Hope: A Liberal Cardinal Was a CONTENDER against RATZINGER

[UTUSN]

*******QUOTE*******

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20050923/wl_nm/pope_election_dc_1

Pope Benedict elected after Argentine waiver-report

.... If true, the diary would show that Pope Benedict was elected with fewer votes than those attributed to his predecessor, John Paul II, and that Latin America was closer than previously thought to having its first pope. ....

But instead, Buenos Aires Cardinal Jorge Mario Bergoglio, a 68-year-old Jesuit known for his humility, emerged as the main liberal candidate, ....

"I watch him (Bergoglio) as he goes to cast his ballot at the altar of the Sistine Chapel. He has his gaze fixed on the image of Jesus, judging souls at the end of time. His face, suffering, as if pleading: 'God don't do this to me'," it said.

The diary said that Colombian Cardinal Alfonso Lopez Trujillo -- prominent among Latin American cardinals -- took advantage of a break after the third vote to persuade Bergoglio's supporters to throw their support behind Ratzinger.

In the fourth and final round of voting, Ratzinger was elevated to the papacy with 84 votes -- less than the 99 votes thought to have been cast for Pope John Paul in 1978.

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20050924/ap_on_re_eu/vatican_cardinal_s_diary_5

.... His two immediate predecessors, Pope John Paul II and Pope John Paul I, are believed to have garnered 99 and 98 votes respectively, and that was when there were only 111 voting cardinals. ....

"It does seem that somebody wants to indicate that the conclave was a more complex process than was being depicted and that Benedict's mandate was not a slam dunk," said David Gibson, a former Vatican Radio journalist who is writing a biography of Benedict. ....

Finally, the diary includes a few surprises, including a vote in the final ballot for Cardinal Bernard Law, forced to resign as Boston archbishop because of the church sex abuse scandal. ....

http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory?id=1154200&CMP=OTC-RSSFeeds0312

.... The diary of the anonymous cardinal is also significant because it shows that Ratzinger didn't garner a huge margin he had 84 of the 115 votes in the final ballot, seven more than the required two-thirds majority. ....

********UNQUOTE*******

[CatholicEdHead]

1. Church is bi-polar

but the Liberal side does not garner the press as the Tradionalist conservative side does.

[SaveElmer]

7. Well you have to admit...

The conservative side is in the ascendancey. I grew up attending a liberal inner city Minneapolis catholic church. And I loved it. None of this conservative crap, just people doing their best to help the needy, the retarded, and the elderly. It was a great place full of 60's hippies.

Now we have a church that declares, like the Nazi's before them, that gays are unworthy of inclusion because they have defective personalities. I have no regret about abandoning the church, but am very sad because I know what it used to be!!!

[regnaD kciN]

15. Same here...

During my late teens and college years, I was a regular at Mass at the Dominican Priory near my home -- a group that could, except for the habits, have been confused with any '60s-era peace and justice movement.

I can't say I'd want to darken the doorway of a Roman Catholic Church as they are today.

:-(

[Erika]

2. Ratzinger shows little compassion or inclusiveness

He's hard line. Let them tow the doctrine or go elsewhere is the message he projects. I predict a tremendous drop off in attendance and donations.

[eallen]

3. Liberal Cardinal? Is that like anything like a mild case of rabies?

Just askin'.

:hippie:

[UTUSN]

4. Hey, Hope Is from Small Pinnings n/t

[Davis_X_Machina]

5. Google on "Cardinal Bernardin"... n/t

[UTUSN]

6. O.K., Will Do. Any Relation to Jorge Mario Bergoglio?

Do you mean to say that THAT fellow was more Lib, or ...?

[UTUSN]

9. Any Particular Reason You Wanted Me to Google a Deceased Somebody?

*******QUOTE*******

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/remember/bernardin_11-14.html

CARDINAL BERNARDIN:
IN MEMORIAM

NOVEMBER 14, 1996
The beloved Roman Catholic Cardinal Bernardin passed away Thurday morning following a public fight with cancer. The Cardinal was an influential and moderate force in the Church, and in secular circles as well. Following an Elizabeth Brackett report about the reaction in his native Chicago to his passing, Elizabeth Farnsworth talks with his biographer. ....

http://www.tldm.org/News4/bernardin.htm

Cardinal Bernardin of Chicago was a satanist

"As I said in the past, a great trial is coming upon mankind. A great trial will enter upon all who remain with My Son in your times of strife. It will be bishop against bishop and cardinal against cardinal, for satan has set himself in their midst. I repeat and I repeat to deafened ears and hardened hearts: modernism in one hand and satanism in the other." - Our Lady, March 18, 1977

"The hierarchy has been infiltrated by agents of hell. Many have come posing as angels of light, but with darkness of heart and dark secrets." - Our Lady, May 30, 1977

"Again and again I wander to and fro directing My children to remain close to the Eucharist, the Bread of life. But do not become misguided: Do not accept My Son's Body in your hands. Satan, Lucifer, came as an angel of light and set his agents among the hierarchy of My Son's Church and deluded them." - Our Lady, July 15, 1978

********UNQUOTE*******

[regnaD kciN]

16. Why are you including quotes...

...from a loony-right Roman Catholic pressure group that makes the current Vatican administration look like aging hippies by comparision?

:shrug:

[UTUSN]

18. Uh, Because I Was Told to Google

and then picked salient info that highlighted that the dude is DECEASED?

[rwheeler31]

8. When Catholics

go conservative nuts, we have lost the universal church. Why?

[UTUSN]

13. So Here's the Google on the BERGOGLIO Dude

Oh,well, too late now.



*******QUOTE*******

http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/9948

Papal Candidates: Jorge Mario Bergoglio, Argentina
Posted by Robert Tagorda at 11:36
It's hard to question Cardinal Bergoglio's concern for the poor when he does many things to display humility. For instance, upon receiving his appointment, he instructed supporters to donate the money that they had raised for Vatican festivities. He refused to live in the Buenos Aires archbishop's palace, choosing instead a small apartment where he prepared his own dinners. He traded in a chauffeured limousine for public transportation. But, beyond his austerity, he's taken public stances on numerous political and socioeconomic issues that have plagued his native Argentina, which is still recovering from financial turmoil. In this light, perhaps it's fitting that he once presented a report on behalf of the Synod of Bishops -- a position that he described as "keeping watch" for the people.

"Servant of the Gospel of Jesus Christ"

Though he started out as a chemist, Cardinal Bergoglio developed into an accomplished theologian and a strong religious leader. This is particularly evident in his writings on the theological identity of bishops.

http://www.manilatimes.net/national/2005/apr/16/yehey/top_stories/20050416top5.html
.... the Cardinal even washed and kissed the feet of 12 AIDS patients when he arrived at the Francisco Muniz Hospital for Infectious Diseases. Later during the Mass, attended by nurses, doctors, patients and relatives, he said, “I came following in the footprints of our only master, Our Lord Jesus Christ, to express how close the Church is to those who must suffer pain and discrimination.”

Two years ago, demonstrators vandalized the Metropolitan Cathedral in Buenos Aires during a gay-pride parade, scrawling phrases like “church dictatorship,” “rapist priests” and “Nazi priests” on its walls. The Cardinal admonished the protesters: “In a pluralistic society when minority groups express themselves, it would be logical that they do so respecting the religious sentiments of the majority. It should be understood that when we express our doctrines around sexual conduct, we do so within the standard truth we believe, but never without an attitude of respect and understanding toward individuals.”

According to Catholic News, during an art exhibit by a militant atheist last year, Bergoglio urged followers to be resolute and lamented the showing of “blasphemous art” at a cultural center that is funded by taxpayer money.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4456581.stm

He certainly has the credentials.

********UNQUOTE*******

[KLF44]

10. This paragraph is strange......

The diary said that Colombian Cardinal Alfonso Lopez Trujillo -- prominent among Latin American cardinals -- took advantage of a break after the third vote to persuade Bergoglio's supporters to throw their support behind Ratzinger.


I thought the Cardinals were not supposed to speak to each other during the time there were voting for the new pope.

[aquart]

11. Bergoglio has some bloody nerve. "Humility," indeed!

Too modest to take the job where he could do the most good?

Selfish slacker, I call him.

[UTUSN]

12. Agreed. Takes a Little Bit of Pride. n/t

[regnaD kciN]

14. It matters little...

The election has been decided. Unlike U.S. politics, there are no terms and no re-elections, and a close runner-up can't look forward to a "rematch" in four years. Ratzinger will be "the Vicar of Christ" until his death, which may be next month or fifteen years from now. It's quite possible that, by the time his term ends, Bergoglio (if even still alive) will be past the mandatory retirement age for Cardinals and thus ineligible for the Papacy.

There was a liberal contender to JPII, too -- Cardinal Willebrands of the Netherlands. (Actually, at the time, it was thought that both of the top two candidates were "liberals.") But, of course, that mattered not a whit to the future of the Roman Catholic Church. JPII could continue on what turned out to be a reactionary path and, by the time the choice of a new Pontiff came around, Willebrands was long gone.

And, remember, when the time comes for the next Papal election, the ones doing the choosing will be those who voted in the last election...plus any new Cardinals hand-picked by Ratzinger. Don't look for them to move in any direction other than even more strident conservatism. :-(

[UTUSN]

19. The First Word in the Headline Is "Hope"

As in, to give (hope), to grasp at (hope). And the intent of the post was to show that, after hearing that JPII stacked the cardinals with wingnuts, there was still SOME independence, not complete monolithism. Whether the past or present contenders are or will be dead at the next selection does not eradicate SOMEBODY ELSE possibly-just-possibly being a Lib contender.

[NNadir]

17. The matter of who is Pope is a tempest in a teapot.

There was a great gnashing of teeth was this creep was elected, but it hasn't mattered in the slightest. Nothing got better, but nothing got worse either.

The Pope is an unfortunate medieval anachronism.

[UTUSN]

20. He's Settling-in

"nothing got better/worse" is another version of "no difference". The fish rots or un-rots from the head. Whoever gets to pick all the petty bureaucrats for 20 years, or the Supreme Court justices, saturates the future.