At First I Was Mad About Levi-Strauss Sending Jobs Overseas

[Eat_The_Rich]

But then I read the article in my local newspaper. A spokes person for Levi said something to the effect that they wanted to keep jobs here, but the results of their focus groups indicated that people put the ability to buy cheap goods ahead of keeping jobs in the USA. A pretty sad commentary on the mentality of the American consumer.

[joefree1]

1. Just makes me want to shake those Walmart customers

Don't they realize they're just sending their money to China? But I've talked to many folk and the chear prices are just too tempting. Ever been to Target on a Sunday?

"It's not over 'till Arnold gropes the fat lady" —Bill Press, on MSNBC

http://www.recallarnoldwatch.org

[Cocoa]

2. don't be such an easy sell

trade issues are very complex. The company spokesperson I don't think can be counted on to give a whole lot of insight.

[brainshrub]

3. Gotta admit...that's good spin

According to Ben Cohen, of Ben & Jerries fame, the cost labor for a $15 dollar t-shirt is .05 cents.
If the same shirt was made in the United States, with Union labor, the labor cost would be .25 cents.
Don't give me the crap that Levis couldn't keep the jobs in the U.S. I don't buy it for one second.

[JohnyCanuck]

6. Interesting you should mention that.

On a local cable channel last night I was watching a blurb on a US clothing company run by a young lefty-type entrepeneur who brought a progressive attitude to running his operation. While owning his own clothing company, this guy also takes part in demos seeking better pay and treatment for garment workers. Pay for the line workers in his outfit(sewing machine operators etc.) was in the $12 to $15 per hour range and among the fringe benefits he provided free English classes for any employee who wanted to particpate. I believe his outfit is based in California and his workforce has a high percentage of immigrants and new Americans.

The show claimed his operation was very profitable and a good money maker and in the process of expanding. The owner said on camera although he could get his shirts and other clothing items made in china by prison labor for nothing (his own description), he felt that overall he was doing way better by employing local people at a fair wage and treating them well enough that they felt a loyalty to him and to his company.

[AP]

14. This is American Apparel. I have a link below in "Carhart" post

we should all be buying from this place.

[lostnfound]

27. A great example; but wonder whether he was niche or masses marketing

Without looking at Levi's financials (or being inside their executive suite), it's hard to know where the blame lies.

Walmart is known for its 'sharp purchasing' (sharp like a knife, not sharp like 'smart') practices. The question mightn't be whether Levi could continue making money but whether Walmart would continue to buy from them unless they cut that extra 5-cents-a-pair out of their wholesale price. That a distributor like Walmart has become so powerful that it can force manufacturers to keep LOWERING the prices to match foreign competition -- it's a huge problem. Even Etch-a-Sketch closed its (U.S.) doors this year under threat from Walmart that if they didn't LOWER their prices, Walmart wouldn't sell their product.

[Zero Gravitas]

16. but think of the extra .20 cents

that could go toward the CEO's next Gulf V! Its more important that some already very wealthy person get even wealthier than ordinary hard working Americans get to keep their jobs. Are you some sort of communist?

[punpirate]

4. Cheap? Last time I bought Levi 501s...

... they were $41/pr. Lee Wranglers are supposedly American-made (can't tell for sure because made in Saipan means they can put a made in USA label on), but were $28/pr (Wranglers aren't stocked in my size locally). The Levi Strauss plant in my area closed four years ago, and cost us 650 jobs.

Cost? It's an excuse, not a reason. The last US plants are closing now. That means a significant portion of their clothing is already being made offshore. Have the prices gone down? No. In fact, Levi Strauss lost market share because they got greedy and overpriced most of their line (guess all the stories about Levis going for $100/pr in the `80s on the Russian black market went to their heads). That's why they couldn't compete. When sales went down, they started closing plants.

This sort of pronouncement is just more hucksterism, to convince the public the corporate mentality is correct, that Levi Strauss is giving the public what it wants.

[Girlfriday]

5. The sad part is...

...pretty soon, no one will be able to afford Levi jeans, not in the USA or anywhere. That's the irony of all of this - US companies take the jobs overseas, pay the workforce $2 - $5/ hr. What's the result? More and more unemployed workers in the US and workers overseas who make the products but can't afford them. All in the name of the bottom line, stockholders and superstar CEO's who want to be on the cover of FORTUNE...OBSCENE!

[Speck Tater]

7. Henry Ford said he had to pay his workers enough...

... so that they could afford to buy the cars they were building. The sad thing is modern companies don't seem to realize they are destroying their own customer base. The economy is imploding.

It seems as if companies used to be about making a product and providing jobs for the consumers of that product. Now the only priority is to provide as much payback as possible to the lenders (stock holders) regardless of its effect on the future of the company or the future of the economy.

It doesn't take a genius to realize that the current trend is not sustainable and the whole system will implode when the supply of consumers runs dry.

If I owned a company that had enough sales to support 10 employees I would be happy to be providing those 10 jobs and to be contributing the economy. What would I need with profit? If I collected a reasonable salary and could feed and clothe my family what use would profit be to me? I just don't get it. Maybe I'm mentally defective or something, but I don't grok the need for profit.

Some years ago I worked for a non-profit organization that provided a decent living for a couple dozen employees. Ten years later, that company is still in business, still employing the same number of people, and has never had a layoff. Its stability is due to the fact that it is a non-profit organization with no stock holders to impress, and no bottom line demands beyond breaking even with a little extra in the bank for lean times. What's wrong with that model?

[SharonAnn]

9. Yes, but the difference is that he owned the company and made

the decisions. I've been thinking about this a lot lately and begun realizing that it makes a huge difference if a business is locally owned and/or owned or controlled by a single person. Under those conditions, the owners have a desire to build and maintain a successful business that does well for all.

However, under the more common structure today where ownership is thousands of people/mutual funds thousands of miles away, the only thing they care about is short-term gains. That's it. No long-term thinking, no rewards for good long-term strategy, only rewards for "financial engineering". Flip the numbers to make them show what you want and the rest be damned.

[lastliberalintexas]

17. Corporate America doesn't care

about long term goals or consequences. You are very correct- they are doing everything to make sure that we have long term troubles with consumer demand.

But Wall Street doesn't care, so long as THIS QUARTER'S numbers look good and the stock goes up in the short run. American management has gone to thinking in terms of 3 month intervals, and the most that they may think into the future is the next quarter.

[Bandit]

21. What would I need with profit?

I love your idealism but Profit is crucial to a business. A business always has upgrades and repairs and un-forecast bills. Also Profit is the major motivating factor for a business to stay agressive and pro-active. Without Profit there would be no business. You sound like you would be a happy laborer who gets a steady paycheck and doesn't need the worry of keeping a business afloat so employees can stay happy and able to take care of their families. It takes all kinds to keep this economy growing. There has to be a happy medium also. All profits can't just go to executives but to be successful you need good executives so you need to pay them well also.

[TreasonousBastard]

8. They're right, but...

Levis cost at least 30-40 bucks a pair, while the generic Chinese jeans I'm wearing cost me $12.

OK, the Levis are made better, but who's kidding who?

I had a customer in NYC who made clothes right there on 34th St. He was telling me that he could save a bunch of money with a foreign sweatshop, but he couldn't respond fast enough that way to the orders and the changes that came in. Buyers would make a suggestion, and he could change the style on the fly. He could also deliver a hot size or color in days, not months, and easily handle reorders. Fabric, labor, and rent+exp, were a lot more, but he was able to service his retail and wholesale customers better. He could also deal with quality control on the spot.

But, he was a little guy, and his customers weren't Wal-Mart, which orders a boatload of stuff at a time. The big guys order a season's worth of clothes two seasons early, and hope for the best.

And, they tell you what they are going to pay.

[Don_G]

10. I Don't Buy Overpriced Crap

Levis, Wranglers and Dickies all use the same, thin Chinese denim that wears out within a few months if you work construction of any type. I've had good luck buying Carhartt jeans---plus, although made in Mexico, the denim is heavier than other brands and made in the US.

[jmowreader]

23. I like Key workwear too

Made in Fort Scott, Kansas.

[Democat]

11. Of course Americans don't care where things are made

Anyone who thinks that Americans won't choose cheap over American Made almost all of the time, are deluding themselves.

[DieboldMustDie]

12. So how about increasing import tariffs...

so that foreign made goods don't have such a huge price advantage?

[AP]

13. People like Carhart & American Apparel because they're made in America...

American Apparel is the company Jim Hightower is always talking about, and which is mentioned above in the "funny you should mention this" post.

Here is one of their many fine products:

Check out their website. You can order on-line. A great place to buy holiday gifts.

American Apparel is the most passionate and innovative wholesale blank T-shirt manufacturer and distributor in the world. We are committed to leveraging art, design, and technology to produce garments of the highest quality, while pioneering industry standards of social responsibility in the workplace.


The fact is, Americans would want this stuff, but not at profit margins Levi's is willing to accept.

[JohnyCanuck]

15. Thanks for posting the link to American Apparel.

I didn't catch the name of the outfit while I was watching the show on TV and was kicking myself for that afterwards.

[GOPisEvil]

19. I wish they had more stuff.

Jeans, for example. I guess if I patronize their store, they might be able to expand their clothing line, eh? :-)

[AP]

22. They have a lot of stuff...but, yeah, patronize them & they'll

get bigger.

[mitchum]

24. Senior Partner Dov Charney is a committed progressive!

This is so weird. I knew Dov as both a friend and a business associate until about 5 years ago. I moved and lost contact with him. When I started reading this thread, I went, "American Apparel, wasn't that...?" And it certainly was. He is the only businessman I have ever met who reads Marx. His stance is not some type of hip progressive-lite marketing. He is the real deal. I urge everyone to patronise this kind and wonderful man's company. This is not some kind of stealth shilling (as I said, I have not seen Dov in 5 years)
Go Dov!

[AP]

26. Any time you have an impulse to buy Gap or J.Crew, go to American Apparel

instead.

Put your money where your pie hole is. Because you're a Concrete boy now.

[Mairead]

18. This is why we need to elect Dennis, folks.

This kind of unrestrained greed is at tbe bottom of MANY of our national problems, and Dennis was the first to start calling it what it is: a looming disaster.

Speaking of Levis particularly, I tried to buy some boot-cuts from them, but was told that they were so popular that they were sold out. I asked when the next production run would be, and they told me they were going to discontinue them. I pointed out the discrepancy, and the young woman in marketing even got snippy toward me, as though I'd no right to make such comments.

It's sad that such a fine old company should be driven onto the rocks by beancounters. But it's just a symptom of a larger sickness

Vote for Dennis!

[JHB]

20. Sad, IF it's actually what they said...

...and not just a case of the company setting up a "focus group" that will provide the result the comapany brass wants, to stave off any shareholder activists who might challenge this decision ("we're just giving the customers what they want :shrug:").

[Clete]

25. I haven't seen the jeans drop in price. As a matter-of-fact,

they are more expensive than ever. They sent the jobs overseas to increase their profit margin. Geez, does the BS never stop.

[Brewman_Jax]

28. Exactly

The prices keep climbing, the jobs still go away, nothing changes--except the bottom line. So the "we can't afford to stay in the US" line doesn't fly in the face of the facts.