The water cooler and why I think DC was great despite the anti answer folk

[kohodog]

I was in Washington Saturday for the march, leaving after midnight Friday and returning around midnight Saturday night. Some of my colleagues at work knew I was going and I guess the word spread. Today at work a few of my republican co-workers asked me about the march and I have to say that they laughed when I told them of some of the great signs (Make Levees not war, Iraq is Arabic for Vietnam), etc. I showed them pictures on my laptop of the crosses at Camp Casey and others.

I have known many of these people for a number of years and I know the tide has turned. Laughter, “wow, cool” was not the response I was expecting. I received a few phone calls asking me how it went from staunch republicans who then said that it sounded great and laughed when I told them about some of the signs.

All the anti ANSWER bs that has been floating around DU is a red herring. My participation has allowed moderate conservatives and Dems to feel ok about the absurdity of this admin and to feel that it’s ok to look at them in a new light. Speaking out and taking a personal stand causes ripples among real people we see every day. Nobody cares about the speeches, but the images we paint take hold.

Paint the picture for them. Allow them to see true democracy that wants no one left behind. Most people are decent and caring, but have been frightened into thinking that if they don’t put themselves first they won’t survive. Divide and conquer is the enemy mantra. ” One for all and all for one” is their nemesis. But together we can make this lousy world a better place.

[EstimatedProphet]

1. Well put!

That's exactly what was important about Saturday-not the speeches, but that possibly 500,000 people showed up so that their voice was heard.

[bettyellen]

2. well said!

[bettyellen]

3. well dupe!

[crispini]

4. Nominated!

[Tamyrlin79]

5. I agree with your point that how we tell it shapes perspectives.

But, it is also true that the anti-war movement needs leadership that reflects its consensus, not fringe positions. It is the difference between us being able to solidify existing perceptions and having to revise and clean up misperceptions (as in this instance).

[kohodog]

6. I think many of the misconceptions are here on DU

CSPAN aside, and I haven't seen the coverage and unless they're replaying it I doubt too many others saw it, most of the media had no mention of ANSWER and the fringe stuff. CBS called it "Cindy Sheehan's march," and other news clips I saw showed the march, not the speeches. Nobody I have talked to mentioned anything about the speeches.

Could we have different and better coordination and a more concise message? Of course. But I'm happy it happened.

[bos1]

31. account of how ANSWER agenda alienated mainstream demo-goers in SD

http://www.indepundit.com/archive2/2005/09/fracture_lines.html

JAMAL KANJ, a fiery Palestinian from a group called Al-Awda, takes the podium. “We Palestinians,” he begins, “have been subjected to GENOCIDE at the hands of the Israelis for generations." He rants on. "In 1948, they forced us out of our homes, and today we must DRIVE THE JEWS FROM PALESTINE!”

Suddenly, a middle-aged man wearing a black “F the President” T-shirt rushes the stage, screaming at Kanj, “I’m TIRED of this CRAP! You people keep bringing this up! This is supposed to be an ANTI-WAR rally, not an ANTI-ISRAEL rally!”

Kanj yells back, into the microphone. Others in the crowd stand up and join in the shouting match.

The Arab-Israeli conflict has arrived in San Diego.

As T-shirt Man exits stage right, ANSWER front man Carl Muhammed enters from stage left, strutting in front of the platform and waving a large Palestinian flag. Carl and his radical Palestinian posse face down the angry Israel supporters, and the entire rally begins to descend into chaos.

[MisterP]

7. boo-ya!

I'm so glad you could make it to DC

[kohodog]

8. West side

Yo

[MisterP]

10. Orange County, Calif.--sorry to let you down

:cry: :o

[Warren Stupidity]

9. Stop the Bad Protestor Meme Now!

Great post! Nominated. I had a fine time. I always ignore ANSWER. The whole event was positive, then I get back here and there are a million and one Bad Protestor Meme posts running around polluting our collective reality. Bummer. Time to get out my bottle of Meme-Away.

[Hissyspit]

18. I was shocked a bit by those posts when I got back home. The protest was

about the Bush agenda and administration and the war. There were plenty of voices to be heard and I consider it a success. No one is ever going to agree on just how something like this should be done, but there were no disasters and the march went PAST THE WHITE HOUSE.

[renabear]

11. Lets make sure the images we paint are for peace and non violence

I agree we shouldn't quibble back and forth about Answer--we had hundreds of thousands of people who came out against the war and that is indeed a powerful picture. But I say again (and as you can see I am new, but this topic gave me a voice finally) I prefer the images of non-violence and peace; not Death to Israel and intifada and it matters not to me whether those voices were from Answer or whomever. If it made me uncomfortable, I can't help but wonder if it had some effect on Mr. and Mrs. Undecided. Perhaps I am oversensitive to it, many of my ancestors were killed in pogroms in the Ukraine and a few escaped to America; I grew up with those stories.
And its not that I believe those few negative (in my opinion) images would change the mind of someone who truly believed in ending this war and ending the killing. They just seemed antithetical to a peaceful and non-violent ideal. I think I've exhausted my time on this topic, I've responded in similar kind to three threads. I don't want to wear out my welcome. Thank you.

[libnnc]

12. thank you.

I refuse to let red herring bullshit rain on my parade. There's a saying in the south "You either run with the big dawgs or stay on the porch." ANSWER gets on my last nerve that's true, but I wouldn't have missed this opportunity for the world. It gave us all a chance to be BIG DAWGS for an afternoon.

[BrklynLiberal]

13. Great post. Wonderfully said. I was in DC, and ANSWER did not affect my

feelings about being there with 500,000 other people who shared my enthusiasm one bit.
FSTV and LINKTV had hours of coverage showing the diversity and huge numbers of marchers. They did not focus on the speeches. I do not think they devoted any time to ANSWER at all.

All in all, it was a fantastic success.

[KittyWampus]

14. "Anti-Answer bs"? How Pathetic So Many DU'ers Are Willing To Flush

great opportunities down the toilet.

The MARCH was a great success, No?

Does exposing the crap from ANSWER's Rally and trying to figure a way to elimate their crap the next time detract from that success? NO!

The ANSWER rally was televised, counterproductive nonsense.

Are your expectations so low you can't imagine having a successful March AND a succesful Rally?

Are you so willing to just say "fuck it" to the idea of having great, inspiring speakers step up to the mike?

[libnnc]

15. okay so when's the next one? Will you organize it?

Huh? When? Where? Are you going to organize it? Will you?

[libnnc]

16. selfdelete

[libnnc]

17. selfdelete

[libnnc]

20. when's the next rally? how will you get 500,000 people to DC?

when, where, how? We need to know.

[rman]

30. Does that mean ANSWER is beyond reproach?

Do we have to support ANSWER at every step they take simply because they got the permit for the demonstration?
Should we be carrying signs saying "free Palestine", instead of "bring the troops home now" and "impeach Bush"?

[Warren Stupidity]

34. No you should bring any damn sign you want.

But did you even go?

[bpilgrim]

21. "exposing the crap from ANSWER's Rally" on the OUTSIDE gives you 0

credibility.

just as we 'lefties' have to stick together on our dem 'leaders' for STRENGTH the same must be done for our ACTIVIST.

all y'all who are sooooooo upset you wont even MARCH with them, start your own group and join the CROWD.

fyi

peace

[gristy]

22. Well put, cryingshame

Well put.

[bpilgrim]

19. NO ONE defends this admin anymore at my VERY republican company and

EVERY ONE expects the rush-bots to attack the commies&hippies, blah, blah, blah... though NO ONE expects it from DU'ers.

thanks for sharing :toast:

peace

[spuddonna]

23. I absolutely agree! The first people to stand up and speak the truth...

...encourage the people who are not as bold to also stand up and speak the truth.

More and more people will stand up and start to speak the truth. And then the politicians have no other choice but to listen, or lose office.

I have faith that the moderate Republicans, who are horrified by what their party has become, will grab the reins of the party from these crazy people. They'll force this administration to get our men and women home asap.

I have hope! And Cindy and the brave people who were arrested today inspire me to fight even harder! :)

[renabear]

24. Well said!

What an inspiring post! I work at a non profit which promotes democratic ideals as its mission statement, so my co-workers and I were always on the same page about this out of control administration and the war. But I am just not seeing and hearing anything positive about Bushco from neighbors and people who work where I shop, buy my gas, etc. We must continue to pressure moderate Republicans (and there are several in my state) to wrest away the controls at the top, and restore our nation to sanity. And our precious young men and women to safety.

[spuddonna]

27. Thank you! Right back at you, too...

And welcome to DU if I haven't already said hi! :)

I've been writing to Senators and Congresspeople in other states as well as my own. They aren't dumb. They know how unpopular this war is, and there's an election right around the corner...

BTW - I have republican in laws. They went from being extremely supportive of Bush after 9-11 to being outraged with this war. It is definitely an issue for them. They have nieces and nephews who could end up in Iraq, and they are solidly against it.

I know they'll be screaming along with us! :)

[renabear]

33. I've been writing as well

and my mother's cousins are furious that their son is in harm's way for this pack of lies. The tide is definitely turning and I will keep my resolve not to let up and educate where I can. People will listen now, when a couple of years ago they would not.

[AuntiBush]

25. Tides Turning on Republicans I know, too!

Seen a rally yesterday a.m. up the road (hard-core bikers) desperately trying to rally support for * & the War. Waving flags, signs, and literally riding bikes up on sidewalks at this HUGE 6 way intersection, no one paid them a "lick" of attention and it was busy & I was watching.

No one, I repeat NO ONE.

Matter-of-fact, those bikers numbered less then 20 if that.

I grew-up w/bikers and many were good, hard-working people. I don't think the ones I knew would have done this, rather it's another part of the small majority that LOVE to HATE <--- * supporters.

[SittingBull]

26. Kick!

Well done!

Only one conclusion:

The foe of my foe is my friend.

Therefore we have to unite despite all affords to get us divided.

[rman]

28. DC was great despite ANSWER

Many of the anti-answer folks went to DC.
They were amongst the people who made the march start early, instead of listening to 90 minutes of speeches on matters they hadn't come to DC for.

Anti-ANSWER does not mean anti-demonstration.

[Nothing Without Hope]

29. Thanks for this! It will be interesting to hear what they think of

Cindy's arrest and the continuing flood of lies about absolutely everything out of the White House.

[bklyncowgirl]

32. Pictures of ordinary people protesting the war speak volumes.

Yeah those ANSWER clowns were a turn off but what stands out in my mind were the thousands of ordinary Americans who went to great lengths to travel to Washington, make their own signs and banners and patiently endure a march that seemed to take forever start and then crawled at a snails pace in order to make their statements against the war and against an administration that has dragged their country's name through the mud.

That is who this march was about.