The Loon Goes off on me again re abortion

[DanCa]

My sister got in my sister and was pushing the lifer crap on. I tried to politely remove my self from the converstion twice because I said am pro neutreal because I am a man and I can't control a women's body.
She than said if I was a woman under what conditions would I find abortion moral. I said drew out my breath and told her if If the woman's life is a danger, or if she would wind up crippled from the birth, or under rape, or if the baby had a terminable disease than yeah I'd consider it moral because I believe in self deffense. But basically it's not my decision.
so she gets bent out of shape and calls me all kinds of ugly names and says there isn't anything called self deffense. But I got back at her and I said , really I thought that was your president's original position as well. If am a hypocrite he must be one too. She fired back flipping me off and leavving.

[eleny]

1. Hit a nerve, huh?!

[GreenPartyVoter]

2. Flipped you off? How Christian of her! Seriously, babe, you may want

to think about divorcing your sister. She's downright toxic. :hug:

[DanCa]

3. Is there anyway to purify your gene pool?

I was just wondering.

[GreenPartyVoter]

4. Not that I know of. :^P

[azureblue]

5. easy way stop her

Just ask her, "what did Christ say about this?"
Anything she will reply will be in conflict with the teachings of Christ, so tell her so. If she persists, the ask her why she chooses not to follow the teachings of Christ? Then conclude with, "well, your words tell me and God that you are not a Christian, so I will pray for you."

Don't even bother debating abortion with these loonies. Their stance is based on cherry picking Bible verses, so you go for the heart of the matter- religious belief.

[youthere]

6. Tell her you want to keep the "innocent lives" from being born sinners.

Apparently human beings spoil from being exposed to air. :sarcasm:

[DanCa]

8. Carbon atoms

Next time she is enjoying a thick cheeseburger Ill simply point out that she's murdering unborn children. I mean you and I are carbon atoms and charcoal is a form of carbon.

[SheilaT]

7. If your sister does not believe

in abortion, then she shouldn't have one. But she shouldn't be putting herself in the position of making medical decisions for others. Is she a doctor? And if she is, is she the doctor to the specific woman contemplating the abortion? I didn't think so.

The truly sad thing is that "pro-lifers" have abortions at approximately the same rate as those of us who are pro-choice. Personally, I think every single one of them should be outed.

Oh! Oh! Ask her if she supports universal health care, and you assume she utterly opposes the death penalty and war.

(When I was running for office last year the "you must also be opposed to the death penalty" was very effective with the pro-lifers. I'm sure I didn't get a single vote that way, but I could tell that some of them were forced to think about it.

[DanCa]

9. I never understood the whole

pro war pro death penality pro gun pro life cult screw the poor mentality myself either.

[Zynx]

10. "If you don't believe in abortion, don't have one."

That argument doesn't work with pro-lifers for one simple reason: they see abortion as murder. That's like saying, to them at least, "If you don't like murder, don't kill.". I am personally staunchly opposed to abortion except in the normal exceptions, but policywise I would never impose my views. That's up to the courts and the states, not me.

[SheilaT]

14. Sometimes it works.

I used that line on a young (he was about 14 at the time) right-winger who would constantly bait me, and it actually brought him to complete silence for about a minute. And, he actually thought through what I was saying and seemed to rethink his position.

Or the next time someone says something like, What if you're mother had had an abortion, point out that Hitler's mother certainly should have.

[Ladyhawk]

11. DanCa, I wish you could limit interaction with this sister.

She does sound like a loon and I can tell you're upset. You don't need her crap when you have so much of your own to deal with. Man, I wish I could help you.

As you know, I have my own set of fundy / freeper family members. I cut off family relationships for several months after the election because I just couldn't take any more of their shit. I had to re-establish relationships after my surgery because I was much worse off than I thought I would be.

Even though I am seeing family again, I think they respect my boundaries a bit more since I cut them off. They know I will do it again if I have to. Unfortunately, my mother thinks I did it just to hurt her. Not true. I did it so I wouldn't go stark raving mad.

If there's any way at all you can establish boundaries with your sister, it would be oh so helpful. She needs to STFU. :(

[DanCa]

16. Yeah but when your license was taken away you have to make do

Where in the same boat. I am glad you can reconcile with your family somewhat. Hang in there Danny. :hugs:

[Ladyhawk]

17. Yeah, that's a big problem, all right. I wish I could create better

boundaries, too. :(

[dsc]

12. For the record the self defense case is the mother having a disease

not the fetus. Otherwise that is a fair point.

[davsand]

13. I'm sorry. .

We don't get to pick our families, unfortunately. Because of that one reality we find ourselves in horrible painful discussions like that one.

I dunno if you want to hear this or not, but IMO, most people have definite opinions on abortion and no matter HOW you talk to them you are NOT going to sway minds who find abortion to be wrong. Similarly, the people who feel that choice is a fundamental thing for women can't be converted with the usual anti-choice rhetoric.

I do think, however, it is possible to make headway sometimes when you talk about the safety of women if abortion becomes illegal. Simply put, when abortion is illegal women die. It is a sad horrible truth--but a truth non-the-less.

As long as we live in a world where the BEST contraceptive technology we can get will STILL leave 3 or 4 women out of 100 pregnant against their will. The old "well, don't have sex" argument won't get it either, because MARRIED women get accidentally pregnant too...

In an ideal world abortion is a rare procedure because every pregnancy is a chosen one. In our world, we need better information and education about reproduction, better contraceptives and more freely available contraceptives. At that point, abortion will become a thing of the past.

If the anti choice crowd is SERIOUS about making abortion stop they will embrace the realities and work to fix them.



Laura

[DanCa]

15. Well like i said

I am neutreal on this decision because it's not my place to judge some one. I am not kresking I donot know what lies in the minds of another person. I also believe that there are many secondary conditions why i can't get in this whole pro life thing.
1: while I will stand up for anyones right to protest on private property the way they protest bother my "personal beliefs".

2: I am unappologeticly pro stem cell most not all lifers are against stem cell.

3: Than theres the whole right to practice religion angle and every other ethical dillemia surrounding it.

See there are many many reasons why I can't get involved in the prolife momvement and abortion itself is just the tip of the iceberg.

[norml]

18. What's it to her what other people do with the cells of their own bodies

reproductive or otherwise.