The new Dinar

[Friar]

Just released in Iraq, the newly designed script has portraits of secular figures from the past, monuments from Arabic history and animals. I bet the deeply religious Iraqis, whether Sunni or Shia, are going to be offended. Their most important historical figures are of a religious nature. This appears to be another desperate attempt by BushCo to force a secular government on the beleagured country. I doubt this will ever be acceptable to the people of Iraq.

Trying to keep Islam out of an Islamic nation is just as stupid as everything else they do.

There's an intractable split between the various factions of Islam, mostly Sunni and Shia, that may very well be irreconcilable but for sure it will not be resolved by a secular government or secular ideologies. I don't have a solution but apparently, neither does the West.

Does anyone here really think a secular government will ever succeed in Iraq?

[BBradley]

1. I wouldn't want Jesus on our money.

I wouldn't want the Apostles, and I wouldn't want Moses. I'm sure there is atleast one Athiest in Iraq, and that one Athiest is probably just as happy as I am that there won't be religious figures on their currency.

[Friar]

3. We are a secular nation though.

And founded on secular principles. I hate having "under God" on our money and in the Pledge of Allegiance. I think it's unconstitutional.

We're sort of a mirror image of Iraq and other mideast countries, which are not a secular people.

[BBradley]

4. I don't think the region needs another theocracy.

If we're going to rebuild Iraq, I think we should do so in a manner that reaffirms the rights of those that live there that aren't Muslim. Having a Government controlled by Islam doesn't do that.

[Paschall]

6. Saddam protected non-Muslims in Iraq

Tarek Aziz, of mustachioed fame, is a Christian. And Iraqi Christians have been vocal about their new fear of religious persecution that we made possible when we "removed" their protector, Saddam.

This is another of many reasons why the invasion was fundamentally ill-conceived.

[K-W]

7. Well, thats iffy logic

I dont think thats why invasion was ill concieved, its not as if Saddam didnt persecute those he feared as enemies. Religion is, like everywhere including the US and extremely difficult issue and one likely without an answer, but I think including islam in the new iraqi gov. would, from a simple tactical point of view be wise.

[Paschall]

9. Personally, I think anything we think is irrelevant

Iraq belongs to the Iraqis and it is theirs to decide. But it is undeniable that everyone with sense foresaw the religious hornet's nest we were smacking when we crossed the Iraqi border.

In fact, in 1991, when Cheney boasted about the accomplishments of Gulf War I, he specifically defended Bush Sr. from accusations of having not finished "the job," because--he said--we could not predict the political-religious outcome of Saddam's fall. Civil war that could, via the Kurds, draw in Turkey, or via the Shia draw in Iran? A reactionary Shia regime to rival Ayatollah Khomenei's? None of the prospects sounds good. And we've set the machine in motion.

[K-W]

5. Iraq was a secular nation

under Saddam, and the U.S. isnt really a secular nation, we just have an idealistically secular government.

[Friar]

8. By "nation" I meant

our government, our laws, our international personae.

I realize most Americans have religious convictions. But what made us a great country, and this is an integral part of the Revolution against Britain, we kept religion out of law, government and commerce, etc. At least we did until the last few decades. And look at all the trouble that's caused. The founding fathers most brilliant idea was that government is not a church. Title IX of the Treaty of Tripoli should have been included in the constitution.

[K-W]

2. I dont think the currency itself is much of an issue

but keeping islam out of our system of control in Iraq is a serious mistake. I realize how much Islam scares the imperialists, but they should know better than anyone how powerful religion is and find a way to keep it under control. Though I certainly hope they dont.

[tiredchap]

10. In Islam it's a sin to picture humans. That's why Islamic art

is usually geometric

[Friar]

11. What about all the portraits of the Imams

and Ayatollahs paraded around by protesters? Are they defying God?

Religion so confuses me...

[tiredchap]

12. Basically, yes

But only the most fundamentalist types (Saudi, Taliban) actually do something about it. Think Jerry Falwell and compare to most Christians.

[Paschall]

13. Yes, even Suleyman the Magnificent...

...left the Hagia Sophia frescos of the Virgin and Jesus untouched after he conquered Constantinople and turned the basilica into a mosque.

There are some wonderful figurative works from that period, particularly miniatures.

But I'm curious: Is it not true that in the more fundamentalist sects of Islam even the artistic representation of animals is prohibited?

(And welcome to DU, tiredchap. Hope you enjoy it around here. :hi: )

[tiredchap]

14. Hi there

Yes it is. My guess the Bush admin/puppet Iraqi gov wanted a compromise. This does seem to be a time they've got it right. (Hey Law of Averages say they must once in a while).

[newyawker99]

15. Hi tiredchap!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[TryingToWarnYou]

16. If Bushco actually had some kind of benevolent intent....

They would have created several choices for the new Dinar and let the Iraqi people pick the one that they actually want.

They apparently aren't going to be able to select their own government so they should at least be able to select the money they are going to have to look at.