Need a little help here...

[thom1102]

I am at my wits end. First, a little history. I am the oldest of 4 boys. I am 33, and my brothers are 32, 31, and 19. My father passed away about 8 years ago, and right before he got sick, he and my mother were having a lot of marital difficulties, and it was unlikely their marriage would have survived. When dad got sick they put aside their differences, and focused on my dad. Since my dad died, she has been wracked with guilt over how she treated him the last few years. That is manifested in how she treats my youngest brother. She lets him get away with everything, and doesn't discipline him at all. My brother is a master manipulator. Whenever he senses he is on the verge of cracking my mother and pushing her over the edge, he gets pensive and says he is sad and thinking about my father. I have traditionally been closest to him, and we have been real buds, and I have tried to use that closeness to point out to him in a supportive way when he is being an ass.

Here is the deal, my mother's health has been poor for the last 15 years. She has beaten breast cancer twice, once before my father died, and then once again a few years ago and last year she was diagnose with 3rd stage peritoneal cancer (related to ovarian cancer). She has been undergoing chemotherapy treatments for the last eight months and my brother has been absolutely useless as far as helping her out. He lives with her, along with the 32yo brother (who has been an absolute saint in all this), and is unable to do even the simplest tasks asked of him (cleaning up after himself in the kitchen, and living room, clean up his dog's shit from the yard, vacuum the pool). The last time I was home, I stayed in his room, because he was out of town and it had airconditioning, and the room stank to high hell, the floor looked like it was growing fur, there was an eighth of an inch of dust over everything, cobwebs in the corner. I had on a number of occasions talked to him about taking the initiative and helping out around the house, and each time without any success. This time I left him a note explaining how bad the condition of his room was, and laid out a plan for him to clean the room. I was careful to stipulate, that I was not trying to tell him what to do, but to point out what needed to be done in order for the room to be clean. My mother found the note and got angry with me for trying to be a parent to him.

Additionally, he is being an asshole. Not really anything that my brothers or I didn't do when we were his age, but the last thing my mother needs to worry about is where is Kevin at 4am, or to have him stumble in drunk at 5am, throwing up, etc. Last time my mother had to go into the hospital, the 32 yo came home to 8 drunk teenagers in the house. He sleeps until 3, 4, 5 pm, gets up, cooks, or goes to the drive thru and doesn't clean up after himself. He spends money frivilously, and then needs money from my mother to pay for his car insurance.

So I am trapped in this situation where, I can't take my brother into the back yard and beat the crap out of him for being an asshole because of my mother's response (besides, he is 6'5", 275 lbs and could totally kick my ass), he won't listen to me when I try to treat him like an adult. I want to create as stress free an environment as I can for my mom, but I don't know how to deal with this out of control kid. Does anybody have any ideas? I know that realistically, he is my mother's problem, and as long as she enables his misbehavior, he will continue to abuse her trust and hospitality (although last time we talked she did say she had just about had it with him). Sorry for going on and on, but I felt the need to rant.

[Habibi]

1. Maybe she needs to kick him out

If, as you say, he's creating havoc rather than helping out, and if your brother and you are doing most of the heavy lifting wrt your mom, there's really no advantage in him being there. Mom, backed up by you and the other bro, need to boot his ass out. If she can't do it herself, perhaps she could be persuaded to grant you or your brother power of attorney, and you could kick him out on her behalf.

Ugh. What an awful situation. I'm so sorry.

Micky

[thom1102]

4. I wish she would...

but she never kicked any of us out even when we were assholes, so we can't even suggest it with out her telling us to mind our own business.

[cincysux]

2. I'm the oldest of 5

brothers we're about a decade older than you guys. Here's my two cents, try to get all 4 of you together and humiliate his ass as only a big brother could. Not knowing your beliefs take this with a grain of salt, tell him your Dad is looking down on him with tears of disappointment in his eyes. Good Luck ......Phil

[thom1102]

3. Ouch...

That would crush him... See the trouble here is, if we were to do that mom would see it as us picking on him, and take his side. It's like we're damned if we do, damned if we don't situation. I like the idea though

[cincysux]

6. Mom

should absolutely be kept in the dark, you and your other brothers have a lot more influence than you probably realize. Tough love really works, for being 6-5 275 he's a baby.

[newyawker99]

14. Hi cincysux!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[GoddessOfGuinness]

5. He's not your problem...

But you should talk with your mother and your brother about this. Tell her your concerns about her health and the need for your brother to grow up. How much longer will she have "just about had it with him?"

You don't mention whether your brother goes to school or has a job. Is it possible that he's depressed and needs counseling? If so, maybe you can convince him to get help. If not, maybe he needs to get out of there and get a life for himself.

There's always the possibility that your brother will continue to leech and your mother will continue enabling him. If that occurs, you'll simply have to accept the path they choose, and try to find something good in it.

[thom1102]

9. Like I said,

He is a master manipulator. He signs up for classes at the local community college (across the street from mom's... btw she works there so he goes for free except for books, that mom pays for) goes for about a week, then stops going and then drops the classes on the last day he can (so that he can still be covered under my mother's health care plan) and he works as a bouncer at a local night club. He is absolutely depressed, but he won't go, and she won't push him. I am pretty resigned to the fact that they may be locked into this enabling relationship. I am just worried about what happens when my mother passes on. Who is Kevin going to latch onto then?

[GoddessOfGuinness]

11. Have you told Kevin that?

It may seem obvious to you; but most 19 year olds I've known live in a pretty self-absorbed world. I don't mean that in an insulting way...it's just a necessary part of the process of growing up...finding yourself, etc. As long as it's possible for him to manipulate your mom, he'll continue to do so.

I suspect that over the next 5 or 6 years, Kevin's going to naturally discover not only what he wants to do with his life and how important his family is, but how important he is to you as well. You can help him along by expressing your feelings about the current situation and your love and concern for him and your mother.

You can't force someone to get therapy, but you can let him know that you'll help him and be supportive of him should he decide to take that route.

It sounds like you all really need a lot of love right now...

Good luck! ~hugggggggggs~

[thom1102]

12. Thanks

:) I am lucky, I have a really great support network (a great partner, and his family is really supportive and loving as well, some wonderful friends, as well as my own very supportive and loving family)

[cherryperry]

7. Yes, a version of the last response:

Call a family intervention. I doubt Mom is going to boot him because of her feelings of guilt. Perhaps you have a clergyperson who would lead the intervention, perhaps a therapist, perhaps your Dad's best friend or a favorite relative? If none are available, then a serious - very hard hittingly serious - family intervention is what I would suggest.

Good luck! I'm glad you let us in on this!

:loveya:

[Robbien]

8. Family of six girls here, with the youngest still at home

Cancer took my Dad eleven years ago. The situation at Mom's house is similiar to yours where little sister takes advantage and worries my Mom all the time because Mom is also an enabler. We sisters have tried talking to little sister, but nothing changes.

Now I just try to give support to mom whenever she gets fed up and needs to vent.

So no help here. Sorry.

[Droopy]

10. I don't know if there's anything you can do

I grew up with a guy who's a lot like your brother. He's thirty now still living at home without a job. He makes no effort to help keep the place up or help his folks out in any way. He takes advantage of them because he knows they will always give him money. They let him get away with it. I think it's totally up to your mom, because I don't see your brother changing any time soon.

About the only thing you can do is lead by example. You and your other brothers should do what you can to help your mom (it sounds like you are already) and maybe he'll get the message that way. That's the way I see. Also, if he's being an asshole, just tell him. My sister and I had no problem pointing out to each other when we were stepping out of line. Today we get along better than ever.

[SOteric]

13. Your mother's health and stress levels do have to be addressed

But you've got to stop treating her like a piece of Isinglass.

Talk to your mother independent of your brother. It may be helpful to have your two other brothers with you to support your position. Tell her in as objective a way as possible that your youngest brother is not advancing into young adulthood the way that he should be, and that your fear is that she's letting herself be manipulated.

Before she can counter, - remind her -and I know this will be hard for you, but she's not unaware of her possible futures, - remind her that she may not be around forever, and she may not be in any condition to care for and support him if she is. He's got to stand on his own two feet.

Each of the three of the eldest brothers need to assure your mother, in non-confrontational, even and non-accusatory tones, that your brother could be moving forward with his life and contributing more to his own upkeep.

Then suggest to her a plan of action. Make it positive and simple to start with. (For example, give your brother the single option to pursue education and a different school, or to find a job. Then support and assist him in that choice).

Try to make her feel included in the decisions rather than usurped by your 'better judgement.' No one likes to feel they've been manipulated, used and lied to. And no one likes to feel their judgement about their children sucks ass.

If you really want to succeed y'all need to think long and hard about what message you're really sending your mother, and exercise the best possible care in crafting your language.