Can't some of you understand two things are happening?

[Ripley]

1. Criminals and/or people who have lost their minds due to the stress are committing violent crimes and rapes are reported and attacking/trying to kill/or are killing other people.

2. Victims of the situation are starving and desperate and are trying to find food, water, diapers whatever. "Looting" is the wrong word and they are obviously just trying to survive.

Why do some of you people deny the violence is going on? It is not a right wing coverup. There is video. There are eyewitness reports - some right here by DUers who are in these areas.

The violence is happening hundreds of miles away from the coastline at gas stations and grocery stores.

Stop slamming the reports of violence as racist and lies.

In no way am I condoning a shoot to kill mentality by those who are sent in by the Government. But to deny it's happening is really odd.

[iconoclastic cat]

1. Are there any independent citizens' vids out there?

Somebody with a digicam must be filming some of this.

[CottonBear]

2. The LA GOV and Police Chief denying on live TV right now

http://www.wwltv.com/perl/common/video/wmPlayer.pl?title=beloint_wfaa&props=livenoad

[Inland]

3. No, it's violence all right vs. looting.

I'll accept that.

[KittyWampus]

4. thank you, it's difficult for Liberals to admit the reptilian impulse

that we all have because we are ususally guided byour Higher Selves.

[aquart]

7. Speak for yourself.

My mean and nasty is always on call.

[aquart]

5. Hunger makes me nasty.

If I didn't eat for days and had access to a gun, it would not be good.

And it isn't racist to believe that many people there believe they are being DELIBERATELY left to die...especially when some of us think so, too. Who sits quietly and passively and lets that happen?

The National Guard should have been available to move in immediately. Not just to maintain order, but to provide essential information about how to obtain help. We know why it didn't happen. They're in Iraq.

Bush has failed to protect the nation from its true enemy: nature.

[Cha]

121. How ironic, too, that "nature" is

showing the world what bush is really made of..a steaming pile of cowardly, uncaring, bullshit.

bush thumbs his nose at nature when he encourages the Polluters by giving them tax breaks and policing their own Pollution and makes statements deriding Global Warming.

[bryant69]

6. It's not Odd

We have become Freepers. We have our bete noir who is responsible for all the evil in the world, whether we can logically prove it or not. For the Freepers it was Clinton, for us it is George W. Bush. Anything bad that happens anywhere at any time is pretty much his fault.

The problem with your explanation is that it doesn't tie back to President Bush, therefore it is not very credible. Far easier to believe that this is part of a Bush-Cheney plan to test out martial law theories or to just kill black people for the hell of it.

[northzax]

12. and any other evil we see

is not as evil as Bush, so we do a comparison between the two, and attack Bush. it's sad, really.

[tx_dem41]

16. Snarky....but spot-on.

[crispini]

18. Very good.

And the OP has an EXCELLENT point. Nominated.

[theboss]

22. I was thinking that today

I mean, it should have been evident during the tsunami when there were posts saying that the US intentionally caused it, but there are things that are W's fault and things that aren't. (I think a lot of this chaos should lay at the feet of the mayor of NO, the police dept, and the governor to be honest). The problem is when you blame everything in the world on him. It just becomes so much noise.

[bryant69]

25. In fairness

Bush does share some of the responsibility because he didn't fund leevee maintenance/repair? ANd also because of who he put in charge of FEMA - but that's a long way from saying he planned all this or that he is orchestrating the carnage.

[mattclearing]

30. But Terry Schiavo had him back in Washington in no time.

Face it: Bush feels no sense of urgency about people who didn't vote for him. He will let them die and not feel one bit of responsibility or remorse. And you know it.

[bryant69]

35. And if I deny it I suppose I'm a secret Freeper?

Or just a naive fool.

Don't tell me what I know.

[Telly Savalas]

80. Well said.

[Indiana_Dem]

8. I don't deny it's happening but what's wrong is

that we are America and we've been handling situations like these all over the world and we are the richest country there is with the most resources! Things like you describe above are happening because our leadership has not responded quick enough! The things that are happening are normal reactions in these types of conditions. The lack of quickness in action by our government is way too slow than I feel we're capable of. IF this is all the faster we can act then I'm really worried about future disasters. They know these things happen in the first few days of anarchy. Look at any breakdown situation without food and resources. This is what happens. Our government should've been on this in planning the day of the storm!

[beam me up scottie]

9. Thank you. You're exactly right.

They have been reporting about this all day on WWLTV, read the blogs, people.

People are desperate, UN relief workers see this all of the time.

It's not safe for aid workers to go in and they shouldn't until they can be protected from violence.

[Ripley]

17. Yep, why do they think Americans are different from others?

And of course I am NOT BLAMING THE VICTIMS! I have already posted a couple of times about how this has affected me and people I know are missing.

But sometimes the hysteria here gets to be a bit much. Of course Dipshit is responsible for cutting the Army Corps of Engineers budget and it is documented that postponed building levees to withstand Cat 5 - thisis documented. He's negligent for playing around and ignoring this potential disaster last weekend instead of getting in front of it. WTF is Homeland Security doing?

Argh.

[High Plains]

43. You mean when everybody's already dead?

[beam me up scottie]

61. HIgh Plains, meet Clue; Clue, High Plains.

More dramatics, very nice.
:applause:

[Qanisqineq]

10. instead of it being RW crap I'd expect them to say this is NOT happening.

That way everything looks much better for them, like everything is in control and the situation is not dire. Why would they make up shootings?

[Misunderestimator]

11. Of course it's happening... but the problem is why... and the reason is

because there is NO order, NO plan and NOT ENOUGH National Guard or Police available to maintain any kind of order.

[Ripley]

19. Oh, I know!

But there are lots of people posting here that say there really is no looting and no guns and no one hurting other people. And some of those people have extremely high post counts.

[tkmorris]

13. Of COURSE there is violence

I don't anyone is outright denying that fact. The point many of us are trying to make though is that the violence is being exaggerated to both justify and distract from the the gross incompetence of the rescue effort.

Can't YOU see THAT?

[beam me up scottie]

20. By spreading paranoia? Nice job. Thanks!

If you haven't seen the denial, you haven't been paying attention.

The conspiracy loons are going batshit all over GD, screaming with glee at the windfall from this crisis.

[Ripley]

21. Yes people are saying exactly that.

I'll try to link it for you, but this place is moving really fast...

[Ripley]

24. Here's one example:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4555771#4556063

[tkmorris]

29. But that's not a blanket denial

She's denying the OP's report of a helicopter being fired upon, a report which the FAA itself says as far as they know is in fact false.

[Ripley]

32. Okay, I'll try to find a link more to your liking.

Sheesh.

[Ripley]

34. Here's one.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4556230


Do you think the physician in charge of the Trauma Center at Christ hospital in NO is lying when he said they fear for their lives from criminals who broke in and they have moved the patients to upper floors to find safety? This is an AP report I'm speaking of. Or is that all propaganda too?

[tkmorris]

69. You are being aggresive, overly so

I never denied that there is violence. Neither did anyone else. You act as if half of DU is claiming that there is no violence at all. We aren't and I think you know that. It's more a matter of keeping the violence in perspective. Here's some info posted by Momcat in another thread, speaking about Gov Blanco's comments about the violence being reported.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4557475

A physician at Christ hospital is afraid because some people broke into the lower floors. OK. Understandable and absolutely believable. The point is that the issue of violence and lawlessness in NO is being overblown by people with an agenda to push.

The VAST majority of the people left in NO are busy just trying to stay alive. Their plight is being belittled by people trying to make all the victims out to be roving gangs.

[Ripley]

77. Where am I aggressive?

Overly so? I never claimed you specifically denied violence. I gave you specific links to people who did.

I act as if? Where did I say half of DU is claiming anything? Where?

I think the aggressive one here is you and others insinuating I am a Freeper or something. Do you really think I'm the one out of touch? Look at all the people in this thread who have noticed this denial as well.

I've had it with this bullshit...

[beam me up scottie]

81. This is the crap that almost stopped me

from joining this forum and will be responsible for my leaving it.

If you don't agree with the mainstream, you're a disruptor, a freeper, a troll or just not a very nice person.

So much for dissent being patriotic.

[Ripley]

83. Do you think I'm aggressive anywhere in this thread?

I guess people are free to hate me and call me names. But it still always shocks me when my posts get deleted while the others are allowed to spew.

I am pretty wiped out from cleaning up after the hurricane went through here and I haven't heard from some friends who lived in Ocean Springs which was destroyed.

I hope the gang of misinformants enjoys their fun...

[tx_dem41]

85. I don't think so...not at all!

and believe me...I've seen you be aggressive to me before!


Duck and cover!!!! :)

[beam me up scottie]

90. No. Considering what you've been through, you're surprisingly calm.

I hope you hear from your friends soon.

And I really hope Skinner decides on a more liberal delete policy when it comes to hysterical threads.

The misinformants (excellent label, btw) are hurting the efforts of the people who are actually doing something to help.

[sniffa]

84. oh no!!!

we might Lose beam me up. :cry:

i onLy pray you take tx_dem with you.

[tx_dem41]

87. Hey!

:evilgrin:

[beam me up scottie]

91. oh. haha He's kidding!

Good thing you said something, I was about to set my phaser to "castrate".

[tx_dem41]

92. Don't do that....we wouldn't want the world to be deprived of...

little sniFFas! :evilgrin:

[beam me up scottie]

94. I'll try to remember that.

But it's dangerous to poke the BMUS when she's angry...
Ask anybody.
:evilgrin:

[joe_sixpack]

101. you too?

I thought that maybe I was the only one that felt that way sometimes.

[mondo joe]

104. You're not.

Honestly.

[tx_dem41]

106. Add me to the list. n/t

[beam me up scottie]

107. No, you're not alone.

I'll be the first one to give someone an earful if I think their opinion is stupid, but I won't tell them they have no right to post it.

I have had my loyalty, feminism, morals, character and allegiance questioned for agreeing with posts that weren't "popular".

Just don't forget that we have as much right to our stupid opinions as anybody else.
:evilgrin:

[Justitia]

42. Thank you - You are right. I wasn't denying violence, I was saying

there are UNCONFIRMED RUMORS ABOUT THIS ONE INCIDENT.

[Justitia]

45. So can you CONFIRM these RUMORS? No press has yet. -eom

[Pacifist Patriot]

108. I actually can't blame people for denying it.

1. Who would WANT to believe it?

2. The media hasn't exactly proven itself to be overly reliable lately.

3. The reports are obscuring other issues.

All my opinion of course

[tx_dem41]

14. Thanks, Ripley....lordy we agree on this.

Thanks for saying that. :)

[ret5hd]

15. the only people that can't understand what you are saying...

can't understand because they choose not to. they are here to spread hate.

[madeline_con]

41. The "love spreaders" are equally bad...

in some cases.

They cannot accept the fact that all those takig things are not taking food and water from major corps. Some are taking other people's things at gunpoint.

[stickdog]

23. Both of these things are happening for the SAME reason:

Rank incompetence and a total lack of leadership from the top.

If I needed a car or a boat to save my family's lives, you better believe that I'm commandeer one by any means possible short of murder.

[FormerRepublican]

26. OK, explain to me EXACTLY how that prevents air drops of food and water

to the convention center and the SuperDome? These people will die shortly without water.

This is bungled mishandling of MASSIVE proportions. Your justification for what they're doing makes me question YOUR motives.

[Name removed]

31. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

37. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

66. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[beam me up scottie]

70. I know. We're appear to be in an alternate dimension.

Where paranoid conspiracy theorists are telling people to believe the government and the msm.

[madeline_con]

44. Chopper fired on a t Superdome is the main reason.

No one wants to die because they tried to help.

[seabeyond]

27. breakdown of society. what bushco has lead us to. yes

you are right

[Bridget Burke]

28. I can understand it.

Here on the Gulf Coast, the National Guard is sent in early after a storm to (1) rescue people & (2) prevent looting. Fear of looters is one reason some people refuse to evacuate.

But the Guard is busy elsewhere, FEMA has been gutted & things have gotten out of hand.

[Stuckinthebush]

33. I am amazed that some here want to deny that violence is happening

Why is this hard for some to grasp?

[Ripley]

38. My guess is...

1. They are long time disruptors who come out in times like these, or
2. They are naieve and don't want to believe people can behave like that, or
3. They are so determined to see a huge conspiracy in this (instead of the plain old fuck-up it is by a miserable failure of a leader and his gang of thieves) that they WON'T accept reality.

I don't have all of the answers. But I am sick that we may all probably face some violence over the coming economic disaster.

[madokie]

55. Ripley Bless your heart, You go girl

I'm sending hugs your way

[LostinVA]

95. Ripley, you are so right

I've been ripped apart for saying exactly this same thing. Looting does NOT mean taking food, water, and meds your family needs. Looting is pillaging. It's criminal. And all of the innocent, desperate people trying to survive are being victimized by these scum... they are evil. Of course they are robbing people and attacking hospitals. They are sociopaths. Normal people don't do this, even DESPERATE people.

They are not victims, but part of the problem. Law enforcement must try to control them instead of doing rescue efforts. And, I grew up in 'cane country, and this never would have happened if if the NG had been in there before hand or RIGHT after.

And, for the poster up thread who said he/she would commandeer someone's property to save their own family... how is that right? Helping one another would save everyone. I don't get this...

[mondo joe]

105. Don't forget that people have a worldview that acts as a prism

for everything they see.

If the facts don't fit the worldview, contort them to fit.

[madeline_con]

46. Their rose colored glasses can't be removed....

All humans are made of sweetness and light in their little world.

[Cleita]

36. I'm not against reporting what's going on. I am against not putting

it into context. Most of the reports make it sound like everyone is involved in violent criminal activity. It's simply not true. The vast majority of these people are victims trying to survive, and if they help themselves to goods they need in the absence of any authority, they shouldn't be criticized for it.

[madeline_con]

48. I didn't get that message from the reports.

It's pretty clear that only a small minority are making it difficult to help survivors.

[Cleita]

57. I meant on DU mostly. Posts are being put up that ignore the

whole story until others come in a straighten them out. Of course we really won't know the real truth of what happened until this is over.

[madeline_con]

59. Those of us who know human nature...

could see this in the making.

What I don't understand are gun shop owners who left their wares in the zone and didn't pack it up and evacuate it.

But there would still be guns in the streets, and available to be burgled from private homes.

[renate]

58. There was an MSNBC cameraman on earlier today

He was desperately trying to get across just how horrible conditions in the Superdome are and emphasizing that the people there are miserable, starving, without water, with dead bodies in the middle of everything, yet--according to him--there was no violence or anarchy, that people are behaving well and that there was no risk to rescuers if anybody would bring in food and water. He showed clips of people despairingly asking where the food and water were. It was awful.

Now, admittedly, he probably wasn't there at night... he was talking about what he'd seen that morning. Nighttime must be absolutely hellish.

But maybe it's reports like that that are leading people to downplay the violence. The cameraman seemed as though he was on a mission to praise the people at the Superdome so rescuers wouldn't be afraid to bring in supplies.

The report was heartwrenching, by the way. There was a mother who said her baby was feverish and it was getting harder and harder to wake him up (watching your baby die by inches... it couldn't get worse)--the old and sick people.... They showed people helping people, too, which in those conditions was especially inspiring. But it's so so so tragic that it's even necessary for untrained civilians to be responsible for caring for the old and infirm like that.

[LostinVA]

97. They are showing it in context

They've been mainly showing dead, dying, and miserable people today on CNN, and only describing the looters/snipers as WTF? moments. I NEVER watch the MSM, but did today because of the posts on here about the video from NO. I'm glad I did.

[beetbox]

39. The totality of it is incomprehensible-it's awful n/t

[madeline_con]

40. THANK YOU!!!!

We need to drop the word "looter" from the DU vocab in this case.

We have "armed thugs" and "desperate survivors" all in the same area competing for scarce resources. The armed thugs are winning. The NG needs to get in there NOW!!

[The Wielding Truth]

75. Even after a limited tornado strike in my area years ago

the National Guard was stationed right at the scene within hours . They strictly oversaw the comings and goings of all and assisted in
establishment of order while providing helpful information. Why was there no immediate mass force to help?

Are we that ill prepared?

Does anyone remember the Civil Defense program.They were neighbors trained in first aid and emergency directives. It was not a "catch the commie" or "report the terrorist", it was the save your neighbor program. It was voluntary with no power to corrupt.It just presented the security that you could help save someone.

Let's get smart.

[Nothing Without Hope]

47. As in Iraq civilization is being destroyed: LOOTERS™ = the new TERRA-ISTS™

Strip away civilization, strip away available food, water, shelter, protection, and people will have no choice but to revert to an earlier way of life in which violence and raids were used to secure scarce supplies of necessities..

There is violence because these people are facing the death of themselves and their families for the lack of food, water, shelter and protection from gangs of thieves and bandits. When civilization fails them, they have no choice but to revert to the older human condition of violence. It's that or die. The destruction of trust, the heart of civilization, will be very slow to heal, I'm afraid. These people have seen the face of death with no one to aid them.

[tx_dem41]

51. You forgot to trademark one of your "LOOTERS". n/t

[beam me up scottie]

63. amateurs!

:rofl:

[tx_dem41]

64. Hey BeamMeUp.....don't laugh.

There's a federal law being broken, before our eyes!

:evilgrin:

[beam me up scottie]

71. Quick! Grab that man in black hiding in the bushes!!!

He'll know what to do!

Maybe he can flag one of those black helicopters that are always following me...

[tx_dem41]

73. Boo!!

<Beating my chest making helicopter noises>

:evilgrin:

[beam me up scottie]

78. eek!

:rofl:

[madeline_con]

52. Who's being a propaganda tool?

Do you seriously believe this is all about some sinister RW "plan" to take over LA?

There are scum who have armed themselves and are out to steal others' property, drugs from medical facilities, and anything else not nailed down that may strike their fancy. That is what's actually going on.

[Nothing Without Hope]

60. no I don't. The looting is being emphasized over the desperate need for

relief, and that is deliberate. The looting is real. I was dissatisfied with what I wrote even before I saw any replies and rewrote it.

[dxstone]

142. Well, I didn't get to read your original...

But txdem and scottie were having such an unusually joyous giggle-fest over it that I thought I'd just drop in to say that I've read many, many of your posts, and we are usually on the very same page; you are almost always extremely thoughtful and in touch with the greater reality, and I concur with what you've said here as well...
It's a question of focus, and what sorts of "lessons" people will take away from this experience...
d

[mom cat]

49. Actually, the Gov in her press conference this afternoon said that the

rumors of violence are way overblown. The State Police said the same thing.He said that the rumors were wasting valuable resoueces...that they have to allocate people and precious time to check the rumors out. Most are not panning out. She said that the altercations have mostly been scuffles. People are not rioting.

[tx_dem41]

54. Luckily(or unluckily), some of us don't have to believe the Government....

we have friends and family who are experiencing this first hand.

What has happened to DU? We are now being told to trust the Government.

Soon to come: Cats sleeping with dogs.

[beam me up scottie]

67. No kidding.

AND the msm, tsk tsk tsk.

Pitiful.

[enigmatic]

50. Thank you

I've rarely agreed with anything you've said in the past, but I agree w/ you on this.

[ClintonTyree]

53. I'm surprised they haven't locked this............

I had several posts deleted yesterday for telling the truth. Sometimes the truth isn't pretty and contrary to our belief systems, but it's still there staring us in the face.

[tx_dem41]

56. You have company in your experiences today. n/t

[lebkuchen]

62. Don't abject desperation and violence go hand in hand?

[Lone_Star_Dem]

65. I've said from the beginning that chaos will reign if they don't get help

... to these people. They haven't and things continue to degrade.

I can't deny that all hell is breaking loose. I do think some of the reports are exaggerated, but not all. That's to be expected at a time like this. When you are getting sketchy reports at best, and then conflicting stories later on.

Two nights ago there were reports of people shooting at and trying to break into Charity Hospital. They also said their generator had been stolen.

The generator part is what made me think it was an exaggeration. The ones used for hospitals are usually INSIDE the buildings and massive things.

I said I'd wait for validation before I assumed this to be true.

Today Charity Hospital says there have been no security incidents and are asking for the rumors to stop.

Alot of the hell we are hearing about is true, most of it would be my guess, but some is just rumors generated by the state of panic that has erupted in NO.

I suggest people just stop and think if it sounds feasible, if it does then it may well be true. If it sounds a little too sensational wait until you hear more on the story before you panic.

Denying what's taking place does no good. When all is said and done violence will still have occurred if we will ourselves to see it or not.

[Ripley]

68. Well said. Except I've seen posts about Charity Hospital...

where the Chief of the Trauma confirmed they were under attack and begged the AP to help them since they couldn't reach anyone. Lots of links in LBN.

We have been trying to call the mayor’s office, we have been trying to call the governor’s office ... we have tried to use any inside pressure we can. We are turning to you. Please help us,” said Dr. Norman McSwain, chief of trauma surgery at Charity Hospital, the largest of two public hospitals.

[Justitia]

79. Attacked or Ignored? I heard his interview w/my own ears, he never

said "attacked". He said they have been abandoned and need help.

Do you have a link to him saying they are under "attack"?

[DemBones DemBones]

125. Here's a link:

(AP) — Doctors at two desperately crippled hospitals in New Orleans called The Associated Press Thursday morning pleading for rescue, saying they were nearly out of food and power and had been forced to move patients to higher floors to escape looters.

"We have been trying to call the mayor's office, we have been trying to call the governor's office ... we have tried to use any inside pressure we can. We are turning to you. Please help us," said Dr. Norman McSwain, chief of trauma surgery at Charity Hospital, the larger of two public hospitals.

more. . .

http://www.nola.com/newsflash/weather/index.ssf?/base/national-50/112560684187871.xml&storylist=hurricane

(That's the New Orleans Times-Picayune site.)

[Lone_Star_Dem]

82. That's an excellent example of conflicting reports

Also, last night on CNN Richard Zuschlag called in and told how a helicopter that was trying to evac patients out of a hospital was shot at. I heard him say this with my own ears.

Today the same man is quoted as saying:


Richard Zuschlag, president of Acadian Ambulance Service Inc., described the chaos at a suburban hospital.

"We tried to airlift supplies into Kenner Memorial Hospital late last evening and were confronted by an unruly crowd with guns, and the pilots refused to land," he said.

"My medics were crying, screaming for help. When we tried to land at Kenner, my pilots got scared because 100 people were on the helipad and some of them had guns. He was frightened and would not land."
http://www.wwltv.com/sharedcontent/nationworld/katrina/stories/090105ccwcKatrinaDocsplead.16a0e3a0.html


Things are bad there, people are scared and facts are going to be hard to come by. My heart goes out to all the people who are suffering.

[Binka]

72. Desperate People Will Behave With Desperate Tactics

Bush is counting on folks to discount the victims. He has no other spin. I have no doubt that there are fuckwittages in NO right now. But this is Pysch-ops 101. EVERY fucking media screed is about the looters, the violence, and the fucking hoodlums. Fuck that BS they should be reporting on the victims of this tragedy. The real victims like the fucking DEAD!

They are victimizing the poor. It is a crime worthy of the Hague.

[tx_dem41]

76. "Victimizing the poor"

Yes, I agree...the people committing violence against hospitals and rescue workers are definitely victimizing the poor. The poor that need Charity Hospital to stay open since its the only public hospital around.

[Binka]

86. Where did you get that information?

My friend on the ground who works for a major LA TV station said those reports are bullshit. You my friend are operating on Bullshit. But steam away and keep repeating the party line.

LA is a fucking disaster zone and it isn't because of looting thugs and hospital marauding freaks. It is because Bush is a failure.

There are many threads on DU tonight about deep subversive operatives who are using DU as a place to spew party garbage. Just sayin'.

[tx_dem41]

89. My father-in-law is Chief of Staff...

at Tulane University Hospital. That hospital is across the street (catacorner) to Charity.

Tulane University Hospital was almost overrun yesterday. They shut it down today.

On Edit: Just sayin'

[Sterling]

103. No my cousin is the King of Siam and he said....

yawn.

[tx_dem41]

109. You know....my father-in-law has now been up there for 7 days...

24/7...separated from his family and not knowing where they were until yesterday....he has evacuated about 20 severely premature babies in the last 48 hours from Tulane, because the city is not safe for them. He was supposed to meet his wife and his dau and uncle and aunt in Alexandria today, but the state didn't evacuate him as promised. So he's probably there an extra few days.

He is the most decent man I have ever met. Three years ago, I, my wife and I traveled back to our hometown to see him installed as Chief of Staff. The auditorium was overflowing with former and current staff, family, and even former patients...some who were 2 lbs when they were born and were now living normally. Eveybody in that whole room cried when he talked about what we all meant to him. So yeah, you can see why I think he's the most decent person I've ever knonw......a lot better than me...and a helluva lot better than you. Believe me....it took me one post...make that 12 lame, pitiful, immature words to let me know that.

In fact....I'd bet on it,if you were worth it...Its a lock.

[beam me up scottie]

112. Your cousin is the King of Siam ?!?

Well, smack my ass and call me Shirley!

Why a cousin of the King would have a reason to have an overblown ego and opinion of oneself.

[sniffa]

113. so how Long have you and tex dem been together?

it is quite adorabLe to watch you tag team.

gives me hope that one day, i too can find another DUer to come to my defense.

[beam me up scottie]

114. How much help do you need?

I'm sure if you run along back to your clique, you'll be safe enough.

Or did I just get lucky enough to be the recipient of your leftover but oh-so-witty snarkiness tonight?

[sniffa]

117. sorry

my cLique has been overun by armed rape gangs.

and you'LL be Lucky enough to for my oh-so-witty snarkiness untiL the ignore function works again.

[beam me up scottie]

120. Oh looky here!

Another person in denial about human behaviour.

At least, I'm assuming that's why I'm the target of this infantile temper tantrum.

Don't blame the grown ups because the truth hurts.

[sniffa]

123. yeah the truth hurts

i'm gLad you're being the grown up on this thread.

was it this post:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4555561#4558530

or this one:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4555561#4558974

or this one:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4555561#4557276

or maybe this one:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4555561#4558058


i'LL try to track down my cLique to heLp me be as grown up as you.

[beam me up scottie]

126. Too bad you haven't got an opinion of your own,

so you're stuck just crying about posters who do.

See, I can at least respect people who have opinions, even if they're different from mine.

What I can't respect is juvenile behaviour by people who are incapable of expressing why they're whining and then declare that they put everybody they don't like on ignore.

[sniffa]

130. oh woah is me

you're making absoLuteLy no sense here, but i can respect that.

[beam me up scottie]

137. I'll type slower.

Just make your case for disagreeing with my opinion and stop whining about how you don't like my behaviour.

This isn't the Lounge.

[sniffa]

139. it's not the Lounge?

LeveL 3 makes it aLL confusing.

[tx_dem41]

115. We could be the Three Musketeers if you like? n/t

[beam me up scottie]

116. I thought he was with you.

Forgive my ignorance, I'm afraid I'm not cool enough to hang out with the popular kids on DU.

I don't give a shit if people "like" me or think I'm "nice".

If I've got something to say, I say it.

To my shock and horror, I am in agreement with many of my arch enemies on this issue, and if I've ticked a few people off, fuck em.

So says BMUS.

[sniffa]

118. i feeL the same way

yet, somehow, i'm in the cLique of cooL kids. strange how that works out.

[beam me up scottie]

122. You must be.

You sure the hell don't hang out on the wrong side of the tracks.
All I've ever seen you do is snark and run.
Members of cliques tend to do that.
They're afraid to break away from the pack or even give an opinion of their own, lest they call attention to themselves and be caught alone.

It's probably a good thing you put everyone you disagree with on ignore.
It doesn't look like you like the unsweetened version of the truth.

[sniffa]

124. aLL i've seen you do is gang up on whoever tx_dem is feuding with

thanks for being the grown up, individuaList you are though.

coLor me impressed.

[tx_dem41]

128. Sorry to cause all this drama, sniffa....

I don't think we've ever even met, much less had a cross word. I usually find you pretty funny. Sorry you're ticked off tonight.


Don't take it out on BMUS though.

[beam me up scottie]

141. I'm crushed and I just HAD to tell my bestest friend about it!

Sniffa doesn't like me because I'm a big meanie!!!
:cry:

Okay.
All better now.
Just add him to the list.

[beam me up scottie]

129. Really? Cuz I'm sure I joined the thread when I posted my thoughts on #9.

You are the one who hasn't had anything at all to say about the op.
You just post a snark and whine, post a snark and whine...

It's boring.

Spines are nice, you should try one on for size.

[sniffa]

133. i've made my feeLings quite known on this subject

i don't give a donkey's nut whether you've read or not... i just got enraged by your juveniLe and cLiquish behavior up thread.

i have quite a spine for going after big, bad internet tuffs who "just teLL Like it is".

but you're right - it is getting rather boring.

[beam me up scottie]

136. Thank you for admitting you are just being petty.

I thought it would take all night.

Let me know when you actually have something to say that has to do with the issue, cuz if I wanted to have a pissing contest, I'd choose a more formidable opponent.

[sniffa]

138. no probLem

i'm gLad you got the Last word in.

[beam me up scottie]

99. How's that foot taste ?

Was the crow done to your satisfaction ?

No need to reply, I can see your mouth is still full. :hi:

[1932]

74. Are you upste that people aren't paying more attention to violence?

Why?

My impresssion is that DU'ers are apportioning the right degree of attention to people who are suffering and not committing crimes and people who are suffering and are committing crimes (and, by the way, we have a fucked-up society where people commit crimes every day, flood or no flood).

My do some people want to talk so much about the violence?

[beam me up scottie]

93. Why do some want to pretend it isn't happening?

That was Ripley's point, since you obviously didn't get it.

She didn't sensationalize the violence and she didn't suggest that the victims' suffering should be ignored.

Nice strawman.
Wrong thread.

[AnnInLa]

88. Ripley..thank you for your post....in the surrounding towns

that are taking in evacuees, the problems with violence are also getting bad. I had a chance to listen to radio stations from Baton Rouge, New Iberia and Lafayette today. These are not "rich" cities...their citizens are running around trying to provide for the people in shelters without FEMA help, apparently. Churches, schools, private businesses, everyone is mobilizing. Yet the violence coming from the people spilling from the shelters is making the citizens edgy. They want to help so much, but they want to keep themselves and their families and their neighborhoods safe. In BR, people were walking around with guns sticking out of their pockets...not the local citizens. I'm not implying that all of the refugees/stranded are criminals and evil...but it's just plain stupid to deny what is going on. How do you justify raping? Beating up old people? Shooting at rescue workers? Stealing from hospitals? These incidents have been proven, they have been verified. Our Abbeville leaders are meeting to set up a evacuee center here in our small town, but they are jittery from the stories THAT OUR OWN CITIZENS RELAYED when they went to N.O. with their flats and pleasure boats to help....they were told to evacuate themselves before it was too late for them. They come back and tell their horror stories, first hand accounts. The denying that this is happening or is being overblown by the press is inaccurate...in fact, the press can't report half of the violence that is going on. The end.

[beam me up scottie]

96. I forgot to say I nominated this thread.

Excellent post, Ripley.

[LoZoccolo]

98. Because they're nuance-impaired.

They think every fact has an agenda, and because they can't have a conflicting agenda, they start editing the facts.

I have a tendency to start putting people like that on ignore.

[sniffa]

102. funny you shouLd mention that

this whoLe thread has sweLLed my ignore List

[Nikki Stone 1]

100. Yes, you are right about this

I posted something similar yesterday. There are very desparate people AND there are violent criminal types out there. The few criminals are destroying the chances of survival for many people.

[DebJ]

110. The poor are the ones stuck. Mentally ill are poor. Now without

their medications...........shudder. My son has BP.......

[sniffa]

119. .

:hug:

[meow mix]

111. banks, jewelry stores, casinos, no electricity, no one around..

eeps

[tlsmith1963]

127. They Are Angry

Hey, if I had been abandoned I would be angry, too. I'm not saying that there aren't some genuine violent jerks there, but I mostly think it's anger at how poorly things have been handled. The Republicans don't understand the situation, as usual. I bet if they were there & felt abandoned they would go nuts, too.

Tammy

[bpilgrim]

131. 'LOOTING' is a fucking RW WACKO DISTRACTION to cover the deliberate STARVE

starvation of the poor :argh:

listen to the ON SCENE reports not the fucking RUMORS or especially the corporate WHORES.

http://news.globalfreepress.com/mp3/katrina/NO-8-31-05-2427-onscene_report-wdsu-katrina.mp3

the CRIME is minuscule considering the devastating on going HORROR!

got it?

peace

[mondo joe]

135. No - the relief workers are facing dangers from armed looters as are

survivors. I listened to a relief coordinator today talking about being shot at. And the live blog coming out NO talks about it being a terrifying lawless zone where people are afraid to go outside their homes.

The fear and violence are part of the horror.

[beam me up scottie]

140. Wake up.

The information came from the people down in that hell.

Stop trying to spin paranoid conspiracy theories out of misery.

It's still exploitation even if members of the left are the ones using tragedy to further their agenda.

[scottxyz]

132. Some people are stealing TVs

So let's kill off the other 80,000 who are just waiting for food and sandwiches to be airdropped.

In my opinion, looting should be encouraged. Store owners are going to put in insurance claims pretending everything disappeared anyways - and most of the "looters" are STARVING and DEHYDRATED because the Federal government doesn't want to airdrop some water and sandwiches to them.

Rumsfeld was quite complacent about looting in Baghdad - he was like, shit happens, freedom's messy. But let some poor black people in NOLA go steal a loaf of bread and a case of soda because they've figured out their government is trying to KILL them via starvation and dehydration, and you get Bush talking about "zero tolerance" on TV like they were fucking Noriega out shoveling coke up their nose.

What's happening in NOLA is murder, pure and simple. You can debate whether it's due to racism or whether it's due to classism or whatever - but at the very best, it's due to cluelessness so call it "manslaughter" if you will. Bushco is clearly guilty of manslaughter for refusing to airdrop in water in sandwiches on Day 5 of this disaster. There's no two ways about it.

Yes there is some looting but overall the situation is pretty calm down there, considering people have been going 5 days with NO WATER AND SANDWICHES airdropped from the Federal govt. You can't let 80,000 people die just because some guys want to steal TVs.

[beam me up scottie]

134. Did you even READ the op?

If so, what the hell are you talking about?

It was addressing the people who deny that there ARE violent crimes being committed, and she specifically states that the people trying to survive by taking what they need is NOT looting.

That's quite a straw man.
Several of them, actually.

[nonconformist]

143. Thank you. nt