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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 08:27 AM
Original message
STOP Blaming
Edited on Wed Sep-07-05 08:42 AM by berni_mccoy
When Republicans ask for the "Blame Game" to stop, just respond by saying, no one is blaming anyone. Blame isn't necessary because it is PAINFULLY OBVIOUS that the ENTIRE Bush administration is responsible for the deaths of TENS OF THOUSANDS OF U.S. Citizens.

This is how our Democratic Leadership NEEDS to respond. When asked by the press about blame... they NEED to respond that blame and investigations are as much of a WHITEWASH as was the INTENTIONAL REDTAPE that prevented rescuers from saving TENS OF THOUSANDS OF U.S. CITIZENS. No Blame or Investigation is necessary because EVERYONE KNOWS WHO IS AT FAULT: The PRESIDENT AND HIS ENTIRE ADMINISTRATION along with all the republican lawmakers WHO DEFEND HIM.

On EDIT: Here is an EDITORIAL that captures EXACTLY what I'm trying to say and EXACTLY what our DEMOCRATIC LEADERSHIP NEEDS TO BE ECHOING:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=4675950&mesg_id=4675950
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BurgherHoldtheLies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 08:29 AM
Response to Original message
1. Children call it "blame"...Adults call it "accountability"
F%*$ing babies!
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sui generis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 08:31 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. exactly - it's not about blame, it's about responsibility
and accountability. "Blame Game" is a republican meme. Every time we respond to it or use it in a sentence, we lose a little.
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mattclearing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 08:30 AM
Response to Original message
2. Also say, "This isn't a fucking game. People are dead! Where were you???"
You can bet the "blame game" meme will be dropped like a hot potato.
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Obamanaut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 08:42 AM
Response to Reply #2
10. This is an excerpt from my (today's) letter to congresspeople...

I have read that the administration does not want to “play the blame game.” This is not a game! This is real! It has been my personal experience that one who hollers about no finger pointing is usually either guilty or complicit to a degree - great or small. I certainly hope that you do not become complicit by assisting in cover-ups and “spin” or by failing to ensure that “we the people” have an honest day in court. The persons responsible must be identified. They must be indicted. They must be punished - not for the natural disaster but for the failure to act and the carnage that was a result of that failure. “We" expect no less.




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Sparkly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 08:31 AM
Response to Original message
4. And how does one determine responsibility and accountability w/o blame?
"Don't blame" makes accountability disappear.

And as the press was getting at with Scottie yesterday, right NOW there is somebody (or several somebodies) in positions of responsibility within DHS and FEMA and the administration who are INCOMPETENT. Should we leave them there, by delaying the inquiry? Or should we get them out ASAP so they aren't able to make any further messes of emergencies?

Tell rightwingers to put that in their pipes and smoke it.
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 08:34 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. Responsibility is OBVIOUS
The point is republicans are trying to hide responsibility by playing the "blame" card. A typical Rovian/Orwellian tactic that can backfire simply by saying that EVERYONE KNOWS WHO IS RESPONSIBLE. NOW It's a matter of what to DO TO THOSE WHO FAILED!
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sui generis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 08:34 AM
Response to Original message
5. but on this topic
The people of Louisiana voted for Bush on MORAL VALUES to keep the Gay Married Terraists from getting gay married.

This gay married terraist and his partner are still going to help you out whether you are a republican, an evil fucking queer hating baptist, or just generally hate gays and abortion doctors and unwed mothers.

Remember that next time you vote.
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iconoclastic cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 08:37 AM
Response to Original message
7. When they say, "Stop playing the blame game!" you say, "Stop the cover-up!
Spread it! When they say, "Stop playing the blame game!" you say, "Stop the cover-up! Investigate now!
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 08:37 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. Exactly!
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iconoclastic cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 08:40 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. Spread it around!
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 08:43 AM
Response to Original message
11. HERE IS AN EDITORIAL THAT SAYS EXACTLY THE RIGHT THING:
Here is an EDITORIAL that captures EXACTLY what I'm trying to say and EXACTLY what our DEMOCRATIC LEADERSHIP NEEDS TO BE ECHOING:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=4675950&mesg_id=4675950
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Dez Donating Member (826 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 08:43 AM
Response to Original message
12. Did anyone see O Reilly
the other night?? He didn't mention the fault of chimpie at all! He blamed it all on the Dems! And you know how many people watch that show and believe everything that liar says. The Right has put all the blame on the gov. and the Mayor.
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 09:32 AM
Response to Reply #12
24. It isn't working... they can blame local gov't all they want
But NOBODY wants their local gov't blamed and no one believes that BULLSHIT.

In fact the MSM is starting to pull back the curtains for those 'mericuns' that may be fooled by the simple bullshit. Check out this timeline from CNN (link to original post): http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=4671904&mesg_id=4671904
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ProfessorGAC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #12
30. Don't Overrate That
You ask ". . .you know how many people watch that show In fact yes i do. It's a very small percentage of the american population. Roughly 1.5%!

And those people are his choir. They are listening to that gasbag because he reinforces their silly, narrow, and simpleminded opinions. The rest of the nation is not affected by what that idiot says about anything.

Remember, the 4 million people who watch that show are going to blame liberals for anything and everything. That would include Bush coming on TV, doing two big honking lines of blow, drinking a fifth of scotch, and shooting his dog on national TV. The opinions of people who watch slime like Billy-boy won't change no matter what anyone says. They're stupid. That's why they watch a simpleton like him.

And, there's just not that many of them.
The Professor
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flordehinojos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 08:44 AM
Response to Original message
13. I AM NOT BLAMING ANYONE. I AM TELLIN THE TRUTH:BUSH DID IT!
Bush cut funding for upkeep of levees and flood control.
bush let people die.
bush lied about hurricane preparedness in NO
now he does not want the BLAME GAME to play out.

ain't no two ways about it. BUSH DID IT. BUSH IS GUILTY. I BLAME BUSH!
and the media ought to too.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 09:00 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
In Truth We Trust Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 09:09 AM
Response to Reply #14
17. Get your facts straight before spewin g bullshit to informed people.
Edited on Wed Sep-07-05 09:13 AM by In Truth We Trust
Gov. Blanco did request help BEFORE the storm even hit!
edit to add public record timeline:

August 26

• 5 a.m.: After weakening briefly to a tropical storm, Katrina regains hurricane status and moves on to the Gulf of Mexico.

• 11:30 a.m.: The hurricane is upgraded to Category 2, with the storm's feeder bands continuing to pound the lower Florida Keys.

• 4 p.m.: The National Hurricane Center warns that Katrina is expected to reach dangerous Category 4 intensity before making landfall in Mississippi or Louisiana. Hours later, in anticipation of a possible landfall, Mississippi Gov. Haley Barbour and Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Blanco declare states of emergency.

August 27

• 5 a.m.: Katrina is upgraded to a Category 3, or major hurricane, with the Gulf Coast in its path.

• During the day, residents of Louisiana's low-lying areas are told they must evacuate; residents in other low-lying areas are urgently advised to do so. President Bush declares a state of emergency in Louisiana.

• Highways leading out of New Orleans are filled with bumper-to-bumper traffic. Several major interstates are converted to one-way routes away from the city.

• 11 p.m.: The National Hurricane Center issues a hurricane warning from Morgan City, Louisiana, to the Alabama-Florida border, an area that includes New Orleans. A warning means that hurricane conditions are expected within the warning area within the next 24 hours.

August 28

• 2 a.m.: Katrina escalates to Category 4 strength, heading for the Gulf Coast. The last time Mississippi or Louisiana saw landfall from a Category 4 or stronger storm was 1969 with Hurricane Camille.

• 7 a.m.: Hurricane Katrina intensifies to Category 5, the worst and highest category on the Saffir-Simpson scale.

• 10 a.m.: As Katrina hits 175 mph winds, New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin orders mandatory evacuations as the storm seems to beat a direct path to the city.

• During the day, Bush declares a state of emergency in Mississippi and orders federal assistance. The National Hurricane Center says low-lying areas along the Gulf Coast could expect storm surges of up to 25 feet as the storm, with top sustained winds of 160 mph, hits early the next day.
...

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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 09:20 AM
Response to Reply #17
21. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 09:29 AM
Response to Reply #21
23. CNN
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Tennessee Gal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 09:12 AM
Response to Reply #14
19. You are highly misinformed!
In the Governor's letter to the President on 8/27/05 the following was included, which is a formal request for the President to take action:

Under the provisions of Section 501 (a) of the Robert T. Stafford Disaster Relief and Emergency Assistance Act, 42 U.S.C. §§ 5121-5206 (Stafford Act), and implemented by 44 CFR § 206.35, I request that you declare an emergency for the State of Louisiana due to Hurricane Katrina for the time period beginning August 26, 2005, and continuing. The affected areas are all the southeastern parishes including the New Orleans Metropolitan area and the mid state Interstate I-49 corridor and northern parishes along the I-20 corridor that are accepting the thousands of citizens evacuating from the areas expecting to be flooded as a result of Hurricane Katrina.

In response to the situation I have taken appropriate action under State law and directed the execution of the State Emergency Plan on August 26, 2005 in accordance with Section 501 (a) of the Stafford Act. A State of Emergency has been issued for the State in order to support the evacuations of the coastal areas in accordance with our State Evacuation Plan and the remainder of the state to support the State Special Needs and Sheltering Plan.

Pursuant to 44 CFR § 206.35, I have determined that this incident is of such severity and magnitude that effective response is beyond the capabilities of the State and affected local governments, and that supplementary Federal assistance is necessary to save lives, protect property, public health, and safety, or to lessen or avert the threat of a disaster. I am specifically requesting emergency protective measures, direct Federal Assistance, Individual and Household Program (IHP) assistance, Special Needs Program assistance, and debris removal.

http://www.gov.state.la.us/Press_Release_detail.asp?id=976

Now here is section 501 of the Stafford Act:

PROCEDURE FOR DECLARATION {Sec. 501}

Request and declaration

All requests for a declaration by the President that an emergency exists shall be made by the Governor of the affected State. Such a request shall be based on a finding that the situation is of such severity and magnitude that effective response is beyond the capabilities of the State and the affected local governments and that Federal assistance is necessary. As a part of such request, and as a prerequisite to emergency assistance under this Act, the Governor shall take appropriate action under State law and direct execution of the State's emergency plan. The Governor shall furnish information describing the State and local efforts and resources which have been or will be used to alleviate the emergency, and will define the type and extent of Federal aid required. Based upon such Governor's request, the President may declare that an emergency exists.

Certain emergencies involving Federal primary responsibility

The President may exercise any authority vested in him by section 502 or section 503 <42 U.S.C. § 5192 or § 5193> with respect to an emergency when he determines that an emergency exists for which the primary responsibility for response rests with the United States because the emergency involves a subject area for which, under the Constitution or laws of the United States, the United States exercises exclusive or preeminent responsibility and authority. In determining whether or not such an emergency exists, the President shall consult the Governor of any affected State, if practicable. The President's determination may be made without regard to subsection (a).

(She did this and the President declared a state of emergency for Louisiana.)

The above references section 502:

Federal emergency assistance {Sec. 502}

a. Specified

In any emergency, the President may--

1. direct any Federal agency, with or without reimbursement, to utilize its authorities and the resources granted to it under Federal law ( including personnel, equipment, supplies, facilities, and managerial, technical and advisory services) in support of State and local emergency assistance efforts

2. to save lives, protect property and public health and safety, and lessen or avert the threat of a catastrophe;

~snip~

General

Whenever the Federal assistance provided under subsection (a) with respect to an emergency is inadequate, the President may also provide assistance with respect to efforts to save lives, protect property and public health and safety, and lessen or avert the threat of a catastrophe.

http://www.fema.gov/library/stafact.shtm#sec501

GOVERNOR BLANCO FOLLOWED THE LAW AND APPROPRIATE PROCEDURES IN ASKING BUSH FOR HELP ON SATURDAY, 8/27/05. HELP DID NOT ARRIVE FROM THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT FOR THE CITIZENS OF NEW ORLEANS UNTIL THE FOLLOWING FRIDAY.


The responsibility for coordinating all disaster relief efforts in New Orleans clearly rested with the White House. Despite all the post-disaster spin by the Bush Faction and its sycophants, despite all the earnest media analyses, the lines of authority are clear and indisputable. Here is the voice of George W. Bush himself, in the proclamation issued in his name, over his signature on Saturday, August 27, 2005:

"The President today declared an emergency exists in the State of Louisiana and ordered Federal aid to supplement state and local response efforts in the parishes located in the path of Hurricane Katrina beginning on August 26, 2005, and continuing. The President's action authorizes the Department of Homeland Security, Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA), to coordinate all disaster relief efforts which have the purpose of alleviating the hardship and suffering caused by the emergency on the local population, and to provide appropriate assistance for required emergency measures"

Bush goes on to say: "Specifically, FEMA is authorized to identify, mobilize, and provide at its discretion, equipment and resources necessary to alleviate the impacts of the emergency."

There is really nothing more to be said about "lines of authority" and "who was responsible" for managing the relief effort. Two days before the hurricane struck Louisiana, the President of the United States assumed the responsibility for coordinating ALL disaster relief efforts. He then specifically designated FEMA as the lead agency in charge of this effort, giving it presidential authorization to mobilize any and all resources necessary to "alleviate the impacts of the emergency." What's more, FEMA was given specific, direct, presidential authority to act at its discretion -- it did not have to wait for approval from elsewhere in the federal government or from state or local authorities.

All of this is as plain as day; it's set down in black and white, in a direct, unambiguous document signed by President George W. Bush and available 24 hours a day on the official White House website. If any Beltway pundit or high media mandarin wishes to know who was responsible for the direction of "ALL disaster relief efforts" in the Gulf Coast during and after the storm, they need only consult the White House website.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2005/08/20050827-1.html
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WePurrsevere Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 09:25 AM
Response to Reply #14
22. "Blindly"? Hmm... FYI...
The Gov of LA declared a State of Emergency and officially requested Fed help on the 26th... Katrina hit on the 28th... help not NOT come for DAYS after unlike for past hurricanes under the Bush watch.

Here's a handy little CNN Katrina Timeline.

Copies of the Gov of LAs request was on the gov site as of yesterday as well.

As for the rest... hopefully someone else will come along with more TRUE information to address your comments as well as the other reasons we can quite CLEARLY lay a HUGE part of the responsibilty squarely at Bush's feet. Sadly I don't have the time to look up all the facts.

btw- welcome to the DU.. hopefully you'll learn alot here, I most assuredly have. :)
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jzodda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 09:02 AM
Response to Original message
15. The blame needs to be spread around
The Feds, the State, the Locals all have some part in it. I just want it fixed so this does not happen again. There needs to be a non partison look at what happened-they need a 9/11 style commision.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 09:03 AM
Response to Reply #15
16. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 09:20 AM
Response to Reply #15
20. BULLSHIT! What exactly could the Gov and Mayor have done
Besides what they DID DO?

They did everything IN THEIR POWER, PLUS DECLARE an STATE OF EMERGENCY Directly to the President himself.

Go read the timeline here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=4671904&mesg_id=4671904
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jzodda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #20
29. Well there is alot more that could have been done from all sides
The Gov of LA made some mistakes along with the Feds-that time line leaves out alot of facts. One of her biggest mistakes relates to communication with the red cross. The Mayor of NO and the Gov had communication problems, the feds had communication problems with the state, the city of NO and each other. Communication, or the lack of it, seems to be one of the key problems with this disaster

Appointing blame is not the most important part, although it will be needed going forward. What we need to do in this country is have a national discussion about who exactly we want to be in charge when these disasters happen in this country. After the dept of homeland security was created FEMA had some of its authority weakened. Also do we want to appoint people in positions like head of fema who have no disaster relief experience. I mean the guy was training horses before hand. The question we need to ask is do we want them to get more power to be able to go over the heads of other fed agencies, or state and city authorities to be able to be a decision maker or do we want them to be strictly a support agency? Do we want the National Guard to be controlled at the Federal level in a disaster or do we want the States to retain command? I do not pretend to know the answers but its a discussion we have to start having.

After 9/11 Billions were spent to make sure we can respond well to disasters. Its obviously been money not well spent.
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tnlefty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 09:47 AM
Response to Reply #15
28. Exactly, and it needs to be spread throughout the Bush** Admini-
stration, every republican politician, and everyone in this country who voted for Bush**, and those who still support him.

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Dora Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 09:11 AM
Response to Original message
18. Absolutely right. n/t
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nonconformist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 09:35 AM
Response to Original message
25. No.
It's not about blame, it's about accountability. And it's important for it to happen RIGHT NOW because the incompetent asses responsible are still in charge of this ongoing disaster/tragedy. You trust them? I sure don't.

To use their own line against them - do you want the next failure to be in the form of a mushroom cloud? That's your talking point right there.
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magnolia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 09:36 AM
Response to Original message
26. Did anyone yell "stop blaming"...
...after 9/11? We started to blame before the towers even hit the ground and it didn't halt or interfer with rescues or anything else that needed to be done.
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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-07-05 09:40 AM
Response to Original message
27. Moreover, when the hell will Bush accept even some responsibility?
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