Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Wellstone told war vets Cheney threatened him about IWR

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU
 
librechik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 02:21 PM
Original message
Wellstone told war vets Cheney threatened him about IWR

snip
"At a meeting full of war veterans in Willmar, Minn., days before his death, Wellstone told attendees that Cheney told him, "If you vote against the war in Iraq, the Bush administration will do whatever is necessary to get you. There will be severe ramifications for you and the state of Minnesota."

Wellstone cast his vote for his conscience and against the Iraq measure, the lone Democrat involved in a tough 2002 election campaign to do so. And a few weeks later on Oct. 25, as he appeared to be winning his re-election bid, Wellstone, his wife, Sheila, his daughter, Marcia Markuson, three campaign staffers, and two pilots died in a plane crash in Minnesota.

Talk about "severe ramifications."

snip

read more here:
http://www.liberalslant.com/jt123003.htm

<pulling on asbestos cloak>
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
RBHam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 02:24 PM
Response to Original message
1. Bush Sr. asked....
"Who is that little prick?"

Guess he found out.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MoonAndSun Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 02:36 PM
Response to Original message
2. I will always believe that the BFEE had something to do with
this "accident". It doesn't matter who investigates or what the conclusions are, Paul Wellstone died because he refused to lay down and let bush* and has evil henchmen walk all over him about Iraq. And he paid for it with his life, along with the other people who died with him.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 02:46 PM
Response to Original message
3. wellstone was murdered
by bushco.
now we have a confession.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
stinkeefresh Donating Member (563 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 03:03 PM
Response to Original message
4. I don't know about the rest of you...
but that event is what pulled me into online politics. He was murdered, just like Carnahan the election previous. Question is, who will they target this election?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 04:38 PM
Response to Reply #4
14. I don't think they will be audacious enough to go for three in a row...
Democratic retirements and a Sovietized Media will see too that.

And sadly, the likelihood is that our own Party will help them, as they continually fail to relize just what they are up against.

Of course, the Busheviks have been bold to the point of recklessness, and have gotten scot free away from it every single time. Dozens of scandals, any one of which would have terminated Clinton, have silently slipped down the memory hole with out a peep.

Perhaps not the Plame case, but the Busheviks had six months to scrub the evidence. Fitzgerald was turned loose, but the Busheviks know they are safe (which is why they waited 6 months to turn him loose).

I only know that in Orwellian Imperial Amerika, such a thing has to be seen to be believed, and not a second before...

So, the bottom line is that I don't think they would do it (or pass some valuable security information to the Colombians or others so that they could do it), as people would REALLY begin to suspect something, even with Pravda spinning and covering as fast as possible.

But they have been so almost utterly successful that they may have the ultimate hubris to just do it and dare anyone to do anything.

Finally, the Plame Leak may have forced them to pull back their hand just a bit, and may have saved some Democratic Congressperson's life in 2004 (in a battleground state trending Republikan where it would just oh-so-speed-things-up if the incumbent would just sort of "get out of the way").

Think about it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
revcarol Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 06:10 PM
Response to Reply #14
34. I think you're wrong, sad to say.
Bush wants a trifecta in everything.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
LiberalFighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 08:38 PM
Response to Reply #34
46. No... He wants a slam dunk
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
goforit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 11:14 PM
Response to Reply #4
49. We really hope this will not happen again.
O8)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ElsewheresDaughter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 03:14 PM
Response to Original message
5. bush*/PNAC was responsable for Wellstone's death.......i have no doubts
Edited on Wed Dec-31-03 04:00 PM by ElsewheresDaughter
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
truthspeaker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 03:16 PM
Response to Original message
6. I have doubts
at this point it's a possibility in my mind, but I don't see any hard evidence to support it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BigDaddyLove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. Other than motive, I also see no evidence.....
to support Bush's (or Cheney's) involvement.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Cocoa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. it seems pretty implausible
Many people voted against the war, going after Wellstone doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Minstrel Boy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 04:26 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. He was the only senator standing for re-election
Edited on Wed Dec-31-03 04:28 PM by Minstrel Boy
to have voted against the war.

His elimination would silence the sharpest critic in the Senate to White House foreign policy, and send a chill through the legislature, much as the anthrax mailings cowed Democratic members into supporting the Patriot Act. A Democratic Congressional representative, quoted in the above piece on Wellstone's death: "I don't think there's anyone on the Hill who doesn't suspect it (murder). It's too convenient, too coincidental, too damned obvious. My guess is that some of the less courageous members of the party are thinking about becoming Republicans right now." Wellstone was leading at the time of his death, and Republican control of the Senate hinged on a single seat.

His death was timely, just one day before his name would have stayed on the ballot posthumously, as did Mel Carnahan's, and also claimed his wife, who could have run in his place. Wellstone had already survived an assassination attempt in Colombia, as he was investigating the White House's drug policy. A bomb was discovered on the airstrip his plane was due to land on.

When you ask about what sense it makes, it's the sense of the thug.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 04:52 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. Damn, that was astutely said, MinstrelBoy
Wellstone was the Democratic Senator likely with the most integrity and cleanest record. No easy task to give him the Gore Treatment.

Further, a fighter who didn't back down (even after the first unsuccessful assassination attempt) and who could have absolutely become President someday on his honesty, passion, and belief. Carrying the standard that Howard Dean is now carrying, I believe Wellstone, either in 2004 or 2008, as Dean is now, could have run for that office on the strength of his honest war opposition.

He possibly could have harnessed all the energy at DU and elsewhwre, and become it's national leader. Even though maqny of Wellstone's views were to the Left of me, I still felt that he was the only Senator who even remotely spoke for me. I;ll bet thousands, perhaps millions of people were coming to that conclusion. With the way the Freepers and Rethug analysts monitor Lefty Web Sites, you know it was noticed.

And you are correct about the Sense of a Thug. Gore and Lieberman and Dacshle and Gephardt and so many others (with the exception of Byrd) could not understand nor deal with the thuggishness of the Busheviks. I don't think it ever computed fully (Gore gets it now...too late) for these guys and that is why they seem so bewildered in this New Amerika and are getting outfoxed because they still play by the Old Rules from post-WWII America.

But I think Dean understands...at least partially. Bob Byrd understands, but is too old to do anything other than play Cicero (for which I am immensely grateful, don't get me wrong).

And so did Wellstone, or would have by now.

"They're sheep. Easily dispersed if we strike the shepherd."
--King Edward, in the movie "Braveheart", speaking about assassinating William Wallace
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Minstrel Boy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. And how dispiriting it is to strike down the leaders.
Edited on Wed Dec-31-03 05:03 PM by Minstrel Boy
Wellstone was one. He was the leader in the Senate at the time of his death in opposing Bush's campaign of conquest.

Think of the Spring of 1968, and the rise - indeed, convergence - of America's two leading figures for peace and justice.

April, and Bam! - there goes Martin.
June, and Bam Bam! - there goes Bobby.

And the grassroot are confused, dispirited, hopeless, and dribble off into self-indulgence, nostalgia and chaos.

Assassination is a state tool. It eliminates leaders who threaten the order, and it breaks the spirit of those who would hope for better.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 05:12 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. Undoubtedly. It has been so since the history began
There is no reason to think is has ever NOT been so, even in so-called "morally superior" societies, as the Old American Republic, somewhat (but not completely) was during the period of 1941-2000.

How about it? Any prominent Canadian politicians outrightly shot or murdered or Wellstoned indirectly or by proxies?

'Fess up.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Minstrel Boy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 05:22 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. The only Canadian politician to have been assassinated
was Member of Parliament D'Arcy McGee, in 1868. Shot by a Fenian sympathizer. It's unlike me, I know, to accept the official story, but I'm not about to open the books on this one.

Bad things happen to good politicians the world over. Sometimes by chance, sometimes design. But if they happened anywhere else with the frequency that they happen in the US, Americans might have cause to think that country was not a healthy democracy.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RandomKoolzip Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 11:28 PM
Response to Reply #16
51. The guy in my sig pic is Fred Hampton.
Edited on Wed Dec-31-03 11:29 PM by RandomKoolzip
Murdered by Nixon's thugs with the help of the Daley Machine IN HIS SLEEP.

Do a google search...this guy was a threat, so they took him out.

IMHO, NOT to draw an unpleasant conclusion from the number of suspicious deaths which have struck left-leaning figures since the MIC set up shop is to remain willfully naive about how this world operates.

Ever heard of a right winger dying an untimely death? Me neither.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Loren645 Donating Member (516 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 11:35 PM
Response to Reply #16
52. Exactly.
"It eliminates leaders who threaten the order, and it breaks the spirit of those who would hope for better."

Did Cheney really threaten Senator Wellstone?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SharonAnn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 07:19 PM
Response to Reply #13
40. He also had a strong enough opponent to turn that Senate
seat to Republican hands. They badly needed to get rid of the Democratic majority in the Senate.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Yupster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 05:53 PM
Response to Reply #8
28. Especially when Wellstone
was the most liberal senator in office. He was not a threat to beat Bush. In fact, he would have been Bush's dream opponent.

If Bush wanted to get someone who was a threat to him, then Gore would have made a good first person on the list.

But what do I know. I still think Jo DiMaggio offed JFK.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MoonRiver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 05:59 PM
Response to Reply #28
31. They needed another Senate seat, and it was fairly close in MN
Did the state have electronic voting then? If not that might have been another way to steal one more seat.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BackDoorMan Donating Member (412 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 07:33 PM
Response to Reply #31
41. This a fact of life...but it's hard for us peasants to accept because
Edited on Wed Dec-31-03 08:02 PM by BackDoorMan
it means we are just pawns, with no real control and helpless, so let's just say it never really happened until there's absolute proof. Well that will never happen, it long gone...

Sometimes one has to go with ones own feelings and inner absolutes, they try at every turn to discourage those feelings in us. Most of us have unknowingly done this and we have been programmed to abandon our own sense of the obvious…we are constantly fed...to just believe what we see and what we are told. Government, (we are speaking of true fascist here, not something else) would never do such things…as if these greedy disgusting people wouldn’t kill and create an invasion with innocent people killed and maimed, for profit and control.

These are ruthless, sick, power hungry, money hungry, cold, insensitive monsters we are talking about…nothing will stop them from their overwhelming need for power and greed. They truly believe they are different and better and deserving of it all. Undeniable elitist. And no one better get in their way.

Secretly killing the opposition has always been a means to silence the voices who speak out against the powerful and the ruling class of this country, as well as though out world history. New technologies and a cooperative corporate media simply make it easier to accomplish and more difficult to exposed.

Always QUESTION AUTHORITY (and their "official" line, because it's always bullshit!)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BackDoorMan Donating Member (412 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 03:41 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. If you refuse to see the obvious...you'll NEVER be convinced.
Edited on Wed Dec-31-03 04:30 PM by BackDoorMan
Of course it was murder...(and they made sure Wellstone's wife was onboard, so she couldn't take Paul's seat like Mel Carnahan's wife did, when his plane mysteriously went down during his senate race against John Ashcroft.)

Paul Wellstone was the most hated and feared democrat in the country by Bush and the fascist.

Killing Wellstone assured the republican fascist control of the senate by a one vote majority...it's too obvious.

What kind of proof do you want? Bush coming out saying "yes, we blew up Wellstone's plane because he was the most liberal senator in the country"? Do you expect to see it on Fox or CNN...Bush's federal FAA doing the investigation?

Are you saying the CIA which is supported and run to protect American corporate interest (i.e. OIL and world domination) DON'T have the means after sixty years and trillions of dollars for secret research and today’s technology, don't have the means to push a button and get rid of anyone they choose with no trace, of course they do...are they going to tell you or me about it...where, again, on Fox or CNN?

Go with your feelings, your gut feelings, it's all so neat and tidy...there is no doubt...the killings of JFK, MLK, RFK, Carnahan, even JFK jr and dozens of others, again we'll never hear the truth...the CIA, FBI and the like do not work for or care about liberals and their concerns...they are all about US corporate world control and these pesky democrats who get in the way...good-bye and good riddance!

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BigDaddyLove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 03:27 PM
Response to Original message
9. Where did the quote come from?
The link doesn't supply a source.

Why haven't we heard about this before? If such a threat was made you'd think that it would have made public sooner than this.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BackDoorMan Donating Member (412 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 04:08 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. What major "news" organization would report it?
Edited on Wed Dec-31-03 04:13 PM by BackDoorMan
The republican owned and operated corporate media? They know people will accept ANYTHING they tell them and the sheep will only have "DOUBTS"...that's good enough for them. "Mission accomplished."

Shit, they won't report on anything that might harm Bush and their own greedy interest.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 04:11 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Thanks
Seems obvious to me.

Thanks for pointing it out.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BigDaddyLove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 05:22 PM
Response to Reply #12
21. Just because an article was written outside of...........
Edited on Wed Dec-31-03 05:39 PM by BigDaddyLove
the 'Republican controlled Media', it must be taken as the truth?

Funny, when someone suggests something that doesn't jive with the accepted and obvious 'truths', they are expected to have very detailed references, but when something is posted that feeds the conspiracy beast regarding the (supposed) murder of Paul Wellstone, no further questions are asked.

For all any of us know, that 'quote' could have been made up; and probably was.

What I also find interesting is the 'selective conspiracy theory' choices people make. It appears to be completely possible (and welcome), to believe that Wellstone was murdered and that the murder is being covered up, and yet to be dismissive toward the myriad of other possible conspiracies currently in vogue.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MoonRiver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 05:45 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. Who do you love 'BigDaddy'?
:smoke:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BigDaddyLove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 05:47 PM
Response to Reply #24
26. My wife mostly............
Is your question a thinly veiled attempt to verify my allegiance to the Democratic Party?

In other words, why do you ask?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #9
17. In the Old America, you may have been right, BigDaddyLove
But the world changed on 9-11, did it not? Though to be quite honest, I think the change was actually on 12-12-2000.

Ah, I remember...it wasn't so long ago, that I would have said something exactly like that.

But that was before I started paying attention, and of coure before the Busheviks began wielding power so nakedly. Before I saw with my own eyes the supression of scandal after scandal, saw Gary Condit roasted 24/7 while a young woman found dead in a Republican Congessman's office and a shady coroner fired from Missouri for falsifying death records who lied and witheld the information that Lori Klausitis had a bruise on her head for 3 weeks and go utterly unreported in the Mainstream Media (at the same time they were flogging Condit daily with no body, no evidence, no crooked coroner...)

Had I not been reading a few Indy Media sources and seen with my own eyes the story unfold from a tiny NW Floida newspaper and nowhere else, I would have never seen it nor heard about it.

But everyone knows who Gary Condit is, eh?

And this is but one tiny refutation of dozens I could list if I cared to sit down and think about it.

Go ahead. Google "Lori Klausutis" and see what you can find. Most particularly, look for the NW Pensacola Journal, I believe, as it is the only mainstream news source to cover the story.

Think. Wake up. This is not your Father's America, that post--WWII egalitarian Republic.

As to Wellstone, think what you like because we'll never know. But you simply CANNOT use that excuse anymore.

Amerika's Mainstream Media has gone from being the envy of the world and now is on it's way to become the world's laughingstock.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BigDaddyLove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 05:34 PM
Response to Reply #17
22. Tom Paine............
I greatly respect your voice on DU, but I resent being told to "think", or to "wake up".

I do think and I am wide awake, I just don't share the automatic knee-jerk reaction that many apparently have when something bad happens.

Sometimes awful things happen in this world independent of the Bush family; and until proven otherwise, the death of Paul Wellstone in my mind is one of those things.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Yupster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 05:56 PM
Response to Reply #22
30. Next thing
someone will start a thread claiming Bush was responsible for the earthquake in Iran.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
prariedogging Donating Member (32 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 07:51 PM
Response to Reply #30
42. He was!
Indirectly of course. But he was. The CIA leaked a study warning of possible earthquakes if too many big bombs were used in Iraq. Bush ignored this report. So I blame him. At least partially.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-04 09:20 AM
Response to Reply #42
59. Ridiculous
n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-04 09:19 AM
Response to Reply #22
58. Apologies, BigDaddyLove
You are right. I was out of line.

Let us simply agree to disagree on this one. You are certainly correct that every bad thing that happens is not a result, directly or indirectly, of the Busheviks.

But my sense of history and human nature suggests that Wellstone was assassinated, just as it tells me it was no coincidence that all 6 or 7 people who could have threatened the Imperial Succession of Tiberius in Rome circa 20 AD either died or were banished.

Even though there is no hard evidence.

At any rate, I apologize for directing those comments towards you.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MoonRiver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #17
32. Just curious about your name.
Edited on Wed Dec-31-03 06:01 PM by saywhat
:hi: Happy New Year!

WHOOPS! Meant to reply to #26.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BigDaddyLove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 08:22 PM
Response to Reply #32
44. Oh, sorry................
there's just something about conspiracy threads that make me feel funny.


Happy New Year to you too!!!!!!!!!!!!

:toast:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Eric J in MN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 06:56 PM
Response to Reply #9
36. I'd like a source of that quote as well.
Did anyone, anywhere, record Wellstone saying that he was threatened by Cheney at the time?

Is there anyone with a name who says he heard that now?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Ficus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 05:20 PM
Response to Original message
19. still not sure what to think
I wouldn't be too surprised.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 05:40 PM
Response to Reply #19
23. And There It Is Ficus !!!
And BidDaddy, I hear what you are saying, but I think that the sad state of affairs is, that with this current crop of facists in power, although we may never know for sure what happened to Wellstone's plane, it being a murder WOULD NOT SUPRISE ME.

:shrug:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BigDaddyLove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 05:45 PM
Response to Reply #23
25. I completely understand what you are saying.............
and if it's one day actually proven that Bush was somehow involved with the plane going down, I too will not be completely surprised, given how much damage they've done; I just refuse to think that when it rains on my picnic, somehow Bush is responsible.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #25
27. Oh Man, You Haven't Heard Of The BFEE Cloud Seeders, LOL ???
Have a GREAT NEW YEAR, BDL!!!

:hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BigDaddyLove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 05:54 PM
Response to Reply #27
29. You too Willy.....
:party:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
gristy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 06:46 PM
Response to Reply #25
35. You mean the BFEE, not Bush personally, right?
I mean, Bush does NOT run this show. My guess is there are many, many operatives out there. Some are in the BFEE, and some are only loosely and remotely connected to it. But they all understand their mission and objectives. Nobody, least of all Bush, had to tell anybody to take out Wellstone. Someone may have just up and did it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
librechik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-04 12:26 AM
Response to Reply #35
55.  it's not a conspiracy
it's a movement. Nobody is in charge, exactly, they just all believe approximately the same things so their decisions seem coordinated. They don't actually make things happen, events generate spontaneously from a combination of intent and, shall we say, synchronous happenstance.

Except sometimes they do do something.

BTW this article is the first to mention that EMP waves effect electronics rather than electrical systems, which explains why the engine was still revolving when it hit the ground. Only the instruments and controls would be effected with such an attack.




Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
juajen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 06:09 PM
Response to Reply #19
33. Sometimes, you just have to go with your instincts
The very first thing I said to my husband when I heard about the plane going down, was "Oh my God, they've killed Wellstone!"

After all is said and done, I believe my first instinct is the correct one. BTW, I was around for all the other assassinations. My instincts on all of those were also, in my book, accurate. Part of that time, I voted republican. All of those convenient killings turned me into a democrat for life, even though I have never officially changed my party affiliation. It isn't necessary in LA anyway, so I don't. I still get all sorts of literature from the pugs so I can see what they are doing, and I love telling them I'm voting democrat when they call me. Got a recorded call from Bush asking me to vote for Bobby Jindal. That was a real laugh.

As far as I'm concerned, there are just too damned many convenient deaths with that bunch. Coincidence my ass! Common sense will serve if you let it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
latebloomer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 08:13 PM
Response to Reply #33
43. That was my first thought too
"They killed him!"
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-04 09:28 AM
Response to Reply #43
60. Me, too.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
librechik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 08:23 PM
Response to Reply #33
45. me too n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
plaguepuppy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 11:48 PM
Response to Reply #45
54. Awfully convenient for certain parties
Luck does seem to smile on this bunch more than most - and frowns severely at their enemies:

http://www.bushbodycount.com/voices/thelist.php
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Loren645 Donating Member (516 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-04 12:38 AM
Response to Reply #45
57. Same here, in fact it's a direct quote.
I don't understand why so many people demand hard
proof of shady murders...

Um, they tend to be off the record.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Eric J in MN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 06:58 PM
Response to Original message
37. The author doesn't even provide a date when Wellstone supposedly said that
Edited on Wed Dec-31-03 07:00 PM by Eric J in MN
No date.

No name of anyone who heard Wellstone said it.

Just a declaration that Wellstone said it.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
aeon flux Donating Member (333 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 07:11 PM
Response to Original message
38. Did Wellstone have a death wish?

The BFEE has a reputaition for political assassination. Wellstone was well aware of this. Cheney himself has just made a thinly-veiled death threat to his face, and yet Wellstone still chooses to fly around in small aircraft? How can anyone be so stupid?

-----------

"You can criticize me, but don't criticize my children and don't criticize my daughters-in-law and don't criticize my husband, or you're dead."

- Barbara Bush (live interview on Larry King).
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Piperay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 07:17 PM
Response to Original message
39. It was no "accident" Wellstone
was murdered by the bushies, I have no doubts about that!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TrogL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 09:30 PM
Response to Reply #39
47. OK. How?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dflprincess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 09:39 PM
Response to Original message
48. Wellstone was a thorn in the Bush* administration's side
He was the only senator up for reelection who voted against the IWR. After doing that, he came up in the polls, and was ahead of Coleman beyond what the margin of error would be. Had he lived, he may well have become the very vocal leader of the opposition - whether he was reelected or not. Paul really connected with people, he told the truth and may have been seen as a threat for 2004.

The systematic smearing of the pilots began (at least in the local papers) once it became clear the weather excuse wouldn't work. Buried in one of these articles was the following paragraph. This was published in the Minneapolis Star Tribune Feb 23, 2003

http://www.startribune.com/stories/1752/3668854.html
<snip>
Steve Thornton, the air traffic controller who handled the first weather briefing and listened to a recording of the second briefing after the crash, told investigators he was concerned that someone was putting pressure on the pilot of Wellstone's plane to make the flight. Thornton told investigators he believed the pilot was "more stressed and apprehensive about the flight" during the second briefing, which was given by another controller.
<end snip>

Both Paul and Sheila were nervous fliers, they would not have been the ones putting pressure on the pilot.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
librechik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-04 12:32 AM
Response to Reply #48
56. thanks for the link, princess
"more "unknown" info, but with a better source than the article I posted.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
xxqqqzme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 11:21 PM
Response to Original message
50. Wellstone was the only
Edited on Wed Dec-31-03 11:21 PM by rozf
campaign ever 2 receive a contribution from me (B4 Dean) and I live in California!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Loren645 Donating Member (516 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-03 11:37 PM
Response to Reply #50
53. I donated too.
And I don't live in Minnesota.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-04 09:34 AM
Response to Original message
61. The bottom line is that there is no corroboration of this quote
For whatever reason, that is the case.

As such, this quote cannot be put into the "likely to have been said" column.

But I still believe Wellstone was assassinated...no matter whether this in particular was said or not.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
markus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-04 10:04 AM
Response to Original message
62. Remember: Ted Kennedy almost boarded that plane with him
eom
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
name not needed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-04 10:24 AM
Response to Reply #62
63. PNAC would have loved that
Murdering a Kennedy
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Thu Dec 26th 2024, 10:37 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC