How do you view the anti-globalization movement?

[lostnfound]

Poll question: How do you view the anti-globalization movement?

Seattle, 1999: The WTO meeting makes the news as some storefront windows are smashed and police in riot gear clash with protestors.

Summer, Fall 2003: The WTO in Cancun falls apart as poorer countries join forces to oppose the demands of the richer nations. The president of Bolivia resigns under pressure from his people who are hostile to his plans to hand over more of Bolivia's natural gas to foreign companies.

What is your image of the international anti-globalization movement?

[Ediacara]

1. anti-WTO is too diverse to sum up in any one category

[lcordero]

2. I've changed A LOT since 1999

I thought back then that they(the anti-globalization group) were a bit on the extreme end.
I think now that they are a hell of a lot smarter than I.

[lostnfound]

7. You've just answered my next poll too! -- Me too.

That's why I asked, as well as just wanting to see where DUers stack up on the issue today. When NAFTA first came out I 'waxed poetical' about it much like Thomas Friedman (well, minus the Pulitzers), telling a friend that it would lift the wretched masses of Mexico out of poverty, and help us all be one big happy family. And thinking that the union guys complaining about it just couldn't see the big picture.

Boy was I wrong.

[rhite5]

10. Those of us who were connected to WTO-Seattle

really got an eye-opener. And the more I learn, the more I know that WTO and NAFTA are destroying the world as we know it.

Both WTO and NAFTA have played a major role in stealing the resources (natural and financial) of several Central American and South American countries, while propping up dictators. This was done hand-in-hand with the multi-national corporations.

The movements toward democracy that we see in Brazil, Venezuela and Bolivia are in direct response to these forces.

Learn about globalization. The Stiglitz book, "Globalization and its Discontents" is an excellent place to start.

[BurtWorm]

25. I'm reading Stiglitz now.

How were you connected in Seattle?

[Maple]

3. A movement

for the terminally bored, fighting the inevitable, with tons of misinformation

[Zorra]

5. If you really believe that, you may want to

read this. It is not a soundbyte, and takes some focus to read. Have you ever spent any time in a "third world" country, other than at a resort?

http://www.stacmexico.com/articles/global.php

The inevitable is not an obstacle. It is just a corporate illusion. South America is dispelling the illusion right now.

[IrateCitizen]

22. Don't bother with Maple. Maple is a propagandist.

Maple has repeatedly demonstrated a disdain for anything approaching serious debate on this issue, and rather resorts to smear and innuendo without any presentation of fact.

IOW, you're wasting your time.

[TreasonousBastard]

11. heh!

[Armstead]

17. You're so predictable

:)

[IrateCitizen]

20. GREETINGS, PROPAGANDIST!

Thanks for spouting the same tired, predictable drivel. Sorry to tell you, but people aren't believing you here anymore.

Anytime you're ready to talk about actual concepts surrounding "globalization" rather than dealing out the same tired tripe, let us know. Until then, I'll continue to point you out as the propagandist that you most certainly are.

Have a nice day, charlatan. :D

[Nevernose]

4. Communist Rabble Rousing Freaks

Of course, I don't particularly see anything WRONG with being a communist rabble-rousing freak, either. I'd wear that label like a badge of honor.

[La_Serpiente]

6. Well

they mainly want to get out of the WTO and NAFTA.

As for me, I'm all for trade and all. However I don't like the whole "rush to the bottom" mentality. I would want it to have environmental and labor standards incorportated in it.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

8. Good for raising consciousness.

[lostnfound]

14. Yes - Consciousness about the absence of conscience, for one

A corporation's amoral bottom-line inhumanity, little more than a computer program saying 'increase profits', basically cuts the human conscience out of the middle (between id and ego?? ;) ) of its decisions.

[FDRrocks]

9. Very good...

I havent studied up on it, but I heard the windows were smashed by homeless kids. Source: Jello Biafra

Globalization is the lowering of American living standards on the backs of innocent third world people.

[TreasonousBastard]

12. They can piss and moan about WTO and NAFTA...

all they want, but things may actually be a lot worse without them.

These and other organizations were started to reduce a lot of the damage of globalization. They may not be doing all that well at it, but think of how bad things would be without them.

The rush to the bottom is natural for the multinationals, and modern transportation and communications, with instantaneous capital flow, makes it a lot easier now than back when there were the European trading empires.

The WTO is supposed to be a brake on this sort of stuff, enforcing rules and stopping trade and tariff wars. I don't for a minute think it's doing the job, but there is little alternative. With or without it, jobs are going to China and India, Viet Nam is going to overproduce lousy robusto coffee, and Mexico isn't going to enforce its environmental or labor laws. Third world governments are falling all over themselves to get scraps of work from the G7, and they don't give a rat's ass how they get them.

The WTO is at the very least a forum for everyone with an interest to have a public voice, and some things actually may get accomplished.

[BurtWorm]

27. The main problem with your analysis is that the WTO and IMF

seem to be congealing the world order according to the preferences of the corporations, from which culture its managers come. The reason Third World governments are begging for scraps is because that's how the IMF and WTO have set up the only game in town.

[fla nocount]

13. Globalization is an extinction burst of behavior

Before the natural regionalization of our interests and ways of governing. Globalization had a good long run (two thousand years, at least). Now the goal has been achieved and it's not worth having. I think most countries are too big and diverse to be managed effectively, particularly this one. California is too diverse and many there know it.

[goodhue]

15. very favorably, thank you

IMHO, it is a much more sophisticated movement than folks here in the USA generally understand. If you have never spent time in the South or "Third World" then you may not appreciate the breadth and depth of the movement internationally. The Third World Network has been putting forth great information for almost twenty years including the vital work of economist Martin Kohr. They have two good maganizes--Third World Resurgence and Third World Economics. If you want to be informed about this topic you cannot disregard their perspective. Check out their website.
http://www.twnside.org.sg/

[Frederic Bastiat]

16. Clueless Idiots in my book

They tried to disrupt a WTO meeting in my home city (Montreal)earlier this year, they succeded in smashing up a Burker King and GAP store plus the vehicles of a few bystanders.

Just a sorry bunch of vandals.

[IrateCitizen]

26. Yup. Because a few are idiots, that must mean all are.

As a fair trade advocate who has lobbied, marched and organized against corporate-driven trade, I hate the vandalism committed by a few misguided people as much as anyone. However, it is NOT indicative of the movement as a whole.

By your logic, someone should be able to smear all members of the armed forces as rapists due to the misguided actions of a few Marines in Okinawa. Thinking people know that it's far from accurate to exaggerate in such a manner.

[SahaleArm]

30. Their problem...

is that the news coverage is only of the anarchists.

[Armstead]

18. They are the kid in the Emperor's New Clotrhes

The Corporate phony "free trade" model of international commerce is a fraud that violates the basic tenants of common sense.

The anti-globalization movement was like the kids pointing out that this particular emperor really has no clothes.

Now, more people are finally starting to notice the naked power grab that is driving Corporate Globalization.

[IrateCitizen]

19. First off, the movement is not "anti-globalization"

:argh:

The very fact that you would refer to it as such indicates how corporate propaganda has influenced you. A more apt description would be the "Fair Trade Movement".

The majority of those who protest are not protesting against any sort of phenomenon that brings the world closer together. What we are protesting against is the attempt by transnational corporate interests to gain control over nearly every aspect of our lives through the cheerleading of their sycophants in government posts of industrialized nations.

I am certain that some people think that such a statement is rather sensational. I would counter that it doesn't go nearly far enough. There is a struggle taking place -- between those who wish to see everything on earth commodified and sold for profit, and those who view the earth as a shared resource that should be stewarded for the greater good of all humanity.

Needless to say, I not only support the fair trade movement, I am a proud MEMBER of it.

[Spazito]

23. I agree! Fair Trade is the goal...

free trade is just another boondoggle for the multinational corporations to steal another country's resources and then leave.

[ulysses]

28. what he said.

Jedi Knights? How about just a bunch of regular folks trying to fight some of the more gross inequities in the world economy?

[IrateCitizen]

31. That's why I picked "canary in the coal mine" (n/t)

[lostnfound]

32. I'm a proud member of it too..

Actually, my use of the (somewhat-perjorative) term 'anti-globalization' in creating the survey was to ensure that I did not unintentionally skew the survey by using the (admittedly more accurate but warm-and-fuzzy) 'fair trade' phrase.

Fair trade it is..but even using the term anti-globalization, DUers who voted in it still overwhelmingly admire the movement. Which I am quite pleased to see.

Power Politics (A.Roy), Profit Over People (Chomsky), Zmag and When Corporations Take Over the World were eye-openers for me.

[Hubert Flottz]

21. Other!

Something we should join and support 100%! Do you want worldwide slavery or Democracy?

OOOOOPS!

[Kimble]

24. Its loose-loose a no win.

For example: The US and Europe subsidize their farmers. This means that farmers in much smaller nations who have no subsidies cant compete or otherwise get a fair price for what they grow. Also, US/European farmers always want higher subsidies so no money is going to be going from the US and Europe to smaller nations. No way are you going to cut subsidies at home, and the few 300mil people of the US and several hundred million people of Europe able to afford subsidizing both.

It’s the same with factory labor and unions, its why unions hate NAFTA and why smaller nations like Mexico see it as small exploitive protectionism. (they want NAFTA with the same workers rights as in the US – which is a little better than they have) Now that would really piss off unions.

It’s a no win.

[info being]

29. Where's 100% for it?

WTF?