The moral thing to do is to go on the offensive....

[kentuck]

Since these mofos are attempting to destroy our nation and are doing a damn good job at it, we have a moral obligation to prevent them from doing further damage. They are in a weak and defensive position. As a political Party, we should not hesitate to take the offensive. We should ram all their dangerous and destructive ideas and policies down their throats. Let them yell about partisanship. Let them say what they will. We tell the people the facts and let them sort it out. If it hurts the feelings of a few assholes like Orrin Hatch, then so be it. Take back our country. Don't be shy.

[lumberjack_jeff]

1. Yes. "F" the high road. n/t

[catnhatnh]

4. Tell the Republicans....

...You take the high road,
and we'll take the low road,
...we both need a change of scenery...

[Bernardo de La Paz]

24. Yes, take the offensive, don't abandon the high road, truth on our side

Yes, take the offensive. Now's the time. Keep the pressure on.

Floodgate / Plamegate are to Bush as Watergate is to Nixon.

The truth will come out. The Republicans can nix a Senate investigation for the time being, but the American public are angry and want the truth. Hammer the truth home. Bush and the Republicans can run but they can't hide.

[Roachman]

2. Agree completely

Unfortunately, this is the moral thing to do with lying fascists before they are in control, as well as during, and after their control.

[closeupready]

3. Funny you should bring this up.

I was just thinking the same thing in terms of the MA anti-gay amendment which was just rejected by legislator there.

The minority leader Lees (GOP) made a comment along the lines of well, we've had gay marriage for a while now, nothing bad has happened, I guess it's okay. Why did he buck the GOP's homophobia?

Because, IMO, Democrats in Calfornia seized the moral high ground and passed gay marriage legislation in CA, putting Schwarz. on the defensive, but also helping to "mainstream" the issue.

See what happens when Dems show a little courage - not just on gay marriage? On lots of issues - Iraq; the economy; social security. Dems could really seize the issues if they'd stop this triangulation BS.

[FSogol]

5. I agree. Why...

Why aren't the democratic leaders acting? The only voice I hear is Deans.

[RethugAssKicker]

10. The Black Caucus is actually the only ones speaking up!

Why do you forget them?

John Conyers
Barbara Lee

etc.etc.

[GreenPartyVoter]

29. Exactly. They were hot last night. And where were the rest of the Dems?

Were they there supporting the, listening to what they had to say? I dunno. I didn't see a shot of the whole chamber but from what area I could see there were an awful lot of empty seats.

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[Doctor_J]

6. Our party's moral leaders have been kicked to the curb

Jesse Jackson, John Conyers, Henry Waxman, Sheila Jackson Lee, Maxine Waters, Ted Kennedy, Barbara Boxer, Russ Feingold, Cynthia McKinney and Paul Wellstone have been forsaken by and for Joe Lieberman, John Breaux, and the other appeasers. "The party", as an entity, is nearly as morally bankrupt as the GOP.

[Frances]

7. This thread started out

being against Repubs.

I wondered how long it would be before it became a bash Dems thread.

We will never take back this country if we can't keep our attention focused on Repubs!

Repeat after me: I am a Dem. I am a winner!

[Bellamia]

8. I am a Dem; I am a winner!

[Frances]

12. Thank you!

nt

[OneBlueSky]

9. reality check . . .

BushCo is government of, by, and for the corporations . . .

Democrats, like Republicans, get their cash (and in many cases their marching orders) from their corporate sponsors . . .

therefore, Democrats are not likely to "bite the hand that feeds them" by strongly opposing BushCo policies . . .

the ONLY way the Democratic Party will ever "go on the offensive" is if the rank and file start a massive grassroots movement demanding that all Democratic candidates refuse any and all corporate contributions of any kind . . .

[Frances]

11. Reforming the Dem party at this time

is a luxury and nothing else. If every single Dem in Congress voted the way you want them to on every single vote, it would do no good whatsoever as Dems are in a minority.

If you truly want change in this country, you must get the Repubs into the minority.

[Armstead]

14. No,no,no,no !

We can only get the repubs in the minority by reforming the Democratic Party.

That's not a luxury. It's a necessity -- both politically and for the good of the nation.

One of the biggest reasons the Democrats have been skunked is not because of the freepers. It's because too many people perceive (correctlty) that there is very little difference between the corporate Democrats and the corporate GOP.

That awareness may be subliminal, but it is why average middle-of-the-road people choose eitehr the strong image of Republicans or the "Nuthin we can do about it" fatalism of political apathy.

The Democrats have to stop feeding at the corporate trough, and make a break and start standing up for the majority in a meaningful way again.

[kentuck]

19. Bingo!

Once a grassroots candidate shows the Party that this is the way to go, then they we follow. It is unfortunate that no one in the Democratic Party is willing to take the gamble...

[Doctor_J]

13. OK, I'll repeat

I'm a Dem! I haven't had a say in how the country's run for years! And there's no end in sight!

I am not bashing Dems. The people I mentioned, along with Jimmy Carter and a handful of others, are the only ones providing some resistance to the storm troopers trying to provoke WWIII. If we can make them the party's moral center, help may be on the way.

[Frances]

15. Just remember, no one in power is listening to Jimmy Carter

And no one will unless Dems are in the majority.

We can do our house cleaning AFTER we get the majority.

For example, I don't particularly like Diane Feinstein, but I don't plan to campaign against her because she does not have any real power. No Democrat does. If Dems can hang together long enough for us to get a majority, I may work for an opponent of hers in a future Dem primary.

In the next election, I plan to put my energies into replacing a Republican representative with a Democrat in a neighboring district (I have an excellent Dem representative in my own district).

In other words, while I am a passionate person, I do have a brain and I intend to use it to save our country.

[Frances]

16. Dupe

nt

[Frances]

17. dupe

nt

[Toots]

18. "Republicans say Democrats give them Hell, we give them the truth and they

think it is Hell" Harry Truman.. Wouldn't it be nice to have a real Democrat around once again.

[kweerwolf]

20. Another Truman quote I've been using lately ...

... sums up my thoughts about the DLC and "appeasement" types who are destroying the principles the Democratic Party once stood for:

"Voters are smart. Give them a choice between a real Republican and a fake one, they'll pick the real one every time."

[kentuck]

21. If we had a Democratic leader say this tomorrow.....

...another Democrat would follow right behind and say, "No, I don't think this is the time to raise taxes..." They can never sing off the same page. It has to be shown to them that they are on the winning side or they will forever be too cautious to win back the majority, in my opinion.

[KharmaTrain]

22. It's A Long Slow Awakening

I see so much impatience here...and I don't blame you. I'm as frustrated as anyone as what I've seen happen to this country go beyond my greatest fears of 5 years ago. How this country has regressed has me frustrated no end...and to see how widespread this regression has crept into our society was alarming as well.

Sadly, like the NOLA FPD in the wake of the storm, we have few weapons to fight this Repugnican storm and sewage surge and what resources we have, we must use wisely. It's going to take more and more Repugnican excesses to wake people up and then they still aren't easily convinced to look to Democrats as an alternative.

I fear many will tune out all sides and withdraw from the "system"...allowing the fringes on both sides to divide this country further...and all if it being egged on by politicians who see gold and power in those divisions.

On a good note, I see major attitude change in this country...for those who are seeing what's happening and want to look objectively at what's going on, they're seeing they've been lied to and this regime as many of us always have.

Recently I saw a poll that showed Junior's real support...or the strongly approves (the baby-eaters) at 27%, while those who strongly disapprove (those with souls, brains and compassion) are at 45%. Now to convert those numbers into House and Senate Seats next year.

[Armstead]

25. 30 years is long enough

That's about how long the Democrats have gone along withe the Republican message that Corporations have the divine right to ursurp democracy, grow endlessly and that the needs of individuals don;t amount to spit.

The 90's was just Bushism with a somewhat kinder and much smarter facade. But the DLC democrats were just as guilty of allowing this consolidation and classism to accelerate as the GOP was.

We need a clean break with that kind of nonsense. And we needed it yesterday!

[KharmaTrain]

26. Times And Tides Move Slowly

That's what I mean by impatience.

Yes, for over 30 years (since 1972 IMHO), the Repugncans have "out-messaged" the Democrats...first distorting and now dominating the political rhetoric and body politic.

Democrats, then, as now, sadly, still find more faults with our own than we do in the real threats. Determining whose a "real" Democrat or which issue is more important or fighting among one another due to the mixing of those two has created a big disconnect as well.

Hitting people who have been overdosed with harsh left or liberal ideas and ideals after they've been fed so much right wing dogmas for so long is both unrealistic and counterproductive. Those who are opening their eyes don't need to be reminded how wrong they were...or how they should conform across the board to a boiler plate of other issues. They need to be reached in a careful but positive manner.

It's not a clean break as much as it's developing a more cohesive party that focuses in on the elements needed to stem the right wing tide in this country and start the pendulum moving in the other direction.

[kentuck]

27. How much worse does it have to get ?

i've noticed an assumption by many Democrats that believe when things get so bad, people will have no choice but to turn to the Democratic Party. Big Mistake. It doesn't work that way.

[KharmaTrain]

28. Agreed...

Wish I knew, my friend. My red flags starting going up during the Carter days. Other have along the way as well. One who I remember speaking out years ago...a real voice in the wilderness was Mike Malloy when he was on WSB in Atlanta and then WLS in Chicago.

The "conventional wisdom" is Democrats were "too intellectual" to fight. We felt the obsurdity of the right wing's argument would collapse under its own moral or ideological ineptitude. However trying to force a massive shift in the other direction as the only way to "fix" this country is not what is realistic.

Honestly, I wish I could say there was a Democratic party I could look to as a Repugnican looks to their party. I wish there was some semblence of a nation/state/local infrastructure that could generate the voters to win elections. I wish I could see more reason TO vote for a Democrat than not to (especially if I'm an Independent or Republican). There's precious time to articulate these messages and I'm not hearing the right voices enough.

Cheers...

[Armstead]

30. Trying to force a massive shift is necessary for survival

The longer it goes on the worse it gets. The bigger and more entrenched the Corporate Monopolies get, the harder it will be to dismantle their power and replace it with some semblamce of economic justice and democracy.

We've been losing for 30 years. It seems to me like there are only two alternatives. Keep doing the same things and keep losing. Or try something different (reallyu just restore the liberal roots) and have a chance at making positive changes.

I just have lost all patience with perebbial calls for patience. At this point too much caution is just stagnation that perpetutuates social and economic decay.

[stevietheman]

23. Totally agree... this is no time to be wienies. Fire at will, Number One.

n/t