So-Cal Fires ---a coordinated attack?

[musiclawyer]

My boss and I, months, if not a whole year, before 911 were sitting around talking about terror eventially having come to these shores. Now we never predicted a plane attack, although we speculated that terrorists were behind some planes that went down, including the one with those Egyptian pilots. But we did say that it would be real easy to take out a few landmarks like the Golden Gate Bridge etc. And we discussed for hours how easy it would be to wait until October and burn down much of Southern California. A single arsonist usually does not drive hours and hours to set up fires. They tend to stay in one locale and enjoy the fruit of their labor..... Just sharing our conversation withn you all.

[dkamin]

1. the other obvious suspect

would be the Bush administration and its allies, who are looking to aggressively promote their "healthy forests" logging agenda. millions of dollars at stake, and all it takes is a spark...

[TLM]

6. ummmm but there are no forests burning...

just scrub and brush... remember this is a desert.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

10. WRONG..Big Bear is forest and Devore is national forest

[DeathvadeR]

31. Yes but we need to Thin those suburbs out ................

so this kinda thing never happens..

[maggrwaggr]

29. Good Lord. Welcome to the "Conspiracy Underground"

this is just getting silly.

Next you're going to blame the hurricane on Karl Rove.

[Maple]

2. Or since this happens every year

why make up fantasies about it?

[ProdigalJunkMail]

4. I rather agree

Unless these attacks have been occurring for the last say 34 years (that's about as far back as I can remember) then I would probably say that it is not a coordinated attack. Besides that fact, most terrorist acts are carried out by groups with political goals and therefor would probably claim responsibility for the attack in order to bring their point to light.

TheProdigal

[DrGonzoLives]

7. Exactly

This has more to do with government officials refusing to do something about a problem that occurs all the time (under presidents of BOTH parties) than with some bizarro conspiracy.

[leftofthedial]

the biggest of the fires in Colorado last year was deliberately set too

though not by a sinister guy wearing arab robes and carrying a scimitar.

[radwriter0555]

13. What does a government DO about scrub brush and mountains, and steep

hillsides?

We have LOTS of wild, natural areas that civilization has encroached upon. There are countless species that NEED wildfires to propegate.

This is nature. Houses and freeways get in the way. Not much the good ol' government can do.

Remember, it's not nice to fool mother nature. Stick a few million suburban tract homes on wild, mountain areas, mother nature is gonna win every time, with either fire, flood, pestilence, famine, drought or earthquake...

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

8. While it DOES happen every year, it is often due to arson

The Laguna fires were due to arson and several of these fires are also suspected arson.

The WORST fires have been due to arson so while I doubt that the WHITE KIDS in a van that are suspected on the Old Waterman fire are terrorists, they could be.

Granted there are natural disasters.

As for the subject of this thread. I doubt it is terrorism but it certainly WOULD be an item a terrorist would consider and they would be no more detectable than some arsonists.

They still have NO clue who started the devastating Laguna fires.

[radwriter0555]

14. Oddly, high percentage of firebugs are actually firemen... they've gotten

into a profession that allows them to feed their fetish.

Many, many cases every year of firemen being firestarters for kicks. Very strange. You all men are STRANGE.

[salmonhorse]

18. A strange but true factoid ~

[nostamj]

19. uh, wasn't there a female

forestry worker that was arrested for arson a while back?

(i could be wrong but i seem to remember that)

[salmonhorse]

20. Yup...

A jilted lover burning her estranged lover's note in a fire-ring. She just didn't do what Smokey Bear has told her to do all those many years...

:shrug:

[Tansy_Gold]

22. IIRC. . .. .

. . . .some of the blazes in Colorado were ignited by a distraught forest service employee who was burning love letters.

At least one of the fires in Arizona was set by a woman who was lost and set a signal fire. She was charged but the charges were dropped.

The fires in New Mexico were a "controlled burn" that got out of control.

I'm not sure, but I think the BC fires in Canada this year were started by lightning strikes.

One of the really nice /extreme sarcasm/ things the developers have done in my area of Arizona is to scrape the desert bare of every palo verde, mesquite, ironwood, creosote, acacia, brittlebush, prickly pear, cholla, barrel, saguaro, hedgehog, and any other vegetation before building hudreds and hundreds of little tile-roofed stucco ticky-tacky boxes with gravel lawns and asphalt streets. They plant a few agaves and sweet acacias and fairy dusters and desert willows and bird of paradise bushes in the street medians and along the bike paths, but there's basically nothing flammable left.

I feel sorry for the folks in California, I really do, but I also wonder how much of this disaster could have been mitigated by outlawing cedar shake shingles and restricting development in high-risk areas. Isn't there a point at which we have to take SOME responsibility for our decisions/actions? We're all still paying through the nose for the insurance company losses of 9/11; are we all going to pay again for the losses in CA?

[leftofthedial]

34. Colorado fire last year.

I bet that ex-lover feels sorry NOW for dumping her.


and the Arizona fire in the WHite Mountains was set by a seasonal firefighter who wanted a job.

[rucky]

30. Yep...the difference this year is

underfunded firefighters in a broke ass state and a federal government that doesn't give a crap.

[Astarho]

32. And every year

we hear about it being an Al-Qaeda plot (eventhough they never take credit for it).

Since the Rodeo-Chediski fire here in AZ was started by a lost hiker, I don't think we need Al-qaeda to do anything at all.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

3. Yeah, buddy...that terrorist Santa Anna sneaks in and does it every year.

[ronnykmarshall]

9. Santa Anna?

Sounds like a turrrist ta' me!!

[TLM]

5. This is no attack.... I'm in San Diego.

and it looks like a camper started a signal fire when he got lost, and that is what started this.


We get fires like this every few years.... but it has been very hot and dry this year. We were due.

[NoKingGeorge]

15. That accounts for 1 fire...

I saw the satelite photo that shows the smoke from a line of fires.There are seperations in the 'line'. Also a curious 'little' smoke trail from a fire seperate from the line ,closer to the ocean?
Seems to be several fires with breaks in between them..

[TLM]

16. The fires spread on the wind....

the scrub burns and the winds take little bits of burning brush and blow it to other areas, that start more fires.

[0rganism]

26. How do you know the camper wasn't a terrorist?

I'm only half serious here, but "looks" can be deceiving.

One thing is certain, with a large portion of the National Guard going to Iraq, we'll be ill equipped to deal with disasters be they terrorist attacks or mother nature's whimsy.

[nolabels]

28. Maybe * can read a book to them

THE KIDS CAMPFIRE BOOK
by Jane Drakeand Ann Love
illustrated by Heather Collins
Kids Can
ISBN: 1550745395
Ages 7-up
128 pages

From how to cook pizza over an open fire to sing-alongs, games and stargazing, this book is filled with ideas for having a great time camping out at camp, at a campground, or in your backyard. Ghost stories and tips on how to avoid insects and other troublesome pests as well as how to build a fire and use proper gear are all included.


http://www.kidsreads.com/features/010627-camp.asp

Two or Three were arson they believe, others were known accidents,that does not souund like a concerted plan to me, but they havn't found any of the on purpose ones so who knows for sure. Sure sucks having to breath all this stuff though.

Btw, what are they going to do anyway, outlaw matches and cooking with fire?

[EX-CONservative]

43. Bush read?

Bush reading that book? Nahh, it has some really, really big words. :P

[EX-CONservative]

42. Copycat fires?

Idiots like to ape others...

Many of our species are evil, dumb or a weird combination of both... :shrug:

[killbotfactory]

11. It would be way too easy for some jackass to take a road trip

and start fires everywhere.

Hopefully no one does that.

[nostamj]

12. FWIW

there was a post in one of the CA fire threads that referenced a story about an al qaeda detainee claiming that forest fires were considered...

i agree it's probably not but... in bush's america, what exactly is impossible (other than truth)

[AntiCoup2K4]

17. How long before Ah-Nold assumes office as governor??

Maybe they needed a distraction that would keep Gray Davis from signing bills and appointing judges (i.e. doing his job)

[salmonhorse]

21. How long before he makes a statement...

...as to the plight of Californians based on something other than his ego? Oh, right, right, right...always time to show up at a bodybuilding event in a cozy little SoCal beach town and ham it up for the already worshipful.

Hey...

Why doesn't he just "terminate" the fires?

:shrug:

[Hippo_Tron]

27. EXACTLY WHAT I WANTED TO KNOW...

Maybe something like "I will ask the people of caliiiiforniiiia how the problem should be solved."

[Catshrink]

25. Ah-nold's inaguration is Nov 17

Link:

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/afp/20031024/ts_alt_afp/us_politics_california_031024004103

[MI Cherie]

23. Isn’t it conveeeeenient …

The new Gov, blessed by BushCo, waltzes in with big federal tax dollars to help with this emergency. He’ll be hailed as a savior and adored more than he already is! He’ll have delivered immediately for CA; will he deliver CA for BushCo in '04?

I do feel sorry for the people who have lost so much. But living in shrub country is a choice they made. Why shouldn’t they be responsible for the choices they make? Why aren’t they required to be adequately insured for such disasters in high risk areas?

The news reported about someone who had been evacuated three times because of fire and was luckily spared. And was still “thinking about” upgrading the wood roof. How often can someone expect to get by on luck? Now that house is gone (while surrounding homes without shake shingles are still standing) and we taxpayers will be picking up the tab for their new house.

[not_in_my_name]

24. This would have been a most opportune time to

go to Code Orange then, don't you think? It would have certainly taken the focus off Bush's most recent troubles.

[ScreamingMeemie]

33. kick

[corarose]

35. Wouldn't it be a perfect photo opt for Arnold & Dumbya

If they produced the guy or girl who started the fires and then Arnold can step up and play like he is the perfect politician.

[pfitz59]

36. WW II balloon bombs.

Japan tried to set the West Coast on fire during WW II! Managed to start a small fire in Oregon. They launched silk balloons with incendariary bombs and let the winds carry them across the sea! I supopose Condi never read about THAT her her history books, just like she never heard of 'Kamikaze'! (PS - I am unable to google. Try Japan + WW II + balloon + bomb.)

[MI Cherie]

37. Here it is ...

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=Japan+%2B+WW+II+%2B+balloon+%2B+bomb&btnG=Google+Search

Very interesting!

[pfitz59]

39. "Those who don't study history......."

All those advanced degrees in the Bush* Admin mean jack! Condi must have given one hell of a BJ to get her PhD! I'll call her "Doctor Kneepads" from now on. Warfare stays the same, the toys change.

[WillyT]

38. Satellite Photo Here:

OMG!!!

:scared:

[pfitz59]

40. Kick...

Michael Wiener was raging about this today! Wants TIA on ALL forest users!

[IranianDemocrat]

41. I think the fire came out of Bush's ass.

And that statement has about the same evidence as you do.

Get the point???