Dem leaders wisely stayed away from the protests.

[txaslftist]

So this hurricane blew into town and turned into a dud. CNN, MSNBC, FOX and all the other vultures were hovering over the southern coast, with 24/7 coverage of that, with little other than a few breaklines devoted to other news.

Among the "other news" items? Oh, there was this little march on Washington. Over 100,000, maybe as many as 300,000 socker moms, lunchbox dads, vets, activists, Republicans, Democrats... Just basically a bit of every one made it to the protests.

The only station covering it was C-Span, if you want to call that a station. So, the first few speakers are great, then along comes a guy in a Palestinian scarf, talking about how bad the Israelis are. Then an Israeli who says ditto. Then some more speakers about how communism is good, capitalism is bad, Haiti is in bad shape, there's a genocide somewhere in Africa, and by the way, Iraqi terrorists are great, blah blah blah. Followed by some incomprehensible poetry that dragged on forever, even as people were walking away, disgusted. Don't forget to put a dollar, just a dollar, into the red bucket...

If I were a politician, and I had even the slightest idea that this was what was going to happen, that the PLO would basically hijack the protest... Then I got to wondering, who is paying for all of this? Who is funding ANSWER? Is this going to be traced back to Hamass or some shit like that? Probably.

So do I, as a politician, even as an anti-war politician, want to be associated with Muslim extremism in any way, shape or form?

Or do I have a regrettable scheduling conflict?

Oh, shit. Got that meeting with Mothers Against Number 2 Pencils I forgot about...

[deutsey]

1. Are there such thing as "Dem leaders"?

:sarcasm:

[ChairmanAgnostic]

3. Yeah, dem and dose and dese guys over dere.

But that is about it.

[deutsey]

5. LOL

:thumbsup:

[Art_from_Ark]

9. That about sums it up

I don't know whether to :rofl: or :banghead:

[electropop]

2. Those who did show up went over to the UFPJ stage.

The message there was focused on antiwar and impeachment. Maxine Waters in particular was amazing, calling for impeachment, and for voting out any Congress people who don't support impeachment. Joan Baez was incredible too.

[deutsey]

7. Read this account of "average Americans" in the street

http://www.motherjones.com/commentary/columns/2005/09/katrina_and_cindy.html

What a waste of time to bring all them together...:sarcasm:

[leftchick]

13. What a great article!

Thanks! And you have to love the Angry Graphic Designer...

[fudge stripe cookays]

17. Great article! Thanks!

I HAVE to go buy some army men on my lunch break! Everybody check out the link at www.mouthswideopen.org! That is a great idea.

FSC

[demnan]

4. I wish they would face this lady and say they were afraid to protest

[The Blue Flower]

6. Yup

Just once, can we stay ON MESSAGE? I couldn't make it to the protest, but would have been completely sorry to be there once the Palestinian protest started. I turned off the tv.

[fudge stripe cookays]

8. Perhaps if any of our Dem leaders...

had the balls to work with progressive groups other than ANSWER, we might have been able to have a protest that concentrated on ending the war instead of diluting the message with Palestine, Mumia, and the like.

I'm just saying.

I can't stand ANSWER, but can any of our Dem leaders think about getting 200,000 people in one place to protest? And if so, could they pull it off? Who would pay? Soros? Might be nice to find out.

FSC

[Freddie Stubbs]

10. YOu mean to say they didn't even say anything about Mumia?

;)

[txaslftist]

12. Oh. Sorry. Yeah. Mumia definitely came up...

...whoever the fuck that is.

We need to organize our own protests, stay on message, invite only sane people to speak, and act with some friggin' discipline.

Are we trying to save lives or "make a point"?

Some ANSWER apologist on another thread said, "if you don't like what ANSWER does, organize your own protest!"

I say, "damn straight."

[RaulGroom]

18. Funny how all the pro-war faces

Always seem to show up on the threads purporting to tell the antiwar movement how to be more effective. Nice of you guys to spend so much of your time helping us out.

[txaslftist]

21. Oh Yeah. Of course. Since I don't want to free Mummia I'm pro-war...

Clearly.

[RaulGroom]

24. Wasn't talking about you, sorry.

Freddie Stubbs is a fixture on any antiwar thread, clucking about how poorly we in the antiwar movement are going about trying to accomplish the goals that he actively opposes.

After a hugely successful protest (one at which the message discipline, other than on the always-horrible ANSWER stage speeches, was actually the best it's ever been at an antiwar rally), it's just a little tough to take.

The Mumia thing has always baffled me, though I'm agnostic on his guilt or innocence since I know nothing about the case other than what partisans are always screaming at each other (cue screaming). There are literally tens of thousands of people locked up on spurious charges in this country and we've let this one case become a national punch line at the expense of the antiwar movement.

Anyway, my point is, a LARGE number (possibly a majority though there is no way of knowing, really) of antiwar activists have the same concerns you do. But the solutions to these problems don't materialize because we complain about them. Come help build the movement, if you believe in stopping war.

I'm not trying to pick on you. I felt the same way about Yglesias' post over at TPMCafe today. It's just frustrating because hundreds of people put in thousands of hours to put on this protest and do the best they could in the face of a lot of tough obstacles, and today all I read from our so-called liberal lions in the media are how many problems there are in the antiwar movement.

There are problems. They are difficult. They are serious. They are not going to go away just because Yglesias types up a post about how he doesn't like freaky-looking people.

[madokie]

11. I couldn't agree more.

[iconoclastNYC]

14. Half the Republican party tracks back to middle eastern terrorists....

Bush and Bin Ladens? HELLLO?

Find me one group in world history that didn't have extremist or 'undesireable' elements. Just name one.

[Raster]

15. I say again, 98% of Congress are part of the problem. Congress has long

abandoned "of the people, for the people, by the people." Congress kneels to their true master: the petro/military/industrial complex. Corporate America rules the land. There is no opposition party, it's all show and bluster.

Here's several ways to determine where your Senators or Representative's allegiances are:

1) Did they vote for MBNA bankruptcy bill? The bill was written by and is a direct give-away to the banking industry. Obviously the billions of dollars they already make on their loan-shark interest rates wasn't enough. Time to revive that old honored American tradition: indentured servitude. Welcome to financial slavery.

2) Are they continuing to support the bloodbath in Iraq? No matter how it's spun, Iraq is illegal, immoral and based on nothing but lies. Iraq is the biggest American fuck up in 200 years. Anyone in Congress that still supports the biggest American fuck up in 200 years has no business serving in Congress.

It's that simple. If your Congressperson voted for and/or supports either, they do not have your best interests at heart. They are heeding the call of their corporate masters. Don't listen to their bullshit, look at their actions. And then take yours.

[RaulGroom]

16. Wow, ANSWER's dominance of antiwar rallies is a problem for theAWmovement?

Man, I've worked in the antiwar community in DC for 5 years and that never occurred to me. Thanks for pointing it out. :eyes:

As for wondering where ANSWER's funding comes from, we all wonder that as well. However, you don't have to dig too deep to find out that ANSWER's core membership is basically a Maoist cult. So, no deep dark secret to be uncovered, it's a nutty organization and we really wish we could get rid of them.

Trouble is, it's really hard to get rid of them. We tried to do it back on April 20th, 2002 and ANSWER wound up glomming on to our protest and basically hijacking it. They have a lot of money and A LOT of manpower, including people who are basically zombies who have no life outside of ANSWER. So that's really tough to deal with considering the bulk of the antiwar movement is people with jobs and children and lots of demands on our time.

I tell you what, if you care so much about how the antiwar movement operates, you should become an antiwar organizer. It's pretty much a walk-in-and-lead type of operation. Anybody willing and able to devote the time and energy to help stage an event can become a very influential and important person in the movement very quickly.

Look forward to seeing you at the next steering committee meeting.

I've been working to try to differentiate the core antiwar movement from ANSWER for years. It's a tough process. It takes work. They have more money, and more people who can devote 50 hours a week to advancing their counterproductive agenda. Come on out and help fight them.

[savemefromdumbya]

19. We don't have many Democrats with spine these days!!! Do we?

At least 3 were at the rally! This makes a mockery of majority of the people's views on the handling of Iraq by the Bush administration! If they had any sense -- the wind is blowing in the direction against the Iraq occupation by our troops and people are objecting to spending billions of OUR (yes taxpayers money) on Iraq and not on homeland secirty and response to disasters.
Cindy Sheehan was right in that Congress were at fault too.

1) Democrats should have opposed the war as the evidence was faulty and - - don't tell me they didn't know!
2) If Saddam Hussein (rent-a-dictator) was so bad a couple of CIA agents could have taken him and his cronies out in a minute. Bush senior never bothered to finished the job of replacing the Republican guard in the first gulf war. The war was just a sham.
3) After the diabolical 'shock and awe invasion' of Iraq the UN peacekeeping troops should have taken over and our troops should have come home. Simple - UN troops have better ways of training and setting up and dealing with insurgency.
4) Bush (and it would seem our fellow Democrats) are after Iraq's oil?) and don't want to leave.
I'm beginning to wonder if there is any difference between our two major parties?

[second edition]

20. I'm all for focused ,civil and peaceful anti- Iraq war protests!

The repubs look for the most outrageous people and play them over and over again as the norm for anti- war protesters.

[freestyle]

22. They had a chance to stand with the people. They failed.

It is sad and disgusting that so few elected officials were there. I think there were four Representatives and no Senators. Some speakers may have been off topic, whatever that means, but the throngs in the streets were united against the war and for bringing people home alive. Democrats need to have the courage to at least stand with the people. It is not even about leadership at this point, for the people are miles ahead, but about joining and affirming and maybe helping out a bit.

The march was not about ANSWER or any single group. I was there and I saw students, teachers, organized labor, religious groups, and countless people wit no particular affiliation except the recognition that enough is enough. I even saw someone with a sign reading "George Bush makes me ashamed to be a Republican". But I didn't see our elected officials standing with and for the people they claim to represent. That is not wise. It is cowardly.

[txaslftist]

23. Stand with the people? The Free Mumia people?

That don't win elections.

They can stand with the people at the NEXT event, the one that is ANTI-IRAQ WAR (with no hidden agendas).

It is because of ANSWER (and hurricane Rita admittedly) that there has to be a next event.

But there definitely needs to be a next event.

[freestyle]

25. The broad section of the American people that were there

We haven't won many elections lately anyway. Maybe some courage, some spine, taking a little heat, and giving some voice to the outrage and pain that most people are feeling would.