The "only way" -- Boycott Hewlett Packard Products --- bring jobs back

[cthrumatrix]

WASHINGTON (AP)--Worried about possible government reaction to the movement of U.S. technology jobs overseas, leading American computer companies are defending recent shifts in employment to Asia and elsewhere as necessary for future profits and warning policy makers against restrictions.

``There is no job that is America's God-given right anymore,'' said Carly Fiorina, chief executive for Hewlett-Packard Co. ``We have to compete for jobs.''

In a report released Wednesday, the companies said government efforts to preserve American jobs through limits on overseas trade would backfire and ``could lead to retaliation from our trading partners and even an all-out trade war.''

``Countries that resort to protectionism end up hampering innovation and crippling their industries, which leads to lower economic growth and ultimately higher unemployment,'' said the Washington-based Computer Systems Policy Project, whose member companies include Intel Corp., IBM, Dell Inc. and Hewlett-Packard.

MORE....................

http://www.ajc.com/business/content/business/ap/ap_story.html/Financial/AP.V7430.AP-Technology-Jobs.html

We have a "god given right" to "not buy" HP products

[TreasonousBastard]

1. Problem is...

try to find something to buy that's NOT outsourced.

[Gin]

2. is canon outsourced? I buy canon products.

gin

[gbwarming]

13. Well, Canon is a Japanese company...

http://www.canon.com/about/library/canon_factbook.pdf

Lots of R&D in Japan, manufacturing in Taiwan, Korea, Malaysia, Thailand, Singapore and China.

I seriously doubt you can buy a consumer printer, camera, scanner, etc made in the US - :shrug:

[TreasonousBastard]

19. Which brings up something I was thinking of...

as I posted that.

Canon, Epson, etc. are Japanese companies, so buying from them is straight up buying from furriners.

For anyone who cares about these issues, is that somehow better or worse than buying from an "American" company that outsources just about everything and has its primary manufacturing in Asia?

Sony, Panasonic, Toyota, Phillips, BMW... have manufacturing plants here to be closer to the market, although they buy parts from all over the world. And Ford Crown Vics are assembled in Canada.

Just what is an "American" company? Does it make any difference any more?

In all cases, profits come home, while jobs can be anywhere. Do we buy from a Japanese or Korean company that assembles in Thailand, or an American company that assembles in China? Do we follow the profits, or the jobs?

Do we have any choice in the matter?

Not new questions by any means, but rarely addressed sensibly. Neither politicans nor economists have kept up with the new "comparative advantage" and the incredibly easy and rapid flow of capital and the means of production.

[Sapphocrat]

4. Here's a good start...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=993779

[screembloodymurder]

16. Problem is:

Their tech support doesn't know up from down. I just bought an HP all-in-one that has destroyed my system. Their support, in India, doesn't have a clue. Didn't even know there was a critical update for my product and wouldn't believe me even after I told them where to look. Their software wrote to a section of my registry that was off limits, and I no longer have acess to any, ANY! transfer devices. Cheaper ain't always better!

[lcordero]

3. "we" have to compete for jobs?

She's an oligarch, she doesn't compete for shit.
http://news.com.com/2010-1071_3-855883.html

[K8-EEE]

8. What Does That Mean...COMPETE?

We have to compete with Chinese workers making $1 an hour?? Even THEY can't compete with Bangledesh workers. This whole thing is so out of control. Instead of exporting the advantages of the American Middle Class -- we are losing our own.

[FloridaPat]

5. Add to the list: Time -Warner, MetLife, Ibm, HOME Depot,

Miscrosoft, GE. Tons more too.

[K8-EEE]

10. Kraft Foods and Walmart Too!

I am really trying hard to support local biz. I go to Costco about once a month -- but Costco is a decent company. I have been AMAZED by the small companies I found once I looked, and how hard those people struggle.

If we don't support our community businesses, we will all be big box wage slaves!

[jmowreader]

18. The thing I'm trying to figure out

Last night I was packing out some lumber and reading the labels thereon.

Most of it was American-grown, but all of my 2x4s are not (most are Canadian, some are Swedish, and there was one bunk of Lithuanian lumber) and all of my 1x stock--1x4s, 1x6s and so on--that's not either oak or poplar comes from Sweden.

It is so bad that the only lumber you can be assured isn't coming from overseas is Southern yellow pine, and that's only because it grows exclusively in the states that formed the Confederacy. (They tried planting it in other places. It refuses to grow in other places.)

Lumber is one of the products I'd never have imagined would come in from overseas. It is a bulky, cheap item--three thousand dollars worth of Swedish lumber require exactly the same number of cubic feet on the ship as a $38,000 Saab. But due to this country's dumb-ass idea of allowing timber companies to own the forest, we now have the highest lumber costs in the world.

You will almost never hear me advocate tax breaks for multinationals, but this country would be so much better off if we eliminated property tax on land used for timber harvesting, so long as the tax savings were passed directly to the consumer in the form of lower lumber prices.

The lurking freepers are by now thinking, "aha! We've converted jmowreader to the cause, and with any luck he'll bring that guy OldSoldier along with him." Sorry, folks, no can do; my penis works. Anyway! We can't use the arguments we throw up against China when discussing the lumber trade. Sweden has great pay and benefits for its workers. It has stringent labor and industrial pollution laws. Everything works against Sweden except for two things: the Swedish government owns the forest land, and the Swedish lumber-processing-equipment industry is the most refined in the world, which means their personnel costs in the mills are kept as low as practical through the extensive use of automation. Scaninge Timber isn't paying taxes on its land, it's not paying to build roads through that land or to maintain those roads, it's not paying to have it surveyed--at least not directly; taxes paid on every board fund this stuff. And Swedish spruce is still the cheapest you can get--so cheap that you can load a ship with it in Sweden, sail for five days to America, unload at Wilmington, drive it to Fayetteville, and undercut the guy sawing lumber in Sampson County.

Admittedly, this is the sole instance where a high-cost-labor market undercuts a low-cost one. (In forest products, labor cost is a paradox. In places where the labor is expensive, land is basically free and the trees are plentiful. The cheap labor lands have two kinds of trees--ones that produce ultra high end wood, like teak, and ones that aren't worth the time to harvest.) I'm not going to bullshit you: we have a lot of foreign-made products.

[rman]

23. Miscrosoft, Intel, AMD

etc etc

[Desperadoe]

6. I don't buy HP

and I don't buy Dell and I don't buy Gateway or any other crap that these companies make. My computers are built by me with my pissed-off, Bush-hating, Liberal hands. That's my God-given right!! Screw those Repuke companies, their computers are nothing but shit anyway.

If you can't build your own then buy one that is built by a local shop or builder. You will get a better computer and much better service and you won't be contributing to pigs like Carley.

It's true that most of the components are built in China or Taiwan but that's beyond my control.

[Cleita]

7. I already decided to never buy Hewlett-Packard or

Compaq ever again because of their shitty product and crappy support. This only reinforces my resolve.

[DrWeird]

9. Hmm

If HP suffers financially won't they just shut down more american jobs so they can outsource more to foreign countries?

In my town most of the high paying jobs come from the HP plant.

[Cleita]

11. I think your jobs are on the way out regardless.

If they have outsourced all their support people to India and other Asian countries, other jobs I'm sure will follow unless our government puts up stiff tariffs and licensing restrictions for those companies who set up their plants in foreign countries.

[DrWeird]

12. Yeah probably.

Capitalism's a bitch.

[birdbrain]

14. "We have to compete for jobs" - including the CEO?

Betcha she'd change her tune if her CEO job was open to competition from India.

[guitar man]

15. CEO Outsourcing

Now there's an idea:)

[newyawker99]

24. Hi birdbrain!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[Deja Q]

17. But her paycheck and bottom line is her god given right?!.

She wants tax cuts, tax loopholes, and no taxes, wants the american government to defend her sorry butt, and yet jobs for Americans aren't a right anymore?!

She's full of it, the f***ing little *****. x(

I hope her job isn't excluded in her "no job that is America's god given right anymore" ideal. She should be on the streets...

I'd say a lot more, but I think I'm preaching to the choir.

HP makes crap anyway and have lived off their name for some time.

[Selwynn]

20. I work for HP

I am not HP, I work by contract. One thing I can say is this: HP employees overwhelmingly do not like Carly, or the direction of the company. Even in the three+ years I've been on site at HP, I can already give you a long list of how much things have changed for the worse. The "HP Way" is long, long gone.

I don't know about not buying HP products - you do whatever it is you have to do, of course. But if your going to be honest, the you need to boycott every American technology company. It's not as though HP is somehow behaving radically different, or even leading the way - it is a large scale industry trend driven by maximizing profits, as always.

The sooner I can get out of there, and get my life back on track, the better.

[cthrumatrix]

21. Lou Dobbs should have her on and have her explain this garbage and

then take calls from people who think this is BS

[Loonman]

22. Boycotts for HP won't work

They'll lose money and just outsource more.

[Nlighten1]

25. The company I work for is a HP reseller.

I can't stand it anymore either.