I hate to say "I told you so," but - Calif Dems never drove home the Enron

[RichM]

-Reliant '01 energy scam, and its ties to Bush-Cheney. I said here 2 months ago that they'd be too cowardly to do this, and guess what? They were too damn cowardly to do it. I'd wager they had the counsel of the DLC types, who, needless to say, advised them it would be "too risky" a strategy to pursue. (These were the people who decided not to protest the stolen 2000 election. See the pattern?)

I live here in Calif; I pay attention to the news here -- and I heard virtually nothing the entire time about the budget deficit being due in large measure to the Enron-Bush-Cheney axis.

From my perch, the whole Democratic campaign sounded like a feeble whimpering, "Please, you guys, please don't throw us out of office! Pretty please?"

The one time Davis talked about the pattern of Florida 2000 leading to Texas redistricting leading to the Calif Recall, it got attention. It was front page. Then I never heard squat about it again.

They didn't have a solid compelling message, and they were simply too chicken to mention the biggest thing. Stooping to the sex-Nazi stuff at the last minute was pathetic. They bought Clinton & Jesse Jackson & every big-shot Dem candidate out here, and it accomplished zilch.

Lesson for Democrats, 2003 California: If you're a bunch of cowards and have no real message, you lose -- no matter how ridiculous your opponent is.

[AP]

1. Yeah. The only way it makes sense that the word "Enron" never passed

Cruz & Gray's lips is if they were told they'd be shot if they did.

You know I'm trying to be funny when I say that. But I then again, I can't really think of any other explanation.

[RichM]

13. Well, it's sort of funny anyway!

It boggles the mind that they didn't use that. It should have been the CENTER of their campaign -- and they scarcely mentioned it!

[Terwilliger]

30. let's run out in the streets and protest Davis' silence

:eyes:

[spanone]

41. I agree with you totally. I was under the impression that

Davis' problems stemmed from the manipulation of energy i.e. Enron. But as you say Enron was never mentioned. Makes you wonder is Davis made a deal?

[arcane1]

2. even Arrianna said nothing when at the debates

and Arnold was there too!!

:wtf:


I agree, that should've been message #1

[KG]

3. the CA dem. party need only look in the mirror.....

'if...you have no real message, you lose -- no matter how ridiculous your opponent is' - this is true on the national stage as well.

[Noordam]

4. Then they all should have lost nt

[proud patriot]

5. Nor did they HAMMER on PETE WILSON

:mad:

[Booberdawg]

6. It wasn't something that could be addressed in a soundbite

Too complicated an issue. Arnie got millions in free airtime the way it was.

It was a fucking travesty no matter how you look at it. I'm not going to contribute to the bashing of CA Dems or Davis camp for an out of state GOP power grab orchestrated in Washington to overturn the previous election for which they didn't like the results and decided they wanted DO-OVERS and had the millions to finance. That's really what happened in California.

[AP]

7. I bet James Carville could have put it in a soundbite.

...

[Booberdawg]

11. There were too many aspects of the Enron scandal to put in a soundbite

[rocktivity]

12. Complicated?

Ernon ripped off California to the tune of $9 billion. Bustamante filed a lawsuit. Arnold met with Enron officials. They allegedly cooked up a scheme where Enron would pay as little as two cents on the dollar as a settlement if they backed Arnold as mayor. It will be easy enough to determine if all this is true--and there will be a legitimate reason to recall Arnold if it is!

It's up to you, California. Don't wait for the politicians or the media to ask. Start asking yourself, and DON'T STOP:



rocknation

[proud patriot]

25. Oh I didn't know Ahhhhhnold responded like that

:mad:

[Classical_Liberal]

47. "Arnold and Enron"

"Want to here more?" "Arnolds sleazy activities with the Enron Boys in a hotel room!" I could think of lots of soundbights actually.

[Racenut20]

8. Blown Opportunities

The California Democrats have had a two year opportunity to hang the whole economy on Bush and to my knowledge (I have family there who are Democrats and some work for the newspaper-can't name it- that supported the No-Recall)... Failed to do it. Grey Davis should have been all over it since the first blackout and the first fall of the stock market. He could have published that 13% unemployment rate in San Jose, but they stood by and let Smirk make one of his economy campaign speeches (that taxpayers paid for) in the middle of San Jose.

[SemperEadem]

69. I don't think Grey Davis took any of this seriously enough

either that or he was too arrogant to believe that he could be ousted from office.

this is like being hit in the head with a stick and 12 hours later saying "ouch! that hurt".

[Iverson]

9. Maybe it's the benefit of hidsight ...

... but the mentality that observes this assault on democracy (which is how I read this misuse of recall) and then says "let's put it all behind us" has not served the Democratic Party well.

[Code_Name_D]

16. No, this ISN'T Hind Sight.

The Democrats will not fight. We knew this for three years now. When the recal was just getting started, I said the same thing. Davis will not fight, as per DLC stratigy.

[Iverson]

19. Well then ...

If it could have been predicted, and if in fact you predicted it, and if it is not a good strategy ...


... why did they follow it?

[Terwilliger]

31. Isn't that the question of the age?

All I can say is... :shrug: :wtf:

[SemperEadem]

71. Dems have rolled over and put their arses in the air saying

"Damn the lube! Hit me, porky!"

Every elected Dem in this state should have been vocally incandescent over what Bush did in 12/00; but in the end, they seemed only interested in their special interest groups and who was donating to their campaigns to get re-elected, which, by and large by the way things are going now, is most likely not to happen. We only have ourselves to blame for being quiet, good little people who don't make any noise when we're being beaten down.

I understand the people of CA being incensed enough over the energy assault 3 yrs ago to sign a recall petition, but what I don't get is that the leading Dems of this state weren't hammering home the message that the president and his cronies systematically and with cold, calculating and predatory premeditation financially assaulted the people of CA and dared them to complain and threatened them if they sought redress--this state has been traumatized like a true victim of crime by Bush&Co. and the Dems seemed to just sit back and take the stance of "well, if you weren't in that part of town this wouldn't have happened to you".

[poskonig]

10. Dems tried to get conservatives to join McClintock by pimping Arnold

as a liberal.

Perhaps we should have labeled him as a *conservative* all along and tried to get the liberals to turnout. Hence, the talk about Wilson, Enron, et cetera, would be a component of this broader strategy. No?

[Booberdawg]

14. Would have also helped if Bustamante had not been running around

on his own encouraging his supporters to vote yes on the recall so he could gain power for himself. Not to mention other supposed "liberals" like the Green interference and Arianna encouraging their supporters to vote yes on the recall. If Dems didn't have to fight both ends all the time maybe they could start winning these battles.

[Classical_Liberal]

48. smear Bustumante, smear Arnold with the sex nazi stuff

smear all other dems, but at the end of the day nobody liked Davis. Figure it out!

[tom_paine]

15. Damnit, Rich, stop making sense!

You are absolutely right.

What about that Arnold-Lay meeting? Nobody mentioned THAT either!

Crazy. Have Bushevik moles bored into every Democratic campaign, counseling caution, cowardice, and stupidity or "does the fault lie not in our stars, but in ourselves"?

Once again I tip my hat to your analytical powers, Rich.

Absolutely right.

[RichM]

22. I'm sorry, tom. I'll try to be more careful. It just sort of slipped out.

I'd just walked down the street past an array of newspaper coin-boxes. All of them with huge pictures of Arnold, & saying how beautiful Maria is, as California's new "First Lady."

It upset me, so these dratted "troubling thoughts" bubbled up to the surface again.

But I'm feeling better now. I'm under control again. Honest I am.... ;-)

[Mandate My Ass]

17. I no longer believe

that these dems fear being Wellstoned or anthraxed or Baxterized nor do they harbor any secret design to cover their tracks and remain silent on the most pressing issues facing the country in order get elected and save the day. An even halfway competent investigation of any of the myriad of scandals that have erupted since 2001 would be enough to impeach or prosecute the criminals now in office.

These people are either in bed, or want to be in bed, with the fat cats because it's five until midnight and they're dropping their slippers on the ballroom floor in the hopes the prince will seek them out and they'll live happily ever after. All the while Americans go to the polls and play a game of political "Survivor" while insurgents from without and traitors from within work in tandem to turn the USA into a third world country.

[tom_paine]

18. Damn, that was well said, Monica!

:toast: :toast:

[Mandate My Ass]

21. Thanks, tom_paine

whew, got a cigarette?

[shanti]

34. exactly

it's the rich versus the poor, as it's always been.

[screembloodymurder]

20. They need to give the people what they want

The voters were upset about two things:
1) The $500 license
2) The illegals license
All else could have been forgiven.

[Ress1]

23. I don't think there was anything the Dems could have said or done

to save them from this takeover. We've lost our voice for some reason and it seems like nothing we say resonates with voters. If something negative for the GOP does stick, it is brushed aside with some silly apology or excuse and life goes on. Sexual assaults, treason in the WH, lying about the war, exploding debt, social programs in dire straits, economy gone to hell and it's treated like it's the norm for the country. Makes the impeachment of Clinton seem all the move trivial now. Gore told the truth, yet he was labeled a liar and is now out of politics, Bush lies and he's a great leader. I think there's something deeper here than meets the eye and I think it lies at the top of our political party. We have the right message, we just can't seem to get the people to take it seriously. It's pretty clear we have been out meneuvered in communicating with the masses by the GOP and we have to figure out how to get our message heard and accepted. Maybe the dems are too busy with their in-fighting to worry about finding an effective way to communicate with the party members and the rest of the country. If it weren't for the web, I don't think I would ever hear anything about a strategy and most of that is speculation. Other than McAuliffe (sp), I have no idea who our leaders are and who makes the decisions. (sigh)

[msmcghee]

37. Your post is full of very good observations and questions.

You said We've lost our voice for some reason and it seems like nothing we say resonates with voters. If something negative for the GOP does stick, it is brushed aside with some silly apology or excuse and life goes on. Sexual assaults, treason in the WH, lying about the war, exploding debt, social programs in dire straits, economy gone to hell and it's treated like it's the norm for the country. Makes the impeachment of Clinton seem all the move trivial now. Gore told the truth, yet he was labeled a liar and is now out of politics, Bush lies and he's a great leader. I think there's something deeper here than meets the eye and I think it lies at the top of our political party. We have the right message, we just can't seem to get the people to take it seriously. It's pretty clear we have been out meneuvered in communicating with the masses by the GOP and we have to figure out how to get our message heard and accepted.

It has to do with the ideas held in common by most Americans - that are received at a level below the words that are being communicated. These are called memes.

The most important meme that Americans have recieved since Bush* was appointed was delivered without words at all - by Osama bin Laden. It is a very powerful meme that exists indelibly in the minds of almost all Americans.

The meme is that we and our familes can be killed at any moment by Arab terrorists who hate us and want us dead. The best memes have vivid symbols that are easily communicated. What could be more effective than that image of the WTC towers in flames that terrible day.

Carl Rove immediately after 9/11 set Bush* up to take maximum advantage of that meme for his own political purposes - do destroy liberals and dem politicians with it. Bush, thanks to Carl Rove, now owns that meme.

When Bush* walks over liberals and dem politicians and the UN on his way to attack Saddam Hussein - the majority of Americans don't blame him for that - they love him. That's what all those flags were about a few months ago.

Instead the majority of Americans despise us and dem politicians and the UN for being apologists for Islam and standing in Bush's* way when he is trying to protect us.

Carl Rove has used this so skillfully that we are much further behind politically than most of us here at DU realize. The more we yell and write letters to the editor and pass resolutions to try to constrain Bush* and his anti Islam "crusade" the more other Americans hate us and what we stand for.

Many here at DU seem to think that at some point it will become clear to other Americans how deceitful Bush is and how wrong it was to fabricate reasons to take us to war. The exact opposite is true. They are only becoming more convinced that we are stupid, un-American and are on the side of the Islamists - and they truly despise us for that.

When dem politicians say that he lied, those politicians come off as weak and unwilling to protect America from radical Islam. When we attack our dem leadership as being pink-tutus, we are cementing their image in other American's minds as being wusses and cowards.

It is ironic that we call them pink-tutus for going along with Bush's* plan to attack Saddam. In the process we are guaranteeing that Americans not on the left as we are - those in the middle who will determine the next election - will be voting for Bush*. Carl knows this - he made it happen - it's a Catch 22.

Listen to Bush when he speaks in public now. He is really into projecting that image as the new sherrif who's come to town to clean house. The dems are now powerless to oppose him - although Clark might be able to pull it off - if he's smart enough to understand what has happened and why we are in such a bad position.

[SemperEadem]

73. so true!

"Many here at DU seem to think that at some point it will become clear to other Americans how deceitful Bush is and how wrong it was to fabricate reasons to take us to war. The exact opposite is true. They are only becoming more convinced that we are stupid, un-American and are on the side of the Islamists - and they truly despise us for that."

America doesn't want to wake up from this stupor... they are addicted to the terror drug that Bush has been adminstering to the nation since he usurped the office...

For them to wake up from it would mean that they would have to think and decide for themselves based upon the evidence presented. Right now, they'd rather go along with what they're being told to think and decide like they're a bunch of 5yr olds. By and large, they don't want that responsibility because it would then nullify their being able to cop to the right to be ignorant of the issues that directly affect them.

Americans want the right to be lulled into a stupor and stay there. Only when the policies of the president come crashing down in their lives will they wake up out of it. But until that day comes, they feel entitled to just sit, stare and drool and do what they're told. Such easy pickings--no wonder Bush&Co. is having a field day.

[maggrwaggr]

43. It's not the voters, it's the media

our message is lost on THE MEDIA

Somehow the republicans (perhaps by just paying them) have managed to grab the media's ear.

We shout and shout and it's like they're deaf to us.

BUT if we had any REAL LEADERS they'd figure out a way to fucking get attention!

That's their job!

Where are they and why aren't they doing their job?

Jesus, where are all the Hollywood liberals who are supposed to be so good at this shit???

[Code_Name_D]

44. So what is the DLC going to do about it?

They seem to think getting on the O'Rilley Facter is just the meadia spin they need.

Its one thing to realize that the meadia is part of the problem. But what good is this knowlage if the DLC Dems refuse to act on it?

[msmcghee]

60. The people who watch O'Reilly . .

. . and Crossfire for that matter, are already on the right or the left and there's zero chance that any of them will change their minds. It is only entertainment and a chance for partisans to root for their team.

The 25% in the middle are not into politics. While we are listenimg to NPR they are doing Survivor or Jeopardy. But they know Saddam sent those airliners into the WTC - and he's got WMD cause we already found lots of them. They know because our president gunslinger told them about it - in the brief sound bites that do get through to them.

The only way to deal with these morans is to control the dominant memes in our political culture. Right now Rove controls those memes.

Watch Bush* or listen carefully to any of his media moments these days. You will see expertly crafted memesmanship, compliments of Carl Rove. As president, Bush* has almost unlimited access to the media - which he's using (as he has from the beginning) to inject Carl's memes into the minds of that 25% factor - who will determine the next election.

[SemperEadem]

72. what doesn't make sense to me

is that 100% of the people I've come into contact and conversation with over the course of this recall mess were totally against the recall and totally against der fuhrer... they didn't necessarily like Davis, but they recognized that he inherited the problems, he didn't make them.

:wtf:

[frank frankly]

24. damn straight

don't they read Palast? don't they give a fuck?

i guess most don't. they gotta, gotta go.

[demgrrrll]

27. Drudge was a major player in framing this debate by seeming to

turn against Arnold and print all the lurid stories about his unsavory exploits. He did not hammer away at the Enron story nor did he hammer away at his association with Pete Wilson or the Palast story. He threw the first punch as I recall and I also recall how surprised everyone here including myself were at what he was publishing about Arnold. The Enquirer was the first source but I guess but Mr. Drudge somehow scooped the story, was that how it went? The Enquirer has not exactly been a friend of the Democratic party IIRC. In retrospect...........

[Rex]

26. Enron who? Oh, is that the company Martha Stewart started?

Look! Shiny things...







P.S. - Americans are deconstructing their DNA into a new genus/species - Homer simpsons

[Cheswick2.0]

28. Just curious ...what did you do to defeat the recall?

I would guess that since we can't prove Arnie promised anything about the Enron lawsuit, the democrats didn't feel they could stress that point. I don't agee, I think they should have anyway.
However unless you were doing something to defeat the recall, you should probably stop the mindless democrat bashing.

[RichM]

35. Coupla points here. First, what I'm talking about has nothing to do with

Arnold. When the price of energy skyrocketed in Spring '01, Davis personally begged Bush & Cheney to impose a price cap, & they refused. They appointed Pat Wood as head of FERC (as per Ken Lay's suggestion), & he made sure that Enron made off with billions of dollars of state money. This info alone is damning -- you don't need to start speculating about deals with Arnold, to show that Bush-Cheney helped Enron loot the Treasury.

Second, your phrase "mindless Democrat bashing" is unwarranted. I am certainly criticizing the Democrats' cowardice & miserable campaign strategy. You might consider this 'bashing,' but it is not "mindless." There's a very legitimate point here that even YOU acknowledge agreement with.

What did I do personally? Well, I spent several afternoons handing out leaflets against the recall up at the university. I voted against the recall, & made sure everyone I know voted against it. I went to see Jesse Jackson & Kucinich speak against the recall, & yelled & hollered when they said stuff. (I hope that's enough to earn me the right to criticize Democrats!!)

[sangh0]

55. But it is mindless, RichM

You don't pay any attention to the consequences of your arguments, which merely serve to place the blame of so-called "leaders", who are in truth nothing more than craven "politicians". Instead of pointing out how the true sources of power, the people, have been silent, you blame our political "leaders", as if the only problem we face is the silence of professional politicians.

I hope that's enough to earn me the right to criticize Democrats

This may surprise, but it has nothing to do with your "rights". You have the right to say pretty much whatever you want. It's not about your rights; It's about your credibility. Just as you miss the central point about where political power comes from, you miss the central point about your credibility problem.

[Dr Fate]

29. Democrats own media outlets???

Which ones?

[Nottingham]

32. Ya Bustamonte the day before the election Sues Enron

That just showed the dems weren't going to do ANYTHING against Enron!

Until they felt the better for their jobs! :bounce:

[KoKo]

33. Disagree with you on this one, I don't think Enron or Female Groping would

have been or WERE issues. Groping....no one cared. So what....all folks like AH-nold are going to "GROPE." and Enron? well ......that's OLD news. After all, we don't hear anything anymore about Enron. What is Enron...(I say this as I chomp my Valley Girl" piece of Gum, and leaf through my Brittany Spears Nude Photos.)" Hey, what are you talkin' about ,Dude??

So What are you telling me here? Why should I care about Grope and Enron. Hey! A Good Lay....is a Good Lay! Doesn't matter if it's "Enron or Brittany Fantasy!"

It all runs together in my mind! ;-)

[Classical_Liberal]

49. It's not old news given the fact that they are the reason the budget

was in crisis, or that Pete Wilson was running Arnold's campaign or that Arnold had a meeting with Enron.

[KoKo]

59. Ah! You didn't read my whole post where I was the Valley Girl! subject

line! ;-)

[Piperay]

36. My understanding was

that Davis didn't exactly have "clean hands" with Enron either and bringing it up would have also brought up his own contributions from Enron. I could be wrong but I am sure that I read it right here in the DU about Davis getting money from them.

[Flying_Pig]

38. Some of us did Rich. I've been working the issue for three years, and

have written hundreds of letters and made hundreds of calls. I also conducted my own investigations early on, and sent the conclusions to the press, and Gov. Davis. Despite all that work, Davis never picked up the ball, and I STILL can't figure out why. As far as the press goes, only acouple of months ago, did one of the major papers (S.F. Chronicle) address the issue in a major way, with an large editorial. "Consumer-Alert" was also very active on this issue, but they didn't seem to stir up much more interest than I did.

There were other press bits too, but it just never caught fire here, and I still don't understand why. Here we had a group of mostly Texas based companies, all good "friends" of Bush/Cheney, led by Enron, who ripped this state off for tens of billions, and hardly anyone got upset about it.

Go figure... :wtf:

There were times when I actually felt like the reason there wasn't any traction developing over it, nor more outrage from the politicos, is that everyone was in on "it" somehow. It still makes no sense.

I'll tell you what though, come the 04' elections, the Dems better get their asses in gear, and slam this issue upside Bush's head, day in, and day out.

[birdman]

46. The public would have tuned out Enron

Especially in the glitzy, celebrity-driven atmosphere
of the recall. Enron is old news; (rightly or wrongly)
it has little if any political value now and an attempt
to make the recall about price fixing would have been
ignored.

It may not be right but people were going to pay a lot more
attention to the escalating car tax and reports of Arnolds
fingerprints on prominent pairs of mammaries than a two
year old energy scandal.

And I imagine if anybody from the DLC ever drops in at this web
site they'd be amazed at the amount of power they have. That
all-pupose punching bag strikes again.

[Terwilliger]

53. and what makes you think that's going to happen?

Davis didn't use it...nor Bustamante...nor other Democrats.

[Terwilliger]

54. oops-a-dupe

sa-dupe

[ctex]

39. Davis was Enron's second most favored Governor

If my memory serves me correctly Gray Davis received more money from Enron than any other Governor with the exception of GWB.

OTOH, Arnold can claim he never took a dime in political contributions from Enron

[onecitizen]

40. You're absolutely right............

RichM.

[maggrwaggr]

42. I agree 1000%

The Dems show over

and over

and over

that they have no leadership.

WHERE ARE OUR LEADERS????

[Zan_of_Texas]

45. Rich makes good points

(We're not surprised though <G>)

The California budget deficit would be a lot less if the energy companies had been forced to cough up their ill-gotten gains. Real money, not that FERC sham.

If you go all the way back to when the state legislators decided to go for deregulation, you'll find that they were wined and dined and treated to junkets all over the world by the dereg crowd, including Enron. They were worked over big time, and the whole legislature voted for deregulation -- I don't think there was even one dissenting vote. They were told that energy bills would be 20% less blah blah blah.

They weren't told they'd have rolling blackouts and sky high energy bills, their state would go deep in debt, dereg would result in bailouts of the big utilities, energy traders would cheat them using tricks like Get Shorty, Death Star, and Ricochet, and the people would turn to an action hero movie star to save the state. They weren't told that Washington would drumbeat a bad-PR tattoo on Gray Davis and the Birkenstock Californians while the lights were going out -- governor is a poor manager, stupid environmentalists refuse to build power plants yada yada yada. Washington refused to help, just blamed California. Wouldn't even meet with the California Senators. Message: "It's your own damn fault." Only later events would shine a light on who probably knew what when.

Here's one report:
One fall day in 2000, in the midst of the California energy crisis, S. David Freeman found himself debating by telephone with Enron's CEO Kenneth Lay. Freeman, head of the Los Angeles Department of Water and Power at the time, had joined other California officials in pushing the federal government for price controls as a means to rein in a runaway wholesale market.
Government intervention, Lay warned Freeman by telephone, would not work. Extended price caps would keep the market from correcting itself, and frighten away future investment in power plants. Lay, as Freeman recalls it, ended the conversation with this parting shot: "Well, Dave, in the final analysis, it doesn't matter what you crazy people in California do, because I got smart guys out there who can always figure out how to make money." LAT, "Paper Trail Points to Roots of Energy Crisis," June 16, 2002

Here's another:
LATE IN 2000 TO EARLY IN 2001 - The New York Times reports that Enron used undisclosed reserves to keep as much as $1.5 billion in trading profits off its books during the California energy crisis, according to six former managers and executives who handled or reviewed the accounts. The enormous reserves, which would have doubled the company's reported profits, were hidden in late 2000 and early 2001, as energy prices soared in California and politicians accused trading companies like Enron of price gouging. The former Enron officials said that the company swelled the reserves in hopes of damping the political firestorm. "We made such an incredible amount of money we didn't want to recognize it all into earnings. We were supposed to make $500 million in a quarter and we were doing it in a day," said a former Enron executive, speaking on condition of anonymity, on Enron manipulation of its trading books. NYT, 6/23/02

May 2001 - "IF we find it, they're going to dread the day they ever thought about doing it," says FERC Chairman Curt Hebert of alleged energy price gouging. More blackouts follow in May.
Bush will announce he is replacing Hebert, on August 14, 2001. The new FERC Chair will be Pat Wood. Wood is the choice of Enron. http://www.cbsnews.com/now/story/0,1597,303149-412,00.shtml

Meanwhile, in mid-May, 2001, Ken Lay is meeting with a few special folks, including junk bond fella Michael Milken and Arnold Schwartzennegger. http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=283&row=1

~~~~~~

P.S. I have no association with this book, but I understand Bethany McLean of Fortune Magazine has written a new book on Enron, Smartest Guys in the Room -- pub date is Monday. I haven't seen it yet.

[Zan_of_Texas]

50. kick

:kick:

[eileen_d]

51. I'd wager you just enjoy gloating

from atop your high horse.

[RichM]

66. Which of the following 2 activities do you think is most useful?

- correcting my behavior (only possible result: making me laugh)

(or)

- focusing attention on the cowardice & ineptness of Democratic Party strategy? :crazy:

I'm flattered that you think I'm the more important issue here. But with all due modesty, I'm not.

[sangh0]

52. Another lie

You just love saying "I told you so" :-)

And once again you promote the counter-productive idea that our problems are the result of politicians not acting, and ignore the millions of CA voters who refused to demand answers about Enron from their so-called leaders. And if they had raised the Enron issues, you would have complained because they didn't raise the issue of Repukes being Nazis.

Way to suppress political activism, RichM! You should be proud for contributing to the same political inaction you criticize.

[Terwilliger]

57. crap sangha, now you're blaimng the voters

I thought it was the duty of the elected politicians and party leaders to do the job of persuading a majority to vote for them

They failed MISERABLY and you want to blame voters :eyes:

[sangh0]

58. Tell that to Ahnold

who won with something less than a majority. Clinton also did not receive a majority.

Next time, learn about how elections work before commenting. In this country, it only takes a plurality

[Terwilliger]

61. Just like you, sangha

do ANYTHING but answer the question :eyes:

[sangh0]

62. Answer the question??

WHAT QUESTION?? You didn't post any question, you bubblehead

[Terwilliger]

64. just like you not to pay attention

you're such a disruptor

[Snellius]

56. Right on target

I was always surprised when I went back to California -- I'm a lifelong Californian living in NY and following what happens there closely -- how during the energy crisis, even though it was obvious to anyone outside the state that they were being gamed and scammed and shilled big time by Bush and his cronies, Californians still blamed it all on Davis. Now I know Californians can be proudly apolitical and like to see themselves as not completely part of the United States, but this was sheer scapegoating and ignorance that Californians can only blame on themselves.

[Mairead]

70. "Californians still blamed it all on Davis"

Sure they did -- they were paying him to keep it from happening, or to stop it if it got started! It was HIS JOB!

[maggrwaggr]

63. Who are "California Dems?" WE HAVE NO LEADERS

There was nobody in California leading the charge.

There was nobody across the nation leading the charge.

Davis was left to founder for himself. And he had no credibility because he was fighting for his job.

We have no leadership in the Democratic party. There's a big vacuum. There's nobody even attempting to spin our case for the media, so the media shills for the republicans.

WE NEED LEADERS.

[ThoughtCriminal]

65. Major Scandal

Even if it would not have changed the election, it was NEWS. That the major media outlets ignored it, that it was not in the debates or in the campaign is a scandal in itself.

It is not even really all that complex an issue.

[nolabels]

67. Before you flog us Californians senseless with even more

And not that I am offering any excuses for the newest extinct DINO, but there were a few things in between then and now. Like the stock market crash, 9/11, Afghanistan, Iraq build up and DC DLC Dems sellout to *, the news of the no news of mass world demonstrations against it, the invasion itself, and aftermath failure and just so much more.

You have to also know a lot of California's legislature got set up by the Enron cartel, so really we didn't really know about the whole back room crapload from the get go. You must remember the first tactic of a manipulator is using fear. This is why they went to the legislature in stealth mode. They were very weak at the time. There is lot of things that they do now that are despicable they have the power to push aside or let wither on the vine now (but don’t). I hate to predict but I think there will be some more of this underhanded dealing even though they no longer have to, or need to

It's just so hard for a leopard to change his spots

In the mean time we get Arnold to deal with, and if to guess from the thing I think I can do best sometimes, it would be guessing the mindset of people by the expression on their face in certain circumstances, judging from California’s newest fraud I think we are in for a rough road to hoe.

This peckerwood looks like he endured much flack on his way there and doesn't seem that he would be too happy with that. You have to also know he won't quit easy, that would be a quick prediction from any person that spent much time in weight lifting room. Don't worry though; his hubris will get him in the long run.

[PurityOfEssence]

68. Drive home? Hell, they didn't even look in the window or kicked the tires

What is the matter here? It was not a perplexing subject, as many said it was, it was easy. Wilson has even gone on record claiming credit for the deregulation.

Honestly, when are the Dems going to learn how to fight ON THE ISSUES?

[MrPrax]

74. Drove Home...they didn't bother to look at Arny's website

Under Energy...
http://www.joinarnold.com/en/agenda/#C1
"Policy makers need to take action to cut the risk of future power supply shortages. The state needs an energy policy that links wholesale and retail markets and rationalizes and clarifies the role of state agencies. States like California that project regulatory uncertainty heighten risk for investors and threaten further delays in new power infrastructure investment. A rational and consistent power policy will ultimately result in lower costs and greater reliability for Californians."
" Create a working wholesale power market based on the lessons learned from other states and the FERC standard market design. California is one of several states that adopted electricity restructuring. However, only California's restructuring caused severe price hikes and energy shortages. It is time to learn from other successful restructurings enacted by Texas, the New England states, and the Mid-Atlantic states of Pennsylvania, New Jersey and Maryland. In addition, California should also look to the standard market design created by FERC."

Essentially eliminate public oversight on any future contracts!!

You would have thought the Dems might have noticed that and the fact that Liebermann and GAO has criticized the FERC has being totally incapable of monitoring the prices...