Can we all agree? No 9/11 if Gore had been in office in 2000.

[The Backlash Cometh]

Able Danger says it all. The information was already out there. The main 9/11 players were known one year prior to the attacks. Even Dennis Hasteret knew.

If Gore had been president, there would have been fewer changes made to the process used by Richard Clarke during the Clinton administration. The same process that uncovered the Millennium bombing plans would have remained intact. They would have listened to the "chatter" and they would have "shaken those trees." Again, remember Dennis Hasteret KNEW about Atta. And if Denny knew, then the sense of urgency that would have been created under the Gore administration would have eventually filtered down to people who could have produced the information we needed to thwart the attacks.

Forget the LIHOP and MIHOP for now. The bottom line is having Bush in office in 2000 was a tragic mistake for this country. Bush was focused on his own agenda to be concerned about the mundane details of running the country. He delegated far too much to his advisors -- a hands off president.

If Gore had been president, we wouldn't be in the fine mess we presently find ourselves in. No 9/11, no Iraq War Folly.

Can we all agree?

[radwriter0555]

1. Um bush wasn't voted into office. He stole it, just like hitler did, then

perpetrated his reichstaga ala WTC 911, just like hitler.

So in essence, you're right.

Had Mr. Gore rightfully taken his office, 911 would not have happened.

[The Backlash Cometh]

4. Correction made. Thank you.

[jody]

2. "Can we all agree?" No, that's idle speculation. n/t

[The Backlash Cometh]

6. "idle speculation" Oh, yes, we don't ever do that here. n/t

[jody]

8. We do it all the time but IMO it's impossible to give a reasoned

Yes or No. :shrug:

[ProfessorGAC]

25. No It's Not

By definition, if one can present a logical and factually accurate scenario, that fits the available information, then one is giving a REASONED answer.

So, it's not IDLE speculation. Don't answer if you don't want to, but you are incorrect that one can't give a reasoned response.
The Professor

[jody]

32. Please present a "logical and factually accurate scenario,

that fits the available information".

[ProfessorGAC]

41. No.

I didn't say i had one, but you posited that it can't be done. If one uses reason and logic to formulate ANY scenario about ANYTHING, then it is possible, BY DEFINITION, to wisely and reasonably speculate about any subject.

Hence, my post was merely a refutation of your thesis.

That's the second time i had to explain this to you, now. Try to keep up, please.
The Professor

[Cha]

37. Right! No Freakin' Idle Speculation

on DU..EVER! :silly:

[Imagevision]

42. Why not? Clinton got Ramseu Youseff 93 WTC bomber!

[Imagevision]

44. I'll g with Clarke over Rice anyday!!!

http://downingstreetmemo.com/

[MoJoWorkin]

3. Agreed, 100%.

But, we all know that there was NO difference between Gore and Bush according to the Naderites, right? :sarcasm:
I STILL can't get over that one. The Greens/Nader people I know STILL can't admit what horrible part they played in this mess. It would not have been close enough for Bushy boy to steal if Nader hadn't been in it. I hold them partially responsible, and ALWAYS will.

[The Backlash Cometh]

5. Isn't that something that we have right-wingers coming out now

and admitting that they made a mistake voting for Bush? I don't remember the same illuminating moment for Naderites. I'm almost afraid to ask who Michael Moore voted for?

[charlie]

9. Fer chrissakes

Moore's Slacker Tour was a full court press to get Kerry into office. You can let go your suspicions of Moore's treachery in 2004.

[The Backlash Cometh]

10. Aren't we speaking about 2000 when the Florida vote was within

532 votes between the two candidates? (That's according to the stats reported in the Florida papers.) And when the Naderites were claiming that there was no difference between the two candidates?

[charlie]

12. Sorry

Your being "afraid to ask" had me thinking you couldn't be talking about 2000. Moore voted for Nader, Michigan was a safe state to do so.

[itcfish]

19. Moore Voted

for Nader in 2000 and Kerry in 2004

[fujiyama]

35. In Moore's defense

he claimed that he never knew Nader would campaign in swing states. The two had a major falling out and Nader, being the immature ass hole he is, actually commented on MM's weight.

Though personally I think Moore made a mistake in '00, I can certainly forgive him because he learned his lesson and did all he can to defeat Bush in '04. I know many did - that's why Nader got less than 1% of the vote in '04.

[DemInDistress]

7. if Gore had been Prez

we would not have had a 911.The reason for the success of 911 was the complicity of the Bush Crime Family.Who stood to gain from a New Pearl Harbor,Carlyle Group,Halliburton,Sharon,and the Pentagon.War-mongering Neoconservatives backers of PNAC are driving this country.
The ability to keep secret documents ,photo's and videotapes that could clear the 911 air. is kept secured,Its frustrating to me !!!!

[SammyWinstonJack]

29. Even if 9/11 had happened under a Gore Admin. and I don't for

one minute think it would have,(MIHOPer) President Gore wouldn't have attacked Iraq, might even have captured Osama Bin Forgotten (if he truly was involved in the 9/11 attacks, still haven't seen proof of that) by now.

[bahrbearian]

11. MIHOP

[moodforaday]

13. "You don't steal elections in order to do good"

as someone on DU has recently said. 9-11 woulbn't have happened under Gore, because Gore was not the one who had planned it.

[Kahuna]

16. I've been saying that for years. You don't steal elections to do good.

You steal an election because you have an agenda to fulfill. Witness the looting of Iraq. It is established that this neocon cabal had their sights on Iraq back when Clinton was in office.

[baldguy]

21. B - I - N - G - O

[Cooley Hurd]

14. I agree with your statement...

The Hart-Rudman report would've landed in his hands on Jan 22, 2001 and, instead of ignoring it (like Bush/Cheney), he would've acted on it. And that's just for starters!

[Dissent Is Patriotic]

15. What is "Able Danger?" n/t

[DemonFighterLives]

22. That was the spy group that was tracking Atta and 3 others

The story on it has been drug out to put the blame on the Clinton admin. for 911.

[The Backlash Cometh]

24. It is obviously not succeeding.

The key factor is that Dennis Hasteret knew about Atta. That makes it sound more like what we're experiencing today. That the Republicans are withholding information that would allow us to make good choices.

[DemonFighterLives]

31. I think they had plenty of information too

When the *regime came to power the elements were put into place to cause fear and suffering for all Americans.
Had enough yet?

[Past_World_Doubt]

17. Right well he stole his way in....

Probably both times, so everything afterward including the 9/11 events were illegal events.

[zbdent]

18. How many times do I have to tell you . . .

This country would have been in a uncivil "civil war" - with the right-wing trying to oust President Gore under the guise of "he stole the election!"

[Terran]

20. As for 9/11, I don't think it's possible to say that for sure.

But we sure as hell wouldn't have invaded Iraq. On that I think we can all agree.

[DemonFighterLives]

23. Gore would never have allowed all these bad people near

the reins of power. The tracking of real threats would have gone on and preventative measures would have been used after "osama determined to strike in US" memo was sent. Somethings like airport security and interceptors and radar. And don't let no fools like cheney play war games when real attacks are imminent.
The war in Iraq would have been out of the question and a stronger UN would be keeping everyone in the world safer.

[yurbud]

26. post on a conservative board & watch them froth

Hillbilly Hitler art:



Blog:

[The Backlash Cometh]

28. I prefer coming in through the backdoor.

[Minstrel Boy]

27. "having Bush in office in 2000 was a tragic mistake" - no, it wasn't

It was a criminal act with malice aforethought, that had tragic consequences on a global scale.

In my judgement, the election was stolen because powerful, far right elements with connections to intelligence and the arms and drugs trades knew 9/11 was coming, they wanted it to come, and they needed a regime in place that would fully exploit it.

[AuntPatsy]

30. Pure speculation and not productive in my mind, I think that

we need to focus on the facts of what did occur prior to and after 9/11 if one is aid in attempting to ferret out this mob.

[DemInDistress]

33. Aunt Pat...

For 8 months Bush/Cheney denied any prior knowledge they claim to have had NO WARNINGS,they were as shocked as you and me but what did we learn as the days,weeks and months passed.On May 15 2002 the NY Post goes with this front pade,"911 shocker,BUSH KNEW,prez was warned
of terror attacks before they happened".The Bush Crime Family downplayed what turned out to be the "infamous" Aug 6 2001 PDB.Why did Bush fail to tell all Americans he was warned? Instead,bush continues on during 2002 to fix,fake,forge and lie about saddam's wmd's with Tony Blair...Young bush wanted to be a war president,PNAC needed 911 to advance their agenda and the neo-cons got their wish on 911,.....3,000 dead and keep in mind the Bush Crime Family was prepared to see maybe 30/40,000 innocent people die on 911.At any given time their are up to 50k people in those Twin Towers...

[AuntPatsy]

38. I already know all that but that was not the question I answered..

the question was whether it would have happened had Gore been in office, do you not agree that at this point in time, the question is mute?

[The Backlash Cometh]

39. On the contrary. It's more relevant today than it was a year ago.

[fujiyama]

34. He wouldn't have been on vacation

the entire month of August - that's for sure.

Gore was very focused on terrorism years before 9/11. He was active in an airline security bill, and other anti terrorism initiatives that republicans tried stalling (and even attacked Clinton on calling the threat "exagerrated") because of money from the airline industry.

For one thing Gore wouldn't have ignored Richard Clarke's advice on counter terrorism. He knew it was an important issue and those he would have appointed understood the threat as well. Unlike those in this administration which ignored it completely.

Even if in the unlikely chance Gore had slipped up on 9/11, Iraq certainly wouldn't have been invaded and those nations that were involved wouldn't have been treated with kid gloves.

In short, we would have caught those responsible.

[Cha]

36. I've thought this for A LONG TIME NOW..

That's why they had to keep our rightfully elected President out at ALL COSTS!

Yeah, katherine harris, we know you Purged the polls in Florida so don't say you went according to the law..you piece of humanoid Garbage.

[theboss]

40. I have no earthly idea

There is really no way to guess.

[Balbus]

43. I guess we'll never know for sure - eom

[The Backlash Cometh]

45. Oh, if the LIHOPs of MIHOPs are correct, we most certainly will know.

[evilqueen]

46. I'm not sure.

I noticed a vast difference in Al Gore...

While he was running for president, I didn't find his speeches all that interesting, it just seemed like he was walking around on eggshells. *yawn*

In 2004, when he wasn't running for anything, Al Gore gave the greatest speeches I have heard from Democrats in at least the last two decades! And I wasn't a great fan of Gore, really... but those speeches last year left me wide-eyed and made my jaw drop. I thought "Al! Where have you been? Why didn't you talk like this for all these years??"

[Brightmore]

47. I can't agree

I have no clue if 9/11 would have happen if Gore was in office.

However, I do agree with you that if Gore was in office the war in Iraq would have never happened.

[NuttyFluffers]

48. of course, they caught the millenium bomb plot mere year+ before

capable, competent leaders with mostly american citizens' safety and betterment on their mind. can you EVER say that about bush and co.? about anything?

edit: not only would there have been a continuation of the agenda set before, using its established momentum, to track, hunt, and prosecute (with diplo power we have all but lost), but we were nearing the Al Qaeda end game poised to strike out OBL. Bush strikes out the Taliban and yet frees OBL, but only after sitting on the obvious intelligence (and previous admin's best advice) for 8 months. all our previous competence just went out the window for almost a year? i don't buy it. completely avoidable.

easy as pie, the answer is yes.