I think I finally figured out what Clinton was doing

[DoYouEverWonder]

All this hanging around with the Bushes. Ma Bush calling him her son. Dems turning against him because of it.

Clinton, Gore and Kerry all know more about the Bush gang then any of us.

They also knew that a major disaster of some sort was in the works, either natural or not. BushCo has ignored science and climate change on purpose. They wanted climate change.

With the hurricanes in the last few years and this year's forecast it was inevitable that New Orleans would get hit with a big one. NO is the #1 pin at the end of the bowling alley.

So Clinton sucked up to the Bushs. Played the good boy. And what did he get for his trouble. A Place on the Stage Today. This is very important! Clinton will be in a leadership role from here on out. Other Dems are starting to pop up all over the media because they are the only ones who know how to run disaster relief.

Maybe I'm just going crazy but I am starting to see a light at the end of the tunnel and still do believe that hope is on the way.

What the heck, if I'm wrong I can go back to being depressed.

[rwenos]

1. Keep Your Friends Close, Your Enemies Closer

Big Bill is applying Don Vito Corleone's wisdom.

[Ouabache]

17. exactly

but it may be a deadly embrace both directions. the bushes know clinton is their greatest enemy as well? unless bill is just suckering them into thinking he is, and running a mole operation at their side. of course he has to be careful, they will say and do things in front of him that they know only HE would know and be able to tell someone else. Bit we know BC always has them topped as far as raw brain power and interpersonal power. advantage:bill

[DoYouEverWonder]

43. The Bush's aren't going to have much to say to anyone anymore

it is time for them to quietly get out of the way.

Go to the Cayman Islands, go to wherever the hell they please, just go.

[brazil]

148. Yes they should go to the Caribbean...

...but I think Guantanamo Bay is much more suitable than the Caymans...

[bigbrother05]

103. Look at the fund Katrina fund raising press conference

The first part of the Q&A after the Bush/Clinton fund raising kickoff had Greta VS asking about the criticism. Poppy said the Prez could take it. Then Clinton spoke and remarked that there was flooding in NO during his 1st term and they put together a program to improve the protections, but he "wasn't sure" what had been done after he left office. He knows how to deflect their transparent attempts to blame him and turn the spotlight where it belongs. Then he sat down with the reporters after the press conference was over. Bill might have been born at night, but it wasn't last night.

[chalky]

112. Love that oblique reference, Bill. Don't worry--we get what you're saying.

;)

[ChiciB1]

127. I'm Still LEARY!!!!

Timothy!!!

[leanin_green]

120. Actually, pappa Bush is applying it to Big Bill.

Does anyone remember who was Govenor of Arkansas during Iran/Contra? That is, before the scandal broke? That the majority of air transports being used for their illegal drug/arms shipments were being run through Arkansas military bases? Big Bill used that bit of nasty business he had on Pappa all the way to the presidency. Looks like it still has legs.

[burythehatchet]

185. applying mafioso philosophy does not give me great comfort

You may be right, but to me its more reason to move away from supporting him.

[yurbud]

207. some of this Machiavellian shit is unavoidable, and valuable.

I would rather have someone who is 100% honest and honorable,but such a person rarely rises to national office, and even more rarely to the presidential level.


Clinton is a notch better than the Bush in that he didn't use the retaliation and fear-mongering that have been hallmarks of the Bush years, and at least some of the stuff he did in office was intended to help the rest of us, not just the Wall Street and Banks.

[opihimoimoi]

2. A good theory is better than a sad response to aid victims anyday

[katmondoo]

3. I hope, I hope

[goclark]

4. I'm with you, I pray you are right nt

[MichiganVote]

5. They should be asking Carter, but he won't play Bush ball

Jimmy Carter has done more to help those in poverty than any one of the millionaire missionaries

[DoYouEverWonder]

7. Carter will come back too

Actually he never left.

[leanin_green]

122. Carter, the last true Democrat.

[peacetalksforall]

177. And Al also?

[DoYouEverWonder]

196. Al's Back

He was there on Saturday with a plane and took out a bunch of people. I'm sure he's not sitting around twiddling his thumbs even now. He's acting like a real leader instead.

[magnolia]

197. Al Gore was at the hurricane sight...

...moving patients. If you blinked you missed it. I read yesterday that Jimmy Carters people were turned away. Without the Bush "invitation" there's no air time. President Clinton knows what he is doing! He's out there, in front of the camera, he has the microphone and none of the right can complain about it because he was asked to be there my their leader!

If you've ever been to Free Republic you know that the "Bush-Clinton-Katrina Fund" must be making their pointed little heads explode!

[DoYouEverWonder]

199. You got it

He set them up and now they can't do a thing about it. Clever boy that Clinton fellow, very clever.

[Walt Starr]

6. Clinton = Bush, IMO n/t

[DoYouEverWonder]

9. Then you don't see what's going on here?

I guess within the next few weeks we'll see whose right.

[hippiechick]

151. What's going on is

...Bill is trying to get Hillary on the ticket in '08, and knows that Poppy is one of the the Don Corleone's of the political world, at the moment.

As much as I loved Bill during his first term, as the rose colored glasses came off, it became apparent that more than anything, he and Hillary crave POWER and the spotlight.

[DoYouEverWonder]

152. That's what the freepers

all say too.

[hippiechick]

154. Is that a hint ?

:eyes: Or in the great Freeper 'I don't need no facts' mindset, is that the only counter-argument you have to offer ?

[Pepperbelly]

178. It seems to be a fact-based observation as opposed ...

to buying all the right wing bullshit about the Clintons. Doesn't it give you pause to be talking the same stuff as those guys? Do you think they all suddenly grew brighter overnight?

[Pepperbelly]

12. Bullshit ...

and I don't even need to argue this with you. Absolutely evil, nasty thing to say and I personally sick of the shit-smearing at the forum. You are entitled to say what you want and I am equally empowered to call bullshit when that is what I see.

[Walt Starr]

14. When you lay down with dogs, you get up with fleas. n/t

[Pepperbelly]

21. I'll take Bill's back over yours.

I know his judgement. I have seen NO ONE posting their hyperbolic bullshit whose judgement is 1% of Clinton's. The ones with with vermin on their bods are the Clinton haters. They sound remarkably like some OTHER Clinton haters I know of.

[DoYouEverWonder]

25. By their deeds and their words you shall no them

and I've seen this one before.

[Walt Starr]

28. Say what you will, Coddling the Bushes has demonstrated Clinton

is nothing more than a political animal with no regard for principle, IMO.

[leanin_green]

124. Exactly, see #120.

[Deja Q]

66. All things considered, you still get the same fleas.

[DoYouEverWonder]

94. They do make flee powder

now a days.

[DoYouEverWonder]

22. Then start a thread about Clinton

and all the things you don't like about him please. This is a positive thread.

PBWY
DYEW

[Walt Starr]

26. I;ll post where I choose. n/t

[DoYouEverWonder]

33. Of course

it's your right.

I guess every thread needs a few rain clouds.

PBWY
DYEW

[Walt Starr]

40. If you cana;t stand the heat of criticism, I suggest you not post

Thick skin is a a requirement.

[DoYouEverWonder]

46. I've been in plenty of battles on this forum

Especially over the last week. If you wish to post criticism fine I will just stop responding on this thread.

If you wish to take it to another thread then I will be happy to meet your there.

[Walt Starr]

49. Are you calling me out? n/t

[skooooo]

87. Hey guys, does this mean "it's on?"

just asking

[libhill]

117. Oh, this is rich -

let's fight amongst each other, just what the Repukes like to see, "divide and conquer". Yeah, let's give the freeptards and repukes a big fucking hard on, that's the god damn ticket.

[leanin_green]

128. It's called healthy debate, something they know little about.

[ElectroPrincess]

52. Ok, I positively believe

The Clintons (both of them!) place their "corporate masters" above and beyond the Average Joe and Jane American ... especially when they schmooze with the Bushies.

Can we say class warfare? They are the ownership class, the mere millionaires are the investor class?

Guess what the rest of us (Middle and Working Classes) mean to people associated within the Bush and Clinton Dynasties? That's right! We don't mean SHIT to them. They think we're stupid and lead us around by the nose through the whorish national media.

Newsflash: The American People are not NEAR as stupid as these corporate monsters believe us to be. The unceasing uproar over the incompetence of the Federal Government is DRIVING THE MEDIA STORIES. We will have our voices heard.

Yes, the Clintons have sold out. Where are the VOICES of our other National Democratic Leaders? Could they be part of the Military-Industrial Complex and/or investor class also? :P

[DoYouEverWonder]

56. Do they live like they sold out?

"By their deeds you shall know them".

They haven't made huge profits from being politicans, not like the Repugs do. I think they've been laying low and playing the game so they would have a place at the table when the time came and they knew this was coming.

If they had been the opposition party since Bush took power in 2000. Clinton wouldn't be anywhere near that stage this morning. He would still be a security risk.

[ElectroPrincess]

72. IMO you are as DELUDED about the Clintons as the RWs are about Bush

No way in hell would I trust either one of them. Sure the 90s were great but that was also a stroke of luck involved.

Make no mistake, the Clintons LIVE LARGE and they are not interested in helping the plight of the Average American.

What part of pro-NAFTA do you not understand? The Clintons are *almost* as corrupt as the Bushes.

This is A GAME to the wealthy - wake up to the reality that they really don't give a shit because their opulence will always be there for them to wallow in and plot more greedy power grabs.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

78. don't forget about the 'longest sustained bombing exercise since Vietnam'

That would be Clinton bombing the 'no fly zone' in Iraq.

and the stuff coming out about Iran-Contra, and how he was involved as Gov. I used to believe in them, but after learning more... nah.

[DoYouEverWonder]

81. Do you have a better solution?

We need leaders right now and this is not going to be about just the Clintons. This is about all the other members of the Dem leadership taking control again.

This is about Gore who by rights, should be the President right now. It is about Kerry, Clark, Edwards, Conyers, Waters, Boxer and all the other good Dems stepping up to the plate.

I think we are about to be surprised. I think some very smart people have been waiting for the right moment because they knew this was coming.

[ElectroPrincess]

83. No, but *any* solution sure as shit wouldn't involve "The Clintons" /eom

[DoYouEverWonder]

88. Then you've got nothing?

I'll go with the Clinton's in that case. Heck I'd even go with Nixon at this point. At least he had a brain.

[ronnykmarshall]

155. Oh thank you for pointing that out me!

I'm so happy to know that I'm a mindless nut job like the wingnuts.

Oh happy, happy, joy, joy!!!

[DoYouEverWonder]

157. Can we discuss this

without using put downs?

Thanks.

[anitar1]

183. ElectroPrincess, Thank You .n/t

[Autonomy]

85. Hey, DoYouEverWonder, you're right about Bill

He's doing a great job as an ex-president. That's a job with a lot of authority and no power, and he has handled himself with the wisdom of a spiritual guru. Don't get suckered into arguments by the puritans on either side. Though I am being a hypocrite saying that; I argue with them about Clinton all the time myself. :D

[DoYouEverWonder]

89. I have too

I did a scathing thread about Kerry awhile back.

[DoYouEverWonder]

58. PS:

I don't have an problems with rational debate, I just have a problem with people who want to distract.

[ElectroPrincess]

74. I think you distract - all present evidence - Bill Clinton sold out n/t

[DoYouEverWonder]

82. Yes that is exactly what the evidence says

I thought so too at least until this morning.

Like I said, maybe I'm crazy? Actually, scratch that. I am definitely crazy.

[Pepperbelly]

91. bull fucking shit!

I am so sick of the childish bullshit. Bill will not EVER act like a spoiled child, a thug, or an insult comic. If that is what you want from your leaders, go find Triumph.

[DoYouEverWonder]

115. I stated at the beginning of this thread

that I was in the crazy stage.

Yesterday I couldn't post without typing curse words. Today, I'm seeing a light at the end of the tunnel. Hang on, it's really there.

If I'm wrong, I give you permission to shot me and put me out of my misery, because I really will go off the deep end.

[SaveElmer]

68. When you don;t know what you are talking about...you shouldn't post..nt

[ElectroPrincess]

76. I could provide the same advice to you - hello? Gee, stop :-)

[SaveElmer]

79. Sorry...but Walt is excellent at posting pithy one line sayings...

Without any backup whatsoever...just fighting fire with fire. Fact is there is nobody I would rather have leading these efforts than President Clinton, and to criticize him because of the method he chooses to use to do that is petty in my opinion!!!

[ElectroPrincess]

86. Again, what part of Pro-NAFTA and Pro-Corporate welfare ...

do you not understand about Clinton? Especially since he's schmoozing withe "poppy" I have ZERO respect for Bill, i.e., the same goes for Hillary. :puke:

[Pepperbelly]

95. fine ...

go get Nader or someone.

[ronnykmarshall]

140. Yeah, where is Ralph?

You'd think St. Nader would be riding up on his high horse about right now.

[SaveElmer]

169. I tell you what Princess...

You tell me who you believe was the greatest President ever, and I will be able to rip him to shreds based on actions he has taken and policies he has followed while President.

A President is judged by the totality of his work, not one or two things you happen to disagree with...

So please let me know who you believe is the greatest President ever, and I bet I can convince you he was the scum of the earth

[Walt Starr]

110. Since I have more than twenty five thousand posts on DU, ...

I'll take that as a compliment that I know what I'm talking about.

[SaveElmer]

170. From what I see it is talk much...say little!

[ronnykmarshall]

174. Oh come on Walt .....

So you have over 25,000 post .... big fucking deal.

I have a lot of respect for you. You're a smart person.

But to cop out with the "I've more post than you" bullshit is childish.

Shit.

I've got over 14,000 post and most of my shit is some funny ass shit.

So fucking what?

That's a fucking cop out.

[qanda]

75. Screw access!!!! What about the people????

You are absolutely right Walt, Clinton has sold his soul to be on the stage and sold the people down the river to drown.

[DoYouEverWonder]

84. Just wait

this ain't over till the fat lady sings.

We will see a lot of people's true colors in the coming weeks. I've already seen it here.

[Pepperbelly]

98. Yep. Me, too.

I have never seen such hating on BC, even at Free Republic.

[GodHelpUsAll2]

141. Oh please

wait until the fat lady sings? That is funny. I seem to recall hearing the same thing about Kerry and Edwards after the non-election. Shhhhhhh everybody, he's working under the radar. Is he done yet? Jesus, Clinton has been waiting on a disaster like this to make his move? Are you kidding me? Are people so desperate they can see a plan to take back the country from a tragic natural disaster. God help us.

[John Q. Citizen]

105. Clinton was the greatest Republican president this country

has ever seen since Lincoln

[DoYouEverWonder]

113. That wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing

He certainly knows how to handle money better then most DEMS.

[ronnykmarshall]

143. I just love the Clinton bashing in here.

Ya know what's ironic? MY parents were republicans and Bill Clinton was why they are now proud Democrats.

Clinton brough a lot of open minded republicans like my parents that believed in rights for gays, protecting Roe in the party.

I'll be damned if I'll bash him.

Go right ahead. There are MANY democrats that will dissagree with the attacks here.

[SaveElmer]

171. Most do...

It just happens the loudest post on these Clinton bashing threads...

[Pepperbelly]

149. Fucking crap again ...

if you were HATED by the gops even 1% of how badly Bill is hated and maybe you'd have a leg to stand on.

That should tell you something. Do I need to detail it or can you see the writing on the wall?

[DoYouEverWonder]

153. The GOP who hate Clinton

aren't real Republicans either.

Just like the Fundies aren't real christians.

[anitar1]

184. John Q , Thanks so much. I do not understand all the

worshiping of a person. Do people have to have an icon to worship? Can't we look at a man and see their foibles? I feel we are rather stupid and childish when we lack the ability to look at a politician clearly.

[Lena inRI]

8. Watch for Wes Clark. . .

he knows exactly what to do. . .along with DeWitt who has been hired by Governor Blanco to clean up the mess. . .wait and watch!

Carpe Diem!

:kick:

[DoYouEverWonder]

15. I hadn't even gotten that far yet

I don't want to get too hopeful.

Okay reality check. This is just a fantasy. Reality check.

[MadeinOhio]

24. Clinton isn't true DLC. He isn't with them one hundred percent of the way.

Think about it: Would Clinton WANT to get rid of the poor and all the poverty people in the USA and abroad so that the rich could go live a perfect life?

Would he WANT them all completely gone, and then build huge industries everywhere worldwide making an empire?

More likely Clinton is AGAINST Big Oil.....And wants to convert to Gore's original plan of alternative energy, but has been playing the Oil game because he wants to change it or sabatoge it.

[Clark2008]

38. Is Clark still in Italy?

He had some sort of planned foreign policy trip - but I think it was one of those conferences that shouldn't take long.

[GodHelpUsAll2]

144. Jame Witt

The Louisian Governor has hired no one named DeWitt. She did however hire James Witt, the former head of FEMA under Clinton.

[mwb970]

191. I was just thinking about Gen. Clark yesterday.

Why don't they put him in charge? Oh, that's right, he's not a total screwup. Never mind.

[DoYouEverWonder]

198. General Honore

who commands the National Guard took over on Friday. Looks like he knows what he doing. But I would love for Clark to come out of retirement? Rummie would take a shit.

[MadeinOhio]

10. I think Clinton signed the pact with them all along to discover the plans.

He must know Cheney has a plan for Halliburton to build the largest thermo-petroleum plant in the country over New Orleans, and they want to get everyone possible out of the way.

Whether they are slave workers or not is inconsequential. Halliburton will expand to include the entire East Coast, smiting anyone who stands in the way.

A prosperous new era for the rich will begin, and then they can finally buy out the entire East Continent of Europe and build there!

Oh wait, are the poor included in their mass domination plan?

Nah, they just get in the way. Slow progress down. So mass genocide. :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr:

They want everyone who's taking money away from their plans, everyone.

[anitar1]

186. Halliburton to rebuild NO, I read on DU.

[skooooo]

11. Billy playing "country dumb?"

[BlueJac]

13. Bill tipped his hand a little today....

Leaving the door open for all hell to break lose on GW in the very near future!

[KyndCulture]

16. whatcha mean?

[BlueJac]

73. That we will be after GW when the smoke clears...

said the levees were setup with a funding plan when he was president. I wonder what that went. Like all things with Bush, nothing is for the good of many, but just for the few rich fucks.

[DoYouEverWonder]

18. Do you think he would have ever been anywhere near that stage

With Bush and Dimson, if he hadn't played up to them? I think he did it on purpose, in order to be here today in that role. He knows exactly what he's doing.

[AverageJoe]

23. What happened?

Lord God, I hope that this is all correct. Time, I guess, will tell.

[Name removed]

61. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MadeinOhio]

71. Clinton is a have more....But it remains to be seen if he is like them.nt

[ronnykmarshall]

161. You owe me a new monitor!

Clinton (or Clinton-ti since we're taking about La Hillary too) and their "fundamentalism Christian and filthy rich BASE voters"?

HOLY SHIT!!

That is proof that their IS Left Wing Koolaide!!!

[Prodemsouth]

41. And you say that based on what? Please explain what you

mean by tipped his hand. What did he do to make you think that. This is a big board everyone does not see all articles or news items.

[MadeinOhio]

45. Clinton spoke about the levees and indicated how he helped fund them all.

And it was the Bush admin who cut and gutted that funding, and that unlike them he did not declare a war for oil. He simply "negotiated" a deal for oil.

OIL is the heart of all the problems and Clinton is sleazy sometimes, but he is not like the imperialist Bush empire.

[FlaGranny]

19. You know, it wouldn't surprise me a bit

if Clinton watched the Katrina horrors and got upset like the rest of us, called Poppy and said "what the hell is going on?", Poppy called Nero and got things rolling. These Bushes are not very swift - as evidenced by Poppy's slow reaction to Hurricane Andrew. Richard Nixon supposedly had the military into the area after Hurricane Camille with 48 hours. The contrast is startling. Richard Nixon was NOT the worst president we ever had. He had a brain and sometimes could come up with appropriate responses - something the present administration cannot seem to accomplish EVER.

[Prodemsouth]

47. I would take Nixon in a heartbeat if the choice was him or Bush.

He could complete Bush's term as far as I am concerned.

[unrepuke]

55. Here, Here! Even dead he would do a better job.

[ronnykmarshall]

162. No shit.

Dead Dick would do better than brain dead George.

I'd take a half of "let me make this perfectly clear" over 10 "it's hard work".

[Dunvegan]

20. I wonder about Bill, too...

I know Clinton was smoothly mondo snarky regarding Bush in his speech at the Dem Convention.

Bill is a Rhodes Scholar...he might be playing along for a long-term reason. Clinton still knows what the Bush supporters did to him regarding Whitewater, the non-existant "Clinton Hit-List", and the "oh-my-heck" (as the Governator calls them when he is in the mood for hired help) "plow-chop."

Clinton still has some garbage to bury and his legacy to top off, I think.

Maybe Bubba will surprise us all and go "off teleprompter" like Kanye West did...love to see George the First staring at Bill with that same look Mike Myers had. :)

[Flying Dream Blues]

146. I have also wondered if Bill had another motive re:

getting chummy with Poppy and Bar. :puke: No question, Big Dog can think circles around 41 and the dimson. It will be interesting to see what happens. I'm hoping that my faith in BC is rewarded.

No doubt, it's a dirty business, and sometimes even the good guys have to get dirty to survive to fight another day. I hope that's what's happening here.

[understandinglife]

27. No persons on this planet have more reasons to despise BushCo ...

... than Clinton, Gore and Kerry.

They are smart individuals with way better than average retention capabilities.

Just a matter of time ...


Peace.

[DoYouEverWonder]

30. Plus, they have a lot of experienced and competent people

who know how to run a government.

Peace and prosperity for 8 years wasn't so bad after all I suppose?

[MadeinOhio]

42. I don't think the Clintons are really imperialists. I think they believe.

In a balance of it all, and have an opposing view of the Bushes and empire.

I don't think that makes them anti-war or anything though, but they do actually care about the poor instead of just the super rich. So that is the difference with Clinton...

And I believe Clinton would really have gotten behind Gore's alternative energy plan and he will now instead of hinging on Cheney's false energy plan.

[leanin_green]

132. Not imperialists, political opportunists.

[MadeinOhio]

135. I don't like opportunists either like Clinton...better than imperialists.

[Montauk6]

156. Well, you left out McCain, but THAT'S a lost cause!

[mourningdove92]

29. I'd back the Big Dawg up against Bushco and Rove

any day.

I love Bill Clinton and have never lost faith in him.

[ElectroPrincess]

80. The Big Dawg is now a part of "big money" - he is NOT one of us /eom

[Pepperbelly]

99. one of who?

Are you guys now excluding Clinton supporters from the Democratic party?

[ronnykmarshall]

165. Pepper, Pepper, Pepper ...

you must know by now that "we" are the problem.

You must realize that "we" are finally being uncovered as the true GOP plants that we are.

I'M REALLY NOT GAY!!!

I've been playing this game for years. Now that our great leader Bill Clinton .... who really is a clone from the might nazi womb of Bar "Bug-eyes, Big Bush" Bush has shown us the way .... we can know unmask ourselves.

"We" have no place in the democratic party ... as the previous poster has pointed out.

DAMN this feels good! I can know go out hop in m' truck and beat the shit outta a buncha fags!

Woooo Hoooooo!! NASCAR!!! Toby Keith!!!!!


:sarcasm:

[Pepperbelly]

172. LOL

best laugh I've had in days.

[SammyWinstonJack]

31. Sure looks that way. I have a little more faith today. nt

[Dunvegan]

32. Yes...I still put my money on the smart people...

...those like Clinton and Kerry that are sometimes ensnarled in politics but (I believe) still have compassion, heart, and righteous outrage that can still be reached on behalf of America.

And Clinton has nothing to lose and everything to gain to become Statesman-at-Large right about now.

[DoYouEverWonder]

34. I think Katrina has helped a lot of us

jump the river.

Nobody thought it was the black people that were going to get raptured.

[Ninga]

51. Ego trumps intelligence each and every time. His ego needs validation

and what could be more validation than to be standing with the current and former Prez's before the whole world and his detractors.

We all have hissy fits when Bush flits around posing for photo ops, well guess what folks, Clinton also knows a picture takes 1000 words.

It ain't about intelligence, its about ego.

[rucky]

35. The levees needed repair under Clinton, too. n/t

[DoYouEverWonder]

39. Isn't it Congress that is responsible

for funding projects?

Besides the Repugs kept Clinton so tied up with legal crap it was amazing he got anything done. I'm sure if Gore was in office, the levees would have been funded more adequately. Instead we're still blowing a billion a week in Iraq.

[rucky]

53. I just meant that the problem has existed for some time now.

and all of our leaders are guilty of neglect. when the first time I hear the problem - known for years - be discussed is after the devastation.

I don't even think anything was proposed to congress. Many Dems had the power to do that.

[DoYouEverWonder]

77. I've been in business for almost 15 years

and one thing you find out in running such an operation is that you can't do everything at once and sometimes just taking care of the stuff you have no choice about is difficult enough.

For example my building needs a new roof and a paint job. The roof is more crucile but is going to cost a huge amount of money. The paint can wait. So what do you do in the meantime is you patch the roof and hope it doesn't rain. Running a country is sort of like that but on steroids.

Now back to the point, if Gore didn't have the election stolen from him, he would be President right now and the levees probably would have been taken care of.

[Swamp Rat]

36. Thank you... I really need hope right now.

:cry:

[I Have A Dream]

54. Hugs to you, Swamp Rat.

:hug::hug::hug:

[RevCheesehead]

107. Hey, Swamp Rat - WE LOVE YOU!

There IS hope...and there IS love. :hug:

[DoYouEverWonder]

114. Hang in there buddy

We'll get through this. :hug:

[ronnykmarshall]

166. SWAMPY!!!!

:hug:

[Atlas Mugged]

37. T'ain't fittin'

To quote Hattie McDaniel.

[UpInArms]

44. I hope you are right.

The US is full of despair and we need (and I mean need) something to be hopeful about.

[katinmn]

48. Well, if he isn't planning a coup on this gov't, I'm not interested

I wish he'd just say "You screwed up my country, the whole world knows it, now sit down, shut up, and let me clean this shit up."

That's my fantasy.

[DoYouEverWonder]

50. The Governor of LA already hired Clinton's

former head of FEMA to run things in Louisiana.

Gore went and got a plane himself and went down to LA and got people out.

It's not so much a coup that is going to happen, just that a lot of people are going to get their old jobs back. Especially considering that Gore would probably still be president if we didn't have a coup in 2000.

[katinmn]

57. Why not a coup? The Repugs have destroyed this country!

It is time to start thinking large, people.

If we always settle for crumbs, that's what we will get - moldy crumbs.

We need a BIG vision here and we need to be ready to embrace significant, mind-bending change.

In the meantime, Cheney is getting ready to implement the next phase of the neocon plan....

[DoYouEverWonder]

60. Why do you need to have a coup

to take back what is rightfully yours?

It's more like reclaiming the throne if we still lived in Medieval times, which with Bush we basically are.

[katinmn]

65. As long as we take back the WH, I don't care what we call it!

:toast:

[Mr_Jefferson_24]

123. We definitely need...

...to do something. Displacing a well entrenched, illegitimate, fascist regime that controls the ballot box will not be done working within the system. At some point we must come to grips with this hard fact.

[Qibing Zero]

158. Exactly.

But it's not going to happen, heh.

[DoYouEverWonder]

160. Sounds like this guy Gen Honore down in LA

is doing just that.

Turns out his son is in Iraq serving in the LA National Guard. No wonder he's pissed.

[Algorem]

59. blah.nah.

[Tatiana]

62. I'm surprised more people don't recognize Clinton's passive-aggressive

strategy.

How many times has he smiled at Republicans, attended their dinners, shook hands with them, and then gone in for the kill? He did this as governor of the super-red state of Arkansas. He did this numerous times as President to get part of his legislative agenda passed through Congress.

They don't call him "Slick Willie" for nothin.'

I may not appreciate his methods, but I'd be stupid not to expect him to let loose with a few bombs aimed at the administration in the future.

[skooooo]

93. Here's an example of the effects of Clinton's buddying up to the Bushes

My die-hard, RIchard Nixon-loving relative who is blindly republican recently expressed to me an appreciate for Clinton. It seems the press was asking some questions of Bush (father, I think) and Clinton stepped in telling Bush not to answer the question for some reason.

My relative saw it as Clinton trying to protect Bush, and that helped her develop a bit of affinity for Clinton.

So, I guess it comes down to whether you think Clinton has OUR interests or HIS interests at heart. I think he has OURS, and he is working for the greater good. He's gotten a tremendous amount of sympathy from his surgery last year, and has proven himself to be non-antagonising to many on the right. I think in the end, he's going to make us proud.

If he's building clout with people like my relative...Im' just saying.

[msgadget]

63. dupe

[msgadget]

64. It's his

triangulation thing in action. It's kinda hard to watch...

[Deja Q]

67. Until something proves that theory to be correct,

I won't buy into it.

Politics is a game played by and for the self-serving.

[SmokingJacket]

69. I think it's always been about maintaining a position of influence.

And that's not necessarily a bad thing, as we can see now.

The Bushies used him for his popularity, and he used them to stay in the public eye. It looks gross, it sounds gross, but... now people are paying attention to Clinton.

Clinton is very smart, and he can play the game. And often (not always), he's played the game to the advantage of the greater good...

[ultraist]

70. I would have much preferred to see Clinton stand with local La Dems

And advocate for them, than to see him stand with Bush I and praise the pResident.

Their schmoozing, laughter, and back slapping was highly inappropriate during a time when our country should be grieving, for thousands of dead and suffering Americans. Disgusting.

[DoYouEverWonder]

92. It's part of the game

He's got to solidify his position first.

Why do you think he has a bad heart and they don't? Because he still has a heart.

[Iris]

96. I don't think I'll get over Bush playing golf on Tuesday for as long as I

live.

The only solace I get from the past 5 years and the next 8 is how this will all go down in history. This is Bush's "Let them eat cake" moment.

[Dunvegan]

90. Then again...Bill's been busy with that little cardiac surgery...

...thing, also.

[ScreamingMeemie]

97. I wish I could say YES!! You're right! But he's just a politician....

not a saviour. Never was. Damned fine president, but no hero. :hi:

[DoYouEverWonder]

100. This isn't about Clinton

Even though he is the one opening the door.

It's about all of us.

[ScreamingMeemie]

101. I am all for all of us. I am all for disregarding what the politcos are

doing right now in the interest of saving lives. I cannot read more into it than what it is at face value at this point. On principal, I could not walk arm in arm with those who helped try to bring me down. I'll eat this post if I am wrong. :(

[faithnotgreed]

118. im with you mrs g -

although im not overly fond of his policies but thats not the point youre trying to make i know

i agree
he is just a politician - admittedly complicated
and in honor of the offer in your other post i will not only eat this post i will consume this entire thread if im wrong

wouldnt that be wonderful

ha

[DoYouEverWonder]

121. Okay, I'm bookmarking this thread

and if I'm wrong I'll eat this whole friggin' site.

Good thing data doesn't take up much room, I really don't need the calories.

[faithnotgreed]

137. ha - would that we had to

i would actually LOVE it

i will talk it over with mrs g and though i cant speak for her i can say i will do this gladly in front of anyone

[DoYouEverWonder]

138. I'll even let you

put chocolate syrup on yours. That way it won't taste so bad. ;-)

[faithnotgreed]

150. oh ok - now i get your meaning

so yes by all means i would take chocolate syrup
i would love to have to eat the thread

dont think it will happen but i would love it

[FreedomAngel82]

102. It is interesting anyways

:shrug:

[XanaDUer]

104. It's much easier to stick a knife in someone's back

when you have their backs.

[Imagevision]

106. GET REAL - "HOPE HAS NO CHOICE BUT TO BE ON THE WAY"

EVERYDAY MORE NEGATIVE RESPONSE IS ATTACKING THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION, AND MORE OF IT IS FINALLY COMING FROM THE GOP!

[dunn]

108. I think Bush Sr may be trying to get some good PR out of it...

Maybe because he will be indicted somehow in the CIA leak case?

[ellenfl]

109. i hope you're right . . . but i doubt it. eom

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

111. I strongly object to your characterization of Clinton as a Bush suck up

It is the Bushes who have curried Clinton's favor in hopes that his charisma and humanity will rub off on their ugly, uncaring, inhuman public image.

He didn't plot to regain the stage. Since leaving the Presidency he has largely avoided the stage for reasons both personal and political. But wherever Bill Clinton goes, the stage comes to him.

[HR_Pufnstuf]

116. There is only one Party.

The Corporate Party.

The Bush-Clinton dynasty must end.

[DoYouEverWonder]

119. And the Corporations are finding out

that Bush ain't good for business.

[Cleita]

125. Methinks thou dost protest too much.

Right now Clinton isn't looking like much of a hero to me, but I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt until something develops that exonerates him.

[mwb970]

126. Clinton mentioned a "Katrina Commission" for later.

Has anyone else said these words? Not that I've heard.

[WilliamPitt]

129. "They also knew that a major disaster of some sort was in the works"

Huh? Your theory is that he hung around with them waiting for a killer hurricane?

This place gets so goddam weird sometimes.

[DoYouEverWonder]

131. Everyone knew BushCo wanted another disaster or attack

The hurricanes models for this season, which by the way are very good now a days, are very scary to say the least. That is why the Salvation Army stockpiled food ahead of time. They looked at the forecasts and knew it would be a bad year.

It was inevitable that NO was due for a big one soon.

If it wasn't this who knows? Maybe BushCO would have done a dirty bomb or a bioattack. They still might try but Bush's god delivered in the nick of time.

Either way natural disaster or Black Ops run terrorist attacks, BushCo responds the same way. 9-11 was a FLOP and Katrina was a FLOP. Failure to Lead On Purpose. It's their MO.

[Tom Joad]

130. Clinton killed as many in Iraq as Bush...why shouldn't they be buds

Sanctions in Iraq created as much human misery as Bush negligence in NO. Why shouldn't they stick together??

[DoYouEverWonder]

133. Clinton certainly

has committed his own set of sins. But so did Carter. So has every President. They are as flawed as the rest of us, you have to be to even want to be President.

At this point, we don't have much for options though. And like I said this isn't just about Clinton, he's just in a place where he can do stuff that we can't.

[alcibiades_mystery]

134. He was aggrandizing himself, as he always does

Clinton is an asshole, and the sooner Democrats realize that, the sooner they can start supporting a real leader.

[Pepperbelly]

142. LOL

And we should believe you WHY?

[alcibiades_mystery]

181. Just my opinion

Take it or leave it.

Clinton is, was, and continues to be a self-serving schmuck. I couldn't care less whether you "believed" me.

[Pepperbelly]

188. Do you realize that when ...

you ascribe motivations to people based on "your opinion," you are in fact telegraphing information about yourself more than the person about whom you have that opinion. That notion comes from inside of you and not from externals.

[alcibiades_mystery]

192. Ay yay yay

Opinions can be based on observation, to be sure. Unless we're getting into some 18th century philosophical discussion about subject and object? I didn't realize we'd be invoking Kant to explain Clinton's abusive behavior. Gimme a break. :eyes:

[DoYouEverWonder]

195. We've hear your opinion

but can you leave out the personal put-downs?

We don't need school yards taunts right now. We need to work on fixing the mess your heroes have left this place in.

[alcibiades_mystery]

204. My heroes? How fucking dare you?

You ask me to leave out the "schoolyard taunts" (of which there were none) then you imply - in a cowardly fashion, since you cannot directly state it without breaking the rules of this board - that Bush and his pack of criminal minions are MY heroes?!? Are you kidding me? What hypocritical bullshit.

I never liked Bill Clinton. But that doesn't mean I like Bush. I'd prefer Clinton to Bush any day of the week, in fact, and I always voted accordingly for pragmatic reasons. But that doesn't mean I have to swallow Clinton's bullshit pandering and self-serving theatrics. You operate by the most simplistic and self-defeating dialectics. If I'm not with Clinton, then I must admire Bush. Great reasoning there. I shouldn't have to state it, since only the most half-witted Clinton fanatics would buy your absurd logic, but I will, for the record: I despise Bush and neo-conservatism in general. Hell, I despise conservatism, and I'm not even that hot on "free market ideology." Of course, I won't ask you to retract your implication, since you'll probably pull one of those "You read into it what you would," and I'd have to ask you to clarify what you mean by "your heroes" which you'll dodge and shift in the typical cowardly fashion ("Oh, I meant Nader," as if I suddenly love Nader, etc.) Either way, your post is reminiscent of the most debased street corner commisar, Stalinism and party-line hackery writ large.

[DoYouEverWonder]

136. Clinton on CNN Now

Talking about what we need to do. The more he does this the better. He has lots of good ideas and using the M$M to get them out, will help get them implemented. This is what leadership looks like. In the meantime, poppy Bush is probably still preying with that family back in the shelter, that he used for his photo op.

[ronnykmarshall]

139. Sea Hag called the big dog "son"?

When?

That's very funny. After all this shit she's said about him and Hillary, now she calls him "son"?

[DoYouEverWonder]

145. I think she said something

like she wished he was her son. No kidding. With the brats she ended up with, I'd be wishing for replacements too.

[ronnykmarshall]

163. GET OUT!!

That's a riot. Sometimes I think ol' Bug-eyes Babs looks at her 'cooch' and thinks ..... "I should have shut you down years ago"!!

[A Brand New World]

147. I have yet to figure out this whole Clinton/Bush team-up. I'm not sure who

is using who yet. I tend to think the Bushies are marginalizing Clinton but I really thought Clinton was too smart for that.Anyway, all I know, is it makes me puke to see Clinton stoop to the BFEE level.

[lebkuchen]

159. Clinton feels comfortable w/Bush the First because he beat him in election

and won two terms, while Bush I only had one. Clinton's ego is intact in that regard.

Bush I knows his son is a total screwup, and confides in Clinton that Junior is mucking up the country, that the two of them must band together to stop America's hemorraging for the good of the nation.

That's how I see it.

[Dogmudgeon]

164. Clinton personally killing Iraqis

Sorry, that theory just doesn't hold water, and I wonder why so many Leftists hold so tightly to it.

The embargo against Iraq was a UN action that was begun right after Desert Storm in 1991. When Clinton became president, they basically dumped it all in his lap, including the Republicans, who carped that Clinton was going too easy on Saddam.

Clinton was also the one who opened the embargo enough to get humanitarian aid through, over the insistence of the Right who wanted Iraq to starve -- then accused Clinton of doing the very same thing, at the same time as accusing him of being too lenient!

My own criticism of Clinton is that he should have told the UN to figure out what to do and do it themselves, and not make the USA responsible for enforcing their policies.

I'm amazed that the hard Left -- notable for extensive scholarship and Deep Insights -- has swallowed this Right-wing lie hook, line, and sinker.

--p!

[Pepperbelly]

167. I am growing as disdainful of the left as the right.

Both sides will go to virtually any length to make a cherished point. The lefties here are about to get their way because it is absolutely absurd to even try here with some many hysterical people all shouting chicken-little bullshit at every turn and turning on politicians who actually manage to get elected.

This site is growing farther and farther away from the Democratic Party as the hysterical, hyperbolic wing of the party chases everyone else away.

[katinmn]

175. Getting elected as a Democrat isn't enough.

No, they must act, walk and talk like one.

Right now we have two major parties: Republican and Republican-light.

Let's see what DC's priority is tomorrow: estate taxes and Supreme Court nominees, or aiding victims of a Bush-made disaster? (And yes, Bush is responsible for the loss of life. He cut the funding everyone knew was necessary so he could use the money for terrorizing innocent people in Iraq, and his man in charge sabotaged rescue efforts.)

If anyone wants to use the argument that Republicans are in the majority and all the Dems can do is wring their hands and wait patiently for 06, they're wrong.

They can walk out and they should. Otherwise they will continue to be complicit as they have been regarding the illegal war based on known lies, on helping establish a feudal system through the new bankruptcy law, allowing corporations (Enron, United and soon-to be announced NWA for examples) to reneg on pensions, and encouraging the establishment of a state church.

The Democratic Party will not survive if the leaders of said party insist on being centrist and complicit in Bush's elitist plans. And that would be a shame because there are many of us who truly care about the rest of us and the least of us and we are trying to REVIVE the party, not kill it!

You cannot say I am not a good Democrat because I don't support every DINO in Congress. Well, you can say it but you'd be wrong.

[Pepperbelly]

180. What I am saying is that YOU

don't get to toss people out of the party. Personally, I am getting to the point that I really don't give a drizzly shit about the lefties being pissed off. I truly do not. They hero worship someone one day, demonize them the next.

Who really gives a shit what people that fickle think? If you wait a day or two, it will all change anyway.

[DoYouEverWonder]

168. Just in from KOS - The Democratic Plan for the Disaster

Proposals that Senate Democrats believe deserve immediate Senate action this week:

Ensuring health care for all displaced victims

* Immediate access to Medicaid for displaced victims.
* No need to prove residency or assets
* No copayments
* No penalties for failing to sign up for Medicare Part B in time. . . .

Getting victims housing

* Emergency housing vouchers for displaced victims
* Expedited application procedures with no red tape.
* No tenant contributions until they find work.
* Tax incentives for private families to take in victims.
* Identify federal facilities that can house victims.
* Relief for homeowners facing threat of foreclosure. . . .

Getting victims to family members and friends

Many of Katrina's victims have little or no access to transportation. Although FEMA has legal authority to address this, the agency seems overwhelmed and has proven unable on its own to meet the compelling needs of countless numbers of stranded victims. We therefore need to make this a White House priority and direct the President to lead a broad effort to quickly ensure that displaced victims can get to family, friends and others who can provide them with room and board.

Getting students into school

Many of Katrina's victims are children who need to enroll in a new school. To encourage schools to accept these victims, and alleviate some of the resulting burdens, we should provide funding to school districts that accept displaced children. This funding could be used to hire additional teachers, teachers' aides, or counselors, or to provide temporary expansions of classrooms. A similar program should be provided for institutions of higher education that admit displaced students.

Bringing victims' families together and placing them with other families

The government should establish a toll free "800" number and web site through which victims could access a national victim database and information about available assistance. Displaced individuals could register and provide contact information, so that separated family members and friends could find each other. The database also would allow volunteers to sign up if they are willing to provide free shelter to victims.

Getting victims cash to meet other basic needs

To ensure that victims can get cash for their basic needs, we should strengthen and expand the Disaster Unemployment Insurance Program and automatically extend any expiring UI benefits that victims are receiving. We also should give the President authority to increase the $26,200 statutory cap on cash assistance through the Individuals and Households Program, and should waive the 25 percent matching requirement for States in the Gulf region. In addition, victims should be allowed to withdraw funds from individual retirement accounts (IRA's) penalty-free, with extra contributions permitted later.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4648094


Looking good.

[katinmn]

173. I think these are good proposals, but how do they compare with

compensation given 9/11 victims and survivors?

A precedent has already been set. Let's see the Repugs spin on that one!

There is a similarity in circumstances because the federal government -- again! -- failed to act to protect American citizens from known and predicted dangers.

[DoYouEverWonder]

179. Bush doesn't even want to bother to ID the remains

Compensation? For black folks? You must be kidding. Bush just wants to take their land. That's why he waited so long to send help, the more dead black people the better from a developer's POV.

[nookiemonster]

176. Damn, I really wanna believe this. I really do,

Can I say, that I really want to believe...

Ad nauseum...

Please, let this shit end.

[CreekDog]

182. Clinton wooed me in the 1980's when I was a Republican

Think of all the great things he said about Reagan in the late 1980's. Used to watch him on C-SPAN when he was heading the National Governors Association.

Keep reading...it's about my political conversion to your side:

As a teenager in the 1980's who idolized Ronald Reagan, thought Bush Sr. was terrific and nearly every Republican in congress...guess what.

I saw Clinton on TV and warmed to him instantly. He got my attention in 1987 talking well about Reagan's policies (the better ones at least). Later when he would run for president, I remember thinking how good he was, but this time he was lambasting Bush Sr. Of course, that was a few years later, I was in college, the economy sucked and Bush was extremely out of touch.

Clinton had me all along. But his part in getting me to consider Democrats cannot be overlooked.

Yes, it's hard to watch, but it's what Clinton does and it is not meant FOR YOU, it's meant to get other people who don't agree, to VOTE FOR THINGS YOU CARE ABOUT.

So don't flame too hard. The only two term Democrat since FDR should be allowed some leeway when it comes to devising political strategy.

[B Calm]

187. Idolized Ronald Reagan? A man that froze working people wages!

How can anybody idolize that?

[Pepperbelly]

189. The poster was talking about his/her own ...

political conversion. Did you not get that?

[CreekDog]

190. At that time I didn't know a lot about Reagan

As I learned more about him and the Republican Party, my political compass shifted.

I first saw Bill Clinton when I was 16 and he was intriguing, so was Al Gore interestingly enough. Most other Democrats didn't appeal to me.

Late in HS and early in college, watching Bush Sr. dawdle on the Exxon Valdez and veto minimum wage hikes, voter registration bills and family leave policies, my political conversion was well under way.

But Bill Clinton helped me look to the Democrats more than anyone else.

That's the point I'm making. This probably applies to lots of people like me.

[theboss]

193. Or, he could just be trying to get Hillary! elected

I like my idea better.

[DoYouEverWonder]

194. Spoken

like a true ______?

[theboss]

200. Student of history?

Intelligent person?
Life-long Democrat?

What's the blank for?

[DoYouEverWonder]

201. It depends upon

whether or not you were being sarcastic or if you meant it.

Sometimes it's hard to tell when it's just words on a screen?

[theboss]

202. I do think that a lot of both Clintons' maneuverings are for 2008

From talking tough on immigration to sucking up to the current president to voting for the war and not backing down. These are not the moves of a family content to be leading the liberal wing in the Senate.

[DoYouEverWonder]

203. That's exactly what Rove wants you to believe

Judge them by their actions instead. The people of NY love Hillary. That should tell you something.

[theboss]

205. I think she's been a surprisingly good senator

For the record, why is saying that she's running in '08 an insult?

I think she's running in '08, I think she's doing the smart thing by running to the middle, and I think she will probably end up winning the nomination in a laugher.

So, it's not an insult.

[bitchkitty]

206. Not just a river in Egypt. n/t