French Quarter is the rich, white part of the city... highest part of

[expatriot]

the city. It was spared the initial flooding and when it started "being attacked" all the cops were called off search and rescue to stop the rioting and the mob from advancing. We should not be celebrating the "white guys playing Survivor" in the French Quarter or that bar being able to stay open... Bush should definitely go down for this but the prevailing class and race bias does not stop with him. It makes me sick how class and race is everything and some DUers get fooled by it if the rich white people are eclectic "liberated" artisans in the artsy fartsy part of town.

[NoPasaran]

1. Sorry the artsy fartsy white people couldn't be exterminated

I'm sure you'd be happier then!

[expatriot]

Did I say that? I am just pointing out there are classist and racist

reasons why they had a "better time of it" than the other parts of the city.

[nonconformist]

45. Yeah, it was really racist when it was built above sea level. nt

[expatriot]

6. Actually, I guess I would be happier.... if those 1,500 cops kept rescuing

people and patrolling the rest of the city who knows how many more would have been saved? more people would have saved than people in the FQ that would have been killed. If these FQ holdouts had to go to the Superdome or Convention Center like everyone else that would have been better if more people could have been rescued. Fuck the buildings, the culture, the college kids from across the country would have to go somewhere else for Mardi Gras and the old hippy boomer entrepeneurs who own shops and such would be out sharing the burden of the rest of the city.

[nonconformist]

43. My thoughts exactly. nt

[msongs]

2. thanks for the false stereotyping :-)

some elements in the french quarter are white and rich. I bet most people living there are NOT rich and many are working at minimum wage jobs in the french quarter's various trades. your personal biases are showing.


good thing there are no artsy fartsy people in the flood zone, but then you are stereotyping those people as well.

Msongs
www.msongs.com

[expatriot]

3. no, statistics: US CENSUS: 89% White. 51% with 4 year degrees

http://www.gnocdc.org/orleans/1/48/people.html

Population: 4,150
Total Households: 2,900
Family Households: 509

Compare to rest of city: 69% black, 23% have 4 year degrees

Pop: 484,000
Households: 188K
Family Households: 118K

[Gormy Cuss]

50. Also practically devoid of children, and largely renters.

The "Family Household" statistic is broad and a couple self-defining as family are included, even if not married, so there aren't necessarily children in the mix. In a separate table it shows that
97.4% of households have no members under the age of 18 (vs. 64.7% in the parish); 75.4% of households are renters (vs. 53.5% in the city) and 37.4% of units are vacant (vs.12.5% in the parish.)

Adding this to the educational attainment and income stats, this looks like the typical urban upscale transitional neighborhood for young college grads.

The other telling statistic is the French Quarter is home to less than 1% of the population of the city --- it's a tiny sliver of the pie.

So who benefits from preserving the Quarter? My guess after reviewing the demographics is that although the current residents benefit, it's more driven by the interests of the property owners, both residential and commercial. They may be mostly rich and white, but those demographics aren't available on that page (Census doesn't collect information on absentee ownership in the decennial population survey.)

[HR_Pufnstuf]

22. Many rich lived in Lakefront area...

... and its underwater.

[expatriot]

37. and they got out. if the FQ was below sea level, they would have left too.

[Der Blaue Engel]

4. Is that the French Quarter's fault?

Would you be happier if everyone there had drowned too? I understand your frustration with the situation, but I refuse to not be glad that something is left of New Orleans.

I have a friend who has desperately been trying to get ahold of his friends who have a bar in the FQ, and who are most definitely not "rich white guys." They are struggling drag queens who make up part of the richness--of diversity--that is/was New Orleans. I hope to goddess they are safe there, and I'm glad that rich and poor in the French Quarter have not turned against each other, like some are wont to do here on DU.

If anyone has seen any information on Rusty LeRoux and Michelle Blue, please PM me.

[expatriot]

8. Is that the rest of the city's fault? more resources disproportionately

went to protecting the 4,000 residents of the French Quarter than the rest of the city.

They were higher and dryer than the rest of the city. I would have prefered the 1,500 cops would have stayed rescuing people in the more affected areas of the city and providing as mcuh relief as they could rather than protecting the precious property of the French Quarter. Why should the French Quarter be given disproprotionate resources than the rest of the city?

I say again.... 89% white. where as the rest of the city is 69% black.

[MaineDem]

10. The NOPD went back to protection duty after the military came in

The Coast Guard took over most of the SAR duties.

[expatriot]

12. But why were they taking off of it? There was obviously a bias to

"save" the FQ.


89% white.

[MaineDem]

19. The military cannot do police duty

The active duty military is not allowed to take on duties that enforce state/local laws. The National Guard and the NOPD were the only groups allowed to be a "police force." So they did that when the rest of the military took on the Search and Rescue duties.

The police weren't only guarding the French Quarter. Sheesh.

[expatriot]

25. I can find the news article.

When the city was in anarchy and being looted police were doing search and rescue and trying to provide all they could in terms of relief. But when the lines "French Quarter under attack" started appearing, the police came like the calvary to protect it. All I am saying is that the French Quarter was given more priority than poorer areas of town.

[ldf]

39. i hate to be the one to break the news to you

but the French Quarter will be the engine that pulls the rest of new orleans back.

tourists won't be coming back to see the poorer neighborhoods.

they will come back to see primarily the quarter and the garden district. the street car out st. charles avenue (through the garden district). the audobon zoo. riverwalk, canal place. all the "torusit" destination hotels. mardi gras. take away the quarter, st. charles ave, and the garden district, and you eliminate mardi gras.

since tourists are the source of all the jobs that the poorer new orleanians have, then i would guess that maybe those areas SHOULD targeted for some protection.

unfortunately tourists, mostly white, provide the need for the jobs that the locals, mostly black, work at. it may not be a fair distribution of wealth, but it is reality.

that does NOT mean that other areas are left to their own devices. but it also does NOT mean that the quarter doesn't deserve some degree of protection.

instead of painting a black versus white issue, maybe you should be concerned about all new orleans.

or, maybe you have a new plan for the city, where all the locals will miraculously be given new jobs earning at least 60 to 70k.

miracles do happen.

[leftofthedial]

5. threaded fastener you

I'll celebrate that bar staying open if I want to.

there's plenty of racism and classism to condemn in NOLA, but it's a stretch to lump the quarter into that mix

[expatriot]

15. Why is it a stretch? they already had an advantage

to the rest of the city:
they were higher above ground... they were a touristy area of town so they had many shops, restaurants, delis where they could get food... then they were given ANOTHER advantage.... police protection from the mob and anarchy when the larger part of the city, the larger portion of the population needed much more help.

[leftofthedial]

26. every hill in North America is racist

every tourist place in the world is racist

yeah. uh-huh.

[expatriot]

36. that is not what I said. read the post #31 that was not posted by me. nt

[MaineDem]

7. It's also an historic district

That aside, why are these people any less deserving of surviving?

I saw an interview with a group who had made it out of the French Quarter. They were tattoo artists, bartenders...pierced and tattoo'd adn looking rather "mad max-ish". They survived in the area and they didn't look to be rich artsy-fartsy types. Just scared kids trying to walk to reach somewhere safe.

[expatriot]

11. No... they were given MORE protection......

Historic district? Historic buildings are worth more than saving people?

They are the highest area of the city... where other areas were UNDER water and in anarchy. The cops were busy saving people and providing the basic relief that they could... then when the "mob" approached the French Quarter the cops were ordered to protect the French Quarter. Why was the FQ unfairly protected from anarchy more so than other parts of town?

http://www.gnocdc.org/orleans/1/48/people.html

[LisaL]

16. I saw that too.

One girl was finally able to call her minister father from OH, I believe.
The father would have to drive the church van all the way to NO to pick them up because they couldn't get any help evacuating.

[splat]

9. French Quarter now mostly tourist businesses; Garden District is mansions

The mansions are at the other end of St. Charles. Where Archie Manning and Trent Reznor live, and Anne Rice until recently.

[Swamp Rat]

13. YOU ARE WRONG! ... this is misinformation! My mom LIVES THERE!

I could go through a litany of corrections, but I am not feeling well and this is waste of my time. How dare you insult ANY of survivors of this holocaust.

Nevertheless, I wish the best for you. I hope you re-evaluate your statement above. Please.

[expatriot]

17. I AM NOT INSULTING ANYONE. I am just saying it is 89% white per CENSUS

and it got more police protection then the poor, black areas of town that needed it more.

[Sgent]

14. Garden District, Lakeview, Uptown

are the wealthier area's of town -- not the FQ.

Most of the white people live in Jefferson Parish, not NOLA.

[expatriot]

21. And how is the Garden Distiict faring? nt

[KamaAina]

29. And note that Lakeview really got hammered

in fact that's where the dreaded 17th. St. Canal floodwall was. :(

So much for that theory...

[expatriot]

33. But those people got out. Lakeview is 94% white. that is not my point.

if a rich white neighborhood was under sea level, everyone would be gone. If the FQ was under sea level, they would have left too.

[MadeinOhio]

18. Bush and his class racism are sick! My letter enclosed:

President Bush, you must resign now.

Your callous ineptitude in the face of a natural holocaust is inexscusable. You lied everyone into the war with Iraq, and not only that failed to help the minorities and people of New Orleans, Louisiana.

http://www.mediainfo.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1001054595

For this and the crimes of letting black and poor people die you should be incarcerated!

But rather than talk about that I and the rest of America will settle for your immediate and unconditional resignation. On top of failing the world, you have failed Americans. You have failed to follow the law of office, and your staged photo-ops with victims is unbelievable and insensitive.

RESIGN RIGHT NOW. DO NOT FORCE US TO IMPEACH YOU, OR THROW YOU IN THE HAGUE.
Do the right thing and resign. Almost everyone hates you now and your failed presidential cabinet, do the only choice.

Everyone should write in and DEMAND the resignations, and then read this!!

http://rawstory.com/news/2005/Lethal_chaos_Law_professor_describes_scene_at_New_Orleans_ho_0905.html
Talk about sick....

[alcibiades_mystery]

20. What a stupid fucking thread

n/t

[expatriot]

23. All I am saying is that the FQ should have been treated the same

as any government housing project in the city. How is that stupid?

[Behind the Aegis]

24. read this...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4645502

[expatriot]

28. That thread was the impetus for this one. Look at this....

I find the following very racist and classist:

While mold and contagion grew in the muck that engulfed most of the city, something else sprouted in this most decadent of American neighborhoods - humanity.

"Some people became animals," Vasilioas Tryphonas said Sunday morning as he sipped a hot beer in Johnny White's Sports Bar on Bourbon Street. "We became more civilized."

Does anybody stop to think why they were able to be "more civilized" while some people "became animals?"

[nashbridges]

27. Luck saved the French Quarter

Since it IS higher than most of the city. Knowing that, it logically follows that a great deal of people elsewhere in the city would end up there after the flooding began.

Cops weren't called off search and rescue until the looting and criminal activity reached such a point as to make the situation, already awful, EVEN WORSE.

It was a hard call to make, and I don't think if I was in charge I'd want to be put in that position. But second-guessing the mayor when he's in a lose-lose situation doesn't help.

[expatriot]

30. It was not luck.

It is the oldest neighborhood of New Orleans because before flood walls and such they lived on the highest area around - that is not luck.
As the city grew.... the most strategic and safest area was also the most expensive property - that is not luck.

Do you think it is luck that the wealthiest neighborhoods are on some of the highest ground?

[nashbridges]

32. I think it is luck that is is on higher ground

Much like being in DC at the moment is "lucky" because the hurricaine didn't hit here.

What, exactly, would make you happy? If everyone in the French Quarter promptly abandoned dry space and instead threw a party in five feet of water?

And just because real estate is expensive in the FQ doesn't mean that the people taking advantage of its location right now are super wealthy. Your argument makes absolutely no sense. If rioters and looters had killed 100 people on Bourbon street, you'd be screaming about the lack of police presence.

It's an awful situation - no one wins. Someone had to make the call that the situation was out of control and restoring order took priority over search and rescue. I seriously doubt that someone feels good about the decision, and I seriously doubt real estate prices were a factor in making that decision. Everything done on the ground at this point is about saving lives.

[expatriot]

34. Listen, this is my point:

I was offended by the article of the other thread that I had before....

these two paragraphs in particular

While mold and contagion grew in the muck that engulfed most of the city, something else sprouted in this most decadent of American neighborhoods - humanity.

"Some people became animals," Vasilioas Tryphonas said Sunday morning as he sipped a hot beer in Johnny White's Sports Bar on Bourbon Street. "We became more civilized."

oh let's analyze why these people in the FQ were able to be a "shining city on a hill" of humanity and while some people "became animals" they "became more civilized." let's not analyze that.

[Sapphire Blue]

31. A historical perspective...

Crisis raises questions of race
New Orleans' poor blacks were already at a disadvantage. Could more be done to help?
By MARCUS FRANKLIN and JAMIE THOMPSON
Published September 2, 2005

(excerpt)

In Hurricane Katrina's baneful aftermath, the dichotomy of New Orleans has become increasingly apparent. In image after image, the victims left to suffer appear to be mostly poor and black.

Why? Part of the answer is that two-thirds of New Orleans' population is black.

But history suggests an uglier explanation:

Black residents long ago were pushed into the swampy, low-lying lands of New Orleans, while rich white residents built on higher plots.

<snip>

To be sure, white, black, Hispanic, rich, poor, young and old suffered from Hurricane Katrina.

But it came as no surprise to disaster planners, professors and historians that New Orleans' poorest neighborhoods suffered most.

The poorest residents have long lived in the city's low-lying areas, starting in the 1830s when well-off whites built homes on higher ground near Mississippi River levees, Craig E. Colten, a geography professor at Louisiana State University, told the Philadelphia Daily News.

Since the 1890s, those lower areas have been occupied largely by African-Americans. The Lower 9th Ward, where the worst flooding occurred, is 98 percent black.

http://www.sptimes.com/2005/09/02/Worldandnation/Crisis_raises_questio.shtml

[expatriot]

35. THANK YOU

[Sapphire Blue]

38. Truth & reality... when so many refuse to see, recognize, or admit...

...how do we correct the injustices?

[misanthrope]

40. Last time I checked...

...most of the money in NOLA was living in huge mansions Uptown and out in Metairie.

I know plenty of people who have lived in the Quarter and while it ain't cheap, it's far from a wealthy enclave.

[RandomKoolzip]

41. Hey, this is stupid.

Watch what you say. I lived in the French Quarter, and I lived on the Lakefront near UNO....they were both comprable in rent. This is total BULLSHIT. Blacks, Latinos, Creoles, Asians, WHATEVER, all live in the French Quarter, and in the Garden District, AND on the Lakefront, AND in N.O. East, and in the Marigny.

And YES, I'm white, but I'm far from rich; I was working at a fucking Subway and going to UNO when I lived in the Quarter.

Class bias cuts both ways, ya know.

[expatriot]

42. I am using US Census data: FQ: 89% white, Lakefront: 94%

Do you think I am black. I am white making 7.50/hour living in a trailer. I am literally "trailer trash."

[Swamp Rat]

44. THANK YOU!!! I lived in both places, plus Uptown where I grew up...

... with POOR BLACK PEOPLE!!! UPTOWN!!!

You and I may actually know each other. PM me if you wish.

This thread is utter BULL SHIT!!!

Now I am getting PISSED!!! :mad:

Now I will openly ask the Mods to LOCK THIS THREAD!

[expatriot]

46. I am very sorry, Swamp Rat.... look....

I am sorry if you find it offensive, Swamp Rat.

I am not saying people in the FQ deserve any less protection than others.

I am very sorry.

Look at post #28. It is more my overly-bitter reaction to those 2 paragraphs in that one article

[Swamp Rat]

47. OK... let's keep our heads.

:hug: I was beginning to channel my anger at you, and that is not fair either. :hug:

My mother is an artist (art teacher who makes very little teaching in two inner-city schools) who lives there. She BARELY got out alive. I play music there on the street and in clubs... we are ALL poor but we are the soul, the lifeblood of the Quarter.

Sorry to the Mods too. Maybe I am overreacting. I need a break from all this, but DU is my lifeline to communication.

[expatriot]

49. Swamp Rat, now you are making me cry!

I am sorry I added stress to your stressful situation (which I have been following on DU) with my impulsive rash statement!


:hug: :hug:

[expatriot]

48. oh shit.. I just re-read my OP for the first time... I said this wrong

"We should not be celebrating the "white guys playing Survivor" in the French Quarter or that bar being able to stay open..."

What I meant by this is this... I think some liberals pat themselves on the back sometimes in thinking they do not reap the rewards of classist and/or racist advantage.

I am white and although I have a very modest income and even more modest lifestyle, I know I have benefitted greatly from being born white and in an upwardly mobile household (my earning "potential" because of my attained education level is higher than my current income).

I DO NOT WISH THE PEOPLE IN THE FQ ANY ILL WHATSOVER. PLEASE ACCEPT MY APOLOGY, I worded it VERY WRONG.

If I could edit it, I would. But the time period to edit has elapsed.

[The Magistrate]

51. Locking

Flame-Bait.