CNNI is saying that those killed in Gaza were Dyncorp employees

[lebkuchen]

...that CNNI could just now release that info because next-of-kin had been notified. Initially, CNNI was saying that this group was in Gaza to interview students for Fulbright Scholarships.

[ewagner]

1. Lots of confusion here

CIA, bodyguards, Dyncorp, observers of peace process,

Something is seriously wrong here.......

[Tinoire]

2. I would say it sounds more like "business as usual"

typical MO of what type of people & operations we use to "advance" peace and democracy around the world.


Cause a little trouble, blame it on the other guy and then
demonize, demonize, demonize!

[Jacobin]

3. Dyncorp

does black ops crap for the Company.

[Ouabache]

4. Dyncorp Black Ops and ad infinitum

Didn't they also have the maintenance contract for Wellstone's plane?
Seems I remember that.

[tom_paine]

13. Yep, these were Bushevik Spooks

[Bozita]

5. Isn't Dyncorp basically a mercenary army for hire?

I know, it's redundant.

[Aidoneus]

7. indeed

most famous for running a sexslave industry in Bosnia, and now for providing rent-a-cops in Iraq (a real bang-up job they're doing). Wasn't aware that these people were mercenaries in the Occupied Palestinian territories as well.

[reachout]

10. Let's not forget

The prostitutes DynCorp were buying and selling in Bosnia were as young as 12.

Several DynCorp employees were also accused of videotaping the rape of one of the women.

When Dyncorp employee Kathy Bolkovac blew the whistle on the sex ring she was dismissed by the company for drawing attention to their misbehavior, according to the ruling of a British employment tribunal (they had to pay her something like $150K, only slightly more than they had contributed to Republican campaign coffers the year before).

DynCorp (now a division of CSC) is being sued by Ecuadorean peasants who claim their spraying as part of Plan Colombia has drifted across the border, killed their legitimate crops, caused illness, and killed children. As though what's being done to the Colombian farmers isn't bad enough.

Mercenaries rank somewhere down around terrorists for me.

[lebkuchen]

30. A researcher friend sent this to me on Dyncorp

DYNCORP

The most broadly diversified PMC, Dyncorp posted $2.3 billion in revenues in 2002. Under contract to the State Dept., it provides bodyguards for Afghan President Hamid Karzai and recently sent 1,000 ex-cops and security guards to Iraq to help train a new police force. Information Technology consulting giant Computer Sciences acquired Dyncorp in 2002 for $950 million.

on edit and my comment: Was it Dyncorp who trained the Iraqi police who were shot and killed by our military because of a gross lack of communication?


....and this on the killing of the 3 Dyncorp employees (sorry, no URL provided, but can be researched from data below):


The Associated Press
October 15, 2003, Wednesday, BC cycle

2:37 PM Eastern Time

SECTION: International News
HEADLINE: Three Americans killed in explosion targeting U.S. diplomatic convoy in Gaza Strip
BYLINE: By IBRAHIM BARZAK, Associated Press Writer
DATELINE: BEIT LAHIYA, Gaza Strip

A remote-controlled bomb exploded under a U.S. diplomatic convoy Wednesday, ripping apart an armored van and killing three Americans in an unprecedented deadly attack on an official U.S. target.

In a strongly worded statement, President Bush blamed Palestinian officials for the attack, which wounded another American. "Palestinian authorities should have acted long ago to fight terror in all its forms," Bush said.

The State Department identified the slain Americans as John Branchizio, 36; Mark T. Parson, 31; and John Martin Linde Jr., 30 - all employees of DynCorp, a Virginia-based security firm.


<snip>

[SoCalDem]

31. More on Dyncorp & the Bush family (Chalabi too)

http://thunderbay.indymedia.org/news/2003/04/6007.php

Meet the new bosses: Introducing the cabal who will carve up post-war Iraq
by Neil Mackay, Glasgow Sunday Herald • Monday April 14, 2003 at 08:00 AM


IRAQ lies in ruins this morning. Its cities are bombed; its buildings have been torched by teenage arsonists; its shops, hospitals, factories and homes have been looted. This is Year Zero for Iraq. The old regime is gone and the United States is to rebuild this country literally from the ground up.


Since the beginning of the year, America has had its reconstruction plan in place. Answering directly to Centcom commander General Tommy Franks, retired Lt Gen Jay Garner will be in command of the reconstruction effort. He will be aided by a series of military hardmen, diplomats and Republican party place-men who will help the United States create "Free Iraq" - aided by exiles who are returning to get their share of the spoils.

This isn't a selfless exercise. In a special Sunday Herald investigation, we have charted the network of financial kickbacks, political pay-backs, cronyism, self-interest and ferocious ideology that underpins the entire reconstruction scheme.


The US denies that men like Jay Garner are in effect the first wave of a military occupation. The Bush administration insists that it wants these men to work their way out of a job as quickly as possible. Some have mentioned three months as the possible length of their tenure in Iraq - others, more realistically, claim five years is a more likely term, taking the length of the US occupation of post-war Japan as the best comparison. America will be entrenched in this nation for decades to come. The colonisation process has begun already.

In this investigation we have traced the roots of the reconstruction process back to the ideologues - the neo-conservatives now in the ascendancy in the US government - who devised the scheme. These men see the US military as the "cavalry on the new American frontier", they wanted Saddam "regime changed" long before Bush took power and they have long dreamt of a permanent US satellite in the Gulf. They have also been brutally honest about having a say over Iraq's oil fields .

Ideology is ideology, but in the US government political theory goes hand-in-hand with big business. The end result of the lofty musings of Republican hawks fashioning the concepts behind the new world order is money-grubbing for the yankee dollar. The world isn't just watching the spread of a political philosophy in Iraq, it is watching a conquest by and for US big business as well. The term "military-industrial" complex brings to mind crazy conspiracy theories , but let's consider the term again. Each and every one of the companies in the running or in posession of contracts to reconstruct Iraq are either major Republican donors or have government staff working for them. The donations to the Republican party - and also to George W Bush himself - run into millions .

Is this payback time? In the UK, connections like this between big business and politicians would be front page news for months. But not so in America.

There is more to this than just kickbacks. The Americans call it "the favour bank", we call it more simply cronyism. The connections between the reconstructors is staggering. If these people aren't in the same think-tank together, then they work for the same companies, have the same friends and interests.

more..

---

lots more on Dyncorp @ http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=dyncorp+neil+bush

[lebkuchen]

11. Agreed....lots of confusion.

CNNI is back to calling those dead "security," with no further mention of Dyncorp. However, when the Dyncorp info came forth from one of the female reporters, I believe it came through her earpiece as she was reading the news. CNNI hasn't mentioned Dyncorp since.

However, CNNI is focusing in on the WH reaction, and Bush's "strong" words, blaming Arafat.

My impression: The Bushies are a heck of a lot more concerned about these 3 dead civilians than they have been our military members who have been dying on a weekly basis. Could that be because those killed in Gaza were corporate "shakers and movers" rather than a caravan of academia heading into Gaza with promises of scholarships?

[Sideways]

6. Stinky Stinky Stinky Fulbright Scholarships My Tiny Ass

Hey since Dyncorp has been implicated in sex scandals maybe this is the fucking link to Bush's wandering off and wandering into sex slave shit to the UN.

Whatever it is it stinks. This has NOTHING to do with scholarships.

Black ops Fuckwittage ops or cyclops this is a real fucking mess.

[LoneStarLiberal]

8. DynCorp~Computer Sciences Corporation

DynCorp is one of several PMCs and companies whose operations include PMC services that offer contract security services to the Department of State.

Technically it really isn't "DynCorp" any longer. They are now owned by Computer Sciences Corporation.

[DinahMoeHum]

9. Excuse me while I reach for the Kleenex. . .NOT!!!

Dyncorp has filthy hands spread out all over the map.

They want sympathy from me? I'd give them a dictionary and tell them to look it up. . .between the words "shit" and "syphillis"

:evilfrown:

[lebkuchen]

12. A CNN Dyncorp link

http://edition.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/10/15/mideast.blast/index.html

The four Americans were employed by the U.S. Embassy to provide security, Kurtzer said, and the FBI is sending experts to investigate. Two Americans died on the scene, a third died on the way to a hospital, and a fourth was hospitalized, he said.

The victims were employees of Dyncorp, a company that provides security for the United States in Israel, Iraq, Afghanistan and elsewhere in the Middle East, according to a senior Bush administration official.

[leanings]

14. You people are so damn paranoid.

I know several people that work for DynCorp doing security. That's exactly what they do: security, checking ID's and walking beats at US embassies and government facilities all over the world. Some of them do basic police training or police work that would otherwise be done by soldiers who are not adept at performing it. Most of them are ex-military, and rather than work a security or police job in the states for 30k a year they go overseas and work six days a week for a year in and bring home 90k tax free. I understand some of them were involved in a child prostitution ring in the Balkans. So what? I seem to recall some UN employees were involved in a sex for food scandal in Africa not too long ago, and I don't recall the UN being too forthwith about it. I don't laugh when other UN employees die. It's not a CIA front, they're not mercenaries; they're just doing a dirty, hard, dangerous job that has to be done.

Furthermore, most of Dyncorp's work has nothing to do with police or security functions. They do mostly IT stuff.

[tlb]

17. This is nothing

You should have been here during SERIOUS discussions of Senator Wellstone's airplane being brought down by Art Bell style electronic rays.

[JasonBerry]

19. CIA Front Companies

Do not advertise themselves as such. In fact, one could work for them at a fairly high level and not know what they're all about. An individual working as a guard would definitely not know (suspect, maybe. Know? Nope). There's nothing paranoid about suspecting CIA fronts. In the eighties, I was almost 100% on picking them out during the whole Nicaraguan debacle with the contras.

[leanings]

22. Do you think

the CIA would use so obvious a company as a front? And what types of intel gathering/direct action type missions has Dyncorp been implicated in? I've never heard of any contracts outside of executive protection, security, and police work. Someone mentioned Dyncorp being contracted for the idiotic counter drug stuff in South America, but I was under the impression that was mostly handled by Northrop Grumman.

I mean, no insult intended with the paranoia comment; anyhow, just because you're paranoid doesn't mean there's not someone out to get you. But Dyncorp? Just because they carry weapons and get a paycheck from the gov doesn't necessarily mean they're evil.

[Jacobin]

60. Look, I'm no tinfoil freak. I'm not. HOWEVER

I have personal experience in dealing with two retired spooks who set up a wireless phone system in Bosnia for the military to use during the late 1990's. My good friend invested to help get if off the ground. I assisted my friend with the due diligence.

As soon as it was up and running on a skeleton basis, they sold it to Dyncorp. I met with these freaks on several occassions. They all knew each other. There was never any question that the NATO commander in charge would approve the assignment of the contract. They were all telling "war stories".

There is NO clear line between legitimate ordinary civilian business and spook land in the Dyncorp organization. It's how they hide it. It all morphs together which makes what they do all deniable.

Something weird is going on with this.

BTW, I don't buy the Wellstone plane theories (icing kills lots of general aviation pilots) and I don't buy MIHOP, although I'm open to LIHOP.

[VeniceBeat]

23. "they're not mercenaries"

Uh, uh huh.....riiiiiiiiiiight. OK. Whatever you say, buddy.

[leanings]

24. Well reasoned post. n/t

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

34. Gosh let's use a little faulty logic to defend our position?

I understand some of them were involved in a child prostitution ring in the Balkans. So what? I seem to recall some UN employees were involved in a sex for food scandal in Africa not too long ago, and I don't recall the UN being too forthwith about it.

Two wrongs don't make a right. Secondly, the abuses of Dyncorp employees in not just well documented by rights organizations in the Balkans but by rights organizations in Latin America.

The fact that they are involved in mercinary activities probably puts their employees performing the services you speak of in greater danger and makes the targets.

Dyncorp employees have also been caught smuggling drugs into the US as well.


Read this ten series set of articles.
http://www.publicintegrity.org/dtaweb/icij_bow.asp?Section=Database&Action=Company&COMPID=32

http://www.publicintegrity.org/dtaweb/ICIJ_BOW.ASP?Section=Chapter&ChapNum=2

[leanings]

47. No one is

condoning the actions of Dyncorp elsewhere, although I haven't perused your articles yet so I can't vouch for their accuracy or relevance. Dyncorp has never been involved in any "mercenary" work that I'm aware of, by which I mean the business of killing for money. Which is what real "mercenaries" do. But people like to throw words around they don't understand, makes them feel important.

I can't really comment too much further on your post with out reading the info you've provided, and I don't have time for that at the moment. But I wasn't trying to justify the actions of Dyncorp's employees by comparing it with the UN. All I'm saying is that you can't judge an entire organization by the actions of a few of it's employees.

And it's infantile and extremely upsetting to me when I see people say, "well, they had it coming". That attitude is unacceptable. It disguises an unexpressed glee.

I'm sorry, I gotta jet off of here. Some of the ignorance expressed by people in this thread...I mean, it's on here every day. But it's really getting to me today, and I should just step away.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

49. I agree with your comments as regards ignorance and generalizations

but the term MERCINARY is vast and not as limited as you would suggest. Instability is hoisted upon countries by more than just targetted killings and kidnappings and Dyncorp has been in close enough proxomity when these activities DID occur such as shoot down of the Baptist minister's plane in Peru to earn some of the disrespect visited upon them.

One can run a candy store in the foreground and be running numbers in the back room...do we judge them on the basis of the sweetness of their candy or on the basis of their backroom dealings or both?

[lebkuchen]

36. DYNCORP--THE PRICE OF A PRIVATIZED MILITARY

Multinational Monitor <[EXCERPT>]

December 1, 2002

SECTION: No. 12, Vol. 23; Pg. 8; ISSN: 0197-4637
HEADLINE: Bad apples in a rotten system: the 10 Worst Corporations of 2002.
BYLINE: Mokhiber, Russell; Weissman, Robert

DYNCORP
THE PRICE OF A PRIVATIZED MILITARY

<snip>

Case in point: DynCorp, a $ 2 billion-a-year company that describes itself as "a leading provider of diversified outsourcing and information technology services to government agencies." Some critics say the company is better described as a mercenary firm.

<snip>

This type of privatization of military matters "is another way to give the government deniability," says William Hartung, director of the New York-based Arms Trade Resource Center. The military "pays the private company to do the dirty work. They hope that gives them more distance if personnel are killed than if they were uniformed service people. If are engaged in unethical behavior or repressive acts, the government is removed" from that.

What this really involves, Hartung says, is "unaccountability." He warns that it is even more difficult to find out what private military contractors are doing than it is for the Pentagon, and that contractor activity tends to fly below Congressional and media radar screens.

<snip>

[Tinoire]

53. Oh please

We are well aware of the type of dealings DynCorps and its sister companies like Brown and Root are involved in because we've been following them for years and not relying on CNN for our information.

If this board seems too paranoid for you, maybe you should try a more "moderate" one :shrug:

[Terwilliger]

64. which is WHY they do so much work for the CIA?

gimme a break

[JasonBerry]

15. DynCorp....

DynCorp, CSC (Computer Sciences Corporation) = CIA Front. I have no proof of that.....however.....it has CIA written all over it. I have thought that for years. Too many "former" intelligence people in that company and everything about CSC is the modus operandi of front companies for the "company."...........

[lindashaw]

16. Who stands to win with this hit?

[AP]

38. It just shows how sophisticated the other side is. The US must be worried

that there's a mole or a leak somewhere.

It's probably freaking them out becuase they don't know who else is in jeopardy.

[morebunk]

18. We often use the cover of corporations as cover.

And guess who would really know about that?

[revcarol]

20. According to CNN,at noon, they were providing security for a

U. S. diplomatic mission....OOOPS....wonder what kind of mission THAT was...

[leanings]

25. According to CNN

it was State Department personnel interviewing Fulbright candidates.

[lebkuchen]

39. That was according to Bush

and we know how much Bush values education.

[pschoeb]

59. It's possible that was true

I'm suspicious, but there seems to be a new Fulbright visiting scholar program called "Fulbright Visiting Specialists: Direct Access to the Muslim World" for former Fulbright Scholars from the Muslim World.

http://www.cies.org/Visiting_Specialists/
http://www.cies.org/Visiting_Specialists/VSspecialists_Instructions.htm

there are several former Fulbright Visiting Scholars from Gaza

'98
El-Masri, Nathmi: TEFL/Applied Linguistics
Yassin, Samir: Physics and Astronomy
'99
Mikki, Mohammad; Computer Science
2000
El-Nahhal, Yasser; Agriculture
Nigim, Khaled; Engineering
2001
Abdelwahed, Said; Language and Literature (non-U.S.)
Thabet, Ahmed; Chemistry
2002
Hewahi, Nabil; Computer Science
Sadeq, Mohammed Moin; Anthropology and Archaeology

there seems to be two visiting scholars selected every year from Gaza, besides this new program for former visiting scholars.

Patrick Schoeb

[sleipnir]

21. IF TRUE

As the saying goes, "if you play with fire, you'll get burned." I have little respect or sympathy for those Americans who die in the Mid-east in pursuit of the demonic corporations looking to loot and pillage the land. IMO, you have to watch who you work for, often these Halliburton, Root's, and Dynacorp employees only care about money, slaves to a system. I'm sorry for their families (they are the hardest hit), but one must choose wisely when working for a corporate employer. Capitalism....damn....

[Muddleoftheroad]

26. I'm sure their families

Would be overwhelmed by your sympathy after this dreadful terrorist attack. So, in your opinion is it OK for terrorists to kill their horrible people who dare to earn a living?

[Tinoire]

27. Pretty muddled reasoning there

I think you should save it for the I/P forum.

Atempts to emotionally blackmail people to cover what those organizations and the governments behind them are doing is really offensive and obscene.

[Muddleoftheroad]

56. These were people there to work

Defending their murder is unconscionable.

[IndianaGreen]

40. Sorry Muddle, but Dynacorp is engaged in terrorist activities

with their double-dipping mercenaries. Many have died in Latin America as the result of their activities.

I wonder if MPRI has any people in Gaza... that's another mercenary company.

[Name removed]

45. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

50. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LevChernyi]

54. I was talking about defending Dynacorp

and if you think I'm a Dersh fan, read the quote again.

[Jacobin]

61. Yep.

There is no question about it.

They are dirty dirty dirty.

[IndianaGreen]

42. If someone were to shoot General Pinochet

I doubt that you would find many people shedding tears for his sorry ass.

BTW, mercenaries are not protected under international law.

[sleipnir]

46. Missing the point

It's not ok to kill anyone, but you missed the point. These people are making a choice with their conscience. If they want to work for a dangerous, militaristic, profiteering, evil capitisitic corportation in the Mid-east, then there are many risks that go along, one being death. The only way to stop these companies is if workers stop working for them. I don't think they dared to earn a living, daring to earn a living IMO is not working for a known un-ethical corporations. If a worker does not research the companies they apply to and accept jobs from, then I have little sympathy for them. Why did they choose these jobs? I don't know, but if they dared to earn a living, maybe they should have gone into a useful pursuit, like the Red Cross or Amnesty, Int. Maybe it's just my quasi anti-capitalist views, but those who work for Brown and Root, Halliburton, Dynacorp, etc are on the wrong side. It's a case of either "you're with us to promote a free and heathly world, or you're with the corporations." There are far too many who are on the wrong side and it's time for each person to be accountable and stand up for the future of the world.

[leanings]

28. Well, where we at on this, folks?

CNN, Reuters and the Beeb are now all reporting that this was a convoy of State Department personnel on their way to interview students for scholarships. The Dyncorp guys killed were riding in a vehicle, providing security. Doesn't look like some CIA op here, or some corporate-condoned prostitution ring. Looks like somebody just killed 3 American citizens who were engaged in a mission to extend educational opportunities to Palestinian children.

Anyone want to temper their earlier remarks? Or perhaps you'd like to extend your conspiracy theories and moral relativism to cover this developement?

[leetrisck]

33. DynCorp also has the maintenance contract

for military aircraft at Ft. Rucker, AL

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

35. CNN would never lie, eh?

[leanings]

41. CNN, Reuters and the Beeb

I guess you're going with the extend-the-conspiracy option. That's a way to live, I suppose; never believe anything until some pimply faced 19 year old community college dropout posts it on IndyMedia.

[Name removed]

43. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

48. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

52. The only faulty reasoning is your own

I pointed out three news sources and all you can tell me is that you doubt CNN. Well, why don't you look thru your fucking crystal ball and enlighten me with the TRUTH. Get me next week's lotto numbers while you're in there.

I cited specific examples in which all three misled. Your statement that it was on CNN, Reuters and Beeb is tantamount to saying the news wouldn't print it if it weren't true.

I don't have a crystal ball and if I knew the lottery numbers, I wouldn't share them anyway. Call me selfish.

I can't say I give an airborne shit about your age or your piece of paper either.


Fine, but you should know I did have to somewhat master deductive reasoning to get my degree. You might consider mastering it yourself at some point. You mostly emoted in this post and personalized the rest.

"We KNOW they reported on all the SMART BOMBS being dropped in Gulf War one when in fact the vast majority dropped were the dumbass kind that land any old place."

WTF is that supposed to mean? How does that have any bearing whatsoever...never mind. I'm going to go argue with the microwave; it'll be a more coherent conversation partner.

Since you can't follow deductive reasoning it is no surprise that you could not connect the fact that I used a well known NEWS event to underscore the fact that the media might NOT have been truthful with their report on this matter.

Happy microwaving. :hi:

[VeniceBeat]

63. Zaaaap!

Bzzzzzzzzzzzzzt! :hi:

[IndianaGreen]

44. You are using the same people that told us that Saddam had WMD

as reliable sources? The "scholarship" cover story is the lamest I have heard since that B-26 landed in Florida being piloted by a Cuban "defector." As it turned out, the "defection" was part of the PR campaign that preceded the Bay of Pigs invasion.

[ewagner]

51. That, I remember well.....n/t

[leetrisck]

57. Know many, many DynCorp employees

quite well and none of them are mercenaries or work for the CIA. They work for a defense contractor - outside of that who the hell knows with what we have running the country now (Slimy Shrub and gang)

[Jacobin]

62. I've dealt with them too. The ones I know are so full of fleas

from lying down with and dealing with spooks involved in shady crap that its incredible.

They have divisions that are up front and normal.

They have divisions that do dirt.

[bobthedrummer]

29. And so they were DynCorp employees and now they're dead.

Lots more where they came from.
http://www.corpwatch.org/issues/PID.jsp?articleid=6328

[Fridays Child]

32. Dyncorp is staffing the prisons in Iraq--another bushista sweetheart deal.

They've been doing some recruiting throughout the Arizona Department of Corrections, offering starting salaries of 75-100K.

[IndianaGreen]

37. In other words, they were mercenaries

What were they doing in Gaza? You normally see these guys in Colombia or the Persian Gulf region.

[Tinoire]

55. I think the term they're using now is "Peace Observers"

It's the 21st century term for "Advisors". Remember them?

[Darranar]

58. Oh, great...

so now we have a mercenary corporation doing jobs in the WB and Gaza? Just what we need.

I guess this wan't so much of a "peace convoy" as originally reported.

Propaganda, propaganda, propaganda, propaganda, propaganda, propaganda, propaganda, propaganda, propaganda, propaganda, propaganda, propaganda, propaganda, propaganda, propaganda...