Ownership and title records are most important NOW! This can not be

[anarchy1999]

over-looked. Please. This is important. More important that any of you know. Please!

Please. This is important. More important than any of you know. Please! This is it guys! Property is about to be stolen out from underneath the owners of said property. You all just have no idea.

It's a catastrophe over beyond anything we could ever imagine. We need to stand tall and protect our brothers and sisters and help them keep their homes and land.

[madfloridian]

1. See my post in GD.

I think that is what you mean.

[anarchy1999]

3. do you have a link? LA is about to be forsaken. I have good contacts

that want it to be so. It is a real heartbreak.

[shance]

2. What are you talking about anarchy? Louisiana?

n/t

[anarchy1999]

4. Yes! The powers that be, the old rich, they are having a field day.

It's a dangerous place to be right now. How many do you know in power? I unfortuantely know too many. I don't like them and their plans are not very nice.

[MarsThe Cat]

50. why would someone who goes by "anarchy1999"-

be so concerned about ownership and property rights?
it would seem to go against the whole anarchy theme.

[The Magistrate]

88. Anarchists, Mr. Cat

Can generally be relied upon to oppose theft from the poor by the rich, whether this is achieved by a gendarme's club, or the proverbial fountain pen, as seems a real danger in this instance of disappeared records. There will be skullduggery, sure as sunrise; the only question is skullduggery on what scale....

"Some men rob you with a six-gun, and some with a fountain pen."

[madfloridian]

5. Here is my post here tonight.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4886225

[anarchy1999]

6. This is important, MF and everyone else wanting to help. There is no help

Records are gone. People are going to be displaced. They have no records. Please this can not be allowed to happen. These people believed and trusted so many people. They were good, they were honest, they thought they knew what they were doing. Please we have to help them in some way. It is real you guys, it is real! Picture your family home up in smoke and no one can save it. How would you feel?

I know way more than I'm supposed to.

[JDPriestly]

7. My guess: Title insurance companies may have records.

Records of title to properties are not just kept in the county recorders' offices. Title insurance companies may keep records too. I'm not sure how far back the title insurance company records go or how long they keep them, but they should have some records since they insure titles of properties as they are bought and sold in most areas of the U.S. I'm not sure what the law is in Louisiana.

[anarchy1999]

9. They don't have them. Computers are not working, tiltle searches are not

working. Everything is up in smoke and water. This is SERIOUS! I'm seriously considering going and giving my expertise to help. These families have to be helped or else they are going to lose everything and the company's and the rich are standing back and saying "Yes". This can't be allowed to happen! You all have no idea.

[JDPriestly]

13. Are the computers lost?

Would anyone have the records on cache? The tax authorities probably have duplicates. They will still want to collect some taxes on the properties. They probably have back-up records or will be able to find copies in cyberspace somewhere.

Property and title insurance companies probably keep duplicate records in regional or even national archives and offices. It won't necessarily be easy to figure this out, but there will be a way. What is your expertise?

[anarchy1999]

18. JD. there are no computers, there is no back up, everything is lost and

under water. Do you get the picture yet?

[Lex]

75. Do you know where the electronic backups were sent?

In most states, the electronic back-ups of vital records are sent off site--particularly in the case of pending natural emergency.

For example, when a Hurricane was threatening NC, all vital records were backed up and sent somewhere in Arizona, everything was stored until the computers would be back up and running in NC.

Everything (DMV records, Register of Deeds records, and other vital records) were able to be re-created.

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[preciousdove]

8. How?

Everybody and their uncle wants copies of ownership papers, insurance companies, loan officers, social security, medicaid, probate actions. Land records are also tracked elsewhere at state and local levels.

Anybody who thinks they can get away with a land grab because of soggy papers in the NOLA courthouse is about 100 years behind the times. But let them try and then let them go to jail.

[anarchy1999]

11. They are going to do it! Damn ed them all!

n/t unless those of us in the know get in there and stop it! We have to.

[Booster]

56. Not to mention the IRS. It may take a long time, no - it WILL take a

long time, but IRS records will show that people owned houses, land, paid mortgages, etc. They would need to request their records. Also, whoever did their taxes would have a record.

[JDPriestly]

10. In addition to title insurance records,

there may be some state property tax records. It's possible they were all local, but the state may have some. Also, how do you know the title records were lost? Is there a report on this? Do the authorities keep records on microfilm or on back-up computer tapes in Baton Rouge or elsewhere? Also, those homeowners who still owe on their mortgages probably insured their homes. Even if the insurance companies won't pay out, they will probably help to verify home ownership.

I realize that the stress on those who are affected by the hurricanes and floods must be horrible. But, don't panic. Think. Some records may be lost, but there may be alternative sources for the information that has been lost.

[anarchy1999]

12. It is a parish by parish issue. Don't expect the best case scenario.

they've been waiting for years for this to happen. I'm not in a panic. I want to take care of the people. This is bigger than any of you can imagine. Titles and property records, gone. No alternative sources.

[JDPriestly]

15. How do you know they are gone?

As I pointed out, most people have property insurance. Those records will identify owners and describe the properties in a very general way. They are probably not gone. The plot maps, the official property descriptions, whatever you call them in Louisiana, may be gone for many properties. There may be duplicates even of those in Baton Rouge especially of historical properties, as opposed to recently subdivided ones. Don't you think this will be worked out for most people once the flood damage recedes? At worst, neighbors will identify each other. They may fight over precise boundaries, and some landmarks may be gone, but this will be worked out.

[anarchy1999]

16. How much time have you spent reseaching records in any Parish?

This is a disaster. Just in Lake Charles alone, let alone Abbeville, Cameron, or let's just not even go to New Orleans or Jefferson Parish, shall we?

[anarchy1999]

17. How much time have you spent reseaching records in any Parish?

This is a disaster. Just in Lake Charles alone, let alone Abbeville, Cameron, or let's just not even go to New Orleans or Jefferson Parish, shall we?

Thanks JD. Peace and then some.

[anarchy1999]

20. You don't have a clue.

n/t Ny best friend in my life is reveling in this nightmare. I'm sick at heart.

[bananas]

32. ouch - that is rough

sorry to hear this

[anarchy1999]

14. Much as I love Louisiana, Louisiana is known for downright corruption

in every direction. I nearly lost my life over it in 94 and 95. It cost me dearly.

This is real folks. The people in Louisiana need all our help.

[Name removed]

26. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[anarchy1999]

19. Who wants to go with me? I'm setting it up tomorrow.

Thanks/
Sherry

I have to save people's homes.

[anarchy1999]

21. I need some ownership and a nomination or two. This thread is important.

n/t

[annabanana]

22. nominated....

because I won't put anything past these SOB's. There was some fear here earlier that this might happen. Have you contacted the ACLU, because if this doesn't rise to the level of an assault on one's civil liberties, nothing does.

Are they all planning to exercise eminent domain in large swathes of Louisiana?

(keep this kicked until people wake up)

[anarchy1999]

25. The poor are going to be taken to the cleaners and the old rich are having

tons of fun. I'm so sorry, it's just the way it is. Been that way for far too long.

I apologize and I'll do everything within my limited powers to keep it from happening. The mortgage companies are having a field day. I'm so sorry.

Peace,
a/
s

[whatever4]

54. Yes, and it doesn't "have" be lost to be claimed as "lost records"

It's just how these folks operate, "because I won't put anything past these SOB's"

Just to point that, some folks here think this can't/won't happen because records are kept somewhere else. But, and this is the point to consider, will that actually STOP the "lost records" excuse from being used??? When they clearly have many records lost in the flooding, won't that be ALL that is required to take their property...legally?

Won't all they need is an "excuse"?? Isn't this the perfect opportunity for them, whether there are any other, saved records, or not?

AREN'T EXCUSES ALL THIS ADMIN HAS NEEDED TO ACHIEVE CROOKED ENDS??? Seriously?

Anarchy, I'm very sorry about your friend, and I hope you can help down there. Please be careful.

[annabanana]

23. kick . . . n/t

[KarenS]

24. Kicked & nominated.

I hadn't even thought of this problem with records & documents,,,,,
I'll bet it's going to happen in Mississippi as well.

[preciousdove]

27. How can anyone help?

Are you a lawyer? Do you have a lawyer you can use in that area in case you get caught up? Do you have political contacts there? How are you going to get past FEMA? Where are you going to stay? Who would know if you disappeared?

You don't have to answer, me but you better have the answers before you head into the trouble.

My only connections to Louisiana are that my Dad took Basic Training there at the end of WWII and my ex husband's grandmother's tenent in 1986 was born there and made a mean jambalaya.

[anarchy1999]

29. Yes, Yes, Yes and Yes again. I'm not afraid. and yes I'll be heading

straight into lots of trouble. I'm measuring myself carefully. I know what I'm doing and I'm doing it with lots of care.

on edit:

I'm taking on people with money. Not a nice place to be.

[preciousdove]

30. Nominated and praying...money I don't have LOL

[anarchy1999]

33. Prayers are good. We need them.

Peace.
anarchy1999

[anarchy1999]

31. My best friend is old school and an attorney. I know New Orleans and all

of Southwest Louisiana. There is the heartbreak. I can make him do right though.

[anarchy1999]

34. I have some of the answers and all the connections. I'll be okay

I think. I'm taking on everyone on behalf of nobody. It's a really sad situation. My best friend will be my ally or my enemy. Who is to say? I have other friends there, but most of them are not on the side of those losing their homes.

I know how to get into the parish courthouses and get the records and I am not easily intimidated. There will be my only value. That will be the most important thing I can do. There's my expertise, JD. I know the courts.

[Maraya1969]

35. Wouldn't mortgage companies and insurance companies hold records

[anarchy1999]

36. Not in Louisiana. Other states maybe.

Not in Louisiana, all records for mortgages are held in the Parish. (That equals county for all the rest of you).

[Maraya1969]

37. Yes but the companies may be far from the parish. My insurance

company is located on the other side of the state and you can be sure they have my information. They want their money.

[anarchy1999]

41. Sure they do and all is safe. Do you really feel safe?

I don't. I own no property in Lousiana and the worst part is I worked for a mortgage banker and an mortgage company. They are your worst enemy. I'm sorry but it is true. I wish it was not so, it nearly killed me.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

39. Are you seriously telling me...

...that insurance companies and lenders have NO IDEA of where their clients LIVE? They don't know the location of the properties which they are financing or insuring? That they keep no off-site records of these things (as they are required to do by federal law?) You've got to be kidding.

[anarchy1999]

44. Kinda sorta of. Yeah. That's the general idea.

I know it's a leap. But it is real.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

45. But that doesn't make any sense.

It can't possibly be true. There are multiple independent ways of verifying ownership of property, not all of which would ever be held at the parish level.

[MildyRules]

47. I'm with you

This is "the sky is falling" fear-mongering.

[anarchy1999]

62. Ownership is held only at the parish level. Sorry to tell you so.

n/t It's all in the title.

[Horse with no Name]

61. Title companies and banks have to have the deeds as well

I know that is a fact. Banks and mortgage lenders have a record of their assets.
Title searches have been done by the title companies and will be on record.
I have a hard time believing that nobody backed up computers before this thing hit.

[MildyRules]

64. They did

This is hysteria of the non-mass variety.

[pitohui]

52. of course they do, this person is fear-mongering

i live in louisiana

this person is not telling truth

[anarchy1999]

57. How much experience have you had with mortgage brokers and title

searches in Louisiana? Any at all? Fear mongering my ass.

[Lex]

67. I have A LOT of experience with titles and deeds and Registers of Deeds

and all that stuff is backed up electronically these days by the title companies and the Registers of Deeds offices themselves.

[earth mom]

38. I believe you. Nominated.

I've been thinking this would happen, but that * & Co would mastermind this kind of land grab...sounds like it will be the rich whites of NOLA instead. Kudos to you for going and trying to help. Stay safe!

Gotta add that just when I thought it couldn't get any worse, it does. When will this modern day barbarism end?! :cry:

[anarchy1999]

40. I do not want to go. I feel compelled. I hate it. I'm still fighting

every inch of the way, but I know I have to go. I don't know how I'll make it happen, but I must. I'm scared out of my mind. I don't really know what I'm walking into but I know I'm walking right.

That's all I need to know.

Peace and thanks to you all for all your support.

S

[KharmaTrain]

42. This Need More Fleshing Out

Lots of conjecture and not much hard fact going on here. While I can see home lands being grabbed for eminent domain or other purposes, this is too big an area...too many people involved to have an old fashioned land grab.

As others have noted here, certainly there are records that are with the State in Baton Rouge...far away from the NOLA flooding...as well as dozens of other sources. Insurance and Title companies would be the most likely to have all these records...as would hundreds of lawyers who handled transactions.

Recently some neighbors were involved in a property dispute. The plats were no conclusive, so they went back and found 10 other plats of that property going back nearly 150 years...when it was nothing but open prairie...and thus was the map that was used to adjudicate the dispute.

Now, what value would all that land be? Create some white yuppie haven in the city...or a Repugnican Nirvana? As though those people are going to bus the tables in the French Quarter or load the ships in the port?

Or that thousands of blocks will be left barren to keep the city depopulated? And this would benefit who? If the land was appropriated...consider it's all but worthless right now...whoever would buy would be a total fool to waste that kind of money with no possibility of a fair return.

So what does that leave? Thus all this discussion about mass land grabs make no sense. If anything, builders and speculators would love to have the original residents return...people who would be more willing to pay a higher price for newly built homes and apartments.

The legal messes of this disaster will tie up court for years. Be assured there will be plenty of property disputes, but not due to lack of records of public record, but of questionable ownership...houses that were handed down over the years and no transaction or transfer of title was ever completed. This I suspect is where the rubber will hit the road in what you're trying to discuss...as it will appear someone whose lived in a house for decades has been evicted and their land taken...yet in reality, they never had a proper title for the land and this is what caused the dispute.

Yes...we need to keep a close eye on the rebuilding of New Orleans and keep shining lights on corruption and government profiteering. One day soon the Feds will get bored with the area and the locals will reclaim their city.

[Name removed]

43. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[KharmaTrain]

48. Two Rants For The Price Of One

First...to answer your strawman "beating your wife question"...that you asked of several others who wanted to DISCUSS this matter and didn't buy into all your points...I have no property in Lousiana...never have, never was interested, never will. But I have done plenty of land transactions over the years and have been involved in title disputes...and your over-the-top fears fly in the face of how property disputes are handled in many different areas...and would surely invoke tons of federal and civil court challenges.

You're the one screaming...posting an article that speculates. Put up facts...people we need to watch, corporations that have their eyes set on parcels of land.

Honestly, I'm amused with your rant...why I posted...as i'm sure others did. I have no interest in playing personal games here, and I don't. Your arrogance and inability to discuss and debate...not an uncommon trait for some around this place these days...are not helping whatever cause you're trying to promote...it's just alienating people who would be your biggest supporters.

Peace...

[anarchy1999]

87. My family took a title dispute all the way to the Supreme Court.

I'm not trying to alienate anyone. I don't care anymore.

[anarchy1999]

46. Have you ever done one single property or title search even in Louisiana?

I didn't think so.

[annabanana]

49. mid-morning kick. . . . .n/t

[pitohui]

51. stop spreading rumors

i own property in louisiana, and the "facts" you describe are not the "facts" at all

i have the title to my house,as does the parish clerk of court, and when there was a mortgage on it, the mortgage company also had a copy of all of that information, as did the title company, as does the insurance company

how stupid do you think ppl are?

there will be no land grab

yr "friend" may have some financial incentive to create fear & uncertainty, does your "friend" sell title insurance or an off-site records storage service i wonder

you give no facts, you give no proof, you just want to stir up fear & hysteria at a time when ppl are already concerned abt their homes

i'm sorry, dude, that is wrong, wrong, wrong

[anarchy1999]

59. When was the last time you did a title search on your piece of property,

dear sir or madam?

I am not stirring up fear, I am not trying to create hysteria.

You are wrong.

Go check it out.

Go and try to get a clear title to your property, okay?

I don't think people are stupid, I just know what I know. Have you ever done any title searches in Louisiana?

[anarchy1999]

63. Of course not. you obviously know far more than I. n/t Hey dude, go do

a title search on your piece of land. Can you get there, do they have it? Is it under water?

I have all the facts I need. By the way, I'm not a "DUDE" and I'm not wrong.

[beam me up scottie]

53. This is on the Greatest page ???

Oh for christs sake.

[anarchy1999]

65. Beam me up scottie, I've always held your opinions in the highest regard.

This time you are out of your territory. Thanks though for your valuable insight.

[dcfirefighter]

55. screw em

the french stole it from the indians, who stole it from other indians, and so on and so forth.

Forget the old titles, claim it all as the state of Louisiana's, and make long term ground leases out of it all. Should more than eliminate other taxes, while providing lots of public money for public goods like ports, railways, levees, highways, hospitals, schools, and public safety. Building will commence nicely with no taxes on buildings.

[Horse with no Name]

58. I don't understand??

The entire state of Louisiana was not flooded.
Do they not have records available in any other city on the computer?
Something is rotten here.

[anarchy1999]

60. Yep! Rotten to Hell and Back!!!

n/t

Stand back and get out of the way!

Anyone ever heard of Southern Funding out of Alexandria?

[bobbieinok]

71. do you mean this company???? also, some details would be helpful

http://www.southern-funding.com/index.html

many of us believe some people would do anything to make $$$, but your comments mostly express great worry with few details.......I don't doubt your concern and believe it's probably well founded, but a few details would help

[Sgent]

66. Legal shenagins

make take place -- in terms of courts allowing evidence in, or levels of proof, that would otherwise not be acceptable if parish records were destroyed.

That being said, I just don't see this being a big issue. Even if there are no property records, the courts can grant title when presented with enough evidence -- things like wills that parshalled out land, mortgage and title insurance records, etc.

Even if the plats aren't available, this just increases the burden to get a clear title. Again however, legal ideas such as adverse possession can be used to gaurentee title to owned land. There maybe some disputes which will have to be "carved down the middle" so to speak; however, I just don't see this as an issue.

I've done property research in LA, and yes it sucks. But title to real property can be granted in a number of ways -- of which titile research is just one of many (and the most expeditious).

In LA a lot of issues are unenforcable anyway (like deed restrictions), so other than identifing the given plot of land and the current owner through adverse possession or through the preponderance of the evidence in a court setting, the fear mongering is over the top.

Unless you are willing to present some reason, other than hystarical keyboard pounding, that this isn't true, please cease this pointless drivel.

[Horse with no Name]

69. The group of people that I can see this type of thing happening to

are those that "owner-financed" their land to some unfortunate souls who didn't have the foresight to take their contracts with them.
That would be the hardest to prove, although not impossible.
I just can't imagine this scenario taking place with banks, insurance companies, and title companies all involved.
Everything would have to be local--and in this day and time, that is probably going to be a rare instance.

[anarchy1999]

70. Okey Doke. Pointless drivel it is. Obviously you have some knowledge

and you must know more than I. Good luck Louisiana. I'll go with the rich guys.

The mortgage brokers and the bankers.

[Lex]

73. The lenders want to be able to prove their mortgages

as much as the owners want to be able to prove their ownership.

Both the bankers and the owners have a lot to lose.

But I can't believe that the Registers of Deeds and Title Companies don't have electronic backups of their files.

That's just standard in the industry for both the protection of the title companies, the owners, and the mortgage holders.

[Lex]

68. All Registers of Deeds and title companies make electronic back-ups

these days.

In case of fires within the Register of Deeds offices, they have been careful of backing up their documentation for years--since backups were available.

And yes, before you ask, I do know this because I work in the industry.

They can probably easily create at least the documentation from the tax offices (from GIS) that show who has owned what for at least the last 5 years.

[anarchy1999]

72. Good luck with that in Louisiana.

Glad you know it. 5 years is not enough for a free and clear title.

Do any of you understand what it is to get a free and clear title to a piece of property? I'm not getting that you do. I'm not a fear mongering person. You all just don't have a clue.

[Lex]

74. We're talking about finding the record owner of a parcel of land

which is different than talking about "free and clear" -- that is matter of who has a mortgage or lien against the property.

Proving you own land and proving it is "free and clear" of encumbrances are 2 separate things.

[anarchy1999]

78. You are correct. Free and clear is all about the mortgage on the property

and that is how it is all going to go down.

"free and clear" of encumbrances are 2 separate things.

Good luck and I quit. You all obviously know more than I do.

[anarchy1999]

76. Sure they do, when were you last in Lake Charles doing a title search?

Or Cameron or Abbeville? or Houma? Everything yet on computer disc? I don't think so.

[MildyRules]

77. And you are in which of those cities?

[anarchy1999]

79. I was in each and every parish in Southwest Louisiana, every parish

from the north to the south all along 49. Home base was Alexandria.

I give, I cry uncle and I quit. You all are far more knowledgeable than I am. Like I said above. I'm going with the rich guys in the know.

See the rest of you later.

[MildyRules]

81. Doing what?

[anarchy1999]

82. Just playing around MildyRules, just playing around.

n/t

[MildyRules]

83. Sounds like it

Either that or scaring people unnesccesarily...

[anarchy1999]

86. You should know coming from Virginia, right? Oh and by the way,

welcome to DU!

[Lex]

80. LOL! Do you think the title searches are done in the individual towns?

Seriously?

Do you even know where title searches are done? What documents are filed? Where they are filed? What documents are searched?


Hint: title searches aren't done in the individual towns.

[anarchy1999]

84. Yes, you are correct, title searches are done in the Parish Courthouse.

not in the individual towns. I did them. Don't take me for an idiot.

[anarchy1999]

85. LOL and who are you?

n/t

Hint, hint, did you ever do one single title search in any parish?

I didn't think so.

[Lex]

89. Yes, I was there right along beside you in Louisiana doing them.

I've done plenty of title searches, however.

How many have you done?

[sproutster]

90. Anarchy

I've worked in city planning, and have a very good idea what you are talking about. Our stuff was recorded to state computers, but not all. Not the land that hadn't left the families since statehood. Those were bound in huge leather binders.

If there is any way I can help, I've done deed searches, etc. I can certainly do my damndest to help find land records that may be out there to help the people.

Please feel free to contact me to help... Not sure how we trade emails.