BBV Alert! CNN Headline News reports 400,000 missing votes on recall in LA

[Generic Other]

Hadn't heard anything about this. Didn't see anything on their website? They said the votes that weren't recorded were on the recall. And that it happened mainly in LA.

Anyone else know more? Another one of those suspicious anomalies?

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

1. Hmmm...

That ought to change the complexion of things, just a tad.

[Must_B_Free]

6. ha ha

I have neutralized you comment with the dreaded :tinfoilhat: !

[creativelcro]

17. MORE PROBLEMS!!

By J. DOUGLAS ALLEN-TAYLOR (10-10-03)

How smoothly last Tuesday’s recall election went in the city of Berkeley depends upon which end of the process you observed. Poll workers reported a nearly flawless experience by voters using the Diebold touch-screen voting machines throughout the city. But there were glitches in the vote compiling process.

http://www.berkeleydaily.org/text/article.cfm?issue=10-10-03&storyID=17546

This is why having observers at the polls would become useless with these machines... The cheating might be going on AFTER the votes have been cast... -C

[Spazito]

18. This is excellent!

It should have a post of it's own! Fascinating reading, poll workers plugging in the modems in the wrong holes???? Quote from the article:

Ginnold said she had no information as to why the Berkeley machines malfunctioned, but said that in other upload centers in the county, some of the uploads failed when workers plugged the modem into the wrong slot.

[creativelcro]

22. Feel free to post as new thread!!

Spazito, go ahead... -creativelcro

[Spazito]

24. Thank you! Just posted, thanks for the find!

*

[creativelcro]

23. wrong slots ?

"Ginnold said she had no information as to why the Berkeley machines malfunctioned, but said that in other upload centers in the county, some of the uploads failed when workers plugged the modem into the wrong slot."

Perhaps they were try to plug a phone plug into an Ethernet socket ? Often they are on the same wall plate... No idea... -creativelcro

[ParanoidPat]

34. No, the machines are built with two PCM/CIA slots.....

.....for plug in peripherals. If the modem isn't plugged into the proper slot, the machine won't see it, or so they say. Most computers and even handheld devices have some form of 'plug and play' capability. The OS should recognize and authenticate a device and then set it up.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

30. I would say democracy will become useless with these machines

I dare say it will. and it never hurts to keep saying this...'cause it's true.

[Nlighten1]

2. 400,000 that they know about...

I seem to remember hearing about high voter turn out and millions of absentee ballots.

[nini]

3. what ws the difference in the yes/no votes?

.

[Wonk]

5. 851,138

http://vote2003.ss.ca.gov/Returns/summary.html

[nini]

7. thanks..

.

[arcane1]

4. and, pray tell, how many votes did the recall win by in LA county?

Shall Gray Davis be recalled?

Yes 877,955
No 911,811

for a difference of 33,856

verrry interestiingggg.... though I had thought that the recall won there

and of course it was in the more conservative areas of SoCal that the petitions got most of the signatures...

hmmm.... not sure what the deal is... though the recall won the state by twice that number of missing votes

would've been interesting, to say the least

[w13rd0]

9. Each incident...

...casts doubt on the whole mess. And the media calling the race for Arnie 30 seconds after polls closed? COME ON...

[althecat]

28. And the media calling the race for Arnie 30 seconds after polls closed?

That's what really got me about this too.. sort of treats the actual poll with complete contempt.

The race wasn't that onesided that the exit polls might not have been wrong....

At the time I thought. These guys are testing the public to see how dumb they really are...

[GregD]

29. I don't think they waited that long

It was feeling like he already won mid-day according to the local tv news

[goobergunch]

46. According to my timing

CNN projected the recall of Davis has succeeded at 8:00:02 PM PDT and that Ahnold would be the next governor at 8:00:05 PM PDT.

[democracyindanger]

27. More importantly

How many more votes did Schwarzenegger get than Bustamante?

[NewYorkerfromMass]

31. 1.3 million plus some

It's not even close which is why the exit polls called it for arnie.

Arnold Schwarzenegger . Rep 3,850,804 48.7 %
Cruz M Bustamante .. . Dem 2,504,481 31.7 %

[Spazito]

8. I sure would like to know where the "missing votes" went?

Another "oh-oh" by the e-vote machines? How do you track down 400,000 lost votes WITHOUT a paper trail???

[AP]

10. LA turnout was lower then expected, I thought.

Also, it was one of the few counties that shifted from majority yes to majority no as the precincts came in. And it didn't finish until late.

I suspect that there are lots of votes missing from Alameda (Oakland, Berkeley). Turnout there was very low historically and relative to neighboring counties. Alameda was a Diebold county, and also had an unusually high number of votes for the unknowns running.

[Spazito]

11. I have neither seen or heard anything on either the absentee or..

provisional ballots, has anyone here? It just seems odd to me that nothing seems to being said about them.

[West Coast Democrat]

12. Did they give any more info?

like what they plan to do about it?

[GregD]

13. here ya go

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/news/archive/2003/10/09/state2033EDT0164.DTL

Note that one study is by this guy Brady who was the Berkeley professor that ACLU referred to as the credibility behind their efforts to stop the Recall (due to the use of punch cards.) I would like to know who this guy is in bed with, and what his motivations are.

[West Coast Democrat]

14. Yep!

And thousand of Florida voters purposely meant not to vote for their Presidential pick.

[Spazito]

15. This part is so pathetically obvious!

Executives at voting equipment companies strongly refuted the conclusion. They said the difference could have been due to a complicated ballot with more than 135 candidates and two proposals.

They said the same thing in Florida, now in California too. At some point, as they keep blowing it, someone will point out this obvious scapegoating!

[SharonAnn]

19. Duh, some elections have complicated ballots. Their

products should handle ALL elections.

[RedEagle]

26. Ask Jones

Thanks for the hard work.

Why don't you ask Doug Jones about Brady? I think he wanted him to be part of a voting study. I never got an answer back as to why. Wasn't that previous study the one that ended up being funded by Sequoia?

[twilight]

16. kick!

<eom>

:nuke: :grr: :nuke: :grr:

[Noordam]

20. Remember these are problems with punch card votes

the Repugs have already taken care of the Touchscreen voting

[Spazito]

21. This is true, that is why there needs to be....

VOTER VERIFIED PAPER BALLOTS, for sure! The only reason there are no problems reported with the touchscreen is that there is no paper trail to show, sadly.

[shance]

33. Thats what they keep TELLING us. And our media is trustworthy?

American media. Where truth is fiction and fiction is truth.

:)

[Clete]

25. On the local news on election day.

they showed Arnold S. voting in a spacious precinct in Pacific Palisades in a proper voting booth. Then they should the poorer neighborhoods in South Central. There the voters didn't have booths in many of the precincts. They tried to vote as best they could at makeshift tables or any space available. One DU'er said she had to wait two hours to vote. Has anyone there looked into this? It seems like a lot of voters especially in poorer, Democratically dominated neighborhoods could have been disenfranchised.

[Cocoa]

32. 9% did not vote on recall

In 2000, my county, Cook IL, had one of the worst failure rates of the punch cards, it might have been the worst, I think it was 7%.

This is what the ACLU's suit was about, this failure affects minorities much worse. It's what HAVA is about.

Thank god the 2000 election wasn't close in IL, it would have been another Florida. Thank god CA this time wasn't close.

[hang a left]

35. How do you know it wasn't even close Cocoa?

Seems to me that there was alot of funny business going on with the Diebold machines in Alameda and Tulare counties. Low estimates of at least 500,000 provisional ballots. 400,000 missing ballots from LA county. I think we have us another stolen election. How is it the media was calling this race in the morning at 10:00. Something stinks, are you here with the air freshener?

[hedda_foil]

39. Cocoa ... I've got to agree with you on those 2000 undercounts.

They were scandalous. What do you think of the machines Cook County used in 2002?

[Lars39]

36. Sorta off-topic, but What happens if a candidate refuses to concede?

to concede when expected, or at least until everything is hunky-dory?
Is everything in limbo until the candidate concedes? What are the legalities/timetable involved? Could refusing to concede be a possible strategy to make sure the truly elected obtains the office?

[hang a left]

37. I certainly hope someone questions this smelly election

[Lars39]

38. When Davis was conceding I was yelling "Wait just a few days!"

And sure enough 3 days later.... :(

[MrPrax]

40. The mercury News has a link

Studies cite 'missing votes' from punch card ballots
By Rachel Konrad
ASSOCIATED PRESS

SAN FRANCISCO - Two independent studies of California's recall election found "missing votes" in counties throughout the state, casting doubt on antiquated punch card systems.

Nearly 9 percent of people who cast ballots on punch card voting machines in Los Angeles County did not vote on whether to recall Gov. Gray Davis, said researchers at Harvard University and UC Berkeley. Researchers said one in 11 voters in the state's most populous county either abstained from the recall question or disqualified their selection by voting both "yes" and "no."
...
Harvard University research fellow Dr. Rebecca Mercuri, who conducted the other study, characterized the votes as "missing." She concluded that many of the 383,000 ballots that didn't answer the recall question had their selections erased by malfunctioning machines...

http://www.bayarea.com/mld/mercurynews/news/politics/6980504.htm

same story on the NBC affliate
http://www.nbc4.tv/politics/2545844/detail.html

[blm]

41. bumping this baby.

.

[Rex]

42. Quick! Someone call in Katherine Harris!

Here she comes (on her broom) to save the day!

[Spazito]

43. Here's an interesting article from the Berkeley Daily Planet on the vote..

count.

some snippets from it:

How smoothly last Tuesday’s recall election went in the city of Berkeley depends upon which end of the process you observed. Poll workers reported a nearly flawless experience by voters using the Diebold touch-screen voting machines throughout the city. But there were glitches in the vote compiling process.
And while Alameda County preliminary vote totals were available early Wednesday morning, precinct or even city results weren’t—even as late as Thursday afternoon.

snip

But Ginnold said that she was at a loss to know why compiled city results (such as the number of votes for each candidate and for or against each issue in Berkeley) were not available two days after the election. She said that such results are normally available to the public on the night of the election.

snip

Ginnold said she had no information as to why the Berkeley machines malfunctioned, but said that in other upload centers in the county, some of the uploads failed when workers plugged the modem into the wrong slot.

http://www.berkeleydaily.org/text/article.cfm?issue=10-10-03&storyID=17546

[ElsewheresDaughter]

44. kick

[Spazito]

45. Kick

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