Pasadena couple forced to remove pro-Sheehan and anti-W signs.

[madfloridian]

This is just so totally outrageous. I admire their standing up for their rights.

http://www.blogforamerica.com/archives/006910.html

Putting the City of Pasadena on Notice
Patrick Briggs and Mary Gavel-Briggs were forced to remove two political signs that read "Support Cindy Sheehan" and "War starts with W.' Bush Lied. People Died." from the front of their home. They join us with their story of taking up the issue of freedom of speech.

Maddie and I are fighting the good fight once again. This time with the incredible help of the ACLU. They are filing suit on our behalf against the City of Pasadena regarding restoration of our free speech rights and our being able to put up political signs in our own yard. Our ever-present Howard Dean sign was on view for many of the stories run on the local tv networks here in Los Angeles tonight (though that wasn't the sign in contention).



Howard Dean has always said, "we have the power to take our country back." It was this message of empowerment and its bottom-up approach to progressive political organizing which first got us involved in politics two years ago. We've acted to embody that message ever since. The stand we've taken on this 1st Amendment issue is all about that.

Seeing the responses from our neighbors, friends and from people we've not yet met it's reaffirming to observe just what Dean meant about power. When we each take responsibility to involve ourselves in the public sphere, to speak truth to power, and to care about something/someone beyond ourselves, we embolden others to do the same. We (all of us!) really are the leaders we've been waiting for!

With a whole lot of passion!

Patrick Briggs and Mary Gavel-Briggs (Maddie)

[Bouncy Ball]

1. Good for them!!!

The city government in Stinkadena sucks.

[WatchWhatISay]

6. I'm pretty sure this happened in Pasadena CA

not Texas.

(I know where Stinkadena is)

[wtmusic]

2. That is astonishing

Pasadena is not particularly "red". How could they force them to take the signs down? Must have pulled some bullshit zoning ordinance out of their ass.

[DemBones DemBones]

7. Maybe a size limit on signs in yards?

I can see that being the objection as that's a large sign. ( After-all, who'd want to live next door to a Bush billboard?)

But is this size sign allowed during campaigns? If so, why not now?

[wtmusic]

11. Good point

Here in Burbank which is just down the road a piece, garage sale signs ( and possibly any yard sign, AFAIK) are limited to 6 sq ft

[Kenroy]

24. such laws have been ruled unconstitutional in California

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?navby=search&case=/data2/circs/9th/9716061.html

There are exceptions for certain commercial reasons (real estate open house signs, garage sales, etc.)

[wtmusic]

29. Appears to apply only to public property nt

[marions ghost]

28. 6 sq ft seems reasonable

kick for the first amendment

[Beaverhausen]

46. I know these two- they are very active in the local Democratic group

I meet them through working for Dean.

The Pasadena Democratic Party group is very active and very well organized.

[Rainscents]

3. I'm glad that ACLU is involve!

[SaveElmer]

4. Homeowners association?

Some have rules against lawn signs of any kind. As long as they enforce it fairly there is no law against it.

[wtmusic]

8. They would still have to agree to the terms

of the association, in which case it would seem kind of pointless to fight it

[DemBones DemBones]

10. Yeah, some places you can't have

a clothesline or a basketball goal visible from the street, even if they're in your back yard. I can see people not wanting their neighbors to hang their undies in the front yard, but forbidding it in the backyard is another matter.

[SoCalDem]

27. Our "code enforcement" people are relentless

I swear..the guy must follow the trash truck. If my husband forgets to put the trash cans behind the gate , we'll get a notice on our door within a few hours after the trash guys..

and we were "ordered" to paint a weathered wood park bench, because it "looked bad"....

we have also been ordered to move a car that was behind the fence and totally un-seeable from the street.

[Arugula Latte]

37. Jeez. The amount of time and energy some people spend

making sure everything is sterile and "pleasantville" perfect is astounding.

Don't they have anything else they could spend their time on? Apparently not.

[me b zola]

12. Home owners associations

Hubbie & I are looking for property in the country. We found a perfect 20 acre lot, but they wanted us to sign a "covenant". The land was more than we wanted to pay per acre, but we were willing to pay (becuse it was so great) until the dreaded "covenant" got mentioned. Deal breaker. When we own something I'll be damned if someone else is going to tell us what we can do with it. Damn, that was a great piece of land, oh well.

[countmyvote4real]

13. How binding was the "covenant?"

Could you have signed under duress? I know that would probably be a deal killer on the seller's part, but I am curious.

[me b zola]

18. We didn't have a lawyer look at it, but it was fairly obvious

It was a developer selling a chunk of prime land in the country.
Anyone who owned more parcels of land would have more votes as to what was or wasn't going to be done.

There were gravel roads that were common to all of the parcels of land. One of the more obvious things that could have bit us was if several people wanted to pay to have the roads paved.

Regardless of all of the little issues that could have come up, the bigger issue was that they could have put a lean on our property if we did not contribute to every project that they voted on. That could lead to a home owner losing their home/land. Bullshit. We will keep looking for what we want without someone else having say over what we pay at the threat of losing our land.

As liberal as I am, I do have a libertarian streak in me. My land is my land. I will pay taxes and other than that people can kiss my ass if they want to control my life on my land :)

[MADem]

19. I won't touch a HOA with a fifty foot pole

Onerous bastards, frankly. Zoning is one thing, in terms of mixing residences and business districts, but those clowns can tell you what color you must paint your house. That is nonsensical, to my mind.

You know, Chief Justice Rhenquist had a restrictive covenant on his home...it could not be sold to anyone who was Jewish. It was unenforceable because of Fair Housing laws, but it was right there in his deed...says something about the GOP, to my mind, and what it says ain't good.

[BikeWriter]

25. I had a HOA harass me for several years. Turned out...

I was on a street the agreement did not apply to. I was damned proud of that.

[MADem]

42. You should have sued them for harassment and emotional distress!!

Some lawsuits are frivolous, but that sort of smackback is simply justice, IMO!!!!

[ColonelTom]

26. Probably a covenant running with the land

Odds are Rehnquist didn't put it in there and couldn't remove it. I wouldn't draw any conclusions about Rehnquist from that.

[CBGLuthier]

39. BULLSHIT

He could have bought another house.

Besides there is plenty of evidence Rehnquist was a true-blue anti-semite. Supposedly he would dress up in a brown shirt and march in front of the jewish housing when he was in college.

[MADem]

41. I would, this was the guy who delighted in anti-semetic jokes while at

Stanford. Read this, it is enlightening: http://news.yahoo.com/s/huffpost/20050905/cm_huffpost/006844
Let’s begin at the beginning. Rehnquist bragged about being first in his class at Stanford Law School. Today Stanford is a great law school with a diverse student body, but in the late 1940s and early 1950s, it discriminated against Jews and other minorities, both in the admission of students and in the selection of faculty. Justice Stephen Breyer recalled an earlier period of Stanford’s history: “When my father was at Stanford, he could not join any of the social organizations because he was Jewish, and those organizations, at that time, did not accept Jews.” Rehnquist not only benefited in his class ranking from this discrimination; he was also part of that bigotry. When he was nominated to be an associate justice in 1971, I learned from several sources who had known him as a student that he had outraged Jewish classmates by goose-stepping and heil-Hitlering with brown-shirted friends in front of a dormitory that housed the school’s few Jewish students. He also was infamous for telling racist and anti-Semitic jokes....

As a law clerk, Rehnquist wrote a memorandum for Justice Jackson while the court was considering several school desegregation cases, including Brown v. Board of Education. Rehnquist’s memo, entitled “A Random Thought on the Segregation Cases,” defended the separate-but-equal doctrine embodied in the 1896 Supreme Court case of Plessy v. Ferguson. Rehnquist concluded the Plessy “was right and should be reaffirmed.” When questioned about the memos by the Senate Judiciary Committee in both 1971 and 1986, Rehnquist blamed his defense of segregation on the dead Justice, stating – under oath – that his memo was meant to reflect the views of Justice Jackson. But Justice Jackson voted in Brown, along with a unanimous Court, to strike down school segregation. According to historian Mark Tushnet, Justice Jackson’s longtime legal secretary called Rehnquist’s Senate testimony an attempt to “smear[] the reputation of a great justice.” Rehnquist later admitted to defending Plessy in arguments with fellow law clerks. He did not acknowledge that he committed perjury in front of the Judiciary Committee to get his job.

The young Rehnquist began his legal career as a Republican functionary by obstructing African-American and Hispanic voting at Phoenix polling locations (“Operation Eagle Eye”). As Richard Cohen of The Washington Post wrote, “e helped challenge the voting qualifications of Arizona blacks and Hispanics. He was entitled to do so. But even if he did not personally harass potential voters, as witnesses allege, he clearly was a brass-knuckle partisan, someone who would deny the ballot to fellow citizens for trivial political reasons -- and who made his selection on the basis of race or ethnicity.” In a word, he started out his political career as a Republican thug.

Rehnquist later bought a home in Vermont with a restrictive covenant that barred sale of the property to ''any member of the Hebrew race.”

The man was a racist pig, cheery little gold stripes and all.

[Patiod]

34. My parents have a friend who harrasses people

She is pround that the trashcans in their condo are all identical in color. If you buy the wrong shade of tan, she'll write you up.

I would never buy a property controlled by a HOA

[Daphne08]

38. OMG, that is sick.

That woman is a control freak. Can you imagine being married to someone like that? Or having her for a mother?

[Melsky]

45. My aunt is like that

They live in a subdivision with all these rules. She actually measured her neighbor's fence and reported it for being 4 inches over the limit and reported another neighbor for painting his house an unapproved shade of brown.

[nolabels]

33. Surrender your rights on that next contract you sign.

Everybody always wants to stick their nose in your business even if the only thing you want do is make a political statement

I find much advertisement abhorrent but I don't make it point to fight it. I look at advertisers as needy, people with things that can't sell there selves because the inherent value is not there. Word and mouth is always much more effective than any sign.

[spuddonna]

5. This is insane...

So, why don't we just give Iraq our Constitution... We don't seem to use it anymore! :eyes:

[Richard D]

9. I have a feeling that . . .

. . . any signs like that in Pasadena would not be allowed. Whether republican or democrat.

[flyarm]

14. i was just forced to remove mine too !!

in nj ...after getting wonderful notes in my mailbox and at my front step..and honks galore and several newspaper stories ..and after the signs were up 6 weeks!@
i had huge signs hanging from my 4th story decking ( its a beach house with reversed living ( kit on top) ...with an open air deck on top of house for views...

well i had giant signs...and i was just made to remove them as per city ordinences...

and the day the city guy came a suburban went by when the city guy was there and gave me a thumbs down..so i am sure that was the asshole that found the law to make me remove the signs..
the city guy felt bad and told me i had 15 days to remove them..so i waited out the full 15 days,,and i saw Cindy Sheehan in Philly so i gave her my signs wrapped up! with all the newspaper stories of my sings and all the pics in the papers...

the city guy told me how i can hang signs though..he told me i could put professional signs on the 3rd story deck..6x6..so i have those signs being made now!!
so screw the freepers..i will do it legal and just as bold only now they will be porfessionally made!! and alot nicer!!

i will not have my voice silenced!!
i live on a main road so the signs are seen by everyone!!

fly ....who will not be silenced!!

[expatriate]

15. Good for you!

Often people end up having to remove signs because of little known ordinances - but you can always get around it by finding out what the size restrictions, etc, are, and then go just a hair under them. I've done this a time or two in the past, when I had complaints about various signs on my property. I then made them about a quarter inch under the size limit and reposted them proudly, to the amusement of the city guy who had to come and tell me to take them down!

Keep that free speech going!

[rateyes]

44. As far as size restrictions on signs...

oftentimes there is "square foot restrictions" but no "height" restriction. I once was told I couldn't have a sign over 20 square feet in area...so, I ALMOST had a sign made that was 1 foot wide and 20 feet high...but, I decided not to "piss off" the neighbors and made it 4x5----but, there was nothing they could have done.

Edit to add: If there is a restriction on size, but not on number, they could always do the "Burma Shave" thing...one word per sign as people drive by; War.Starts.with.W. Bush.lied.people.died...

There's more than one solution to many problems.

[madfloridian]

16. This couple had the W sign up 3 weeks.......

Then when they put up the Sheehan sign, they got a call the next day and a visit. It was not that big, either.

[wtmusic]

30. good work fly

:thumbsup:

[unrepuke]

17. Pasadena, CA sign regs. I'm a sign painter in San Gabriel and have butted

heads with Pasadena before. I found out sometimes you just cannot get a permit no matter how many hours and days you stand in line at City Hall. We just learned to put the sign up and when the guy came around with his ticket book, we paid the $10 fine. When we failed to remove the sign and got a second ticket, also for $10, we paid that one --- and NEVER EVER heard from them again. Price may have gone up some in recent years but at $20 it was well worth it to eliminate the hassle. They won't just come out and say "Give us $20 and we'll leave you alone"

[radwriter0555]

20. "It's better to ask forgiveness than permission" is how the local govs

operate in the LA area.

Excellent information.

[Redstone]

31. "It's better to ask forgiveness than permission" God, how I loathe

that phrase. It's the one the greedheaded, self-centered yuppie fucks from New York City use around here when they break our town's zoning laws, because they feel like the laws shouldn't apply to them; they want to build a 5,500 square foot McMansion on a lot that only legally allows a 2,000 square foot house, and the fact that they want it in their mind is all the justification they need.

God, I hate yuppies. They're every American small town's worst enemy.

Redstone

[earth mom]

36. I loathe (dare I say hate?) yuppies too! LOL!

The way things are going in this country I thought I was just about the only one! :evilgrin:

Oh, and how could anyone could ever buy property that forces you to do what your neighbors want and demand!?! Now there's a definition of TOTAL INSANITY! :crazy:

[Nothing Without Hope]

21. Recommended with thanks! These people show us the power of taking a

stand and refusing to be intimidated. Like Granny D. said,

"It is the loss of faith in our personal power that drives the woes of the world." --"Granny D." Haddock

[ladylibertee]

22. I cannot wait till I get my two bumper stickers in.I swear, the

people here in Green Bay Wisconsin with all their Packer crap had better not say one word to me for having my "BUll SHit" sticker and my "My Body,My Choice" sticker.This is a free country.I will cover my entire car with stuff if I have to. He He :kick: :kick: :kick:

[U4ikLefty]

23. I wonder how big your flag can be??? n/t

[FreedomAngel82]

32. I'm glad they're standing up

No more being told to shut up!

[Gregorian]

35. In a dictatorship, you're not supposed to speak out.

In America, a mandate is really an excuse to ignore the minority. And rule like it's not a Democracy. That is, if you're republican.

If I had those signs where I live, I'd have to have 365 of them, and I'd have to wear kevlar. But Pasadena?!

Thank god for the aclu.

[The Backlash Cometh]

40. Good job.

[Shakespeare]

43. Fucking CC&Rs and homeowners' associations.

Covenants, Conditions & Restrictions.

Beware buying any house or piece of property with one of those attached to it. Wanna put up a basketball hoop for your kids? Whoops, no can do. Want to put political signs in your yard? No fucking way. And on and on.

If you DO want to buy anything that includes a set of CC&Rs, go over it word for word (preferably with the help of an attorney) before you buy.

[Binka]

47. Good Gawd I Am So Happy To Live In Italy

I could burn a car in my yard and the neighbors would ask if they could add their sink to the pile. FYI I would never burn my trash or my car in my yard but it is completely legal. La Dolce Vita!

[jarnocan]

48. ImpeachBush.org Pay what you can SIGNS!

http://www.impeachstore.org/store/
Just do it! Supposedly I live in a consevative town- for NJ. Mike Ferguson - repub. is my rep. I get mostly positive comments. I know there are much worse places-and you can't take too many chances -if you have childern etc. But do what you can.