Those who call looters criminals, should walk in their shoes first.

[mod mom]

These poor people have been pushed to the edge off sanity by such an horrific experience followed by intense heat and deprivation of basic human needs. They have lost loved ones and experienced tremendous stress, waiting for basic supplies and guidance and have yet to come. Our nation lacks a leader in it's commander in thief. Our nation has become de-moralized by a cold calculating (faux) President who was to busy pushing his self servicing agenda pitching his social insecurity plan to plan for the safety of his citizens.

Look at the difference of the MSM correspondants who in the past have appeared to be a mouthpiece for the neocons. Anderson Cooper has a deep soul. Others are just as truly moved by the suffering. They are finally calling a spade a spade. If this event has had such an effect on the MSM who are not losing loved ones and have access to water and food, just imagine how tolling it would be on someone who are trying to survive on the mean streets on NOLA.

George W. Bu$H was NEVER ELECTED PRESIDENT of the United States. He cheated. They stole it in Ohio and elsewhere. We have the evidence, just no fair courts. NOT even the Democratic Chair of the House Judiciary, John Conyers, has subpoena power and can't even call a hearing.

He and this neocon cronies started this IMMORAL WAR in Iraq based on LIES. This war is about gaining a strategic hold on water and oil in the middle east. It is part of their PNAC fascist plan. They are cold blooded war criminals!

They are RUINING OUR ENVIRONMENT. Our earth is sick. Their profit centered agenda is causing irreparable damage to our planet.

They have caused our world to become so much less stable. There is a major proliferation in terrorism. There is great disdain for our Nation. They have undermined generations of diplomacy and goodwill.

They have greatly increased the disparity of between rich and poor in our country. The great strides of the working poor made during the Clinton Administration has been erased so help fill their quotas of cheap labor and soldiers.

Every child born today inherits a birth tax from this administration. Their tax cuts ot the wealthy helped fuel a huge deficit that each and every American child will someday have to repay. Do we know if their time will not be more trying than our own? Do they deserve to have to pay for our excesses? Bu$h inherited a huge surplus and strong nation. His administration have drained our nation's financial strength to enrich his self serving cronies.

We can not accept this faux leader. George W. Bush is a man with no soul. The world experienced this in the handling of the hurricane disaster. Who the fuck cares if these ABUSED people take material posessions? I would like to suggest that all those who cry foul, take a walk in their steps.

What have we, as a nation, become? Is there an image when we collectively look in the mirror? This horrific chain of events is happening under our noses. There is no knight in shining armor-it is only us. Enough is enough. We must PUSH FOR IMMEDIATE CHANGE!

[meisje]

1. Taking a Plasma T.V. = Looting

Attempt to spin it anyway you want, taking material items is looting.

[me b zola]

6. If that is al you can see from this horrific picture,

You can see the video, hear the reports--from the MSM, no less--and *that* is what you have to say??

Okay, then. I don't even know how to respond to someone who cannot understand what is going on in NO. You focus on the few. What about the many?

[kestrel91316]

15. And taking food/water/shoes/diapers is a basic human right, AFAIC.

(Not just anytime, but under these circumstances.)

[Joe Chi Minh]

33. It is also a precept of the Roman Catholic church.

Certainly with regard to food and water.

Murderous, armed thugs are murderous armed thugs, period, and deserve to be shot on sight. But JD Priestly's point is also a good one on the subject of the looting:

"The poster is, however, also right. Many of these people are at least momentarily not living in a reality. They can't handle the reality they are in so they are acting out fantasies. It is a sort of temporary insanity".

But most of all, I am struck by this whole issue of the looting reports, in the same way as Manic Expression in his post 18.

How can anyone following this ongoing drama brought about by "malevolent neglect" give a second thought to the theft of consumer goods from shops, in a situation like this; when so many of the "respectable" middle-class people of the country have, themselves, contributed over the decades to the theft of their own government essentially by the Pentagon, State Department and military-industrial complex, in a sense, predictably leading to this self-same man-permitted catastrophe?

I've just read the second of H2O's posts, cited by Nothing Without Hope, and now find that I have to point out that in my remarks about murderous, armed thugs, "murderous" must be the operative word.

Nothing and no-one can justify the armed thugs who have been trying to hunt down and shoot the few police officers there trying to hold the fort. But leaving them aside, I don't have any difficulty imagining that, in a seriously marginalised and oppressed minority, essentially good young men can find themselves joining forces in quite heavy criminal enterprises - any more than essentially bad young men in a very affluent minority can find themselves joining forces with very heavily criminal - though no doubt often, ostensibly, lawful - forces. The latter, increasingly, it seems, with impunity and even promotion for their "good work".

It was quite heart-warming to read of those young criminal "robbin' hoods", I suppose you might call them, using a speedboat they'd stolen, to help feed and protect young families. Not a recipe for a good, stable Christian soceity in normal circumstances, for sure, but a) our societies on both sides of the pond are deeply corrupt, and anything but stable and Christian, and b) precisely because of that, the ethics of survival, never mind the wonderful compassion those young hoodlums showed, is by no means straightforward.

Although, very arguably, on the basis of Christ's utterly unambiguous contempt for worldly possessions, and that love is the fulness of the Law, at least in that selfless enterprise, the thugs showed themselves to be heroes, in a sea of, at best, lethally sinful official dereliction.

[JDPriestly]

17. So is charging huge prices for gasoline during a time of

national disaster. There are, I believe, laws against taking advantage of disasters in some states. You are right, however, stealing unnecessary things is looting. The poster is, however, also right. Many of these people are at least momentarily not living in a reality. They can't handle the reality they are in so they are acting out fantasies. It is a sort of temporary insanity. Some, of course, are just habitual thieves. It's hard to know who is who without being there and meeting them. There are lots of photos of these people. And, if the people survive, they will have eventually to answer for their crimes because order will be reconstituted, hopefully sooner rather than later. The L.A. riots resulted in many arrests and convictions for looting and vandalism.

[tk2kewl]

25. have you ever been oppressed? kept down?

not given opportunities while the kids on the other side of town have everything handed to them?

And then, after generations of that, had your government turn its back on you in your most desperate time of need? While your family fights for its survival?

I could see someone very easily thinking taking that tv was the justice they were owed.

[Jamastiene]

28. Taking food, water and medical supplies is survival though.

Many are taking those items and not the televisions. IMO, they aren't looting. They are surviving. I wish ignore worked right now.

[slackmaster]

2. Some looting really is criminal, some is not

Denying it just makes you look silly.

I don't plan on walking in their shoes, ever. I have prepared myself to be self-sufficient in any foreseeable disaster.

[bliss_eternal]

7. deleted post

It's not worthy of me or the original posters kind and thoughtful post to dignify such posts with a response...

So I deleted my angry response...

carry on.

[Lindacooks]

14. Yeah, you might think that now.

But don't be so smug. Things can change in a hurry - in a heartbeat.

[1932]

19. I think that's the attitude that makes people so blind.

They look at suffering and feel morally superior. They think the fact that they're not suffering means they're somehow better.

Good for yout that you think you're prepared.

Once you get over yourself, perhaps you'll notice that decent people are suffering and that we shouldn't be total assholes towards them.

[tk2kewl]

27. you are the one who looks silly. you didn't read the post

no one is saying its not criminal but that it is definitely understandable. read my response... http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=4567969&mesg_id=4571792

that is what the poster means about walking in their shoes. can you honostly say that if you were poor your whole life and treated like a second class citizen and then left for dead you might not be pissed off enough to look for something you might think you're owed?

[KittyWampus]

3. violent thugs are just that... violent thugs.

[bliss_eternal]

9. Who's a thug?

Might want to be careful about calling those that you saw on television thugs. It says a lot more about you than it does about them...

Think about it.

[Biased Liberal Media]

10. Excuse me, but have you ever been so desperate to eat

or drink or desperate for your children that you acted out in violence??

Again, try walking in their shoes before being judgemental and calling someone a "thug".

[kestrel91316]

16. What is violent about taking water to give to a child?

[1932]

20. I'm going to start calling you "crying" because you really have no shame.

Don't you think it's time for you to get off your highhorse?

I really can't beliefe that this is the only aspect of this event that you feel compelled to comment on.

[Just Me]

4. Our society is built upon capitalism, not compassion.

Hence, our society's priorities are laid on the table for us all to examine.

Let us EXAMINE!!!! It's about time!!!!

[dweller]

5. ...

nom'd.

if only for the thread title.
for it's the step those quickest to condemn will most likely not take.

dp

[DanCa]

8. A great man from Tupelo said it best

Before you abuse criticize and confuse walk a mile in my shoes.

[fishnfla]

11. The shoes will never fit. never

http://www.wwltv.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=13384

This mall survived the hurricane, but not looters. My brother's business there

[bliss_eternal]

12. I'm sorry to hear of your bro's business...

But how do you know that--really know that?

You don't.

Oddly the universe has an interesting way of handing us the very thing we say 'we will never.' Just something to consider...

[fishnfla]

13. How do I know what?

the oakwood mall was where his business was, I've been there

how do I know I would never loot? because tonight I have a real strong feeling of the pain it can cause to someone else. There's your fucking liberal compassion.

I am very fucking sorry, I have no patience for looter lovers today

[manic expression]

18. You know?

what sheer arrogance!

If supporting someone's access to VERY necessary products, no matter what the situation is "looter loving", then I am the biggest "looter lover" you will find.

Oh, so your brother's business was hurt! :nopity:

PEOPLE ARE DYING. I DON'T CARE IF YOU OR YOUR BROTHER LOSES THE ENTIRE STORE. THERE ARE INFINITELY MORE IMPORTANT THINGS THAN YOU AND YOUR GREED (not to mention the fact that these people have been thrown out into a storm with no support. I think that stealing is NOT unreasonable at all, contrary to your foolish and callous opinions).

Cute little catch-phrase there, by the way.

[bliss_eternal]

22. Thank you, manic--

you said it so much better than I ever could have. Oh and btw, what is he doing on this board, if he has no tolerance for 'liberal compassion?' :wtf:

I guess we can be looter lovers together...

:toast: :pals:

[Jamastiene]

29. Bravo. The high horse can come down and see the truth too.

Sooner rather than later. Karma is a boomerang. I'm disgusted to find that kind of snobbishness and selfishness on DU, to be honest.

[bliss_eternal]

31. Me too, Jamastiene--

--earlier I thought I logged onto the wrong board. :scared:

:hi:

[Solon]

21. I don't know whether to hate you or pity you...

valueing property over people, pathetic.

[bliss_eternal]

23. Ooooh, oooh, I know, I know....

(bliss waves hand wildly)--pick me, pick me!

:evilgrin:

[Jamastiene]

30. No. No. Pick me. I know.

[Nothing Without Hope]

24. I strongly recommend reading what our wise H2O man posted on this:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4569688

And also, some of those "looters" are actually feeding and rescuing people. It's not like anyone else will. Some of them are saving lives:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4568012

[Kurt Remarque]

26. diversionary propaganda, my friends

after all, could it possibly be worse than iraq?

[mod mom]

32. I had been brought to tears by the coverage on CNN when I wrote this. I

could not believe that what I was seeing was happening in the richest country in the world. This tragedy did not have to happen. Yet there are those who post on this forum who place more value in material possession over basic human dignity. I pity them.