"We are all Black Americans this week."

[tinfoilinfor2005]

If every American can be Irish on St. Patty's day, then we sure as hell can all be Black and proud of it throughout this struggle.

I guess it appears that bush really is a uniter because I have never in my life felt as much compassion and fellowship and pride as I have for this community this week in their struggle for survival.

[sniffa]

1. does that mean i'm gonna get puLLed over?

are peopLe gonna cross the street when we're waLking towards each other?
are women going to cLutch their purses tighter when i waLk by?
even though i work, am i going to be assumed to be on weLfare, and a criminaL?

[JuniperLea]

4. uh oh

Hard not to be offended even when the stereotype behaviors noted are sarcastic.

So Sniffa... the L deal... Left with a capital L?

[sniffa]

10. you shouLd be offended

and outraged. possibLy ashamed.

[JuniperLea]

20. I have nothing to be ashamed of:)

The only judgment I pass on people is when they are willfully stupid:) You can be willfully stupid in any color.

[growlypants]

11. unfortunately, yes.

[bostonbabs]

2. beautifully said....thank you

[JuniperLea]

3. Nothing unites like a common enemy!

Hmmmm... interesting thought here and way off topic...

Seems it's ok to "act Irish" on St. Patrick's Day... speak with a brogue, drink beer, etc. I don't think it would be so well accepted to "act Black". Just saying.

I'm a member of the Dugan clan, you know. Me mutter sed I'm tird generation American.

A light just went on and I don't quite know how to feel about it.

[tinfoilinfor2005]

5. As a matter of fact, my Irish husband asked me to post this

because the poor Irish were called wogs. He has lived here for a couple of generations but he has never forgotten that his grandfather was called a wog.

Maybe off topic...maybe not.

[JuniperLea]

6. My grandfather

Told me of all the "NO IRISH" signs in pub/bar windows and "IRISH NEED NOT APPLY" signs nest to the "Help Wanted" signs. Yes indeed... He used to say that the Irish were the "N's" of Europe. I hated it when he said that because I hated that N word. But I think I just came to understand why he used it and said that. I think he felt a connection and I think he wanted me to understand how horrible that whole deal was.

There must be a lesson to be learned here somewhere. How did my grandfather and his brothers and sisters, and all of the American Irish people of that era get past the bigotry? I don't get it.

BTW - can you define "WOG"? I think I was five years old the last time I heard that word!

[tinfoilinfor2005]

8. "Wog" was the the N word in Britain, only it was applied to the Irish.

[bobbieinok]

14. mom told me about 'shanty Irish + lace curtain Irish' + 'your Irish flag i

is flying'

'your Irish flag is flying' was code for 'your slip is showing'....later I realized the implications: Irish women are slovenly, their slips always show; AND they're sluts, slip showing = 'disorder in dress'

mom (2/14/1913-3/31/2005) grew up in St Louis; her family was part Irish + an aunt-in-law was Irish

she didn't explain where she heard these, but I suppose it was while growing up


DELIGHT IN DISORDER.
by Robert Herrick

A SWEET disorder in the dress
Kindles in clothes a wantonness :
A lawn about the shoulders thrown
Into a fine distraction :
An erring lace which here and there
Enthrals the crimson stomacher :
A cuff neglectful, and thereby
Ribbons to flow confusedly :
A winning wave (deserving note)
In the tempestuous petticoat :
A careless shoe-string, in whose tie
I see a wild civility :
Do more bewitch me than when art
Is too precise in every part.

[I Have A Dream]

15. I think that it was easier for the Irish to get past the bigotry because..

they had white skin so did not stand out. Once they lost their accents, they blended in. Until we get to the point where black skin (or any skin color) is viewed like hair or eye color, this will continue.

There was a Star Trek episode about this once. There was an alien race where each person had half of their face one color and half the other. The ones with the first color on the left side of the face rather than the right side of the face were the ones who thought that they were better than the people who had it the other way. When the Earthlings on the Enterprise had this explained to them, they just couldn't comprehend why it would matter. It really put this whole skin color thing into perspective for me. (I was young when I saw it, and I already understood that judging by skin color made no sense, but it just really clarified the ridiculousness of the whole thing to me.)

[JuniperLea]

19. I remember that episode

Priceless! The whole color thing IS as ridiculous as depicted in that episode.

On blending in... Yes, I see your point. But I also know that blending in was a necessity, not a choice.

I remember the very English relatives on my father's side telling me never to let on that I was part Irish, and the very Irish relatives on my mother's side telling me not to let on that I was part English. Frankly, in that regard, I'm an abomination and I love it!

[patdem]

33. Sort of like a take off of Dr Seues' Sneeches...love it!

I like the 'we are all black americans now'..but being black cannot be understood unless one is black. I recall a movie in the late 50's early 60's about a man who pretended to be black and all the racism he faced. I think it was called 'Black, Like Me'?

[chalky]

37. Based on the book: "Black Like Me" by John Howard Griffin

n/t

[Pirate Smile]

29. My Mom has a special level of disgust for Irish-American Republicans

like Hannity and O'Reilly. They have forgotten their history. They should know better.

[eppur_se_muova]

7. Does this apply to our elected representatives too?

If so, it's about time. It was eerily conspicuous that only black
Senators stood up and spoke out againt *'s re-selection. This was the most worrisome thing connected to American relations I had yet seen...until Katrina.

GG

[newyawker99]

35. Hi eppur_se_muova!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[I Have A Dream]

38. Welcome, eppur_se_muova -- glad to have you here!

:hi:

[FlemingsGhost]

9. I know you mean well, and all ...

but there is no way a white American can truly empathize.

By the way, Saint Paddy's day is a celebration. For Americans, an excuse to get drunk. Hardly a juxtaposition I'd use for comparison to the destruction of New Orleans.

[tinfoilinfor2005]

13. I truly hear what you're saying but I think you are missing my point...

I am saying that with this tragedy we really are ready to empathize. For whatever reason we couldn't and wouldn't do this before...but this tragedy has made us really want to do this.

No, many of will never be black or never be that poor. But finally many of us really do want to change this...

Yes, St. Paddy's is a celebration. But thousands of Irish who died in starvation and poverty and came here for a new life will argue that their struggle ended up in just "an excuse to get drunk."

[FlemingsGhost]

17. Saint Patrick brought Christianity to Ireland.

The holiday, has little to do with the famine, or British occupation. In Ireland, they go to church, visit family and, of course, lift a glass for departed family members. Americans wear green and drive home drunk from the bar.

I repeat, a white American cannot, ever, empathize the African American experience. Ever. The best we can do is sympathize. And if is undertaken with political opportunism in mind, you are not even attempting that properly.

Look, I know you mean well, but this reminds me of the South Park episode where the town throws a celebration for the nurse who has a dead fetus attached to here face, in order to prove they are not insensitive to her condition. In doing so, they display their ignorance, and insenitivity, ten-fold.

[JuniperLea]

24. Interesting

My family was extremely poor when I was a kid, bag of rice and bag of beans to last a month poor... buying school clothes from the Goodwill poor. Now I live in a gated townhome complex where I am the minority... mostly Black families here. We are all on equal ground, literally and figuratively. No problems here at all.

[JuniperLea]

22. but there is no way a white American can truly empathize.

Unless you were there when the Irish were being oppressed, I hardly think you can make such a statement. The only difference WAS the color of their skin, there was no difference in their treatment. THAT is the point my Irish relatives were making. It truly did point out the stupidity in judging anyone by color instead of the kind of person they are, which is the only judgment I can bring myself to make. I don't care if you are Irish or Black or Asian... if you are an asshole, you are an asshole. Get it?

[yurbud]

12. I've been black since 2000 when Black Caucus stood up for us while

White Dems sat silent.

[tinfoilinfor2005]

16. Black Caucus stood up for all of us as the white dems sat silent

and it appears they are paying for that shame as we speak.

[IndyOp]

32. This is EXACTLY how I feel - the CBC speak for me...

After seeing Rev. Jackson stick his neck out last November to try and carry the truth about election fraud to the people - I was captured. I had never appreciated that man's courage before. I admired him, but I did not 'get it'. I'm sure I still don't completely, but...

Knowing the truth about the stolen election and having everyone treat me like I was insane or stupid (or both) - having my rights trampled, the value of my life, thereby diminished - that was my experience of the theft of last November's election. A friend (who did not believe me about the theft of the election, but still 'got' my experience) summed it up this way, "Road hard and put up wet. Now you know a bit about the black american experience."

I am also in complete agreement with Howard Zinn when he talks about how black opinion about the US is far more accurate, far more willing to see the US for what it is than white opinion. Zinn talked about feeling immediately, completely at home when a guest on a talk radio station in D.C. - black callers got it right on issue after issue.

I am at the point (in my Red State) where I initially regard whites with suspicion and disdain, but feel immediate kinship with blacks and internationals. I can let loose around these people and see their surprise and amusement and appreciation and relief. If I speak truth to whites I am way too often instantly put in the position of defending my case.

On a completely geeky note: A favorite research finding of mine involving brain imaging - White people who initially show brain activity indicating fear when shown pictures of blacks, hispanics, others... are told a story in which they are the protagonistic and shown pictures of the other characters. When all of the characters who help them in the 20-minute story are black, hispanic, other -- the brain activity indicating fear goes away for those particular pictures and for pics of others of the same ethnic groups. Implication: Racism must be carefully taught and constantly reinforced for it to remain strong.

[journalist3072]

18. As an African-American, thank you for that

I am always proud to be an African-American, but I think that these past two weeks have made me more proud that usual.

Because we have stepped up in a major way to help the least among us, taking them into our homes, clothing them, etc.

It has really helped restore my faith in humanity in general.

And here in DC, there have even been some hair salons that have provided services (hair wash, cuts, manicures, etc) to the evacuees we have here.

One of my favorite stories from here this week, was how a woman took some clothes and shoes down to the D.C. Armory where some of the evacuees are. She was told by the Red Cross they didn't need them, b/c they had enough. So she took matters into her own hands, and simply put the shoes right on an evacuee outside of the Armory.

[katinmn]

30. We as a nation are only as great as the least among us

And by least we mean those not born with ready access to

Money
Education
Health care

[journalist3072]

41. You are absolutely correct.

And we have an obligation to do the most we can for the least among us. For those people who cannot make it above the poverty line. For those families working 2 jobs and are still "food insecure."

And that's what really makes me angry about how they were treated in New Orleans.

These are tax-paying American citizens, just like the rest of us. And they did exactly as they were told to do: go to the Superdome if you can't evacuate.

Yet, their government failed them.

[lonestarnot]

21. Am Irish for real on St. Patty's day, but I've been black for years now!

BLACK AND PROUD OF IT!

[NNadir]

23. When one thinks of the rich cultural wealth African Americans have brought

to this country, and how much of it is in each and every American - including even the racists themselves - one doesn't have to go very far to do this.

It is a disgrace that for all that we have been given by this rich culture, the culture of African-Americans which has probably had more influence on American culture than any other ethnic group, that such a huge negative disparity in treatment still exists.

It makes me sick even to think of it.

[journalist3072]

26. Absolutely right

As an African-American, it is my ancestors that helped build the White House, the Capitol, and a lot of other infastructures in our Nation's capital, and in this country as a whole.

This nation was built on the backs of slaves.

And we can see how the African-American community has been rewarded.

What's interesting too is how, even in the face of racism, African-Americans have remained loyal and faithful to this country. My grandfather was in the army. He fought in the Korean War, and was injured. Yet, he still experienced racism living on the base, and within the Army. But my mother said he was still a soldier through and through.

[stepnw1f]

25. I'm With You)

Time we unite and fight our common enemy.

[jokerman93]

27. Who said this?

"As long as any of my brothers are opressed, I walk with them."

[tinfoilinfor2005]

40. Nelson Mandela?

Maybe John or Robert Kennedy? Just guessing.

[linazelle]

28. Randi's black. Welcome all you new black folk! Glad to have you.

:hug:

[katinmn]

36. We are there, linazelle!

:hi: :hug: :grouphug:

[Paradise]

31. six degrees of separation... n/t

[G_j]

34. Yes n/t

[stubtoe]

39. I have been noticing ,,,

a pouring out of hearts all over the place to the hurricane survivors. It does encourage me. I think a layer of "I don't care about those folks" has been peeled away from a lot of white America.

[AnnieBW]

42. Say It Loud, Say It Proud

I'm an "uh-oh Oreo" and I'm proud!

* Annie dances to some P-Funk