About this "200 buses" issue

[CatWoman]

you know, the ones sitting underwater.

where the hell were they going to go?

[FormerRepublican]

1. They're complaining because they weren't used to evac people...

...before the levee broke. Or at a minimum, moved to higher ground.

[nyhuskyfan]

4. And that's what's a joke...

Bring everyone in the city to higher ground and let them deal with the brunt of a Category 5 hurricane outdoors?

[FormerRepublican]

9. Not the people, the buses. Move the buses to higher ground.

[nyhuskyfan]

13. Ahhhh.

That's a more reasonable point. There are still more issues...

1) After the city was flooded, the local government was clearly going to be swamped -- not enough personnel for even the most basic of functions. The Federal goverment (FEMA) would obviously be needed, including finding enough people to drive them. And that assumes that the buses could still even get to the people -- 80 percent of the city was underwater.

2) If people in charge (like the head of FEMA, for example) came into town with a plan of action and said "get me every goddamn bus in this city pronto" and he was told that they were all underwater, wouldn't he then say, "Well, call up Baton Rouge, Houston, Shreveport, and every other metropolitan area within a few hours drive and get me some buses. Then call Greyhound and Peter Pan and everyone else with an extra bus."

In such a case, I would say that you would be looking at an unnecessary delay of a few hours -- not four days. But FEMA was AWOL.

[xray s]

2. I am withholding judgment until I hear the whole story

It's possible the people responsible for driving the busses left to save their families. I am surprised they were not at least positioned in the Quarter or Garden District (relatively high ground).

There are plans, and then there is reality.

The bottom line is, the city did what it could, everyone knew there would be tens of thousands left in a storm of this magnitude, and no one came to the rescue for five days.

Inexcusable.

[nyhuskyfan]

6. There were public buses bringing people to shelters on Sunday...

They announced pick up points all over the cities, as well as a phone number they could call. I haven't heard of anyone who washed away at a bus stop.

Evacuating the city still begs the question - evacuate to where?

[bushisanidiot]

12. Exactly! school bus drivers are paid minimum wage.. they shouldn't HAVE

to do it..

the mayor did his job by getting the majority of those who stayed behind to the superdome and the convention center..

it was the federal government who dropped the ball when they FAILED to come in and help after the hurricane passed by.. despite NUMEROUS TELEVISED PLEAS FOR HELP FROM THE MAYOR, THE GOVERNOR, AND SENATOR LANDRIEU!!!!

[SaveAmerica]

14. I read a couple days ago that the volunteers that they had lined up

did just that. They said that about half did not show up. On tonight's NBC news (or special) they said that 200 of the 400 buses available weren't used for evacuation.

[guruoo]

17. This pretty much backs that up

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=4633750&mesg_id=4633848

[nyhuskyfan]

3. Nagin should have sent them to Enid, Oklahoma...

Seeing as how he has that right, as the mayor of New Orleans. He's allowed to send his entire population to Enid whenever he wants.

The New Orleans mayoral position has a lot of power, you know.

[DoYouEverWonder]

7. He asked FEMA where should he send the buses

Sometime Sunday around midday FEMA finally decided to open the Superdome and to send the people there. FEMA decided that the Superdome was a safe shelter for the storm. Nagin was in no position to argue with them at that point. He had to send the people somewhere.

[FormerRepublican]

11. If this is true, then we need documentation, and we need to get it to the

media. Otherwise, Bush is going to get off the hook.

[thethinker]

5. Who owned the buses that people left on?

Where did the buses come from that evacuated people? Who owned them? Where were they sent from? I heard rumors of free buses being turned down by FEMA.

[nyhuskyfan]

8. When they came to bring people to Houston...

The buses I saw were plain white charter buses, with restrooms.

[leftchick]

10. The Fact is in the OLDEN Days when I was a kid

which was in 1972 and had to be evacuated from a MAJOR flood. Guess who did the evacuation? The NYS National Guard! That is the point no one is making. The NG were not in NO to do their traditional jobs of saving the citizens of their states. They are in Iraq protecting bushco**s oil. And that is a fact!

[amandabeech]

15. The flood started during the night of 28-29, and went very quickly.

Communications were down, and my guess is that it would have been impossible to get everyone organized to move them to higher ground before they flooded.

I'm waiting for an explanation of whose helicopters failed to deliver the sandbags to the 17th ST. flood wall break and why. Getting started on that immediately as Nagin directed and as planned may have cost many more lives than would have been lost at the church that was evacuated instead.

[markus]

16. Working on this breaking issue

National Review is pushing it, and John Breaux told my local rwr host that the buses did not run to the Superdome as planned over the weekend.

I have other reports that's a lot of hooey, and doubt John B was on the ground.

Total RTA fleet is about 400 buses, seating about 60 people each. That 24,000 people, out of a Census Bureau estimate of 115,000 in Orleans Parish without cars.

Even if half those people found other transport, which 25,000 would you leave behind? Those too wake to make it to the martial points, and force there way onto a bus?

This would have been a recipe for panic and mayhem.

wetbankguide.blogspot.com

[applegrove]

18. Nagin admitted turning down school buses from outside - said he said

he wanted travel buses not school-buses - since these were victims needing to travel long distances with children.

I think that is what the freepers are harping on.

If Nagin was making wrong decisions, that should have been taken care of immediately. It wasn't. Bush did things like not take his calls.

Much was let to "just happen".

We all know that any President worth his salt could cut through anyone's bullshit in a time of disaster. If Bush or his people couldn't discuss with Nagin, then they could have commandeered great leadership to do it for them. Honore was sent in Tuesday or Wednesday. But it would have taken one phone call for someone with the leadership skills of Clinton to 1) get to know Nagin if he didn't already 2) work out the issues with the orders and get some boots or buses or anything needed on the ground.

If Bush was incapable of using Clinton, he should have appealed to someone in his own party with the ability to lead to step in.

Fact is - there was a problem by Tuesday. They did nothing and "let it all hang out" for another few days.

FEMA was a planned disaster. It would be interesting to see who exactly was Brown's competition for the head position.

The thing about FEMA is that it was created to take disaster management to a level of expertise based on experience. Any Mayor of a small city or Governor of a small state don't have the experience with disaster that comes to the federal government. The federal government deals with a few disasters a year. Looks like New Orleans dealt with great disaster way back 30 years ago. If you undo the capability of FEMA to do the job with expertise - you are responsible for the outcome.