Why is there so much hostility toward Northeastern liberals...

[_Jumper_]

...among certain segments of the population? Do they think we eat kittens for lunch?

[Demobrat]

1. They tend to be highly educated.

"Book-learning" is very threatening to a large segment of the population that believes that if you are educated you have no idea what real life is like.

[kodi]

5. bingo.

and the pace of the culture in the northest does not suffer bullshit artists well, the results of which offend many parts of the rest of the country where form over substance in interpersonal transactions is considered more important.

[WhoCountsTheVotes]

11. "form over substance in interpersonal transactions "

"the pace of the culture in the northest does not suffer bullshit artists well, the results of which offend many parts of the rest of the country where form over substance in interpersonal transactions is considered more important"

That's a great description. Dixie and places like Northern California have a "form" in conversation and a ritual aspect to social interactions that Yankees don't. Bluntness and concision cuts out a lot of bullshit artists, but also people with different cultural sensitivites as well.

[kodi]

18. i believe it is a result of population density affecting the culture

i was raises in the northeast, and have lived in the south all but one of the last 25 years.

the cultural differences in the way people deal with each other is astounding.

for example: if one needs to borrow a few bucks from a friend, up north the person would get right to the point.."hey, can i borrow a coupla' bucks?"

down here, the person would first talk about something else and gradually get around to asking for some help. it shows that there is some ritual to the way people deal with each other.

after spending 15 years in north carolina i lived for one year in providence, rhode island and it was amazing to recognize the differences, especially for one who was raised originally in that culture.

one day at the supermarket in providence, i thanked the man who was bagging my groceries, who promptly acted like i was dissing him and he said "what do mean by that?" like he was travis bickle in "taxi driver" in an almost angry tone which signified that i has insulted him. i was taken aback after having spent years saying "thank you" and "i appreciate that" to people who done the same thing and helped me in the south.

it was really strange.

i headed back south the next month.

life is hard enough without having to deal with other people's anger.

[creativelcro]

32. Hmmm, never had anybody get mad at me for thanking them...

I regularly thank waiters when they bring water, janitors when they pick up the wastebin in my office, bus drivers, people at cash registers... This in Boston... Never had anybody react that way... It does seem very strange...

[NewJeffCT]

38. Hmm...

I've lived in CT my whole life, but have always thanked people for helping me out, be it bagging groceries, holding a door or just giving me the time of day.

But, the company I work with has their HQ in North Carolina and it is amazing how different the culture is down there. If you ask them to do something, you don't get any questions, just that it will be done in 15 minutes. Meanwhile, you end up waiting 2-4 hours, or longer, for the 15 minute task to be done. And, I am still waiting for them to finish a task I had asked them to do back in September that was supposed to be finished by the beginning of October (no problem, we can do that ourselves...)

Nobody down there, except for a few of the very senior people, work any extra time at all. The clock strikes 4 and they are out the door... up here, we stay until a job is done or we're at a reasonable stopping point.

[JVS]

44. I think that may have just been the individual

[RobinA]

51. I'm From Philadelphia

and have travelled to many parts of the country. I found that the people I ran into in Providence, and I'm talking business people in stores, were the rudest people I have encountered anywhere. And let me repeat, I'm from Philadelphia, the capital of rude.

[JHB]

62. Does not suffer b***s*** artists well?

On the contrary, there is no shortage of them in the NE. All that differs is the style.

[Bombtrack]

8. Ignorant remarks like that are EXACTLY why

It is perfectly exceptable to a large percentage of Northeasterners to stereotype all southernors as dumb, redneck, racists etc.

The northeasters arrogant superiority complex

So you have a big reason right there, and I'm a baystater

[NewJeffCT]

40. Yes, part of it

Part of it is "Book Lurnin'", and they think us rich folks up here with expensive prep schools (and generally good public schools) are out of touch with the regular guy on the streets...

[NashVegas]

57. I Don't Believe It's the Education

As much as it's the value of education as an ends to itself, vs in the South, it's an ends to social status. (This is, of course, aside from the point of education as a job-getter.)

In the south, one need not display the results of a Harvard degree in conversation, in fact it would be unwise. One may however, feel appropropriate in using said sheepskin to impress others with the simple fact you have one.

[arewethereyet]

83. I disagree, a few well educated rich kids can't elect people

its largely blue collar union people that put the Kennedy's and Kerry's of up there in office.

[Imajika]

2. It is the perception that...

they are out of touch.

It is really that simple. Much of the country doesn't take kindly to the perception of northeastern intellectual elitist trying to tell them what to do.

The entire thing is utterly silly, but it is a reality at this time in America.

Imajika

3. Is it?

because they had something to do with throwing out the first King George a couple of hundred years ago?

or is it because they had something to do with ending slavery 150 years ago?

[amazona]

4. it's because of that business...

...of burning down Georgia.

War crimes aren't forgotten easily in any nation.

[JohnKleeb]

6. but Sherman was from CA I think not the Northeast

[kodi]

9. sure, but no one in new york talks about andersonville prison anymore

.

[Jacobin]

15. well, er.....you just mentioned it

[kodi]

19. yeah, but i live in georgia and know the facts.

.

[JVS]

41. God Bless General Sherman!

[ACK]

43. You say that but General Sherman's men did not rape your kin

Fuck total war. Fuck Sherman.

Burnt my family's shotgun shack of a barn to the goddamn ground. Took everything but the hominy and the grits. Fucking poor dirt farmers in Southeast GA on the way to Savannah.

My grandmother told me the stories of how our family survived that.

Sherman can rot in hell.

[JVS]

45. Sherman is not responsible for the activities of individual soldiers

But his decision to bring the war to the homes of those who had waged it was proper.

[ACK]

46. Bullshit not what the Nuremberg trials said...

I thought officers were responsible for the conduct of their soldiers.

[JVS]

49. Nuremberg trials, pfeh. What a farce!

We all know that the only war crime is losing!

But as far as Sherman is concerned, I've never heard of him ordering soldiers to rape civilians.

[Yupster]

84. Measure actions against the norms of the times

Taking the war to the civilians, killing the livestock, digging up the buried silverware, and depopulating an entire city was not the norm in the Civil War. Most armies on both sides was respectful of civilians in the Civil War. I have no respect for General Sherman. Yes he made the civilians of Georgia howl. Certainly a proud moment of American history, and hardly one to be celebrated on Democratic Underground in my opinion.

[JVS]

101. It was the proper thing to do

Sherman had no supply lines and could not occupy Georgia, so he prevented it from falling into enemy hands by destroying it. A perfectly prudent move.

[LeahMira]

50. Or possibly...

or is it because they had something to do with ending slavery 150 years ago?

... because back when the "pioneers" went out west... "west" being west of the original thirteen colonies... they did so in part to get away from the newly-established government control? As you read through history it seems that the government in Washington, DC has always had a difficult time managing its citizens the farther away those citizens move from the east coast.

[Killarney]

7. Still fighting the Civil War after all these years

Some hate them because they tend to be better educated.
Some hate them because they think of elite, rich people (like the Kennedy's)
and some still hate them for the Civil War

I think a lot of it may be jealousy, too.

[juajen]

16. Ok, Killarney, that one did it

l. No thinking "down South" way reflects that anyone here thinks "yankees" are in any way superior in intellect to Southerners, quite the opposite.

2. We have just as many rich people in the South as there are in the North, and we've felt superior just as long.

3. You might have a point on this one. We still resent reconstruction and carpetbaggers, the burning of Atlanta and the unnecessary destruction of millions of dollars worth of homes, uncalculable looting of our homes, businesses and plantations, etc., and then, of course, the reign began.

4. I don't know what the other reasons are for resenting Northerners, but, at a guess, one might be the attitude witnessed on here, that is usually negative when it comes to the South.

YA'LL COME DOWN NOW, YA HEAR? We have great intellect, great food, and great people.

[thebigidea]

17. so lets get this straight

its bad for Northerners to feel superior to the South - BUT - it isn't bad for Southerners to feel superior to the North?

Ah? Hypocracy, what sweet music.

[DoNotRefill]

29. Nope...the big sin....

is to come into our homes, and then tell us we suck. If we suck, stay home, don't come visiting and give us shit about the way we do things.

Many moons ago while in high school, I worked in a gas station near I-95. It was SHOCKING the number of Northerners who gave me crap about not wanting to pump their gas for them. What part of "Self-Service" on the sign didn't they understand???

[thebigidea]

64. I don't believe I was asking you.

"What part of "Self-Service" on the sign didn't they understand???"

are you serious? THIS is what upsets you? The fact that its generally full service in the NE, so some people who aren't used to self-service don't realize they hafta pump it themself in other states?

That's what bothers you?

Talk about petty.

[DoNotRefill]

73. It's one small thing...

that serves as an example.

If a person wants their gas pumped for them, that's OK. Just go to the "full serve" pumps. But coming down here and whining about having to pump their own gas, and how "that's not how it's done up North" irritates Southerners. If they like how things are done "up North" and don't like how we do it, fine. It's a free country, and they can bloody well stay home, instead of complaining about it. This extends to lots of other things. Don't like hot muggy weather? Don't go to Savannah or New Orleans in the summertime. It's pretty freaking simple.

Here's another example. I know of a case last summer where a person from the Northeast rented a vacation home in a coastal area in the South for a week. He complained that there were mosquitos OUTSIDE of the house, and DEMANDED a partial refund after the fact because of this. I shit you not.

BTW, if you weren't asking me, then why put it out on a public discussion board? That's INVITING a public response. Maybe you should have conducted the conversation via email.... I guess it's just another thing that Yankees and Southerners disagree on.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

81. Ummm...us Yankees have mosquitoes the size of small birds

in the summer. Come to Cape Cod in July sometime!

[Yupster]

86. Another example

I grew up in NYC and now live in Texas. My mom came down to visit and we were next in line in a grocery store.

The person before us had eggs. The checker told him the bigger size eggs were cheaper. She started telling him where the bigger eggs were and then said, never mind, I'll get them, and the checker went and got the eggs leaving us next in line. When the checker came back, my mom actually had to tell her in a low voice that she shouldn't have left the line of people to get that guy eggs. She talked about it for the whole week how the people down here are so slow, she just left us in line to get this guy eggs.

I had to keep telling her that it is something she may learn to appreciate about the south if she lived here. It bothered me for the first few years too, but now I kind of appreciate it.

[Killarney]

22. Just stating facts...

I really didn't mean to offend anyone. I'm not saying Northeasterners are better than anyone, but it is a fact that the general population of northeastern states is more educated than southern states. Not saying anything bad about anyone in particular or anyone here on DU. Just the facts from the US Census. Here are some links:

http://factfinder.census.gov/servlet/ThematicMapFramesetServlet?geo_id=01000US&ds_name=DEC_2000_SF3_U&tm_name=DEC_2000_SF3_U_M00072&_dBy=040&_MapEvent=displayBy&_lang=en&_sse=on

http://www.morganquitno.com/edrank.htm

http://factfinder.census.gov/servlet/ThematicMapFramesetServlet?geo_id=01000US&ds_name=DEC_2000_SF3_U&tm_name=DEC_2000_SF3_U_M00161&_dBy=040&_MapEvent=displayBy&_lang=en&_sse=on

[WoodrowFan]

47. Sherman

"You might have a point on this one. We still resent reconstruction and carpetbaggers, the burning of Atlanta and the unnecessary destruction of millions of dollars worth of homes, uncalculable looting of our homes, businesses and plantations, etc.,

It was bought with slaves blood, it had to be paid for with blood. The North paid for its selling of slaves and allowing slavery with 300,000 dead and money spent on the war. The South, for protecting and even praising slavery, and for building its civilization on the backs of slaves, paid for their sins with lives and treasure.

[Sterling]

23. You are right I am from the south.

I have spent the last 12 years living in CA and NYC and much of that time has been spent on unlearning the latent bigotry and irrational thought process that was ingrained in me from 21 years in Oklahoma.

I still love my home and family but understand the problems there as well. Not that my new home is perfect but I do believe by and large people are more socially evolved in the NE and NW than in the south and midwest.

LA people are a whole different breed all together.

[smirkymonkey]

56. Why is it that Southerners can't

seem to get over the civil war?? Our enemies in the past two world wars seem to have moved on from hating the U.S. (Although the current administration is rapidly reversing that)- Why do southerner's continue to refer to it as if it happened yesterday.

I don't mean to insult, but I am truly curious. Please enlighten me. Thanks. :)

[carolinayellowdog]

60. Always something there to remind me

Hey,

It's not a matter of "not getting over it" in terms of holding grudges against Northerners-- not in my Virginia upbringing anyhow. But the CW cannot be forgotten because we are surrounded by reminders of it; battlefields and monuments are everywhere. That's true of the Upper South; I've lived in the Deep South which saw little actual conflict and the memory does not seem as strong even though the sectional consciousness is stronger.

CYD

[smirkymonkey]

63. That makes sense...

I noticed in Tennessee, when I was in Knoxville on a business trip, there are animosities between East and West Tennessee, as one sided with the Union and one sided with the Confederacy(don't remember which side is which.) It kind of surprised me.

Then again, when my last name came up (which is Italian, although I am blonde and blue eyed) they all seemed kind of uncomfortable and then, apparently to break the tension, one person asked, "So, what kind of holidays do you celebrate?". I think they automatically assumed I was Catholic (which I am not). It was kind of an eye opener for me.

[SharonAnn]

79. (Smiling), yes, I know what you mean. I live here now.

I live near Knoxville now (almost 4 years) and have found it to be a real experience. I'm on the outskirts of Koxville, in an area that was rural not too long ago.

Very anti-Catholic here, very anti-outsiders, very anti-minority, and this is East Tennessee, the Yankee part of Tennessee.

18 months ago there was a Letter to the Editor that said: "Where I grew up in Yankee country, people generally regarded the South as a region uniquely marked by demagoguery, anti-intellectualism and deep, deep ignorance. Judging by the antics of the state legislature over the past three years, I'd say we got it just about right."

There are times it seems all too true.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

82. My Dad-Irish Catholic-was stationed all over the South in the '50s

while in the Air Force. The anti-Catholic thing was rampant. It's pretty sad that it still exists.

[Yupster]

87. East Tennessee generally pro-Union

Western and central Tennessee generally pro-Confederate. A good general rule is any mountainous area was pro-Union. No plantations in the hills and therefore few slaves.

They were the Billy Yanks of the hills, or as the Confederates termed them, the "hillbillies."

[rucky]

10. Cuz old-monied Ivy leaguers are supposed to be conservative

heads may explode

[Fixated]

12. Well I actually eat kittens

But I'm sure it's the education thing.

[nn2004]

13. Because the NE liberals know what is best for them

Free healthcare, free education for all, peace and accepting gays and transgendered as equals, environmental and mostly against animal cruelty like hunting. It will be hard to convince most that the NE liberals are here to help those that have been left out of enlightenment but after a few terms they will come around. They will come to find that the culture of peace and diversity is what is needed to bring us all together and there is no other choice.

[Jacobin]

14. Are you sure you wanna know???

"First them fellers in Boston--them ship captains-- make a fortune selling us slaves, then they git on their high horse and say we can't have them, and not only that but they attack us and destroy our way of life. All the while they use child labor in their factories and use white people as slaves livin' in ghettos. But, they don't call it that, nosir, they call that 'capitalism'

Then, a hunnert years later, them fellers in Boston tell us we gotta go ta school with the black folk and let'em eat in our restaurants and sleep in our hotels. Course, they didn't git aroun to bussin them black folks to the white schools up north, til the end of them court cases, then all of sudden, bussin' ain't such a good idear.

Yeah, they sound all hi fallutin and talk pretty 'bout given all my hard earned tax money to the furriners and the welfare queens, and they do it jest to buy their votes.

Well that Mr. John Kerry, he can take his hi fallutin talk and his rich wife's money an stick it where the sun don't shine. I know what I know and I'll take plain talkin' George any day."


This btw applies to much of the south and much of the midwest, particularly, but not exclusively, in rural areas. This kind of talk works well all the way from the panhandle of Florida, up to Virginia, over to Wisconsin (Big David Duke Territory there), over to Montana and back down through Texas and points east.

If your gonna be from the northeast, it might help (at least this election cycle) if you sound a little madder, not have a filthy rich heiress for a wife, and have a populist tone.

Shriek, is my skirt showing? (I'm a Deaniac)

[Yupster]

88. My favorite is

One fourth of all the adult white men in the south are killed, and another one-fourth wounded, the livestock is killed, the cities are destroyed as are the railroads, the money made worthless, whether in Confederate dollars or bonds, and then the Yankees say, boy you folks sure are backward.

[QC]

20. The self-congratulatory nature of so many of the comments in this thread

might explain some of that hostility.

Honestly, it reminds me of that shampoo commercial in which the supermodel cautions us, "Don't hate me because I'm beautiful."

[kerry-is-my-prez]

21. Here in the South they think of them as "New Yawkers"

In many peoples opinions here in the South, that is the worst crime of all. I'm not sure exactly why. Maybe because in some ways, they are the opposite of a "slower-moving genteel Southerner" (fast-moving, impatient and outspoken Northerner) - maybe that's the problem.... Since I have lived in both areas - I've been on both sides.

IMO - we could both learn some things from each other and this country needs both segments.

When I first moved to the South - I found that at first it made me crazy that people took so much time to do things. I then learned (out of necessity) to slow down and take time to enjoy life and to smell the roses. It's a much more pleasant way of living.

[TexasSissy]

24. Because they're condescending to other parts of the country.

Example: Dean basically calling white southern conservatives rednecks (when he described them as men driving pickup trucks with confederate flags on them). I mean, come on, now. That's respectful? That shows his lack of understanding of southern conservatives. Before then, I hadn't given a thought to the fact that he's a yankee. But that brought it front and center, and highlighted the fact that he doesn't understand the south and has not spent much time there.

I've known lots of white conservative southern men. Not one of them drove a pickup truck that had a confederate flag on it.

[Jacobin]

27. Try going over the east a bit toward Mississippi and Alabama

There are plenty of white guys in trucks with confederate flags. Not the majority of course, but Dean was trying to make a point which was missed by many.

[carolinayellowdog]

25. Perceived as rude, aggressive, impatient, condescending...

but I don't think that has a thing to do with liberalism, and everything to do with the (urban) Northeast. Kodi is right about the pace of life, which has even been documented empirically. A few years ago there was a study that measured how long it took people to walk a block, explain the difference between certified and registered mail (postal clerks), and some other assorted tasks. The researchers used stopwatches in cities all over the nation and found the three fastest-paced places were Boston, Buffalo, and NYC. The slowest were in the Deep South (Memphis and Shreveport I recall) and California. I don't think that form vs. substance quite gets at the heart of the issue. It has more to do with respect and honor; Northeasterners have a way of making others feel disrespected and dishonored without even trying. I've seen something similar in the difference between northern and southern Europe, as well as India. Abruptness and aggressiveness seem somehow to increase with latitude (Canada excepted!).

[DoNotRefill]

30. I'd agree...

it isn't so much of a "liberal" versus "conservative" thing. I've met plenty of "Northeastern Conservatives" that I dislike as much as "Northeastern Liberals". For me, the dislike springs from "Northeastern", not "Liberal" or "Conservative".

I think we need to put up stations near the borders of the Northeast, and make people going in and out take a short class on appropriate behavior for both the Northeast and elsewhere. It would help alleviate the problems of culture shock.

[trogdor]

36. so them paper placemats explainin' Southern ain't no good.

You know the ones, in the greasy spoons (I'm originally from KY, so don't assume I'm shooting off my mouth) like Stuckey's, or Shoney's, or whatever, that translate English into some stereotyped form of hillbilly language. You don't see those north of the Mason-Dixon line.

[Maine Mary]

37. Hmmmm

The researchers used stopwatches in cities all over the nation and found the three fastest-paced places were Boston, Buffalo, and NYC. The slowest were in the Deep South (Memphis and Shreveport I recall) and California.

Maybe they are walking fast to stay warm??? :think:

[Maine Mary]

42. URBAN Northeast????

The REAL NE is north of Augusta Maine. ANYWHERE south of there (including dixie) is urban as far as I'm concerned. :evilgrin:

[Malva Zebrina]

78. Absolutel;y true

I travelled on the black and blue roads of the eastern area of the south for many months in my travel van, staying at many of the back road parking lots.

I loved the people of the south in these travels and have had many satisfying experiences and memories. Once you get to talking to the people, the barriers seem to disappear. We are, after all, only all human beings and I found that to be true if you only take the time to connect and recognize the common connections.

But, there is a definate resistance in certain parts of the south, to the recognition that the north won the civil war. I have no idea how come. But it is there. It can be amusing at times, for instance when we went to a couple of civil war re-enactments. We just shut up and took pictures rather than challenge the thing. LOL


At the same time, there is not that much resentment of the northerner but more like a reserved respect--more like a curiosity than anything. And I suspect as the economy demands in the south, with the fluency of travel from north to south in the propagation of economic advantage, there will be more blending of ideas as time goes on. It will take some time, but it is inevitable that this will happen.

The most liberal, enjoyable and accepting state I found in all these travels over these several months, was Louisiana. The most suspicious and uncomfortable to visit was Mississippi. But, still, people do try to be human beings in all of those states. I can find positive things in all.

San Antonio Texas was very friendly, or at the least, detached and unconcerned, but the further north one went in Texas from SA was, actually, imo, quite poor and conservative with no where to go but down. It looked tired and poor.

I travelled for hundreds of miles up the middle of Texas without seeing a sign of a human being and seeing a herd of maybe ten cattle on hundreds of acres of land. Hmm to a northeasterner, this seemed odd as we are used to seeing herds of hundreds of cattle all grazing on our lush green pastures, especially in Vermont. It seemed rather a waste to this yankee to see such paucity of a herd using such a great amount of grazing land.

Uh uh--did not and was not impressed with that, although San Antonio was really enjoyable and terrific\ especially the river walk which we did the whole of in one day and that was really fun. It just happened to be the annual celebration of the battle of the Alamo the day we were there--and it was packed with fun loving people that day.

[smirkymonkey]

53. What do you think is the reason for

such differences between Northern and Southern people (seemingly, everywhere, not just the US?) I have noticed the same thing in many countries - always curious as to why?

Anybody have any info or links on this?

[carolinayellowdog]

58. Where else have you seen it?

Hey,

My experience is that southern French are friendlier than northern, northern Italians friendlier than Swiss, Swiss friendlier than Germans, Andalusians friendlier than Castilians, Tamilians friendlier than Hindi speakers. Even within certain states it seems to apply, certainly in Virginia. I bet it works backwards in Brazil, that northerners are friendlier.

As for explanations, I haven't a clue other than greater population densities in more northerly places.

CYD

[smirkymonkey]

61. I was referring mainly to the

perception that the north is more , countries where this seems to be the case - Italy, France, Spain, India, Ireland, Northern Europe v. Southern Europe (in general)- Northern Hemisphere v. Southern Hemisphere, etc.

Mostly I think those so called "northern" traits center around urban areas - but one theory I have is that colder climates produce a more work/study oriented culture, as there is not as much opportunity to get out and "bask in the sun" or enjoy life as much. Seems like the warmer the client, the warmer and more laid back the people are.

I know it's a generalization, but so are most of the posts on this thread.

[klyon]

102. Why the difference

I think what you are seeing is the difference in life styles caused by population densities.
In the north with people literally living on top of each other, different rules of privacy must be maintained and so different behaviors. In the south with fewer people, everyone knows everyone else’s business, life is on a more personal level.
The problems seem to come when people travels to the other’s area and don’t respect the ways and customs of the area and the locals should be more accepting different approaches to living when guests come to visit.

KL

[Selwynn]

26. If you mean the candidates, I don't believe there is a northestern liberal

...in the running. I'm not sure why there's so much hostility towards northeastern centrists, though.

[DoNotRefill]

28. Probably because....

many of them have an attitude problem and are into stereotyping.

For example: look at the anti-South threads here. I live in the South, and neither drag my knuckles on the ground nor have had sex with my sister yet I'm often accused of things like that just because I'm Southern.

Frankly, I don't give a sh*t about how you do things "up North". Extend the same courtesy to me.

[Paladin]

76. As If.......

...you're not exhibiting an attitude problem and engaging in stereotyping in this thread, broad-brushing everybody north of the Mason-Dixon line as a bunch of inconsiderate louts. Lighten the hell up......

[Fescue4u]

31. I have no hostility toward NorthEasters

I travel alot for business. When I work with folks in the North East on business, I don't notice anything different.

But when I deal with folks in other than business relations ships, I am usually astounded at how uniformly rude folks are.

It seems as though the rudeness and hostility is reserved for strangers.

After a few days, Im ready to get home to nicer people.

[Loonman]

33. They hate us 'cuz they ain't us

:)

[creativelcro]

34. It's mostly sour grapes mixed with insecurity....

Partly fueled by some more or less veiled elitism on our part. That has to be said...

[coyote]

35. That´s because we are superior.....

nothing more to say. It´s just the way it is. :)

[ACK]

39. Unable to talk the populist talk ... South hate... Education arrogance

The NE part of the country is more educated and NE liberals tend to be unable to talk the populist talk and convey their message to the people of both the Midwest and the South.

There is a reason all those Southern Democrats went to the whitehouse. They could actually talk to the people.

There is the sense from even liberals in other parts of the country feel that NE liberals have a hard time understanding what liberals in other parts of the country have to put with.

In fact many NE liberals here are willing to write off the entire South because of the Nascar vote ignoring that Clinton won GA and the margin of victory for the typical Repuke candidate is smaller here than in other sections of the solidly Republican states.

There is this arrogance that is associated with what my grandfather called being "educated beyond your intelligence". They criticize good Dems (not Zell or Nunn but good Southern Dems like Edwars and Graham or even NE rural Dems like Dean) for the compromises they have to make without any understanding of the situation in other parts of the country.

There is the feeling even by some left-of-center Dems that moral purity as Michael Moore put it is more important than winning.

Not only that but even some left coast Dems I have spoken to feel that NE Dems look down on them as New Age dope smoking crackpots or silicon valley sellouts because they don't live in the rustbelt.

This is all my humble opinion and the opinions I have heard over the years from other Dems.

[Maine Mary]

48. There is too much generalizing in this thread from both sides

There are plenty of elected populist NE Dems "who know how to talk to the people".

On the other hand there are also snotty elitist southerners who are "educated beyond their intelligence"

[ACK]

52. Come on ... that is why I use words like they get the sense and preception

No joke no generalizations are absolute.

That is why we are talking about feelings. People want to know why NE liberals are disliked even by other liberals in this country.

I say because of some very common misconceptions and generally feelings they get from their interaction with some but not all Northern liberals.

This is why I used words like "people get the sense that" and peoples "perceptions" of NE liberals are etc... etc... etc.

Considering the number of "They hate us because we are so superior" messages on this thread there are Northern liberals that indeed live up to the general perception of them.

[smirkymonkey]

55. They hate us for our FREEDOM!!

We must declare war on them!!

Freedom Bean Soup for everyone!

[Maine Mary]

67. Sorry. I didn't mean your post in particular

even though I picked some of the phrases from them. I understood what you meant by "people get the sense that"... excetera. In other words I wasn't saying YOU personally were generalizing, but rather you were stating the case of many of those who do. I didn't get the feeling that you necessarily agreed w/the generalizations either.

That's why I said I beleived there were too many generalizations from both sides even though I didn't pick some of the more untasteful ones from the North as I probably should have....ie. Southerners are rednecks, Southern women are vain and superficial. etc. (Which I don't necessarily agree with either)

I never get involved in the N/S threads for this very reason. In fact this is the first one I've ever replied to. Too many people on each side seem to generalize.

I can't speak for the south but I can say 99% of the generalizations I hear about the NorthEast are NOT true in the case of most of Maine, Vermont and NH. The rural parts anyway. If anything, we are much more like the generalizations I hear about the south then the north. In my part of Maine we are VERY rural. I would venture to guess that my area is more rural then most parts of the south. For example I live in a town w/no store, post office, or town office... just the k-8 school. And with a population of approx 650 my town is one of the larger ones in my legislative district. I Represent one town about 100 miles north of here that had 100% voter turnout in 2000 w/22 people!!! I won there 13-9. TeeHee

Not many people around here go onto college, Government interferance pissess them off, you'd be hard pressed to find a home w/out at least one shotgun, and the voter breakdown is only 24% Dem. You wouldn't beleive the uproar it caused when I won my seat for the Maine House in 1998! :-)

Anyway, my point is that most generalizations (on both sides) grow out of ignorance.

[WoodrowFan]

54. It's a plot from the Midwest

It's a plot from the rustbelt-midwest to distract the West and South from the fact that the rustbelt REALLY runs everything. heh heh.

(Ohio Native)

[NashVegas]

59. Because Reagan Was from California

..

I don't recall hearing the phrase 'northeastern liberal' thrown about as an insult until 1980.

[SpaceCatMeetsMars]

65. Well, I'll see you all in hell, Johnny Rebs!

Just kidding. :)

I think this is the type of thread that almost requires discussing in person because it requires so much in the way of generalities and qualifying. Like, what's considered rude in different places is such a wide subject.

[Bucky]

70. You yankees'll only kill me over my dead body!!!

Um, wait. Let me think this one thru for a second

[0007]

66. I've lived in 17 different states starting with Colorado Springs,

where I was born and raised.

I liked living in NYC the best and found the people indeed great. I now live in Texas and it is probably the worse place I've ever lived. Pittsfield, Mass was the next best.

I believe it is all a matter of perception. I remember when traveling in Austraila back in the 60's, a young girl and I were having this same conversation and she said something that I'll never forget. She said, "It doesn't any difference where your at, it's who you're with that indeed matters."

[Yupster]

90. I'm opposite

I grew up in New York City, and hated it. I moved to Texas 20 years ago and love it. It takes all kinds.

[0007]

68. double post

deleted

[eileen_d]

69. People from the NE think the world revolves around them

They think of the rest of the country as either a vast wasteland or a quaint, exotic novelty act.

This became quite evident to me when, having been raised in Montana, I went to an Ivy League college in New England. People did not know where my state was on a map; they assumed my family ran a ranch and rode horses daily; they either felt sorry for me for having grown up far from "where it's at" or they wrote me off as as a curiosity.

(Of course I am overstating my case here, but hell - everyone else in this thread is. ;) )

[coyote]

71. I find people from the Midwest rather dull and boring.

I have met too many people from the Midwest that are only skin deep. They have no culture and lack identity. They are content with their own little world and have no desire look beyond it. I also feel sorry for you having been brought up in Montana.

Touche.

[SharonAnn]

80. Montana is not the Midwest!

eom

[put out]

98. Oh my, them's fightin' words.

And who is your fight with exactly? I have met many wry, funny, and energetic folks from the South. And I have been furious with folks from the South in situations where my party is trying to accomplish something. I want to scream "Pick em up and put em down, people! Let's go! Let's go!" I want to, but don't.

I have met many warm, generous, and kind folks from the North. And I have been furious with folks from the North for treating me as their personal assistant when we were working together. I want to scream "And who the hell are you to do so little and demand so much as though it were some kind of birthright! Do it yourself faster if you can, and I doubt you can!" I don't do that either.

I think there are real regional differences in the way people operate in their environments. A little cultural sensitivity and patience go a long way.

This is from a dull and boring Midwesterner, only skin-deep, with no culture or identity. Just content in my own little world, with no desire to look beyond it.

Hey, was that French you were using, that Tooch word? Please don't, it is so scary to all of the rest of the country.

[klyon]

103. Yea. I only exaggerate for effect too.

KL

[CBHagman]

72. I think it's just garden-variety demonizing.

I was born in New England and have lived in seven different states (both coasts, the North, South, and Midwest) and the District of Columbia. It depresses me to see the way people still stereotype each other in this country and that still, despite all our mobility and the like, we have these apparent barriers between us.

When I was living in South Carolina, I heard more than a few people, including a dear friend of mine, commenting that the Northeast "got everything" (meaning that the federal government provided advantages to the Northeast that were not available to the South). I'm really not in a position to give a long-term evaluation of how true or untrue that is, but in recent years, of course, I have been seen article after article about how the higher salaries (and higher cost of living) in the urban Northeast translate into their payment of a larger chunk of federal taxes. And I'm sure all of us recall how Newt Gingrich's Cobb County, GA, far from being independent of the federal government, relied a great deal on taxpayer dollars and government contracts.

But I digress. Really, if possible, everyone should have a chance to travel through at least two other regions of the country besides their native area and get a feel for the pace of life, the accents, the economy, etc. It's a real eye-opener.

When I lived in the South, I felt as though I had to explain the North to my Southern friends.

When I lived in the North, I felt I had to disabuse my Northern friends of their notions concerning the South.

Now I'm in the Mid-Atlantic and happily wishy-washy. :-)

[KaraokeKarlton]

74. Actually, I think it's aimed mostly at Massachussetts liberals

I don't think it applies to most of Maine, NH and Vermont. People in rural areas are actually fairly conservative (in the traditional sense, not political sense) and old fashioned. There does seem to be a distinct difference in the mentalities between those who live in the cities and those who live in small towns. The two New England populations are like night and day.

[UrbScotty]

75. I don't know. The last Northeasterner to become President was this guy

The previous one is in my avatar.

[CarlWoodward]

77. Here in Texas, we don't hate Yankees ...

... we just feel a little sorry for 'em. :)

And don't forget, while Dubya might have lived here for a few years, he's definitely NOT a Texan - he was born in Connecticut. Real Texans include people like Ann Richards and Jim Hightower.

[Yupster]

92. I gre up in NYC and moved to Texas

when I was 21 which was 24 years ago. Am I a real Texan? I sure think I am.

[incapsulated]

94. That's interesting

As a NY'er myself, I'm curious. Do the Texans think of you as a Texan or are you a NYC boy/gal forever to them?

*coughs up ball of kitten fur*

[Yupster]

96. I'm a Texan now, but

I still get some good natured nribbing now and then.

I'll get introduced by a friend with something like "he's from New Yawk City, but he's okay anyway." I'll usually respond with a Texas colloquilism like, "oh that Bubba, he's nutty as a peach orchard sow."

I have clients named Bubba btw as well as Robert E Lee (last name).

[incapsulated]

97. "he's nutty as a peach orchard sow"

Do you use these on your NY relatives during the holidays? ;)

[Yupster]

99. You bet -- love to talk Texan to the Yankees

I also bought a 1 % stake in 21 oil wells just to say I did it.

BTW, the wild pigs eat the peaches from the ground that have fallen and then fermented. They get drunk and run around the orchards stumling around, hence the expression.

[incapsulated]

100. I love those crazy southern expressions! :) n/t

[apsuman]

85. Because NE libs own the Dem party...

They force their issues into the national party...

They (by association) tie the hands of southern dems...

They cause the party to lose nationally.

[AngryAmish]

89. No, small dogs

j.k.

[THUNDER HANDS]

91. because we're better than everyone else

;)

[Cleita]

93. I thought we, on the Left Coast, have dibs on that claim.

:-)

[incapsulated]

95. East Coast, West Coast and Texas...

all have one thing in common: They think they are the center of the universe. That's why we can't stand each other. :)