For All You Folks Havin A Hissy Over A.N.S.W.E.R....

[WillyT]

Peace comrades, LOL.

:hi::evilgrin::hi:

[Mr_Spock]

1. lol

All one of them :rofl:

[Maat]

2. I agree.

[NYC]

3. A.N.S.W.E.R. is good at organizing protests.

They have organized some big ones in New York, and before the war, we had weekly anti-war demonstrations that had been organized by A.N.S.W.E.R.

[Carolab]

4. I have no problem with ANSWER at all.

All of these causes are ONE.

[WillyT]

8. Very Well Said !!!

:toast:

[Melodybe]

14. No, they aren't

Those causes are NOT the same. Related, maybe, if you are talking about imperialism, generally. But, THE issue here is Iraq. That is the clear, unmuddied crime. All the other stuff just muddies the issue and takes away the focus.

And, there are different circumstances related to all the various ones that do not put them all in the same category. The consensus of the vast majority of the people at this march had to do with Iraq. Nothing else. There is no clear consensus for the resolution of those issues AND not all of those issues are connected to this administration and what it has and has not done. They may have contributed to an existing problem, sure, but they aren't particularly and solely to blame for those issues/problems.

[WillyT]

20. So... How Are You Going To Explain...

to the Iraqi people, and their neighboring Arab countries, that this war has nothing to do with Isreal, or American Hegemony?

American policy makers want oil, permanent air bases, and a stable middle east, but you arab people don't got nothin to do with it?

I'M confused now.

:shrug:

[Carolab]

21. Exactly. It's all imperialism. n/t

[Bernardo de La Paz]

22. Some Links from ANSWER's own site, WWP, LA Weekly, and Wikipedia

A thorough-going reading seems to show that Marxist-Leninists and Maoists are also involved. But then again, just about everyone else is too.

http://www.laweekly.com/ink/02/50/news-corn.php

http://www.answers.com/topic/workers-world-party-1

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ANSWER

http://www.workers.org/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Workers_World_Party

[Mari333]

5. Peace to you too but ANSWER still sucks

and the rally today was embarassing. It would have been nice if there had been coverage of the march on TV, but there wasnt. ANSWER , once again, had screaming shills with bones to pick and I finally turned them off.

[tlsmith1963]

34. I Agree

Completely embarassing. Just a bunch of people playing at being "revolutionaries". They are just as annoying as the neocons & the fundamentalist Christians. Maybe more people would listen to ANSWER if they didn't come across like a bunch of nutcases. The problem isn't their message, it's the way they conduct themselves.

Tammy

[knowbody0]

6. some peeps just gotta bitch

hi back darlin

[WillyT]

7. Word...

:hug:

[madfloridian]

9. My problem is the huffy demands made here that our Dems go or be damned.

That has what has made me so furious about all this. My husband and I and half our friends would love to watch the whole event, but every year we have turned it off. I am not saying that they should not have their issues.....in fact I blame the anti-war people who teamed up with them more.

Cindy Sheehan got a very rushed 5 minutes early on. They practically rushed her off the stage.

I checked back later and saw some person acting very odd, like a man trying to be a woman and acting silly. I did not know who it was, but it was not anti-war.

That group is practically anti-Jewish, and I think the people here at DU who have been screaming for the heads of our Democrats should be ashamed.

I know for sure that Dean, Kerry, and others spent a lot of the day and the last few days with the Congressional Black Caucus at their conference. I think Kerry spoke, I know some of the black caucus spoke, and Dean was supposedly working with them in his role as chair this week-end.

I don't think that an anti-war rally should be combined with so many other issues. It turns people off to our cause.

If you want Democratic leaders to go to protest, it needs to be kept simple.

[w13rd0]

11. thank you...

...it's gotten rather tiresome. I'm not condemning ANSWER, but I COMPLETELY understand why an elected official might pass on the opportunity to share a stage with them. I'd rather have them actually working to get our troops home and hold Bush accountable than getting face time at a rally anyway.

[Old and In the Way]

12. It was a people's rally....not a political rally.

I'd have trimmed the buffet of speakers, but I suspect that's the price to put such huge coalitions together.

I'm kind of curious about ANSWER....I only here of them when these rallies happen. What mojo do they have to be the designated conductor of these events?

[WillyT]

24. And Better Yet... Just Who's Gonna Have The Balls To Dis-Invite Them ???

They've been organizing just about every march since BEFORE this war began in earnest. Just who is going to go to them now and say, thanks but we don't want you any more?

And who has the resources and wherewithal to step in and organize in their place?

There may a damned good reason the other peace groups join with A.N.S.W.E.R. for EVERY MARCH SO FAR!!!

:shrug:

[SlowDownFast]

16. What were we protesting again today?

Was it something about Haiti?

No, wait, it was 5 of something or another in Cuba...

and I think that was just before some other thing about some leader of the Phillipines, Moomoo something...

or was it after those long speeches about free Israel?

Dammit, either free Israel or somebody named Moonie...

:sarcasm:

Ma and Pa and cousin Joe woulda never understood all that, though they might think that Iraq is a mess and Bush is ruining America. And don't forget the inherent short attention span of an American populace in general.

Yup, A.N.S.W.E.R. is a problem...

[thebigidea]

18. as if Ma and Pa bother to watch CSPAN

they'd find about it like most everyone else, through an article or brief news story mentioning "anti-war protests" and a vague estimate of the number.

None of the stories go into detail about the Cuban 5, Israel, or whatever pet issue you want to mock.

What's this "we" shit, anyway? Weren't you just watching it on tv?

[ikojo]

28. Maybe if people thought they were being listened to in the time

between large demonstrations, those same demonstrations could be more focused. As it is, most people are aware that they mean NOTHING to the corporate media and to their alleged representatives.

Thus when they have an opportunity to carry signs through an empty metropolitan area, as will be done today in St Louis, people who want to bring attention to their cause will also join in and bring their own signs.

[Terran1212]

31. Kerry and Dean don't even try to represent the people. THAT IS NOT DEMOCRA

There is NO democracy when you have leaders that listen more to the acceptable Establishment than the people. We are screaming for their heads BECAUSE THEY DON'T REPRESENT US. It is NOT DEMOCRACY if we don't have leaders that are doing what WE WANT THEM TO DO. Pro-occupation leaders are NOT OURS, and WILL ask for their heads.

Get it?

[tlsmith1963]

35. I Agree...

...but I don't think ANSWER is the solution, either. I don't like the DLC, but I also don't like ANSWER. We need leaders who will stand up to Bush, but don't act like nutcases at the same time. Let the Right have the nutcases. We should be an alternative to that.

Tammy

[Scurrilous]

10. Great pic...

...thanks for sharing. :thumbsup:

[SeattleGirl]

13. Hey Willy T

I think that's one of my pictures! (Thanks for using it!)

I went up to this woman and asked her if I could take a picture of her and her sign -- she seemed a little shy. I told her I really liked the sign. She said I could take her picture, and also said that she did not know whether she should feel joy or despair. I told her I understood -- on the one hand, the event in Seattle did bring me joy, but the reason why we were there -- the war -- does fill me with despair. But I was very happy to see this woman there.

[WillyT]

15. Hey, Thanks For Letting Me Use It !!! - Great Shot, Great Sign !!!

Your other shots were fabulous as well!

:applause::yourock::applause:

:hi:

[SeattleGirl]

17. Thanks!

B-)

[bpilgrim]

33. added to the gallery

http://GlobalFreePress.com

great picture :toast:

peace

[SeattleGirl]

40. Wow, cool!

Thanks bpilgrim!

:toast:

[buzzsaw_23]

42. Here's one for the gallery

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=4885326&mesg_id=4885344

[bpilgrim]

43. added

http://GlobalFreePress.com
thanks, great sign :toast:

peace

[burrowowl]

19. I think many

having problems with ANSWER are what in Europe would be considered center right to right (although many Democrates in Europe would be considered center right to right, oh well).
Many have not yet read: Howard Zinn's A People's History of the United States, nor Kevin Philips (former Republican economist) Wealth and Democracy.
They should read these 2 books.

[kysrsoze]

23. Yeah, no kidding. Shouldn't we be trying to drag things to the left a bit

You people who bitch about ANSWER are, in effect, doing the same thing Hillary Clinton did - shuffle to the right. Give answer credit for organizing and showing up. Anybody not interested in it digging further would still only see a short clip about 300K attending an anti-war rally. And it's not only one cause messing up this country - people need to be bombarded with info about what goes on in the world.

[Bill McBlueState]

25. yeah, sure

I have enormous respect for Howard Zinn. But to suggest that the average overworked and underpaid American read "A People's History of the United States" shows a certain failure to understand real people, their interests, and the amount of time they have to read lengthy texts.

We need to understand that the people whose votes we are trying to win will only be convinced by simple, focused arguments. A 750-page tome isn't going to do it.

[WillyT]

26. True... For Most Americans, Only McNuggets Of Truth Can Be Handled...

and even then, only one at a time. With some syrupy gelatinous goo to dip them in, so as to soften the blow to the stomach.

The dumbing down of this country was\is quite a success, don't ya think?

:argh:

[ikojo]

27. Maybe the average over worked underpaid American will not

read Howard Zinn but perhaps those who have read it can use their skills to parse it down to the most easily understood sound bytes.

Do you think all those people who voted for Bush have read Marvin Olasky? or William Kristol? I DON'T THINK SO...but what they have that is sorely lacking on the progressive side is an echo chamber who parrots what is said in the think tanks. They don't use polysyllabic words, instead they bring it down to an eighth grade level (the same reading level that many newspapers write at I should add) and keep the message short.

Sound bytes
Sound bytes
Sound bytes

Repeated over and over again become the truth.

Iraq, Katrina and the economy need to become NOOSES around the necks of EVERY Republican and I do mean EVERY Republican down to the local dog catcher.

[entanglement]

29. Great post! n/t

[Imajika]

30. My problem with ANSWER is..

..I don't support them. This is an umbrella group made up of a whole host of marxist organizations I do not want anything to do with.

From the sign the woman is holding - "All the sounds of freedom have a right to be heard"

Then why does ANSWER support the North Korean stalinist regime? You know, the one which starves it people and tolerates no dissent at all? From my reading, it appears that Brian Becker (national coordinator for the A.N.S.W.E.R. Coalition) likes to denounce America while he is hanging out in Pyongyang. A little research turned up all sorts of ties between International ANSWER and the North Korean regime.

Can anyone explain to me how supporting Kim Jong Il is a good thing? Why would the US peace movement want any association with a group that supports the North Korean regime?

[WillyT]

32. Just Ta Cause More Liberal Angst !!!

Ain't it awful???

:wtf:

[ima_sinnic]

37. really. blah blah blah from the ANSWER obsessives, who sound

like control freaks. ONLY those conforming to "the message" have the right to protest BushCo, I guess.

in a couple of weeks I am going to pop up here and ask how the organizing for the next big rally is coming along. somehow I don't think there is going to be much of a response from the whiners and complainers. and I anticipate dress codes and cue cards when their action IS planned--must stay "on message," dress to impress Joe Sixpack, and not be too free with our grievances, might "offend" somebody.

sheesh.

[Walt Starr]

36. Everybody has the right to speak

They do not have a right to demand that I hear them.

And I'm not your "comrade".

[ima_sinnic]

38. nobody's "demanding" that you hear them (n/t)

[WillyT]

39. Oh, C'Mon Man... We've Been Comrades For Some Time Now, No ???

Is 'comrades' exclusively Communist now???

:shrug:

[dpibel]

41. Reflections on Gored Oxen

Now, it's hard to keep the cast of characters hereabouts perfectly clear.

But it seems to me that some of the folk who complain loudest about how terrible bad it is to have these ANSWER commies involved in "our" movement are the selfsame people who carp right loudly about leftists demanding ideological purity in the Democratic party.

See how that works?

If it's "leftists" criticizing some beloved centrist Democrat for being a bit too corporatist, that's fearsome bad, and should be sneered at as ideological puritanism.

If, on the other hand, there's some group hanging around, organizing protests and such, that's uncomfortably left, well, we gotta purge the muthas, lest we damage our...ummmm...ideological purity, is it?

Or did I miss something here?