlayer]

136. It's an oxymoron.

It also sucks major league moose cock.