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LeftHander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 11:52 AM
Original message
Wood pellets delivered and solar power quotes coming
Edited on Thu Sep-22-05 11:55 AM by LeftHander
Over the past two years since moving into my modest (small) home in Wisconsin my wife and I have been slowly converting to renewable energy sources and diversifying our energy sources.

The house was built in 1921 and is walking distance from a historical downtown in the center of an old Wisconsin city of 50k.

When we moved in we converted the house to use to gas for the stove, dryer and water heater. We installed Energy Star washer, dryer and fridge. The wash machine is a front loader and uses less than 1/4 of the water of a top loader does.

The next project was a wood pellet stove to supplement our heating. It ends up we use the pellet stove for over 50% of our heating needs for the past two winters. This winter we are upping that to 80% by increasing the number of hours the stove is operating.

We took out a small loan to pay for the stove and installation. We spent $350 for the winters supply of pellets. 1-1/2 tons. 90 40 lbs. bags of premium hardwood pellets.

Now the next project is underway. Photovoltaic to produce approximately 80% of our electrical energy needs. Last year we used averaged 470kw of electricity per month. This included the electricity used by my rock band that recorded and practiced in the basement for the past year. So I expect this number to drop as we tighten up our conservation habits and move the band studio to a new location.

There are lots of reasons to install a grid tied in PV system now. 2006 the feds have a 30% tax credit up to $2000 dollars installing a new system on a home.

Wisconsin has a solar value add tax credit on PV solar systems. In other words the vaue added to your home for installing a PV system is not added to your homes assessment for property taxes.

http://focusonenergy.com Wisconsin's state and industry sponsored energy program offers a 35% instant cash back rebate on installation and Zero Interest loans for renewable enegery installations.

Adding it all up it equals paying for only about 20% of the total installation costs. The system will pay for itself in less than 3 years.

So next week I have a certified Solar contractor coming over to quote a system and help take advantage of all the incentives in this State program. After the solar install I'll be looking to a small wind turbine to put us into Net electric production. Sure we will be making payments...but better for that that credit cards for junk.

The next car we are buying is going to be a Honda hybrid or VW disel (for bio-desiel, diesel hybrid would be best...hope they are coming soon...) and we a looking at a scooter for local errands as well as more bike riding. Hopefully we will be a one car family soon.

Rather than expensive vacations and racking up the credit cards on bogus consumer garbage...we are using our limited monetary resources to diminish our personal dependance on petroleum. Our goal is to become energy diverse with a strategy of biomass, natural gas, solar and wind electical production.

It is all about living lighter on the earth people. We have no choice now. This is not a right or left political thing anymore...it just makes a hell of a lot of sence to get green...

So get on those bikes, ride the bus, walk, turn the heat down this winter, turn the air conditioner off if you don't really need it and invest in systems for the long term production of electricity from solar and wind energy sources.

Think of the possibilites of thousands and millions of homes generating electricity with wind and solar....for the earths sake don't buy a non-hybrid NEW car. If you are buying a used car consider a quality bicycle, motorcycle or scooter instead...change, do something different.

Don't let your lifestyle and the old petro economy make excuses anymore. That is what helped degrade the planet thus far....it is time to change.

Peace.

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GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 11:53 AM
Response to Original message
1. Awesome!
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Lex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 11:55 AM
Response to Original message
2. Doesn't burning hardwood cause environmental damage too?
It isn't a cleaner source of energy, is it?
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sui generis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. also, how much energy does it take to pelletize hard wood?
just curious -

but it sounds like you've made tremendous effort and that's worth immeasurably more than doing nothing at all and hoping for the best.

I have an old house too - unfortunately a big sprawler. Have replaced walls, floors, furnaces, windows, water heaters, insulation, ductwork, plumbing, etc., and gotten energy efficient appliances - it's just crazy not to do what you can. I know some of my neighbors living in their un-remodeled homes basically live in one room for most of the year - and that was WHILE home energy was relatively cheap.

Older folks on fixed incomes can't manage a 70% hike in their utility bills under any circumstances.

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LeftHander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. Pelletizing is still a minor cost compared to
Natral Gas or fuel oil infrastructre. The pellets are formed by pressure alone in an area close to where the production of sawdust occurs.

The infrastructure to deliver the fule alone tips the balance to wood pellets.

Regional biomass is a very viable energy alternative.




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LeftHander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 12:05 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. I new someone would ask this....
No wood pellets are not "cleaner" interms of particulate matter.

Wood Pellets are a wood industry waste product. Pellets are made from saw dust destined for land fills. they are also "infrastructure" light. No piplines, massive tankers, drilling rigs etc....

Burning them in modern stoves is extremely efficient and clean. to the tune of < 2-4g/hr of fine particulate matter. this is a little dirtier than natural gas that is < 1 g/hr. Compared with cord wood burning fireplace that spews 50-100gs/hr or more particulates into the air and burns very inefficiently.

The big benefit is pellets are greenhouse gas nuetral. It is a renewable resource that absorbs CO2. As compared to natural gas that deposits greenhouse gases.

Corn can also be burned. It will only be a matter of time before other biomass fuel pellets are introduced.

So I consider it a vary acceptable alternative heating fuel.

The stove sends smoke for a few minutes when first starting then no noticeable smoke. Burning a ton (2000 lbs.) of pellets produces on small bucket of ash.
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faithnotgreed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 11:59 AM
Response to Original message
3. fantastic - nominated
Edited on Thu Sep-22-05 12:00 PM by faithnotgreed
i used a pellet insert in my fireplace a couple winters

that i know was some work because that form is all by hand
does yours run on electricity

either way youre doing an exceptional thing and im sure you know how lucky you are
hope your job(s) are close by as well or is there any public transit there

best wishes lefthander
i applaud your commitment to a small imprint
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LeftHander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #3
9. Yes the blower and combustion fans are electric...
was one of my main reasons to go solar...and have a battery backup...

We are doing a grid tied in solar system...most incentives require it.

makes alot of sence to not let any electricty we generate go to waste...might as well sell it back to the utilites.
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faithnotgreed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 12:38 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. solar - you must have wonderful sun coverage
which i dont think about in wisconsin but of course anywhere there is sun there is that possibility it just depends on the cost and return but sounds like you have a great situation
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LeftHander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 12:50 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. Been doing a lot of research...
Wisconsin is not New Mexico when it comes to solar exposure but it does okay. There are many solar intallations through out the upper midwest.

Wisconsin receives about 75% of the annual solar energy received by the deserts of Arizona and Southern California

Lots of data on solar heating days...

Wisconsin averages 4.5 sunlight hours per day in summer and 2.5 in winter.
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faithnotgreed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 01:09 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. great - its a wonderful and sorely needed setup
thank you again to you and your wife for this investment in sanity and caring
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Eurobabe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 12:00 PM
Response to Original message
4. You're amazing, good for you!
I keep telling my hubby we should go off the grid. :)
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me b zola Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 12:13 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. We are planning to go off of the grid eventually
We live in Portland and we never use our furnace, we have a wood stove that provides all of our heat. But we are planning to buy property in the country and go all of the way. Well water, solar energy, and of course wood heat. We plan on growing our own fruits & veggies and having laying hens. I am too scared that I will get attached to animals that would be raised for slaughter ( I'm a city girl), but hubbie is a good hunter and I'm sure our freezer will be full.

All of this started as a dream just to get away from the rat race, but the way things look with the economy, I think we will be doubly happy that we are going to do this:)
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madokie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 12:43 PM
Response to Original message
11. This will be the 14th winter for us using a wood pellet stove
the first 8 years heating a 14 x 80 trailer, the last five heating a 1200 ft house built in the early thirty's. A couple winters we spent a little over 300 bucks for pellets. the rest have been for less. The stove cost 1268.00 in '92. I figure it has saved us its cost many times over. We're planning on upgrading this winter to pass our old one to our son.
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LeftHander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 02:27 PM
Response to Reply #11
19. thanks for sharing...
The more peope know about alternatives the more can participate.

We use a Harmon Accentra stove.

It is in the main living/dining room of our quite small 1921 house.

Two bedroom, 1 bath with 2 bedroom dormer added to attic.

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trekbiker Donating Member (724 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 01:38 PM
Response to Original message
14. how large is your solar array?
how many panels, kw?

here in california it takes 10-15 years to break even on electric savings and thats after all the incentives and rebates and no battery backup costs (system interconnects to utility with no battery storage). Right now it doesnt really pay but new developments in nanotech are going to lead to efficiency breakthru's in a few years.

thats interesting info on the pellet stove. I didnt realize they were that clean
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LeftHander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 02:17 PM
Response to Reply #14
18. Depends on electric usage.
Edited on Thu Sep-22-05 02:21 PM by LeftHander
First design run throuh was for a 3.0 Kw/hr system 16 60"x30" Kyocera 190 Watt panels 15% efficiency. System cost $16K installation a couple more.

With incentives, tax cuts and tie in the amount to pay will be reduced to around 6K...the system should produce 100% of June, July, August and September electricity needs of 400 kw electric usage per month. Actually it may go net in those months and WE Energies pays twice wholesale when buying back. Due toi Net Metering...it literally spins your meter backwards when you are producing more than you are using.
Which mean you are essentiall y getting free energy off the grid. When you need to use grid power during the evening. You basically become a little power plant adding to the grid. Seems like a great deal to me.

Wisconsin averages 750 Kw/month some estimates I've seen for California are between 800-1200 Kw /month.

Our average is 470 kw/month far below the state average. We are pretty good about turning stuff OFF....

For us using less than 400 kw per month is feasible. We ran our AC 12 days this July. Last year we ran it twice. In california where air condisitoners run alot I would expect more energy usage....Into the 800-1200 Kw....

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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 01:56 PM
Response to Original message
15. Great! I have just started looking
into wood/pellet stoves. We are building on the farm next to a 4 acre pond and are going to use it as a GeoThermal source. We are also looking into the stoves. The house is planned with solar panels in mind for the future, we can't afford them quite yet.
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ohio_liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 01:58 PM
Response to Original message
16. I just ordered
Edited on Thu Sep-22-05 02:18 PM by ohio_liberal
a woodburning stove that heats 1400 sq ft. $349.00 plus $97 shipping. My grandmother owns an overgrown farm with tons of trees down. My brother started cutting wood last month. Should help with costs a bunch.

edit typo
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Matariki Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 02:03 PM
Response to Original message
17. congratulations! I'm planning on doing something similar
Edited on Thu Sep-22-05 02:12 PM by kineta
i'm about to build a house based on a yurt design. they're super insulated and i'm going for a certain amount of passive solar heat. i'd really like to do a combination of solar, and hopefully hydro electricity. i'm having a hard time finding good info on solar system installers. any tips on finding a Solar contractor would be appreciated.

thanks.

on edit: i live in the pacific northwest. solar might be a waste of money here. i found some cool info on hydro generators if you have a year round stream or river on the property. and maybe wind generators.
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lildreamer316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 02:37 PM
Response to Original message
20. PLEASE post this in our new Frugal Living Group!!!
along with any resource links you may have......we would really appreciated it!!
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merbex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 02:43 PM
Response to Original message
21. I have a 20 year old wood stove - how do I adapt my stove to accept
the wood pellets you are talking about?

Could you please go into greater detail about the wood pellets and the apparatus needed to burn them?

Thanks
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madokie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 05:43 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. just google wood pellet stoves.
I don't think you can use your old stove
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tilsammans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-22-05 06:08 PM
Response to Original message
23. Very inspiring story!
You are so right: "We have no choice now."

I've been suggesting green options to my fiance, as we go house-hunting.

How did you find your certified solar contractor? Was it through the state's energy program?

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