TEXT: And here's what our loved ones died for. IRAQI CONSTITUTION

[Bluebear]

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/international/AP-Iraq-Constitution-Text.html

Chapter One

Article One

The Republic of Iraq is an independent state.

Article Two

The political system is republican, parliamentary, democratic and federal.

1. Islam is a main source for legislation.

-- a. No law may contradict Islamic standards......

[BlueEyedSon]

1. Christian soldiers dying for Islamic law. Sounds about right to me....

[serryjw]

5. It it possible that woman will

have the same rights as men?

[BlueEyedSon]

7. About 0.0005% probability

[serryjw]

8. RFLOL!

Can you be more precise?

[BlueEyedSon]

9. If Mr. Spock was so smart, how come he never learned to "round off"?

[Bluebear]

16. "No law may contradict Islamic standards"

There is your answer.

[ncrainbowgrrl]

2. Take a look at article 66.

Article 66

A presidential candidate should:

1. Be Iraqi by birth and the offspring of two Iraqi parents.

2. Be no less than 40 years old.

3. Have a good reputation and political experience, and be known as honest and faithful to the nation.

[PsychoDad]

19. We could use that ourselves...

The Iraqi constitution also provides the right to education and health care. See post below.

[serryjw]

3. It won't be worth the paper it's printed on

if the insurgency doesn't stop or it turns into civil war.

[Whoa_Nelly]

20. There already is a civil war

Thanks, BushCo :sarcasm:

[The_Casual_Observer]

4. The freeps ought to be proud of this great jump back to the dark ages.

It's where they'd like to be anyway.

[NYC]

6. Islamic republic.

Is Bush's "mission accomplished" now?

[long_green]

10. How soon until our children are reading

"Miracle in Baghdad" in civics class?

[DanCa]

11. No law may contradict islamic standard

forget christian hello new boss meet the old boss

[long_green]

14. I think some people over here are gonna get awful jealous

of the Iraqis.
Hatriots all over this country will go to bed tonight and dream of the Iraqi constitution becoming the law of the land here...with Jeebus in place of Allah, of course.

[DanCa]

18. welcome to du long green

And of course you know the first the the fundies will do is ban the new testament.

[long_green]

21. Not Revelations

they have no theology at all without it.

[DanCa]

24. Well they can just make up a new revelations to go with thier party line

I mean that's what there doing with genesis and Intelligent Design. twist and tweak and fabricate what jesus said and sprinkle in your own rhetoric confuse the masses via repition and catch phrases, give am a common enemy and scare them hell fire and brimestone and boom instant kool aid. What did springsteen say. You take a god filled soul and you fill it with devils and dust.

[Toots]

12. I can see Falwell and Robertson calling for an Constitutional Ammendment

To say no law may contradict the Bible. If it's good enough for them Iraqis then it ought to be good enough for our Christian Nation. Praise the lord

[Bluebear]

13. And they will get a lot of people agreeing with them.

:crazy:

[DanCa]

15. shhhh --- dont give robertson any ideas

He's already goofier than a pet coon.

[PsychoDad]

17. Some other bits

PREAMBLE

The people of Iraq, striving to reclaim their freedom, which was usurped by the previous tyrannical regime, rejecting violence and coercion in all their forms, and particularly when used as instruments of governance, have determined that they shall hereafter remain a free people governed under the rule of law.

These people, affirming today their respect for international law, especially having been amongst the founders of the United Nations, working to reclaim their legitimate place among nations, have endeavored at the same time to preserve the unity of their homeland in a spirit of fraternity and solidarity in order to draw the features of the future new Iraq, and to establish the mechanisms aiming, amongst other aims, to erase the effects of racist and sectarian policies and practices.

This Law is now established to govern the affairs of Iraq during the transitional period until a duly elected government, operating under a permanent and legitimate constitution achieving full democracy, shall come into being.

CHAPTER ONE – FUNDAMENTAL PRINCIPLES
B) Gender-specific language shall apply equally to male and female.


Article 6.

The Iraqi Transitional Government shall take effective steps to end the vestiges of the oppressive acts of the previous regime arising from forced displacement, deprivation of citizenship, expropriation of financial assets and property, and dismissal from government employment for political, racial, or sectarian reasons.

Article 7. You should have quoted it all.

A) Islam is the official religion of the State and is to be considered a source of legislation. No law that contradicts the universally agreed tenets of Islam, the principles of democracy, or the rights cited in Chapter Two of this Law may be enacted during the transitional period. This Law respects the Islamic identity of the majority of the Iraqi people and guarantees the full religious rights of all individuals to freedom of religious belief and practice.

Article 12.

All Iraqis are equal in their rights without regard to gender, sect, opinion, belief, nationality, religion, or origin, and they are equal before the law. Discrimination against an Iraqi citizen on the basis of his gender, nationality, religion, or origin is prohibited. Everyone has the right to life, liberty, and the security of his person. No one may be deprived of his life or liberty, except in accordance with legal procedures. All are equal before the courts.

Article 13.

(A) Public and private freedoms shall be protected.

(B) The right of free expression shall be protected.

(C) The right of free peaceable assembly and the right to join associations freely, as well as the right to form and join unions and political parties freely, in accordance with the law, shall be guaranteed.

(D) Each Iraqi has the right of free movement in all parts of Iraq and the right to travel abroad and return freely.

(E) Each Iraqi has the right to demonstrate and strike peaceably in accordance with the law.

(F) Each Iraqi has the right to freedom of thought, conscience, and religious belief and practice. Coercion in such matters shall be prohibited.

(G) Slavery, the slave trade, forced labor, and involuntary servitude with or without pay, shall be forbidden.

(H) Each Iraqi has the right to privacy.

Article 14.

The individual has the right to security, education, health care, and social security. The Iraqi State and its governmental units, including the federal government, the regions, governorates, municipalities, and local administrations, within the limits of their resources and with due regard to other vital needs, shall strive to provide prosperity and employment opportunities to the people.

Article 15.
(B) Police, investigators, or other governmental authorities may not violate the sanctity of private residences, whether these authorities belong to the federal or regional governments, governorates, municipalities, or local administrations, unless a judge or investigating magistrate has issued a search warrant in accordance with applicable law on the basis of information provided by a sworn individual who knew that bearing false witness would render him liable to punishment. Extreme exigent circumstances, as determined by a court of competent jurisdiction, may justify a warrantless search, but such exigencies shall be narrowly construed. In the event that a warrantless search is carried out in the absence of an extreme exigent circumstance, the evidence so seized, and any other evidence found derivatively from such search, shall be inadmissible in connection with a criminal charge, unless the court determines that the person who carried out the warrantless search believed reasonably and in good faith that the search was in accordance with the law.

(C) No one may be unlawfully arrested or detained, and no one may be detained by reason of political or religious beliefs.




Wow... pretty barbaric and scary Islamic stuff there!

[Bluebear]

22. Islam is not scary. But a nation built on a religion is not a democracy

[PsychoDad]

25. They've already got around that....

Islam is the official religion of the State and is to be considered a source of legislation. No law that contradicts the universally agreed tenets of Islam

Universally agreed tenets of Islam? What are those? Islam is not monolithic, it's quite diverse and understood in many ways. If they mean the universal mainstream principals, then they should be strong for human rights and the advancement of education and the care of the poor and disenfranchised. Which last I checked were universal religious tenets.

de·moc·ra·cy n. pl. de·moc·ra·cies
1 Government by the people, exercised either directly or through elected representatives.
2 A political or social unit that has such a government.
The common people, considered as the primary source of political power.
3 Majority rule.
4 The principles of social equality and respect for the individual within a community

Democracy simply defines how a governmental system is governed. There is no mention of the need to exclude religion as a framework in order to fit the definition.

[bpilgrim]

34. It is a RELIGION

no getting around that.

and i would still like to see the original... who knows how many words got tweaked in this version :shrug:

peace

[PsychoDad]

23. Some more Jems.

It looks like they have learned much from us.

(I) Civilians may not be tried before a military tribunal. Special or exceptional courts may not be established.

(J) Torture in all its forms, physical or mental, shall be prohibited under all circumstances, as shall be cruel, inhuman, or degrading treatment. No confession made under compulsion, torture, or threat thereof shall be relied upon or admitted into evidence for any reason in any proceeding, whether criminal or otherwise.

Article 17. Damned gun control!

It shall not be permitted to possess, bear, buy, or sell arms except on licensure issued in accordance with the law.

[Brightmore]

30. That isn't the Constitution

That's the Law of Administration for the Transitional Period.

[geomon666]

31. here

http://www.rockymounttelegram.com/health/content/shared-gen/ap/Middle_East/Iraq_Constitution_Text.html

[Brightmore]

32. I don't think that's the Constitution

www.cpa-iraq.org/government/TAL.html

It's the Law of Administration for the Transitional Period written in March of 2004 before the elections.

[geomon666]

33. Ah yes. Sorry about that.

I didn't realize what you were talking about.

[bpilgrim]

36. that is how it is labeled at the NYT

Text of Proposed Iraq Constitution

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/international/AP-Iraq-Constitution-Text.html

though i want to see the ORIGINAL myself... who knows how many words have been tweak for us consumption :shrug:

peace

[Brightmore]

37. I was talking about PsychoDad's post

He posted parts talking about gender equality. Those excerpts weren't from the NY Times link or the draft Constitution but rather the Law of Administration for the Transitional Period written in March of 2004.

[newyawker99]

38. Hi Brightmore!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[Jack Rabbit]

26. I am truly disappointed in this document

What are Islamic standards? What are democratic standards? The Iraqi Parliament needs to know, but because it is prohibited from passing a law that contradicts either.

Power is transferred peacefully through democratic ways.

That sounds nifty. Exactly what does that mean? Free and fair elections? Well, then it it would be better say Power is transferred peacefully through free and fair elections.

Any organization that follow a racist, terrorist, extremist, sectarian-cleaning ideology or circulates or justifies such beliefs is banned, especially Saddam's Baath Party in Iraq and its symbols under any name. And this should not be part of the political pluralism in Iraq.

Again, we have a bunch of undefined words that need defined. Furthermore, as much as I hate Saddam -- not to mention racism, terrorism, extremism and sectarian-cleaning ideologies -- I don't see how banning them contributes to political pluralism. Indeed, limiting political expression, even that which is repulsive, diminishes political pluralism. Better: Parliament shall have the right to ban any organization it deem racist, terrorist, extremist or the elimination of other sectarian groups.

Human freedom and dignity are guaranteed.

This sentence sounds nice, but it should have been left out. It could mean anything. How would a judge interpret this?

No person can be detained or interrogated without a judicial order.

Excellent. This limits the power of the government. This is probably the best example of this kind of clause in this document. Unfortunately, there are too few of them.

The State guarantees . . . (f)reedom to establish political groups and organizations.

Except for the Baath Party? Wasn't that banned elsewhere?

Oil and gas are the property of all the Iraqi people in regions and provinces.

Another good clause. The neocons get a black eye over that one.

How is Parliament to be elected? How long may it sit before being dissolved? Aren't those important features of basic law?

[PsychoDad]

27. This is a document for the interem government...

Maybe some of these issues were the sticking points that delayed the document... terms of office, legality of various political parties, etc.

And remember this document was hammered together under the gun, as it were, with a deadline imposed by those who had bombed their country into the toliet.

I think much has been left to be hammered out later, what is here is a proposed framework, which has promise.

Remember our own constitution took a great deal of work and was forged and ratified before the addition of the bill of rights.

[Jack Rabbit]

40. That not what it says (but I hope that this is some kind of mistake)

The headline is Text of Proposed Iraq Constitution. This is supposed to be the basic law of the new Iraqi state?

It's not that I find particularly abominable features here. The document doesn't mandate that women shall walk three steps behind their husbands or anything like that. In fact, there are some good things here.

However, as a basic structure of government, this fails. It mentions who can run for president and even then says more than it ought to say: (he should) have a good reputation and political experience, and be known as honest and faithful to the nation. What does that mean? Shouldn't the voters be the ones to judge those kinds of qualifications? Putting a clause like that in the constitution invites judges to decide if a candidate for president has a "good reputation." This is the kind of clause that should have been omitted. There are many such superfluous clauses in this constitution.

Honestly, I was expecting to see a document that enshrines Sharia and limits the rights of people according to their adherence to somebody's idea of Islamic doctrine. Thankfully, that's not what I see.

What I see is something appallingly incomplete. This document is not ready even to be discussed seriously.

[BlueJac]

28. I fucking knew it!

Shit all those deaths and a bullshit constitution. Our young men died for Islamic law.................what a joke Bush, you promised the best.......democracy, freedom. You delivered the goods, just to Halliburton and your friends. The rest of us got caught holding an empty bag to the tune of $300 billion. Jerk........Loser, and I can't think of all the rest right now. Asshole! :puke: :kick:

[geomon666]

29. Sigh, did we really expect anything different

What a farce this whole thing is. But people will still defend it.

[bpilgrim]

35. another reason they had to push the 'we are a christian state' meme

to make it seem more like a democracy :shrug:

peace

[m_welby]

39. Is anyone surprised by this?

Isn't exactly what you would expect from a fledgling country where a majority of the people are Islamic?

Oh, wait thats right President cookoo-bananas don't live in the real world.