40 Freeper Gold Star Mothers to rip son's crosses out @ Camp 2

[elehhhhna]

At 4:00 p.m. Central. Freeps hoping the Moms will be arrested (!) so they'll have coverage.

Heads Up.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1471900/posts

(Last page of posts)

[kbm8795]

1. This should get very interesting.

Those crosses are, I'm assuming, now on PRIVATE property, rather than along the road. And their children's names are part of the public record - since they died as soldiers in service to the nation. I wonder what legal ground the Freeper moms have to stand on. . .and how they will even get to Camp II? It seems to me that the police, before the camp was moved, restricted movement beyond Camp I.. .and are restricting movement between I and II now to keep out people not welcome at Camp II.

[annabanana]

6. I think the crosses are still at Casey I...n/t

[elehhhhna]

41. iirc they're at both camps. camp 2 has like 11 rows of 24

[txindy]

2. Forty, hmmm?

That means there'll be about four of them.

[mwb970]

8. It's Pythonesque.

Husband: Yes, we'd like a bed, a double bed, and I wondered if you'd got one for about fifty pounds.

Mr Verity: Oh no, I'm afraid not, sir. Our cheapest bed is eight hundred pounds, sir.

Husband & Wife: Eight hundred pounds?

Mr Lambert: Excuse me, sir, but before I go, I ought to have told you that Mr Verity does tend to exaggerate. Every figure he gives you will be ten times too high.

Husband: I see.

Mr Lambert: Otherwise he's perfectly all right.

[longship]

30. Did you say, "mattress" to Mr. Verity?

n/t

[oasis]

53. Now way there are 40 gold star mom's there supporting Bush's lies

that their kids killed.

[PuraVidaDreamin]

81. That's about the size of it

Thanks for the laugh Tx!

[Fleshdancer]

3. war protestors should stand next to them and instantly replace the crosses

with crosses of other soldiers lost. Unfortunately there are names of other fallen soldiers who could too easily take the place of 40 missing markers.

[annabanana]

5. ding ding..

and express sympathy for those mother's pain as they replace the crosses.....

[KittyWampus]

31. agreed. graciously allow Moms to have the crosses with a smile and replace

them with the other sorrows.

[elehhhhna]

42. Plus a free tee shirt: "GW killed my son & all I got was this lousy cross"

[stevedeshazer]

55. Let them go - take pictures

Spread them far and wide.

Then replace the crosses as you suggested as soon as the freepers leave.

[DanCa]

4. so they want their mamas to be thrown in jail rather than fighting in iraq

About sums up the sleazeoids.

[Dem Agog]

7. they are talking about bringing all their yellow ribbons...

do they forget the meaning behind the yellow ribbon? it's about bringing the loved one HOME! Tie a Yellow Ribbon - the song - is about the guy's homecoming. When the hostages were taken in Iran (the first big yellow ribbon campaign I remember) the ribbons were used to symbolize: BRING THEM HOME!!!!!

So the freepers have the yellow ribbons, but they're using them to mean "keep our troops in iraq"... that's stupid. yellow ribbons are not supposed to show a support of murder, and that's what they're using them for.

jesus these fucktards can't get anything right.

[nankerphelge]

36. In their defense...

They are very, very stupid. You can't expect miracles from people this dumb.

[Jara sang]

67. Yes, they are most ignorant

comes from all the inbreeding

[matcom]

9. Freeper Kids Desecrate an American Flag - they are 'touched'

:eyes:

They have an American flag that is about 50 feet by 40 feet. Children of military personnel serving in the Middle East have written notes to their parents on the stripes of this flag. A very touching thing to behold.

[jlseagull]

52. Agreed.

You don't write on the flag. Period. Additionally, it is not to go on shirts, bikinis, watches, etc. UNLESS IT IS IN ITS ORIGINAL FORM AND NOT CHANGED.

It's about respect.

[seabeyond]

10. how about if we just hand them to them, instead of a rippin out

oh so dramatic. and replace it with another, written, fallen soldier

[shireen]

11. let the moms have those crosses

if those freeper moms want the crosses with their sons' names, someone at Camp Casey II should just remove them and present them to those moms with their condolences. We need to acknowledge their grief peacefully.

[cornermouse]

72. Agreed.

If they want their crosses, give them to them.

[etherealtruth]

79. Excellent suggestion ...

Prevents them from having a "grand media moment," actually it gives the media moment to Camp Casey.

These are mothers that lost children and don't want them memorialized there ... let it go.

my assumption is that if met with dignity and compassion these people will "go off" inappropriately disappointed that there was no confrontation, hopefully it'd be caught on camera.

[DinahMoeHum]

86. Alternative suggestion: "Name Withheld Upon Request Of Next-Of-Kin"

n/t

[Generic Other]

12. They aren't even allowed to cross the road at this point

Ripping out crosses will not help their cause. We are sick of this war.

[annabanana]

22. we should meet them in the middle of the road....eom

[TriMetFan]

13. They are trying to start something up.

I think these wackos are willing to even go as may-be a gun fight. This is Texas after all. Just about every one has a gun or shotgun.

[elehhhhna]

44. Sheriff always has a bigger one & shoots more. Don't worry.

People are not stupid enough to mess w/ Texas law enforcement. (Some towns still call 'em "Peace Officers -- teehee!

[txindy]

74. Oh, yeah, we each have a regular arsenal

:eyes:

[5thGenDemocrat]

77. I don't agree, TriMet

Maybe they don't want their childrens' names used for a cause (however worthy we see it). I'd give them the crosses along with our sincerest condolences. And then replace the crosses with unmarked ones.
These parents have a right to their opinions, too.
John
But there isn't going to be gunplay. That's just silly.

[Horse with no Name]

14. Camp Casey should be poised to graciously PAINT OVER the

names if they do not wish their loved ones name to be represented.
However, I would not give them the crosses because they will only use them to start their own little memorial in their "Copycat Camp" with resources that were furnished for this cause.
Let them do what they do best...copy someone's idea.
Don't let them just steal it.

[Cleita]

25. I think that would be okay if they do it.

The idea is for Bush and others to see the number who have died needlessly for his OIL war.

[riderinthestorm]

26. Painting over the name is a good idea also

Can you imagine being a mother and watching someone paint over your son or daughter's name on that cross?

Gives me the chills just thinking about it... like someone is walking over their grave.

[Horse with no Name]

29. But it's what they wanted

They can't deny that.

[riderinthestorm]

34. Yup, meets their objective

But it's creepy!

(and I daresay, very effective. Non-violent also.)

I would hope that the eradication of their son/daughter's place in this respectful memorial would give some of them some pause.

And perhaps in that pause, room for a new way of looking at what we're trying to accomplish.

[Horse with no Name]

43. Yes it would be effective because

They don't object to their child being memorialized (wanting the cross proves that). They just want to be vindictive.
However, we are staging a peace protest and a call for the end of the war. The crosses represent the cost of the war. If they don't want their child's name included in the cost...then that is fine. Take away the name. We should still symbolize the number.
This is an effective way to demonstrate that.
But you are right. Would be like walking on someone's grave.

[Inland]

33. It can be a tomb of the "Known Soldier". nt

[riderinthestorm]

15. Let them take them

Have someone from Camp Casey let the women take their son or daughter's cross and send that woman off with a hug.

Compassion will work better on our behalf than creating a scene.

If need be, replace that cross with a plain cross, without a name, I honestly believe that will be much more painful for any mother regardless of their stand on the issue.

[Pirate Smile]

27. I agree. They shouldn't try to stop them.

Law enforcement should deal with things.

[elehhhhna]

46. I'm sure that would be the case. The creeps who want to accompany

the "40"...uh, 3, Mothers are gonna be PO'd-- they're not invited.

Cindy invited all goldstar parents, freep or not, to a private no-media audience this afternoon.

[deadparrot]

50. Agreed. nt

[stepnw1f]

16. Sounds Like a Karl Rove Tactic

It will backfire.....


"First your enemy ignores you,
then they taunt you,
then they attack you,
finally you win."

(Something like that)
Ghandi

[elehhhhna]

48. copy this:

my sig line.

[stepnw1f]

87. Thanks (nt)

[ComerPerro]

17. If its their son, then I don't have a problem with it

[fishnfla]

54. How would they know anyway?

any lady could walk up and claim a cross

[ComerPerro]

58. Someone posted below: Document it

Id suggest people there "guarding" the tribute let people take the crosses they claim to be those of family members, but document their name and take pictures.

[TankLV]

60. Yes - document it. 4 mothers can only take 4 crosses - not 40.

Have them proove it.

Driver's licenses should do nicely.

Otherwise, call their bullshit.

[ComerPerro]

62. And its perfectly justified asking them to prove it

Considering that in Southern Illinois there was a case where a soldier who died and his daughter (who was mad at war protesters because they hurt her feelings) never even existed. They were completely made up.

[slor]

18. Is this on TV...

so we can see the nazi wannabe-fools in action?

[donco6]

19. Turn the Other Cheek time.

They're just trying to set up some confrontation. I say they let them in to take whatever they want. We replace them all the next day.

[Pirate Smile]

20. Faux News has betrayed them by not covering this. LOL.

"FOX News is betraying the *decent* people of the US.
FOX News is betraying the US.
FOX News is betraying the TRUTH.
FOX News is betraying Free Speech.
FOX News is betraying the Idae of a Free Press.

I allways expected Rupert Murdock would eventually
betray the Unted States...King Rat that he is...
I'm just sorta siurprised it took this long.
But the signs were allways there..look how he's
in bed with Hitlery..."

[dogday]

23. Why don't they just make extra ones for them so

if and when these mothers get their crosses, after they leave you put them back and if they complain, tell them we will not forget their loved ones and will remember them and will try to stop this war before other young men are remembered this way.

[Cleita]

21. I thought those crosses had been set up in California

months before they were moved to Camp Casey. Why are they all in a dither now? I say let them have the crosses. I think they should offer the price of the lumber too. They can't do anything if they are replaced with blank crosses with no names to keep the numbers right.

[Sydnie]

24. Are all 1800+ names there?

Wouldn't that be a kick in their pants to find that their children's names are even there at all? Guess they would have to complain about being denied ripping their crosses out then instead.

[Horse with no Name]

28. That's karma at it's best

Go there to rip out your child's cross in a spiteful gesture, only to find that your child wasn't represented.
You know then they will be really pissed that they weren't represented.
Again...a no-win situation.

[me b zola]

32. Hmm. this smells fishy. 40 GS Moms?

And they have never said anything public before today? I call bullshit.

Of course cover the names that THEY CLAIM as their son/daughter, but I would do a little quiet research of the names of those claiming to GS moms.

[Scout1071]

71. Smells fishy to me too. My guess is a couple of gold star moms and

the rest "moms" who stand (or were hired) with them.

I think that the Camp Casey folks should surround the crosses and hold hands. If the so-called Gold Star mothers want them, they have to physically attack to break thru - and get it on camera.

[salin]

35. If they are the mothers - let them

all grieve in their own way. Treat them with dignity and respect.

But take pictures - of the women and of the crosses - so IF these are not the mothers of those who are represented by the crosses - it is exposed.

[ComerPerro]

38. exactly

My inclination is not to trust them. Ask for their names, take pictures. Document it.

But, if they want them down, the by all means, take them down. Pull the cross out for them, and hand it to them.

That would be a nice piece of footage...

[Scout1071]

73. Personally, I think the entire camp should be documented for the sake

of history and for their own safety in case one of these freeps really goes over the edge. I'm praying nothing like that happens.

[me b zola]

78. Bingo.

Let the mothers in one at a time, for security purposes. This ensures good photos of each of them.

[MelissaB]

37. Does somebody from Camp Casey know this?

[confludemocrat]

39. One guy says in that thread: "Freepers to the front!". I wish.

Anyway, where does it say they're gonna rip crosses out. Even they might be able to see that would not go over well in the country, no matter you point of view on the war.

[Joanne98]

40. Film it. Spoiled brat freepers insult God and Country.....

[sattahipdeep]

45. 10%

A SIGN AT CAMP QUALLS lists the names of soldiers whose
families have requested that crosses be removed at Camp Casey I.
Iconoclast Photo By Gene Ellis

http://198.65.14.85/News/2005/31-40/34news14.htm

[TankLV]

64. Prove it - let's see their "request".

They have already proven themselves to be liars, why should we just trust it because they say so?

PROVE IT!

[sattahipdeep]

85. 17/2000=.85% less than 1 %

nt

[Pepperbelly]

47. sounds like freeper bullshit to me ...

I doubt sincerely that there are 40 gold star moms on that site.

[Neecy]

49. I counted 18 on the sign...

They could be friends, or distant relatives. I doubt all 18 are mothers.

Whatever, let them have them. We're not petty.

[titoresque]

82. 17 one name is duplicate

look again. :)
These people are god damn idiots! Sickening "christians"!

[Initech]

51. It's official now - these people are certifiably batshit insane

[DemonFighterLives]

59. I agree

For people that claim to be Christian, they sure seem to have problems with crosses. There is nothing wrong with the depiction of gravesites at Camp Casey and they should stay on their side and mellow out.
One mother at a time could be allowed to walk among the many crosses and be shown and given her sons cross.

[Pobeka]

56. I do hope they are able to identify themselves as relatives of the dead.

And the most immediate relative, not some distant relation or in-laws.

Once that's done, then let them have the crosses. Both of them...

[julialnyc]

57. if people want the crosses with their child's name they should walk over

and give their cross to them.....respectfully. Camp Casey can ask the mothers to give their name and they would be happy to walk their cross over.There is nothing better than being the bigger person.... it shouldn't be a fight. They should beat them to the punch and hand them to the moms.

[TankLV]

66. By all means - if they are really their mothers, not some second distant

relative-wanna-be-because-it-suits-their-political-agenda.

I agree BUT...

Make them prove it!

They've already proven that they will lye about the cause of the war and bunkerboy's lies.

Make them prove it.

No proof - no cross.

[theHandpuppet]

68. I agree with some of the other posters here

I like your approach.

[Whoa_Nelly]

61. Something else to represent the fallen should be used instead of crosses

Hear me out first, please, before you decide to flame.

Please take the time to read all the way through my post here. Then, if the flames come my way, so be it. I'm only in charge of my words and opinions, and know that I cannot, nor would even attempt to consider, second-guessing or controlling anyone else's views or responses.


1) Using crosses, which are symbolic of Xtian faith immediately gives an "in" to the right to protest. For those GSMs that wish to have a cross represent their son or daughter would be fine because it would be their choice. It seems odd to me to use a symbol of the Xtian faith and to give other religious recognition of the fallen troop on that symbol still gives rise to the message represented that the Xtian faith comes first.

Yes, crosses are used at Arlington. However, in order to NOT give an "in" to those from the RW side who go looking for any reason to be destructive, I think something used that is a not connected to religion would be better to represent the number of fallen troops, such as a white brick, and set out the number needed to make that representation.

2) I think that for any parent, left or right, it should be up to them whether they wish to have their child's name on the marker. By placing names on the markers (crosses, as it it now), again gives rise to anger for those who do not wish to have their child recognized through the use of name. I think it is ultimately up to the individual parent(s) to choose whether their child's name will be written. By using an object that is objectional to none, the message and original intent to remember those now gone would remain the same in a positive, nonconfrontational way.

No, it's no secret regarding knowing the names. However, out of respect for the families who have lost loved ones, it should be completely up to them if they wish for their child's name, religion and/or face to be used as representation for displaying, or making a case, against or for the war.

I have deep respect for Cindy, and the fact that her quest to get answers has resulted in creating a venue for those who wish to voice the same questions and request answers from the highest ranking (supposedly...) public servant in our nation.

I have deep respect for all who have gone to great lengths to support Cindy, and who have given their time, efforts and care to make Camp Casey I & II live and continue to be sustained throughout Cindy's personal vigil.

I believe that we have come to a crossroad in world history in regard to a movement for peace that is a precedent in the way it came about due to the Internet, today's mass media and the sheer numbers of people participating in all of this: Cindy Sheehan has set the principled way for peace movements of the near, and possibly far, future.

When it takes a mother's tears and grief to gain the world's attention about the horrors and wrongness of any war, albeit especially the Iraq war, the world has come to a crossroad. The people of our nation and around the globe who seek peace and truth now know that they, as individuals, can be heard and recognized.

Thank you, Cindy.

PS I wish I could be there with Cindy. I hope everyone who is in Crawford continues to be safe, and all goes well.

"We all have a stake in the future of the United States. We are united in this concept regardless of our diverse cultures and views; We are the nation." -- Whoa_Nelly 2003

[sunnystarr]

75. From what I've seen those who are not Christian don't

have a cross as the symbol. It sort of looked like a half moon. Others can correct me but I've seen other symbols when looking at the pictures.

[Whoa_Nelly]

76. Even if this is so, why use any religious symbol?

The point to be made is to remember the fallen, and IMO, that can be done without bringing any religious representation into the message, unless done so by the the family member who wishes that to be represented.

[Generic Other]

63. Bradblog reporting NOW:

Deborah Mathews: At Bush rally. Rally dispersed. Goldstar families accompanied by law enforcement heading to Camp Casey to ask crosses to be removed.

Heading to Camp Casey 1 and 2 now.

[proud patriot]

65. I'm listening too

[annabanana]

69. the feed is live.. but i just get music. . . . . n/t

[Vinca]

70. What is their point with the "cross removal" move?????

Isn't this display to honor their loved one? If they think their loved one's name is being used for propaganda purposes, here's a news flash for them: the loved one's name is, sadly, still on the dead list. Removing a piece of wood from the ground will not bring them back. Can't they understand we honor the people represented by the crosses? It's infuriating how stupid these people are. (Yes, I'm pissed.) Why do they think we don't support the troops? If I were "a troop" I'd want someone supporting me who wants me home alive, now, rather than sacrificed for who-knows-what reason at this point. Isn't the latest Bush reason we have to continue to honor those who have died? He's so fucking, totally nuts. (Getting more pissed.) I swear . . . sometimes I wish as was as stupid as these people. Life would be easier and my blood pressure would be lower.

[tlsmith1963]

84. Yeah, it Would Be Easier...

...to be a stupid Bush supporter. It would help my stress levels tremendously. But I can't do it. I deal with *reality*, unlike them.

Tammy

[RSchewe]

80. What is this a kamikazee mission? n/t

[MODemocrat]

83. They obviously love George W. more than they love their children

and this is the sickest thing I've heard from the republicans yet. They do not support the troops, or else they would not want them to keep dying for W's bloody war. Those people desperately need their heads examined because they are screwed up royally.

PLEASE! GET HELP "GOLD STAR" MOTHERS. Being a freeper is an illness!
:cry: :cry: