Why didn't they just "plant" WMD in Iraq?

[Bonobo]

This has bothered me for a long time... I always assumed they would just plant the evidence (it seems to be a tactic that law enforcement do on occasion -if TV, movies and common sense are to be believed).

Anyone have any idea why they didn't just plant the WMD?

[absyntheNsugar]

1. My guess

is that they planned to at some time. But they didn't expect all of the eyes to be on them - they expected a cake walk and to be greeted as liberators. They would definitely need Iraqi support to do so - and they didnt have it. Someone would come forth and rat them out if they did.

[blm]

2. They'll show up

as soon as they know for certain who the Dem nominee is.

The WMDs and Saddam will be planted or found. I have no doubt. Watching the Dem party tear themselves apart over Iraq plays into their hands.

[dreissig]

7. The October Surprise

WMD's will be found six weeks before the election. Saddam will be carrying a few on his person. Cheney will disappear into his hidey-hole.

[DeepModem Mom]

3. Someone speculated that only the CIA could do it...

and they're not too pleased with the Bushies.

[blm]

8. DynCorp can do it. Pug Winokur has often bailed out the dictatortot.

.

[truth2power]

28. "dictatortot" Bwahahahahaha

n/t

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Bunny]

10. Do you really think Bushco would allow the UN or

anybody else to inspect them? I'm certain they'd keep them under lock and key for "national security".

[Scott Lee]

5. How do you know they won't?

Never mistake timing for intent.

[DjTj]

6. They don't need to.

Bush's approval ratings are still holding up and there hasn't been a huge public outcry yet.

Why would they risk being caught when they don't even need to produce WMD?

...If things start to look worse for Bush's reelection, I would expect WMD to show up. We might even find Bin Laden or Saddam.

[stewert]

13. They Will never Find WMD's !

I guess you guys have not heard the news, David Kay is quitting, to spend
more time with his family. And they are going to bring the WMD search team
home.

I saw it on CNN earlier today.

It looks like they have thrown in the towel in the WMD search.

[calimary]

23. Shit! David Kay is QUITTING? I had not heard that!

Oh my! Guess he realized he wasn't going to get any ticker-tape parade for what he failed to find. I'm wondering if he's been "asked to leave" because he's no longer of any use to those schmucks (jettison that useless baggage!).

[sistersofmercy]

9. Remember the mysterious illness that hit some of the soldiers?

I saw reports that the soldiers stricken with the mysterious illness were on some sort of halling duty. I wish I had a link to a letter Michael Moore wrote asking the same question. His take was that Bush* co have such arrogance coupled with disdain for the American public they don't feel it is necessary. He wrote this several months ago.

[ripplingwater]

18. Flashpoints covered this

Browse through the program archives at www.flashpoints.net - it's a few months back, but they covered this story.

A guy spoke to his folks, told them he had to go on a hauling mission, and something went wrong. Next thing they knew was that he had been sent to Ramstein, was immediately "medically retired" (which means they cut off all benefits?) and the parents had to fly at their own expense. When the parents arrived they were forced to wear special protective clothing, and were not permitted to touch their son. He died shortly after...

If I recall correctly, many other soldiers met the same fate. The program that covered this was good, and worth listening to.

[woofless]

20. Medically retired.

The person will collect disability. A percentage of their base pay to be determined by the doctors. Daughter-in-law is a medically retired MP and collects 50% of her pay. She will have to be re-evaluated periodically and they typically try to reduce the amount of disability.

Woof

[sistersofmercy]

25. ummmm.....

The soldier in question passed away. IIRC, his parents had to pay for their own passege to Germany to be with their son. They also stated that the amount of soldiers involved in the incident were downplayed severely.

[sistersofmercy]

22. Yes that is what I was refering to. Thanks! n/t

[truth2power]

29. I remember at the time

that incident being discussed here. I thought from the beginning that Bush and his minions were trying to plant the WMDs then. Something went wrong.

That the one soldier died is just one more reason I think Bush/Cheney et al should burn in hell forever.

[retyred]

27. Try these

CIA and DoD Attempted To Plant WMDs in Iraq — and Failed
http://www.envirosagainstwar.org/edit/index.php?op=view&itemid=331

Pentagon Whistleblower Reveals CIA/DoD Fiascos

According to a stunning report posted by a retired Navy Lt. Commander and 28-year veteran of the Defense Department, the Bush administration's assurance about finding weapons of mass destruction in Iraq was based on a CIA plan to "plant" WMDs inside the country. Nelda Rogers, the Pentagon whistleblower, claims the plan failed when the secret mission was mistakenly taken out by "friendly fire."

http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2003/06/266752.shtml

***********************

GULF WAR II “MYSTERY ILLNESS”
http://www.gulfwarvets.com/news13.htm

One of the most surprising statements to come from The Power Hour interview conducted on “The Genesis Network” was that while the son, Josh Neusche, was a healthy young soldier on June 26, 2003, when he reported that he was going to serve on the secret hauling mission, by July 1, 2003, he was in a coma, and that day was suddenly classified by the military, as medically retired from the Army without Josh or his family’s consent. Josh did not die until July 12, 2003. Among other problems that this new classification created was that the DOD was no longer obligated to assist the family in getting to Germany to be with their son as he lay in a coma. Because the DOD would not provide even so much as plane or taxi fare for the Neusche family, all 650 members of the 203 Engineer Battalion each contributed $10.00 to make the family’s final visit possible.

******************

Why was bush so eager to make sure David Kay was chief "WMD evidence seeker" in Iraq? Speculation was that David Kay was sent over with instructions to locate the spot where these weapons were planted.

What David Kay is leaving out of his bio these days is that until 2002, he was VP of SAIC, a company rolling in Bush defense contracts. Kay produced "retroactive" evidence of WMDs for Bush I. Now he's Bush and Tenet's pick to get the goods...tho' he was fired in 1992 from his UN job for unethical behavior.
http://www.govsux.com/kay.htm

Did David Kay Engineer WMD Evidence for Bush I -and Now Bush 2?
http://baltimore.indymedia.org/newswire/display_any/4430






retyred in fla
“good night paul, wherever you are”
So I read this book

[annxburns]

11. I think we are being set up ....

... I think they will. They have set the bar so low now, with NO evidence of WMD being found that ANY discovery of WMD will lead to an outpouring of "Bush was right" stories. They are just biding the time till we get a nominee, then they will wait until the maximum time to embarrass him (maybe after a big speech or the convention) and then BAM, WMD discovered in Iraq. Even if it is one warhead, the media will jump all over it and ask our candidate "Should you apologize to President Bush?"

I predict it. Just watch.

[mlawson]

12. I think it's too late now.

Because IF they got caught, bush would indeed be toast. The risk is too high for that now, and it might have been all along.

[Journeyman]

16. And these fools can't even lie well about a plane flight. . .

let alone something tricky like a weapons plant.

[calimary]

24. Yeah, but it seems as though most of America is still buying that one.

[dolo amber]

14. I have totally wondered that myself

for the longest time. Someone explained it to me this way; any and all components, chemicals, etc. have *signatures* that can be traced, thus making it almost impossible for them to do so. Not that I think for one hot minute they couldn't find some way around it, mind you, but the tracing factor plus the CIAs generally disgust at this admin might make it a bit harder than it would seem to us lay folk.

[ant]

15. it would be impossible

I mean, you could maybe plant *A* nuke or some chem/bio agents, but you simply can not plant an entire weapons program. What's the US going to do - build a uranium enrichment facility with no one noticing? Not likely. Even the alleged bio labs on wheels fizzled out. And then there's the tracing issue you mentioned. Weapons elements and components are, to some extent, tracked. I'm not saying the U.S. couldn't get around that, but to do so to the extent needed to really "prove" Iraq had a WMD infrastructure of some sort - and to ensure that infrastructure was consistent with Iraq's past attempts - would basically be impossible.

[no_arbusto]

39. Bingo

Why do you think we haven't heard about the anthrax stuff in awhile?

[alcuno]

17. A conspiracy of that magnitude requires a lot of participants.

There are too many variables. You would be asking many to involve themselves in perhaps an illegal, if not immoral, activity. They could not guarantee that the soldiers and agents required to carry out such a conspiracy would not rat them out. The average scientists, workers, soldiers, and agents are more likely patriotic Americans than not.

[JackSwift]

19. Because they are afraid of getting caught

Getting caught planting the WMD would be worse than finding none. And the chances of getting caught are very high. There are a lot of disgruntled personnel stuck in Iraq who would have to participate, and even the gung-ho turkey-with-Bush eaters are probably honest. Planting a whole program is not going to be a four man job -- like killing JFK. And the source of bio-weapons, even if legit, is probably going to the US from when Rumsfeld provided them in the 80s.

Anyway, the response to Bushler suddenly finding them is to make a Nixonesque accusation that they were planted and that those underlings who planted them need to be prosecuted and Bush will never do it because he hasn't even found the Republican who Anthrax'd Daschle, Leahy and Rather

[Kamika]

21. I think they knew it would leak

Too many ppl would have been involved in it..

But I'm sure they will find "something" maybe some papers with plans on building wmds etc

[karlschneider]

26. Good question. I suspect that was a seriously considered option, but was

put on the back burner back in late March when the "war" appeared to be a fait accompli...the Saddam statue being toppled, etc. I think the neocons believed at that time they had gotten enough PR to "justify" the IWR and the invasion. And perhaps they even continued to believe they really -would- find some smoking guns. By ...July or so, have not found any, the rationale was being massaged into a completely different justification "we liberated a nation from a nasty dictator, bla bla)...so the WMD question had, to a degree, already been relegated to a minor consideration by the very people who used it as an excuse at the beginning.

Given the suspicions publicly raised (in most of the world, at least), they probably figured (likely correctly) that a big 'discovery' would be viewed with extreme skepticism, and decided the safest course would be simply to let the issue die out...which it mostly did in the USA.

The Bushistas are stupid in many ways, but politically they're savvy enough to realize the unfortunate fact that it's damn near impossible to underestimate the intelligence of a huge number of Americans.

[Walt Starr]

30. They would be caught

It will have to be within a week of the election. They'll get caught after the election, but it will be too late then.

[9215]

31. They tried to

according to Al Martin, don't know about his crudibility.

WMD's planted in Iraq (credibility problem) http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=62006

snip

According to a stunning report posted by a retired Navy Lt Commander and 28-year veteran of the Defense Department (DoD), the Bush administration’s assurance about finding weapons of mass destruction in Iraq was based on a Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) plan to “plant” WMDs inside the country. Nelda Rogers, the Pentagon whistleblower, claims the plan failed when the secret mission was mistakenly taken out by “friendly fire”, the Environmentalists Against War report.

Nelda Rogers is a 28-year veteran debriefer for the DoD. She has become so concerned for her safety that she decided to tell the story about this latest CIA-military fiasco in Iraq. According to Al Martin Raw.com, “Ms Rogers is number two in the chain of command within this DoD special intelligence office. This is a ten-person debriefing unit within the central debriefing office for the Department of Defense.”

The information that is being leaked out is information “obtained while she was in Germany heading up the debriefing of returning service personnel, involved in intelligence work in Iraq for the DoD and/or the CIA. “According to Ms Rogers, there was a covert military operation that took place both preceding and during the hostilities in Iraq,” reports Al Martin Raw.com, an online subscriber-based news/analysis service which provides “Political, Economic and Financial Intelligence”.

Al Martin is a retired Lt Commander (US Navy), the author of a memoir called “The Conspirators: Secrets of an Iran-Contra Insider,” and is considered one of America’s foremost experts on corporate and government fraud. Ms Rogers reports that this particular covert operation team was manned by former military personnel and “the unit was paid through the Department of Agriculture in order to hide it, which is also very commonplace”.

[NNN0LHI]

32. Here is why Bush and his minions were afraid to plant WMD's in Iraq

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/N03267750.htm

U.N. weapons commission wants to return to Iraq


<snip>In a report to the Security Council, the U.N. Monitoring, Verification and Inspection Commission (UNMOVIC) said it was still updating its extensive database, especially on biological arms and missiles, and analyzing imagery from ongoing commercial satellite overflights.

more

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=819713

[Randi_Listener]

35. Bingo.

Too many eyes in the sky for Pretzel Puss to plant anything without the whistle being blown. Remember the "Saddam is massing troops on the Saudi border" White House hoax? Same thing....

[in_cog_ni_to]

33. They couldn't

every chemical has it's own "footprint"/chemical makeup (there's a term for it, but I can't remember it) and can be traced back to the maker, directly to the lab that made it. Plus...too many people would have had to be involved...it would have leaked out sooner or later.

[Silverhair]

41. You gave an excellent answer and it's being ignored. n/t

[mikehiggins]

34. They know they can't trust the people they rely on.

Too much like themselves.

[number6]

36. its there really, i swear.....

:evilgrin:did u see nbc snooze tonite some colonel dude:evilgrin:
sez man, ... its out there, hidden in the desert ...
just waiting to be found ....:evilgrin: :freak::eyes:

[arewethereyet]

37. Mark Fuerman not in charge over there

look them may be dumb but they area not stupid. plants would get found out.

[hooraydems]

38. They should plant evidence

It would be simple...place a few vials of botulism...and then they can claim it was all worth while...Then Bush's oil cronies will get what they wanted after their campaign donations.

[alcuno]

40. Welcome to DU, hooraydems

The oil cronies are already getting what they wanted. I was listening to an interview on Northwestern University Radio today and they were talking about the privatizing of Iraq's state owned businesses. One that was mentioned was an oil refinery. Bremer signed authorization back in September that foreign companies could own 100% of these businesses.

What Iraqi is going to be able to buy an oil refinery?