I gotta say one thing....I just don't understand why those school busses..

[ClusterFreak]

....weren't used to evacuate the poor. It's not something that we are talking about here, at least not as far as I've seen. The Bush/FEMA/military response to this disaster has been righteously slammed....but, what about those busses? Or city transit busses? I don't know, WAS an effort made, at the local level to evacuate the poor who had no other transportation?

Alright....I'm going to post this now....then I'm going to duck for cover. :hide:

---------------------
Follow up: thanks for the info everyone....this is something which has simply slipped past my perview...which is why I asked. :)

Additional follow up: and for those who felt compelled to answer my post with sarcasm....well, whatever floats your boat.

[cynatnite]

1. They were used...just not enough of them

Mayor Nagin issues mandatory evacuation for New Orleans

As of 9:30 a.m., Mayor Nagin has issued a mandatory evacuation for New Orleans.

The Superdome has been opened for people with special needs and as a shelter of last resort. Residents should call [phone] to reserve space in this shelter.

The city has set up ten pickup areas to take people to emergency shelters. RTA buses will be picking up citizens for free and take them to these shelters. The number to call for pickup areas is 1-800-469-4828.

The pickup locations are

McMain High: 5712 S Claiborne Ave New Orleans, LA 70125

Rabouin High:727 Carondelet St New Orleans, LA 70130

Mondy George O Elementary: 2327 Philip St New Orleans, LA 70113

O.P. Walker: 2832 General Meyer Ave New Orleans, LA 70114

Abramson: 5552 Read Blvd New Orleans, LA 70127

S.T. Reed : 5316 Michoud Blvd New Orleans, LA 70129

Sylvain Williams: 3127 Martin L. King Blvd. New Orleans, LA. 70125

Augustine Middle:425 S. Broad St. New Orleans, LA. 70119

Warren Easton: 3039 Higgins Blvd. New Orleans, LA. 70126

MLK Jr. Elementary: 1617 Caffin Avenue New Orleans, LA 70117

N.O. Mission, address not available at time of publish.

Mondy Center, address not available at time of publish.

William Franz , address not available at time of publish.

Residents are asked to bring food for 3-5 days, pillows, blankets, and any other supplies needed.

http://www.nola.com/newslogs/breakingtp/index.ssf?/mtlogs/nola_Times-Picayune/archives/2005_08.html

I think NO was stretching it's resources and couldn't do as much as they wanted to.

[Maple]

2. How come this question keeps being asked?

It's been answered dozens of times.

[ClusterFreak]

6. Because when I don't know the answer to something...I ask a question.

That's why. Now that I have an answer, I'm satisfied.

[DoYouEverWonder]

30. Then read the threads before you post please

this place is noisy enough has it is.

[lildreamer316]

33. ....and that is SO easy to do at level 3!

c'mon; give him a break on that. The threads on this subject were buried like 3 days ago and every time I've logged on since we have either been at 1 or 3. Kinda hard to look when the search engine is off and threads are dropping like flies.
Love

[justiceischeap]

As I understand it

The bus drivers weren't there to drive them...

[zanne]

29. School buses WERE USED...

To take people to the AstroDome. They were not used to take people out of the city, but it was thought that they'd be safe and comfortable in the Astrodome for what they thought would be a couple of days. In the lead up to the storm...am I the only one who remembers this?

[cynatnite]

31. You are right

Everyone believed they'd be safe there. And from what I remember, while people were riding out the storm, there wasn't all the unspeakable horror going on until afterwards when no one came to help them.

[Connie_Corleone]

34. You remember correctly.

I was listening to the news reports during the hurricane where the people were calm and I heard NOTHING about rapes and murders that Monday.

[Catch22Dem]

3. Talked about earlier

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4667154

[bloom]

4. I don't know why

they weren't used either - at least on Saturday/Sunday.

Once the Hurricane hit they may have been flooded already.

[King Coal]

5. This thread will be deleted. Mine was, but I'll answer you quickly.

Where could Nagin have taken the evacuees. He would have had to take them out of his jurisdiction. He had the people safe, he just couldn't get water and aid to them, as he was promised over and over. If Nagin had it to do over again, I would imagine he would get a gazillion port-o-potties and move the buses to high ground. But it wasn't in the plan. Getting aid to the Supedome was.

[nyhuskyfan]

7. We've talked about it here over and over and over...

In fairness, posts disappear quickly here and the search function is down.

However, public transit was offered on Sunday in New Orleans to bring people from designated pick-up points to local shelters. There have been no reports of people not getting to shelters who wished to. The Superdome was rather crowded on Monday.

If you mean why they weren't evacuated out of town, that's a task beyond the scope of what local officials can handle. The mayor of NO can't send people to other jurisdictions without their consent. As for the governor, the entire state of Louisiana was in the path of a Category 5 Hurricane, so there was nowhere safe to bring them in buses. The best plan was to get people in designated shelters like the Superdome and get FEMA in as soon as possible afterwards to get people relief. The problems came in the aftermath, when FEMA was AWOL.

Those who pointed out that Shreveport was safe should realize that Shreveport suffered a lot of damage in a 1986 hurricane, so there was no guarantee that anywhere in the state would be safe enough.

[Spangle]

8. And take the people WHERE?

They couldn't evacuate TO a bus. Thatwould have been deadly. The bus had to go somewhere. WHERE?

There were already buses going to the Superdome. Not and issue about getting people TO the super dome.

[notadmblnd]

9. my take is .....it was the weekend.. school bus drivers are off weekends

when they got the message to evacuate, they didn't think about going into work. they left. No one o drive the buses. Maybe if FEMA had let civilian volunteers in they would have had drivers after the fact. But it is currently quite clear.. the fed delayed any attempts to rescue and recover for several days.

[dogday]

10. Those that wanted to leave and could not get out of

town were told to go to the SD. There rest either were not leaving or could not even get to the buses or SD. There was no manpower to assist house to house search. What is there to get? The ones that went to the SD did not die, at least not drown, they died from lack of food and water and heat.

Governor requested help on the 28th from the President. Help did not arrive for 4 days

[htuttle]

11. Take them to *where*?

If you evacuate someone to 'safety', it seems that you'd also have a responsibility to know that where you are taking them is safer than where you are taking them from. The mayor had no way of doing that.

Or would you suggest that they should have just dropped 50,000+ people off at a Stucky's on the freeway somewhere?

In addition, the act of actually loading 50,000 people onto buses is fraught with hazards itself, and probably impossible to do unless you have far, far more crowd control than the entire NOPD (and consider that they would have had to continue to service calls in the entire city while all this is going on).

[Guaranteed]

12. Maybe those who could have driven buses were evacuating

their own families.

Which is why you need OUTSIDE help.

[Name removed]

13. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Spangle]

15. People are talking about it at work. I rather they ask HERE

so they can get a different view point.

Search function is DOWN. How else is people going to know, if they don't ASK. They are getting HIT with the right wing crap. I rather they have ammo to shoot back at them.

[ClusterFreak]

18. Cheers!

:toast:

[ClusterFreak]

16. Oh. I see.

You've got me all figured out.....I'm a tight-fisted repuke troll or something? I'll tell you what, since you HAVE a gold star, why don't YOU use YOUR search function, and look up posts made under my name? Then you tell me if I am someone who parrots RW talking points. :hi:

[blondeatlast]

21. Okay, I was outta line, but after 3 threads on the same page about

the same thing, I'm a bit irritated.

Apologies. But please, check out how often the same stuff is being posted in just 1-2 pages.

[ClusterFreak]

32. I always make an effort not to dupe....

...but at the rate postings fly off the front page of GD with the site at Level 3....stuff happens. In my original post I indicated that the answer to the bus issue simply escaped me...meaning I didn't know the answer to why busses weren't used...not suggesting at all that they could have or should have been. Needed an answer to be better informed, that's all. And apologies accepted. Everyone's pretty upset these days, as am I.

[proud2BlibKansan]

26. It's not that hard to get a star.

Maybe you don't spend a lot of time here. This bus deal has been discussed to death. And if you go to any RW board, you will see the picture of the flooded buses posted all over the place. They are blaming the mayor for not evacuating the people. You know the drill - ABB (Anyone But Bush) is responsible. :eyes:

[Scout1071]

17. Actually, it seems like one of the functions that's been temp disabled

on DU for the time being.

[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Dr Fate]

14. Where was the Board of Education supposed to take them? The woods?

I say we blame the Dog Catcher next- yeah- thats it.

[Barack_America]

19. 500 Buses would not have been enough...

...there was no plan. Were would these buses pick people up? Who would they pick up? Where would they have gone? The Superdome, which was at capacity with 20,000 people when there were 100,000 left in the city?

I agree that the school buses could have been a great resource, but the truth is that, without a plan, you would've had half empty buses getting turned away from shelter after shelter.

IMHO, the Department of Homeland Security, along with local officials, should've been working on evacuation plans of all major cities long ago!

[cynatnite]

24. Check post #1

The mayor did his job and set up pickup points. I don't think they had enough resources to get every bus out and set up more places.

Using buses is in NO emergency plans. They showed it on NBC tonight, but I don't think they had the resources as I've said.

[bluestateguy]

20. NBC noted that they could have gotted out 13,000

That's only a small dent.

[nyhuskyfan]

25. And the question still remains - get them out where?

The problem they were facing on Sunday was a Category 5 hurricane coming down their throats. Buses weren't going to bring them anywhere that the hurricane wasn't -- unless they were shuttled all the way to Kansas.

If the question is why the buses weren't available AFTER the hurricane, when the city was 80 percent flooded, well, what exactly is FEMA for? A city government is completely swamped at that point.

[MelissaB]

23. Nominating because I hadn't see the info in post #1

I teach and am blocked at school. I was on DU all weekend and didn't see this. We need this info to fight.

[dalaigh lllama]

27. Someone on another thread did the math on this

NO had 500 buses, which each would hold approximately 40 people. Assuming 500 bus drivers would be available -- which they weren't --
that's only 20,000 able to be evacuated by bus. I think estimates were 200,000 left in NO, so even if they did use buses to full capacity, that's only 10% able to leave by bus. And, of course, where were these buses supposed to take them?

[expatriot]

28. Here is why the school buses are not an issue.

It does not matter what local autorities do or don't do, it is the federal government's responsibility to oversee local and state capabilities and to respond to the needs accordingly. The federal government should have known (if Nagin truly dropped the ball) thsy resources weren't being deployed properly and they should have been pro-active in their response to the fact local authorities weren't competent. Feds have the power to bypass local authority to get things done in a disaster situation per the NATIONAL RESPONSE POLICY