I don't get it. All these years and NO FUCKING PLANS????

[Redstone]

Nobody, not one person at the city, state, or Federal level said even once "Hey, those levees might break, from a hurricane, you know. Shouldn't we, maybe, have a plan to deal with it? If we plan now maybe we won't have to scratch our asses and try to come up with some ideas after the city is under water?"

And nobody figured they might have to get the prisoners out of the jails if the fucking levee broke? And that a lot of people in that city don't own cars so there should have been another way for them to get the fuck out beforehand?

I can't stand it. The plans should have been made years ago, and now they'd just have to put them in motion, instead of standing around saying "Omigod, what do we do now?"

Nice going yet again, FEMA. Wonderful way of putting our tax dollars to work.

Redstone

[NMDemDist2]

1. they had plans and the Homeland Sec dept sucked out the money n/t

[jsamuel]

2. And sent the people who carry out the plans to Iraq with the equipment

[Redstone]

12. I saw that in another post. But even without the money, where the fuck

are the plans they made? I don't hear anyone saying "OK, we've had plans for fixing this for years; now all we have to do is get the resources organized to carry out the effort."

Anyone who has heard ANYTHING even remotely like that statement, please correct me.

I'd really like to be wrong about this one.

[jsamuel]

16. the problem is that they had a risk prevention plan and no risk mitigation

plan


They tried to prevent the worst case scenario, but did not plan to mitigate the damages if the worst case scenario happened.

THEY SHOULD HAVE BUSSED THOSE PEOPLE OUT BEFORE THE STORM!!!

[nini]

3. Clinton had a plan and jr. did away with it

kinda like the intelligence on Bin Laden


They are such assholes.

[rodeodance]

7. Can you tell us what you are talking of?

[nini]

25. here you go

"...Among emergency specialists, 'mitigation' -- the measures taken in advance to minimize the damage caused by natural disasters -- is a crucial part of the strategy to save lives and cut recovery costs. But since 2001, key federal disaster mitigation programs, developed over many years, have been slashed and tossed aside. FEMA's Project Impact, a model mitigation program created by the Clinton administration, has been canceled outright. Federal funding of post-disaster mitigation efforts designed to protect people and property from the next disaster has been cut in half. Communities across the country must now compete for pre-disaster mitigation dollars.

more....http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4482567

[rodeodance]

4. does not seem to be. as there are locol/state by state efforts but

only Fema to coordinate. but even here we have not seen much from them.

[NMDemDist2]

5. check this out.....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4514462

[demo dutch]

6. They got all their funding cut by our Prez, including FEMA that's why!

Goverment cut Hurricane Protection funding to NOLA including a study to determine ways to protect the area from Cat 5 hurricanes.

In fiscal year 2006, the New Orleans district of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers is bracing for a record $71.2 million reduction in federal funding. It would be the largest single-year funding loss ever for the New Orleans district, Corps officials said. I've been here over 30 years and I've never seen this level of reduction, said Al Naomi, project manager for the New Orleans district... The cuts mean major hurricane and flood protection projects will not be awarded to local engineering firms. Also, a study to determine ways to protect the region from a Category 5 hurricane has been shelved for now.
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4200/is_20050606/ai_n14657367

[Igel]

20. But since the budget hasn't been approved,

one can figure that that reduction isn't going to happen.

It's rather like the 6/2004 quote concerning the allocation for upgrading the levees in the 2004/2005 budget: they cite the proposed budget amounts, not the actual budget amounts. Citing the proposed amounts may show priorities, but it says little about how much money was actually budgeted or spent.

[demo dutch]

35. Unfortunately it's not going to do a whole lot at this point!

Senator Landrieu has been complaining for a while about deteriorating infrastructure etc. so now we're seeing some of the results. Prevention is a dirty word in this country, whether it's healthcare or anything else. But there's always enough money to start a war and rebuilding other countries.

[The_Casual_Observer]

8. Cobbler's children have no shoes, it's an old story

But it is true

[babylonsister]

9. It's amazing me that, in this day and age of high tech, they're

resorting to sand bags to plug the levees?
And after hearing for years how much a huge hurricane could devastate NO, no plans were in place? Yes, Redstone, our tax dollars working away.:eyes: Guess we all will be paying for years to come.

[chelsea0011]

15. when I read in an above post that they would drop 3000 lb. bags

of sand on the levee, I thought the same as you. Is this how they prepared to deal with this?

[gratuitous]

18. Elemental forces of nature don't "do" high tech, really

But yes, sand bags still provide an effective, cheap, and easily portable bulwark against flood waters.

One does wonder, though, what use any of that $200 billion we've flushed down the toilet in Iraq might have been for this disaster.

[mondo joe]

41. They could use computers to plug the levees but sandbags work better.

Seriously, high tech doesn't do much in this situation.

[tridim]

10. I've seen several experts who said plans have been on the table

for a long time, and they can't get funding.

[expatriate]

11. Lots of people have said this for years.

Longtime residents of Louisiana are well aware of what will happen should a levee breach. If a levee breached on the river during a flood time, the loss of life would be incredible - not just in New Orleans, but in many places along the river.

Unfortunately, there has also been a longtime attitude of fatalism, and a lot of corruption that has winnowed money away from disaster preparedness. The pumps in New Orleans are - well, they're ancient.

There has always been a "today we live" attitude in that area. It has always been frustrating to cope with.

The federal government has diverted a lot of the money that was originally intended for disaster preparedness and relief in Southern Louisiana.

[blm]

13. Clinton's Disaster Mitigation took years to develop. Bush cancelled

the program and actually defunded the New Orleans project to prepare for a category 5 hurricane.

[Mutley]

14. I saw a documentary on this very scenario about a year ago...

and it said the same thing. That there are no plans to deal with all of the problems they predicted, and that have come true. They all saw this coming; the meteorologists, the government, many people. They figured the levees would hold, they figured flooding would be at a minimum, they figured most people would evacuate. They figured wrong, and now possibly hundreds are dead, and hundreds more could die.

[Lex]

17. Which means we HAVE NO PLANS if we have another terrorist attack.

We are well and truly screwed.

[Lerkfish]

37. exactly my thought.

If we cannot handle this, how could we possibly handle a backpack nuke attack of a large city? the answer is, we could not.

[iamjoy]

19. They Gambled...And Now Lives Are Being Lost

My theory: they looked at the cost of implementing a plan, and it was staggering. They figured the chances of a Category 4 or 5 taking a direct hit at NOLA. Then they figured the potential death toll of people who could not leave should such an event occur.

They determined the risk was worth it.

A part of me thinks this is a huge failure at the federal, state and local level. But then, why weren't we calling for a plan before this disaster? That is not a criticim, but it just shows what officials had to deal with. I think not enough people cared, and the officials knew they would have gotten slammed if they had spent all this money on a disaster plan and then no major storm hit.

[mondo joe]

42. Sure, but who's going to cut education, healthcare, roads and more to

implement an outragously expensive plan that might never be needed.

It's the same gamble most states make in one way or another, as well as most people.

[Horse with no Name]

21. Here is the reason--a must read

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=4493298&mesg_id=4493298

[Redstone]

29. Thank you SO much for that link. Now if we could only get all the

Republicans in this country to read it...

Redstone

[Redstone]

22. Why am I not surprised to hear that there were plans, but bushyboy

fucked everything up. Even more deaths for which he's directly responsible, not that he gives a shit.

Yet another paradigm of failure on all fronts.

Can there possibly be worse excuses for human beings than him and his pals?

Thanks for all the information.


Redstone

[Pepper32]

23. In my opinion they didn't care enough. I wonder why? hmm (nt)

[SammyWinstonJack]

33. The rich needed their tax cuts and yes that includes Jr and his mega

rich cabinet.

[shireen]

24. i share your frustration

Government priorities are insanely skewed against the public good, especially during the reign of King George. As long as private donation are used for fueling the campaigns of political office holders, the public good will NEVER be served.

[Cooley Hurd]

26. Some were paying attention:

I posted this on Sunday afternoon:
http://americanradioworks.publicradio.org/features/wetlands/hurricane1.html

Please read - it's the blueprint for disaster. :cry:

[Redstone]

27. Yes, I read a book a while back called "Goodbye, Louisiana," (I think)

that talked about the problem with the Delta shrinking, and the author predicted this hurricane outcome as well.

Redstone

[shireen]

28. here's more -- funding for hurricane prep slashed

Someone on DU dug this up a couple of days ago:

http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4200/is_20050606/ai_n14657367

New Orleans district of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers faces
New Orleans CityBusiness,  Jun 6, 2005  by Deon Roberts

In fiscal year 2006, the New Orleans district of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers is bracing for a record $71.2 million reduction in federal funding.

It would be the largest single-year funding loss ever for the New Orleans district, Corps officials said.

I've been here over 30 years and I've never seen this level of reduction, said Al Naomi, project manager for the New Orleans district. I think part of the problem is it's not so much the reduction, it's the drastic reduction in one fiscal year. It's the immediacy of the reduction that I think is the hardest thing to adapt to.

There is an economic ripple effect, too. The cuts mean major hurricane and flood protection projects will not be awarded to local engineering firms. Also, a study to determine ways to protect the region from a Category 5 hurricane has been shelved for now.

<see link for rest of article>

[formernaderite]

39. Okay....but it says the defunding is for fiscal 2006...

so it hasn't happened yet. Sorry, as much as I think Bush is dirt he hasn't been around long enough to mismanage all of this. New Orleans has had decades of scandal and money mismanagement....so has the state of Louisiana. I think the inepititude and blame goes years back.

[iamahaingttta]

30. You people still don't get it...

It's all part of the Neo-Con agenda to kill off as many poor people on the planet as possible. Send the poor people who join the National Guard to kill off poor people in Iraq. While they're there, a hurricane hits and they can't help the poor people here. You watch, the death toll will be much higher than the 80 we're hearing now. Bush doesn't appear to do much in these situations because he has no intention of doing anything. He's the perfect puppet for the agenda.

Maybe they'll stop when we get down to about 2 billion. Or maybe their blood-lust still won't be satisfied.

[wli]

34. didn't they call that Globalsomething 2000?

[Karenina]

43. This is another MIHOP

It's been known for decades that NO was a disaster waiting to happen. There are lots of OLD songs written about it.

The MOMENT the *dauphin reversed the process of dealing with the threat HE MADE IT HAPPEN ON PURPOSE.

[Catchawave]

31. Homefuckingland Security, what a farce....

Thanks George. The buck stops with you dearie. I'm tired of battling your supporters blaming Clinton for the shortage of 7,000 NG troops available to help in your latest Ground Zero.

Your God is still angry, I guess the 4 devastating hurricanes in Florida last year to grab your attention didn't work.

I even couldn't blame you for a Natural Disaster such as Katrina, but for your God's sake, act like a PRESIDENT WHEN YOUR COUNTRY IS IN SHOCK ! Your financial aid files are probably back at the White House you moran.

::sigh:: Yeah, I'm mad as hell too. It's a grief thing. Working on anger and blame now. Doubt I'll reach acceptance til the little dork is out of office!

[Name removed]

32. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[demo dutch]

36. NOLA is "democratic" country though!

[SoCalDem]

44. a blue dot...in a sea of red..

The money to prevent/repair/restore would most likely have to be approved by the WHOLE state.. If most of the reddies are the greedy stingy bastards we know them to be, why would THEY spend THEIR money on a bunch of poor folks who don't vote like them..?

NOBODY wants to see their money spent on "unseen" things..like infrastructure.. It's not "sexy"..like sports stadiums..malls..fancy buildings...snazzy white sand to fix the beaches..

It's ugly stuff...like sewer systems, roads, communications networks, etc..

It's hard to get people to willingly pay for the unseen stuff.. But that's the stuff that matters most in a disaster (or may prevent one)

[JerseygirlCT]

38. No fucking plans seems to be SOP these days nt

[theflyscotsman]

40. It Ain't Just FEMA

The locals failed spectacularly in coordinating the evacuation (there were estimated to be, what, 100,000 left behind?), and it looks like the Superdome would've been a deathtrap had they gotten hit as hard as Biloxi.

I think what we have here is a case of a comic-book threat that everybody liked to theorize about, but that nobody took seriously enough to actually take measures to prepare for it.

[In Truth We Trust]

45. They've had DECADES to prepare! Now watch them rebuild again without

compensating for this very scenario occurring again. It is common sense to know that it is unfortunately just a matter of time before this are is struck again.