Flag-Waving RW Mom On Military Service: "It Isn't For Our Kind Of People"

[stopbush]

Military's Recruiting Troubles Extend to Affluent War Supporters

By Terry M. Neal
washingtonpost.com Staff Writer
Monday, August 22, 2005; 8:00 AM

There was an eye-opening article in the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette a few days ago that explored the increasing difficulty the military is having recruiting young people to enlist. As has been well reported in many newspapers, including The Washington Post, the Army and Marines are having a particularly tough time meeting recruitment objectives, in part because of Americans' concern about the war in Iraq.

But the Post-Gazette raises another issue. There has been much talk about the relationship between race and ethnicity and military recruitment. But what about social and economic class? Are wealthier Americans, who are more likely to be Republicans and therefore more likely to support the war, stepping up to the plate and urging their children and others from their communities to enlist?


The writer of the Post-Gazette article, Jack Kelly, explored this question in his story that ran on Aug. 11. Kelly wrote of a Marine recruiter, Staff Sgt. Jason Rivera, who went to an affluent suburb outside of Pittsburgh to follow up with a young man who had expressed interest in enlisting. He pulled up to a house with American flags displayed in the yard. The mother came to the door in an American flag T-shirt and openly declared her support for the troops. But she made it clear that her support only went so far. "Military service isn't for our son," she told Rivera. "It isn't for our kind of people."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/08/19/AR2005081900815.html

[Name removed]

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[nankerphelge]

2. Reinstate the draft for her son.

[Name removed]

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[Beam Me Up]

42. Best laugh I've had all day!

:rofl:

What a coot she is! So TYPICAL of these CLUELESS people!

[indepat]

3. So typical of so many sanctimonious and reichous hypocrites who wrap

themselves in the flag.

[babylonsister]

4. Barf alert! "It isn't for our kind of people." And what kind

of person is she? Is she a patriotic American? So she's affluent, so what? This is so much bullshit, I can't imagine how people can even have this mindset!:banghead:

[mongo]

9. Didn't anyone tell you?

She's better than you.

[dcfirefighter]

5. I'm fairly libertarian

and would normally oppose a draft on the basis of involuntary servitude. However, there are certainly benefits to having an egalitarian military . . . specifically, these suburban soccer moms wouldn't be so hawkish.

[theHandpuppet]

13. Precisely why I favor a draft.

Only when the sons and daughers of the upper classes are forced to serve will there be not only an end to this war but a reluctance to engage in ANY war.

[Vincardog]

28. Precisely why I oppose our side supporting the draft

It is bush's war let his side take the heat. Why the hell should we support a draft to man aWoL's illegal immoral wars of aggression?

Sure the 'Soccer Moms and NasCar Dada' might face the facts sooner but they are coming around.

The Bu&hit is coming out and the house of cards if beginning to fall. why should we help them stay in power a nanosecond longer?

No Draft No Way,

[Ganja Ninja]

76. Exactly right!

It's a GOP mess let the GOP shovel the shit. When a draft resolution comes before congress Democrats should abstain from casting a vote either way. GOP war - GOP draft!

[Maru Kitteh]

64. Could I ask WHY you are so quick to blame it on the women?

The pukes have tried very hard to stake claims but the hard fact remains that women, even the suburban ones are more likely to vote Democratic than their gun-totin', beer drinkin', Bush lovin' hubbies.

I don't have anything against the responsible and non-lethal use of beer or guns but DAMNIT! Bush is where I draw the line.

How about putting the blame where most of it belongs? On the men of this country?

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

6. This was a local story. I'm glad it's getting National coverage in the WP

To all the flag waving, magnet driving, W-supporters: You need to put your kids in Iraq now or STFU.

[stopbush]

20. I'll bet she's got a few Purple Heart bandages in the medicine

cabinet...souvenirs from the RNC Convention in 04.

[Kurovski]

53. I'm also glad it was picked up by WP.

It helps to reveal the pro-war (but not for them to fight) folks as the elitist and often racist minority that they are.

Pro-war folks who will not go and fight are ELITISTS.

[mongo]

7. Ain't it the truth

My kind of people eat her kind of people.

Someone needs to buy that piece of video and use it as part of an anti-war commercial.

Let the class war begin.

[Raster]

8. "I mean, we support the troops and everything, and we certainly enjoy the

benefits, but people of our class never put our lives on the line. That's for the little people. Just like taxes."

[Cobalt Violet]

10. It's hard to not want a draft with her kind of people around. n/t

[stopbush]

11. In fairness, I should point out that the article I posted didn't identify

"mom" as a Republican, but as someone who was affluent. I imagine she could be a Dem or even a Green...nah!

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

17. I'd bet money I could pinpoint her neighborhood (hint: NEW money)

She's from a northern suburb close to me. But, it is NOT the old money areas of Fox Chapel or Sewickley...you never see the flag waving, yellow-magnet types. Instead it is the new money McMansions where they have all the pretend patriots live. Nauseating.

[blue neen]

50. You know, that's just the area I was thinking of.

There were a lot of letters to the editor of the Post Gazette complaining about this woman's high and mighty attitude.

[speedoo]

12. And we all know "our kind of people" don't we.

An affluent (and almost certainly white) woman saying in so many words to a latino marine... "you go to Iraq and risk your life, but not my son".

[mongo]

16. I was thinking almost exactly what you posted

but was afraid to say it -

"let those poor n______ go to Iraq and better themselves in the process".

[DinahMoeHum]

14. IOW, military people are NOCD - "Not Our Class, Dear"

Typical preppie asshole.

:grr:

[CrownPrinceBandar]

15. Is it time for the fucking revolution yet?...........

"It isn't for our kind of people." = "Let them eat cake"

[Chocolatebison]

18. Lof of assumptions on Mr Neal's part

"Are wealthier Americans, who are more likely to be Republicans and therefore more likely to support the war, stepping up to the plate and urging their children and others from their communities to enlist?"

One that the vast majority of the wealthy are Republican

and two even a lot of Republicans still support the war.

[alittlelark]

25. The vast majority of the wealthy... esp. the UBER-wealthy

ARE Republicans.... how do you think we got into this mess?

[Chocolatebison]

26. Can you give me some numbers?

I don't doubt that is the truth.

Thanks a lot!

[alittlelark]

27. Look them up yourself... get informed via your own neurons.

If you do not know that yet, I'm not sure how you found DU.

[babylonsister]

33. Well that was helpful - NOT. nt

[alittlelark]

36. It all depends on whether one NEEDS help....

many specific ?'s, how many are 'talking points'? After all.... aren't ALL R's poor and rightous and moral and honorable?

[babylonsister]

34. I don't have numbers, but the wealthiest

in this country who are benefitting from not a whole lot of taxation and tax breaks for their industries are the ones that donate the most to the repugs. Ergo... If you want to pick a few companies, say, Halliburton, and look up their campaign contributions, you'll see the correlation.

[kittenpants]

45. here are some from the article...

The wealthier you become, apparently, the more likely you are to vote Republican. The GOP advantage grows more pronounced for people from households making more than $100,000. People from households with incomes exceeding that amount voted for Bush over Kerry by 58 percent to 41 percent. Those from households making less than $100,000 favored Kerry over Bush 51 to 49 percent. And nearly two-thirds of voters from households making more than $200,000 favored Bush over Kerry.

same link as the OP

[fujiyama]

70. While it cannot be determined from the following exit poll

what percentage of Bush's base the rich make up, it certainly can be concluded that the majority of the wealthy voted for Bush:

According to the exit poll at CNN.com, here is the breakdown:
http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/pages/results/states/US/P/00/epolls.0.html

Of those voting 100-150k per year, it went 57-42 for Bush. 150-200k, 58-42. And finally those with greater than 200k went 63-35k.

[Mairead]

73. Neal gave some numbers. Did you read the article?

If you need more numbers, go look up the NORC social survey. It'll confirm what Neal said.

In general, wealth predicts politics. It's a reliable enough correlation that you can win bar bets (except that it's also well-known enough that few would bet you).

[Mairead]

74. Neal gave some numbers. Did you read the article?

If you need more numbers, go look up the NORC social survey. It'll confirm what Neal said.

In general, wealth predicts politics. It's a reliable enough correlation that you can win bar bets (except that it's also well-known enough that few would bet you).

[ecstatic]

19. Drafts only affect the poor and middle class

Wealthy people can get out of drafts, just as they've always done. Why do some here promote the draft?

[bluestateguy]

21. Those of you who favor a draft for this woman's kids are misguided

Oh, you think that a draft with "no exceptions" will force her son to suit up?

WRONG.

People like her have the money, the connections and the ability to work the system in ways that will prevent "their kind of people" from serving. That's just how it works. Daddy has a golfing buddy on the draft board; the town doctor is also the boy's Little League coach who can certify a sudden diagnosis of "ADD" or some nonsense like that. Or they fly Junior out of the country for an extended "study abroad" program.

A draft only results in more poor, non-white people being sent off to war because they lack the ability to play the system to their advantage.

[alittlelark]

43. Sadly... you are right - and I doubt it will ever change.

I have enough power to keep my kids out of the draft... AND I WILL USE IT.


Sadly, most do not.

I hope that 'MOST' rises UP!!!!

[Gemini Cat]

69. That's right.

Old sucker mom there, can get her baby precious out of the draft.
It's the poor and non-white who will get drafted and subsequently die.

[stevedeshazer]

22. Leona Helmsley lives

They don't want to pay taxes, either.

Fucking fair-weather patriots.

:grr:

[Initech]

23. The smell of hypocrisy REEKS, dont it?

:argh:

[sakabatou]

24. Chicken Hawks, all of them

[Name removed]

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[ignatius 2]

31. "Our kind of people." Cryptic for white,wealthy and bigoted.

They will support the troops and their pResident by buying up a boatload of yellow magnetic ribbons and playing Yankee Doodle Dandy out their ass but don't expect them to give up one of their spoiled younguns..thats for the blacks,hispanics and poor whites.

They would all just freeload off their hard earned dollars anyway.(sarcasm)

When nothing is sacrificed, then they really do not feel a sense of responsibility or even a real need to find the truth, only the feeling of get me to the country club in time for my tee off.

[Name removed]

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[Starbucks Anarchist]

55. LMAO!

I don't know why, but that's hilarious. Maybe because I'm picturing you saying it. :)

[tallahasseedem]

35. This is disgusting...

may she burn in hell for her disdain for the poor.

[stanwyck]

37. Sounds like my next door neighbor

Very rightwing evangelical. She loves Bush. She always asks how my son is doing since she supports the troops 100%. (my son is a Marine on his second tour). We're in an affluent community. Her husband is a pediatric surgeon. But when I asked her if her son planned to enlist (he's 22 -- the same age as my son) and a Young Republican, she looked truly shocked that I would even ask. "He's going to graduate school!"
Of course.
Military iservice sn't for her "kind of people" either. It's for the people next door. You know. The liberals with the Kerry/Edwards signs and the (oh, the horror) Cynthia McKinney signs.

[ignatius 2]

38. My sincere best wishes to you,your son and family. May he stay healthy

and come back to you soon.

Regards,ig

[Gay Green]

44. May your son stay health and come back soon.

And may he not receive any orders to commit war crimes or crimes against humanity.

[bleedingheart]

39. Yeah the Military isn't for Cowards

My dad was poor and wanted to see the world. His parents (poor coal miners) didn't want him to join and back then you had to be 21 to join without a parents signature.

Then World War II started and my dad enlisted because he wanted to aid the US in the war effort.

He fought for 4 years in the jungles of Guadalcanal and Luzon, came home with malaria, two bronze stars and some other medals as well....and he went back to work in a mill.

[Nobody]

48. I love that response! n/t

[alittlelark]

65. Your dad is indeed an American Hero.

The true heroes do not preach about their patriotism (pharisees), instead, they LIVE IT. WW2 was an honorable war... what we have now is a dishonorable war with honorable young (mostly poor) people dying for corporate profit.

[Blue_Tires]

40. this was posted earlier

but it still warrants more attention

[stanwyck]

41. Don't forget. Barbara Bush

has 17 grandchildren. None have enlisted. I don't think military service is for the Bush kind of people, either. Or Cheney. or DeLay. or Limbaugh. O'Reilly. Hannity.
That's why they're all such flag-waving, over the top "support the troops" types. It's over-compensation for their very noticeable snobbery.

[Conservativesux]

72. Savage didnt serve in Nam', either. He was too busy molesting Fijian boys

to do so, the hatemongering pedophile.

[ronnykmarshall]

46. Was that woman Jeb Bush's wife?

[B Calm]

47. Sounds like my right-wing neighbor and their two sons..

[Cleita]

49. "Our kind of people." This is the problem with affluent America.

They really believe they don't have to contribute to society as a whole in the same way lower classes have to. As a matter-of-fact, they think everyone should contribute to them. This is like Leona Helmsley's remark about only the little people paying taxes.

[are_we_united_yet]

51. It is

this type of disconnect that makes it so difficult to break thru to wingnuts.

[NoBushSpokenHere]

52. We need to have recruiters go to the Bushlovers

anti-protest protests. We can do this! Find recruiters, call them and ask them to attend the Bushlovers protests! Let's see how much they shout patriotism then!

Also, letters to the editor need to be written to point out the Republican party DOES NOT SUPPORT THE CAUSES OF THE MIDDLE AND POOR CLASS of this country! Take every opportunity to educate, because our school systems certainly aren't going to!

Kudos to Terry Neal!





Patriotism doesn't mean dying for a lie.

[TheModernTerrorist]

54. Her kind of people?

Is she referring to snotty, spoiled bitches?
fake people maybe?
maybe she's secretly a ZOMBIE!

[mom cat]

56. ISend the twins!

[Generic Other]

57. That woman is pitiful

Whose kind of war is it? The parents of POOR minorities? Of people who marched for peace? Of liberals who opposed the war?

WTF??

Some people are too stupid to live!

[WorseBeforeBetter]

58. Wow. It sure is easy to be a Republican...

when someone else is doing the dying.

[LibDemAlways]

59. When I was organizing my Class of 70

high school reunion a few years back, a friend asked me if I would have any sort of special recognition at the event for the Vietnam vets. I looked at her like she was crazy. She had no way of knowing that Palos Verdes HS in Southern California was an affluent repuke area and everyone went to college. Only three guys that I know of served in the military, and all three entered as officers after completing college. Everyone escaped the draft. The richer they are, the less likely they are to serve - period.

[belle]

60. Unfuckingbelievable. Hey, lady, "your kind of people..."

if by that you mean "cowardly, hateful hypocrites," then by definition I suppose you're right: military service isn't for you. Lucky you.

if I might suggest though: at minimum, howzabout you kindly SHUT THE FUCK UP about your supposed patriotism, mommy dearest.

No? Oh, right: "your kind of people" doesn't believe in minimal requirements of common decency, either.

You know what? I've decided: "my kind of people" would not feel guilty about kicking the ass of "your kind of people."

[nickgutierrez]

61. I thought you were going to say...

"Your type of people... GOT US INTO THIS WAR."

Which would be absolutely true. Bush, Cheney, Rummy, Rove, the whole lot of them - Chickenhawks all.

[the_spectator]

62. What ever happened to dressing the part?

So the recruiter goes to an "affluent suburb" to follow up with a prospect, pulls up to a house displaying flags, and meets a mother who openly declared, essentially, her support for the war, and THEN lays down an absolutely PERFECT Marie-Antoinette/haughty-snob aside -
"It isn't for our kind of people." ---
And is fucking dressed in a FLAG T-SHIRT !?!? :puke:

Come on lady, you've GOT to come to the door in pearls and tweeds or something to pull off a line like that!

People are getting SO LAZY about their clothes!! The sweatpants-from-Walmart culture has taken over everything! :crazy:

[Stirk]

63. One more argument against regressive taxation.

The entire system is set up to pamper people like the ones found in this woman's neighborhood. They sit on their asses and let the little people do all the work- and that includes fighting the wars.

[PowerToThePeople]

66. well now.

looks like they are writing their own futures. There WILL be a class war in this country sometime in the near future. And fascists/capitalists will lose, badly. Let them see if their "volunteer" military will be willing to fire on their own home neighborhoods.

[Hardrada]

67. Excellent point

and the police are from the working class as well and from less than elite neighborhoods. The revolt of the troops brought down the Tsar and the Bourbon Dynasty. Hohenzollerns too. And they were entrenched for denturies.

[Buns_of_Fire]

68. What a gem of an idea for a TV ad (it writes itself, doesn't it?)

...Kelly wrote of a Marine recruiter, Staff Sgt. Jason Rivera, who went to an affluent suburb outside of Pittsburgh to follow up with a young man who had expressed interest in enlisting. He pulled up to a house with American flags displayed in the yard. The mother came to the door in an American flag T-shirt and openly declared her support for the troops. But she made it clear that her support only went so far. "Military service isn't for our son," she told Rivera. "It isn't for our kind of people."

...then the door slowly shuts (this would be shot from the woman's POV), right in the face of the recruiter. Fade to black. An appropriate message would appear on the screen. I haven't the foggiest idea what the message would be, but short 'n' pithy is always preferred -- something like "Think About It" (nice and oblique), or "Patriotism -- It Isn't For Republicans Anymore" (make people scratch their heads and wonder if they were just insulted or not).

It probably wouldn't change any minds, but then people of this woman's ilk aren't likely to vote anything but the straight (R) ticket anyway. Nah, its only purpose is to piss "those kind of people" off, and enrage everyone who isn't "their kind of people."

(Proudly Rabble Rousing Since 1968. :evilgrin: )

[fujiyama]

71. I'd like to throw this article in the DLC's face

because one part especially struck out at me (I would urge everyone to read the entire article...It has some very interesting facts).

"One of the interesting phenomenon of today's politics is that, in general, Republicans tend to be more educated on average than Democrats, with a larger percentage either holding a bachelor's degree or having attended some college. But Democrats represent a larger portion of the super-educated -- that is, those holding graduate degrees. So Democrats are made up of the least and the most educated, with Republicans congregated largely near, but not at, the top.

So how did those near the top of the educational tree do in Segal's and Bachman's study? They were half as likely as those in group two to enlist. And because there are far more people who have been to college or have bachelor's degrees than there are people who have post-graduate degrees, the former group has far more political influence, just in sheer numbers."

--------------------------------------------

Contrast this with Marshall and From's idiotic views:

"Conversely, the military is not always held in high esteem in what might be called the European wing of the Democratic party -- secular liberal elites in the deep-blue Northeast and West Coast. Frank Schaeffer, a Boston writer, tells the story of how shocked his upper-middle-class neighbors were when, in 1999, his high-achieving son joined the U.S. Marine Corps rather than follow his peers to elite universities:

"Why were I and the other parents at my son's private school so surprised by his choice? During World War II, the sons and daughters of the most powerful and educated families did their bit. If the immorality of the Vietnam War was the only reason those lucky enough to go to college dodged the draft, why did we not encourage our children to volunteer for military service once that war was done?

"Have we the wealthy and educated Americans all become pacifists? Is the world a safe place? Or have we just gotten used to having somebody else defend us? What is the future of our democracy when the sons and daughters of the janitors at our elite universities are far more likely to be put in harm's way than are any of the students whose dorms their parents' clean?" "

---------------------------------------------------------------

Time to let these ass holes know the truth. The group whose votes these people are bending over backwards for is the least likely to send their kids into battle. It's not the so called "liberal elite" that isn't sending their kids into battle. It's the moderately well educated BA/BS holders that aren't sending their kids (though neither group is sending them - though in the case of grad/post grad holders they're less likly to support the war too so they aren't guilty of the hypocrisy).

[mmonk]

75. Send that article

to the pro war and bush caravan.

[Supersedeas]

77. Classist Chickenhawk Attitute: Service is for Commoners

[Name removed]

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