What you've all been waiting for: Unbiased look at the debate...

[wyldwolf]

...from my wife, who has very little interest in politics and doesn't no one dem candidate from the other (despite my best efforts.)

Her top performers with comments:

Al Sharpton - great speaker!

John Kerry - talks like a president. Seems very smart.

Dick Gephardt - same as #2 basically.

Clark/Dean Dean/Clark - said they were about the same. Both seemed to be on the defensive. Said Dean seemed "shifty."

John Edwards - thought he was "kinda' cute."

Carol Mosely Braun - impressed she was up there.

Dennis Kucinich - a little preachy

Joe Lieberman - said he looks like Emperor Palpatine from Star Wars.

[cprise]

1. America deserves more than just "a little preachy" right now

And yes, Lieberman is so Palpatine.

[laura888]

2. what about the candidates' policies and views?

I hope your wife is not voting based on her above ideas...

I'm firmly of the opinion that people should take a test to see if they understand their candidate's views on important issues before they vote. I know it smacks of Jim Crow, but the alternative is what's happened in Calif.

[wyldwolf]

5. She's an educator... her only issues are education and civil rights...

...other than that (and the occasional "Bush is an idiot" outburst), she really isn't into politics at all. It was a challenge to even get her to watch.

But I'm workin' on her!

[laura888]

11. Sad- but I think the majority of Americans are the same way.

She's probably more aware than most.

If you're not "into politics" - that is, educated about your candidate's position on anything, I really don't think you have any business voting.

In your wife's case, since she has strong opinions about some issues, she should vote. However, I'd plead with her to know much more about the candidates. She's liable to vote for someone who agrees with her views on education and civil rights, but may be anti-abortion, for example.

[wyldwolf]

13. I understand your concern...

..she ties abortion rights into civil rights - or, women's rights.

[Rowdyboy]

7. Certainly!

also bring back the requirement that voters own land, literacy tests, poll taxes, etc. Lets herd those people right into the tight little corrals we've built for them. Its for their own good!

Sorry, that may be a touch overboard. I despise what happened in California HOWEVER it is still America and you, like everyone else, get one vote. Use it and use it wisely, but how I use mine is none of your or anyone's business.

[laura888]

14. the old requirements for voting...

...were wrong because they were meant to keep a certain segment of the population from voting - namely, those who were landless, minorities, the poor.

What I'm saying is that ANYONE can vote, but they must understand what the candidate is going to DO - not how he acts, not how he sounds when he talks, and not what he wears.

The test might be given orally and in any language.

[papau]

15. Beginning in 508 BC the Greeks voted every 9 days on everything!

Sort of a California thing- direct democracy.

Maybe it is this representative democracy thing that is the problem!

:-)

[laura888]

16. hmmmm.... interesting point!

if we were voting directly on the issues, we wouldn't be distracted by candidates' looks, etc. It would also remove the issue of the lobbyists' money power (altho there might be a variation on this...hmmm).

Wouldn't you have liked to vote in the election about whether we should go to war with Iraq?

[papau]

22. Just about every turn to the right would have been stopped by direct vote

Technical problem is the fact that voters in CA with irregular direct democracy leave a situation that illogical - and can't be fixed without another vote sometime in the future.

Right now 90% of the CA budget can not be reduced unless it is via a same % reduction to all budget categories.

I rather like an internet democracy with a vote every 9 days - topic by Constitution and those not mentioned in Constitution to be brought up via minimum number vote petition.

[morebunk]

39. Why should she care about polices and view; the rest of the public doesn't

Her analysis is just as good as any. I agree with her 100% She didn't say Sharpton would win or anyone else for that matter. She was grading the debate...period!

[morebunk]

40. I would rather have the candidates take a test to see if THEY

understood their own views. I think we can pretty much understand thier motives.

[phillybri]

3. My wife is a terrific unbiased source, too....

She has almost exactly the same takes with a few exceptions:

Dean: She's freaked by him. Thinks he's shifty and defensive.

Edwards: Doesn't like him at all.

Lieberman: Says he sounds like Droopy Dog.

Kerry: She really likes Kerry (partly my influence!), but thinks he's a bit stiff...

[DemCam]

20. Am sick to death of this focus....

on waffleing or flip-flopping or whatever they label it by the media.

Last night's debate was yet again a glaring reason we have the likes of Arnold and Bush in office. Men who have no substance are annointed and men with the ability to talk with vision and knowledge are subjected to farcical and false scrutiny about silliness.

Can you tell it didn't sit well overnight?

[cspiguy]

4. Would Clark like some egg with his Waffles?

http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/10/10/elec04.prez.democrats.debate/index.html

:9

[wyldwolf]

8. there was a little waffling going on with several candidates.. Dean, too!

Clark and Dean, who was getting it from Kerry and Gephardt, and Gephardt and Kerry.

[Rowdyboy]

10. Bring it on....

If this is the best they have on him, its gonna be a piece of cake...

[KharmaTrain]

6. Lieberman: Elmer Fudd In A Yamulka

I'm Jewish and I thought that was funny.

[bread_and_roses]

9. ROFL

at the Emperor look-alike. Your wife's observations are a good reality check for us political junkies parsing arcane minutia as if most people will ever care about our fine points. It's all about the big picture.

[indigo32]

18. I wouldn't call it arcane minutia

considering how it affects us in the end... but it's reality that there are MANY people like his wife... and we aren't likely to change that anytime soon.

[trof]

12. Was Judy Woodruff a bit MORE than Devil's Advocate?

Not exactly neutral moderator?
She seemed to be in attack mode to me. Very challenging, accusatory and trying for the "gotchas".
I admit that I do not like the woman.

[robbedvoter]

19. "And don't attack bush" she requested. Yeah, I'd say she wa

unbiased, right?
The Palpatine resemblance struck me too. The rest is what CNN staged it to look like. It was a disgrace! (still they all did fine considering). And if CNN's staging is not enough for ya, Wash Post follows it up with a transccript that conveniently excises Clark's best answer (on the preemption doctrine)

[sybylla]

21. Agreed, trof. She seemed to want to be more than a moderator

She very seriously tried to manipulate the candidates answers in my view and her banning all things bashing the pResident was a little extreme. I realize some questions would never get answered without that requirement, but she went a little overboard to me and even seemed to cut off people the minute the shrubster came up.

Didn't like the hands on control and attitude of Ms. Woodruff at all.

[caledesi]

37. Did you guys know that Judy is married to Al Hunt?

I don't see these two together at all. JMHO.

[Darth_Kitten]

24. Who was the biased male moderator?

He was on CNN whining and snivelling because Kerry got in that perfect shot at Limpballs (about prescription drugs/being Limpballs' maid). He looked so sad as he said he wonders how that will play out. :) :eyes:

:nopity: poor Rush :nopity: poor liberal bashing biased moderators: :nopity: :cry:
our society is really going to sh*t because the big bad media is turning on innocents like Limbaugh. ;) :nuke:

[sybylla]

26. That was Jeff Greenfield

Media Whore Extraordinaire. When I saw him introduced, I knew that CNN had special plans for the candidates. I don't watch CNN anymore but they used to bring Greenfield in on news stories as a political consultant, as if he had credibility as anything other than a conservative shill.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

36. He asked two identical questions:

(Paraphrase)"We all know that the Democrats are viewed by the middle class as failures, why is that?"

Unbelievable.

[Darth_Kitten]

41. He was on CNN this morning....

they showed a clip of Kerry, and he was wondering how that will play out.

He looked very down. :)

[theboss]

17. Andy Pettite was the most impressive last night

He was the night's big winner.

[seasat]

23. Rotflmao

Wyldwolf wrote: Joe Lieberman - said he looks like Emperor Palpatine from Star Wars.


That is the funniest thing I've heard lately. :D

[Reaganite]

25. hey,

This site is great for a laugh, let me tell you. Rule 1, no conservatives, whatsoever. Rule 2, absolutely no bigotry. What a farce. Well, since you can't have a fair and balanced forum with balance and fairness, I'm here to through a few thoughts around. Wow, you guys really hate catholics, or is it just organized religion in general. No bigotry, I know, if you're atheist that's fine, but still, lay off the religion subject if all you're going to do is piss and moan about how your parents made you go on sundays.

How you can just revel in your own philosophies amazes me, how can anyone be so short sited. I have never been to a conservative forum where the opposing view was banned, rather, we encourage different opinions. Talking amongst yourselves about how great you are is just mental masturbation, now it's time for your sexual revolution. Let other people talk, too, it's not that hard. We're not trying to change your views, just trying to give our two cents. Freedom of speech is a two way street. And Nobody said you had to listen.

If you try to ban me, I will return, under a new name, new identity, like hell anyone can keep me from having my voice, besides, this can get fun. I really hope no one is terrified that one of us "big bad conservatives" is out to get everyone. I'm not, I think this is a great way to expand the minds of already openminded people.

But then again...

[sybylla]

27. "Rule 1, no conservatives, whatsoever. Rule 2, absolutely no bigotry."

Hence "Democratic Underground." There is no false advertising here.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

28. You're Off Topic-But I'll Bite....

I don't hate Catholics.... As a born again Christian I look at Catholics as my brothers and sisters... I have a problem with the church's take on sexuality... All sex outside of a committed relationship is wrong but I'll let God sort it all out....

Bigotry is verbotten here.... It should be verbotten everywhere.... But I am a First Amendment absolutist so you can say what you want as long as you are willing to suffer the consequences....

I'd like to hear what "conservatives" have to say but I don't make the rules here.... I just follow them


Brian

[darknemus]

29. Congratulations, you made me spit soda on my monitor.

It was this line, here, that made me break out the bottle of Windex. "I have never been to a conservative forum where the opposing view was banned, rather, we encourage different opinions"

You do? FreeRepublic does? HA! I got banned there the other day after AGREEING to debate a couple of their resident numbskulls. A mistake I won't make again. I realize that I don't have talent on loan from Merck, so I probably would have lost, anyways.

Hey, Mr. "like hell anyone can keep me from having my voice" - Why the HELL do you think we oppose legislation like the Patriot Act. Because it contains provisions that can quiet BOTH OF US if we say something not welcomed by the administration. Think about the shoes being reversed, and a Democrat in office having passed that legislation - you'd be scared to go to the library to check out the latest Ann Coulter book because you might be labeled 'unamerican' and get to rot in some 'undisclosed location' for a few years without the right of Counsel. Sounds like a ball of fun, huh?

-darknemus

[gully]

30. ever heard of Free Republic? This is why we need to have a donation

before people post. Even $5 would detour people like this..

[maha]

31. If conservatives don't mind disagreement ...

How come I got banned on Free Republic? I wasn't vulgar or insulting or anything. I just stated a disagreement with conservative groupthink, and that was it. No more post for moi!

And then there's Bill O'Reilly ...

[thebigidea]

32. bwahahaha!

"I have never been to a conservative forum where the opposing view was banned, rather, we encourage different opinions."

Yep, FreeRepublic, Lucianne, etc. All very encouraging. All very open to opposing viewpoints.

Might I inquire as to where these tolerant conservative forums exist other than in your deluded imagination?

"If you try to ban me, I will return, under a new name, new identity, like hell anyone can keep me from having my voice, besides, this can get fun."

Indeed! Free at last, free at last - thank Gawd Almighty, you'll be free at last to piss in an electronic pool!

Have yourself another oxycontin on me! You deserve it.

[Cat Atomic]

34. Stop listening to hate radio, Reaganite.

You're full of "you think" and "you people believe". Don't trust conservative propagandists to tell you what dissenters "think".

And the fact that your post is still here sort of defuses your claims. There are plenty of conservative sites that quickly ban people with unpopular opinions.

[Terwilliger]

35. Frankly, you've never been to a conservative forum

Free Republic BOASTS of its censorship...every other conservative forum I've seen will simply not allow a true opposition viewpont to get through...they delete the post or ban the poster.

[LTR]

38. Hi Reaganite!

Welcome to DU!!!

:bounce:

NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNOT!!!

Now don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out!

[mvd]

33. Our candidates did a great job

I actually liked the loose format for a one time thing, but not the way the moderators were rude. Candy Crowley was actually the best mod. Thought Kerry had his best debate, and thought Dean recovered after a shaky start. Thought Clark did fine considering the pressure. He kept on message nicely. And I always love Kucinich, Sharpton, and Braun being there. Glad Sharpton spoke out against Woodruff. I need more "yes, yes!" moments from our Dems. Woodruff has given me a pain for a while now.

I still am a Kucinich supporter with Dean second.