Viewing the body before a funeral

[lazarus]

Is it just me, or this the creepiest ritual we go through? I remember when my son died, certain members of my family tried to encourage us to have a "viewing".

I responded that, if they really wanted to see dead baby, head on down to the morgue and get their jollies there, but don't use my son for that purpose.

This strikes me as being ghoulish. What's the purpose? To remember the person laying in a coffin with a bunch of makeup on? I remember my son's two months of life. A viewing would have overwritten a lot of that, I fear.

Am I off base here?


Brief edit to explain that all this talk about Reagan's viewing is what dredged this up.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

1. No and some of your southern compatriots have a tradition of taking pics

and mailing them to the family afterwords...my friend got a coffin pic in the mail after her father's funeral from a family friend who thought she might want to have it! Creeped her OUT!

[lazarus]

5. yeah

somehow I missed out on that, for the most part. I just found out an aunt has been doing it for some time, though.

She was one of the ones encouraging me. Ick ick ick.

[CatWoman]

11. er, *ahem*

I have a photo of my father lying in his coffin. It's right in my den. He looks like he's sleeping.

*grinning sheepishly*

However, I agree with you.

I don't want my body put out on display.

[ScreamingMeemie]

8. My husband's family was guilty of this until I straightened MrG out

on the aspects of modern decorum in the Midwest. But we do have a couple of albums from the 70's that I refuse to put up in the bookshelf for those reasons.

[Lars39]

9. Not just photos, anymore....camcorders !!!

:wow: We politely declined our copy.

[TrogL]

15. That's also a European thing

They were thinking about doing a "coffin pic" at my first wife's funeral until they saw the homicidal gleam in my eye.

[Kathleen04]

29. Parts of my family do that too

They're not even from the south (upstate NY)!

I just can't handle that--to me, after the person is gone, the body is just an empty shell..often times the people don't even look like what you remember them to be, so I'd rather just remember them as they were and refrain from any viewing or open casket funerals.

[Maeve]

43. I can top that--guy I knew took an album of funeral pics to SUMMER CAMP

What a pick-up line--"Wanna see my dead relatives?" :scared:

[Justice]

2. Viewing

I am very sorry that you lost your son after such a short time - I cannot imagine what you have been through.

I do think viewing helps us deal with death in certain instances. It helps say goodbye, particularly if you have not seen the person recently.

I honestly cannot say that viewing a baby is a good idea, and agree with your decision.

Again, I am so sorry.

[lazarus]

3. Thanks

Just to clarify, he died 14 years ago, so it's not a recent thing, but all this talk about Reagan's "viewing" has brought it up again.

And I do appreciate your kindness. :)

[Bunny]

6. I agree with you about viewing a baby.

Maybe a private time for the family to say their goodbyes, but to have a public viewing for a baby would be very unnerving. When my twin nieces were stillborn, there was only a brief funeral service at the cemetary. Seeing the one tiny white coffin, which contained both their little bodies, was too much for me. I can't imagine what a viewing would have been like.

My condolences on your loss, lazarus.

[markses]

4. There are as many different death rituals

as there are cultures, so there is no one answer for your question. Growing up Catholic, I'm completely at ease with the viewing. Think of these things as strategies for coping - there is no one right way, just a series of strategies. Most of these strategies end up being ritualized and inserted into cultures to the point where they seem normal, or "right" (or, from your persepctive, "wrong"), but they are still only strategies: how do you hack this experience. Because they have been formalized, though, people can then enter the new experience of grief into a generalized pattern which, I suppose, makes the shock and singularity of the event of death easier to live through and with. So, the open viewing is no more liable to produce bad effects than a completely anaonymous state-cremation - they are different strategies. However, because many people have been taught to deal with death through the cultural form of the open viewing, it may help those people socialized in that way to get through the shock of it.

[Lars39]

7. My condolances for your loss, lazarus.

:hug: I personally have to agree with you, although I know some folks are comforted by having a viewing.

[ScreamingMeemie]

10. I think it is up to the family. Funerals are for the living, not the dead.

My grandmother was comforted by "being" with my grandpa for the time before the funeral, hence the viewing. My father in law we shipped off to the crematorium because his son's, and himself, wanted it that way.

By all means, I believe lazarus that you did the right thing.

Laura

[johnnie]

12. Maybe sometimes it's ok

I had a friend when we were in our early 20's and he "accidentally" took most of his head off at a party. His mother (I'm sure she was a little out of it) made the decision to have an open casket to show us what drugs and that crap can do to you. It was a little strange...although they did an ok job putting him back together.
I tend to not go to viewings. I agree with you that it is a little far out. I have asked not to be.

[NMDemDist2]

13. i agree it's a ghoulish ritual eom

[TreasonousBastard]

14. I would agree with you about the baby...

since that is already extremely difficult to deal with, and a viewing would serve no purpose.

With adults, though, it is often a way for many to say one last goodbye, and to pay their respects. The funeral itself is often a private ceremony, and many who can't, or won't, attend the funeral can stop by at the viewing, wake, or whatever and share their condolences with the family and loved ones without the formality of the funeral ceremonies.

Death is one of the few things we all have in common, and every culture has come up with ways to mitigate the pain of it. If one feels somehow wierded out or offended by a viewing, OK, but many of us are comforted by it, and don't find it ghoulish in the least.

On edit:

I won't be viewing Reagan. The only reason I could think of for that would be to make sure he's really dead, and THAT wouold be ghoulish.

[theivoryqueen]

16. er - sorry - missed point

[MarianJack]

17. 2 Points lazarus, 1 political and 1 Personal.

I don't think that reagan's casket should be open. I lost an uncle and an aunt to Alzheimer's and they looked awful at the end. reagan was no longer politically relevent or a public figure. Let his family preserve his dignity. The man has died, rest in peace and as Robert Ludlum says at the end of "The Gemini Contenders", one of my favorites of his, certain struggles end, certain struggles continue. The wisdom is in choosing which.

Secondly, as a parent of a wonderful 4 yoar old son, I know the treasure you lost. Please accept my condolences. I think that the loss of a child must be nearly unbearable and it's probably something that's always there. At least that's how I feel after the loss of my little sister in '96. You have my sympathy, affection and rsppect for your honesty and courage and dignity. May GOD bless you and mend your heart.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

18. Dude, they're not even viewing his body!

They're viewing his Coffin covered with a flag! Who's to even say he's IN there!?
Duckie

[Kenneth ken]

19. you are correct

as far as I'm concerned. I hate that aspect of funerals. I never do the viewing, nor do I do the walk past the casket for a last look at the deceased at the end of the euology/memorial service. (I don't know what that's called, but have encountered it at some funerals.)

I prefer my memories of the people as living, and would rather not have them corrupted with memories of them as dead non-people.

[Shakespeare]

20. Attitudes on death and dying between cultures never fails to fascinate me.

I'm not disagreeing with you at all--this thread simply reminded me of the radical differences cultures have in their attitudes about death, especially between eastern and western cultures.

Buddhists in the crowd may want to join in the discussion for fun--and talk about differences in the way we think of the body left behind.

[MallRat]

21. I agree.

I'm certainly not going to pass judgment on any other tradition- I guess you're only comfortable with what you're accustomed to.

Jewish tradition dictates a closed casket at the funeral. The first time I attended a funeral with an open casket (I was well in my 20's when this happened), I really didn't quite know what to make of it.

I mean, what do you say to the family? "Oh, he looks so peaceful?" or, "they did a nice job with him?"

:shrug:

-MR

[lazarus]

22. I've heard both

At my grandfather's funeral, I remember hearing women in the back of the room discussing various details of the undertaker's makeup job.

[lazarus]

23. A blanket thank you

I want to thank all of you who have expressed condolences in this thread. Rather than try to do a reply to each one of you, I thought it best to just do one big one.

I was under the impression that Reagan's viewing was of the actual body, though. Is that wrong?

[Shakespeare]

24. NOT viewing the body, just the closed casket.

I'm sure that was explicitly dictated by Nancy, who worked so hard over the last 10 years to shield him from the public eye after he began to deteriorate.

[Bertha Venation]

25. I don't know. My mother's was closed-casket

but I've been to two "viewings." I didn't want to look but was told it was disrespectful to the family NOT to look. So I looked.

My grandmother took pictures of bodies in their coffins.

I think Reagan's casket is closed, BTW.

[Red State Rebel]

44. My Mom threatened to haunt us if we opened it and she didn't look good.

It's been pretty customary in our family to have it open until the graveside service. I don't know if it's a regional thing or what. I've always heard it was easier for people to accept the finality if they actually viewed the body.

With my mom, we had it closed because she had lost so much weight from the cancer and we had a beautiful picture of her on a stand up near the coffin. She was always particular about her appearance and knowing what she had was terminal, she told us if we had it open and she didn't look good she would come back to haunt us. She was 46 when she died. We had it open for a family only viewing and decided immediately to close it. When we came back in the room after they had closed it, it was like the air had cleared - we knew we had done the right thing for her.

This past year my cousin's was open and I was glad because I hadn't seen her in some years. My grandmother's was open also, and yes, I took the opportunity to lean over and kiss her cheek.

I haven't seen anyone take pictures, but I know someone took them of my dad when he died (he was 32)I saw the pictures in a box at my grandmothers.

[RoyGBiv]

26. To each his own...

As others have said, different cultures, and different sub-cultures withing those cultures, have different rituals surrounding death. Remember that these rituals are for the living, not the dead because the dead don't care. They help people cope, and whatever has been ingrained in us that allows us to cope is what we do.

I can't think of any death ritual that isn't "ghoulish" to someone.

On a personal note, I am quite sure that viewing my grandmother's body was how I began truly dealing with her death. We were very close, and the last time I had seen her, she had been smiling and waving to me as she was wheeled into an ICU ward. When the doctor walked out and told us "she's gone" there was a subconscious sense if disbelief. How? She was smiling. I didn't even cry for two days, yet I was very close to my grandmother. She'd been one of my parents growing up.

When I saw her body, it became real. The denial phase ended, in other words, and I went forward with my grief. My daughter, just four at the time, was there with me and help put it all in perspective for me. She stood on a stool and made sure Grandma's gown was not wrinkled, that the collar was properly smoothed. She made sure none of her hairs were out of place. She said it was a shame we couldn't see her eyes because they were such a pretty blue.

[Sean Reynolds]

27. My grandma use to tell us stories.......

About how they always had the body in the living room of her house for 24 straight hours (up until the funeral. In fact for the night before the funeral the women would stay up and watch over the body while the men would get drunk in the kitchen. :)

[ArmchairActivist]

28. I used to think I agreed with you...

... at least about the 'ghoulish' part. But as I slowly approach that point in life where the funerals I attend outnumber the weddings, I've found viewings to be very, helpful, I guess is the word. Helpful in making things concrete and real, helpful in saying a final goodbye, helpful in coming to terms with my own grief.

And believe me, I clearly remember my dad's cancer-wracked corpse, lying in his bed at home, but that's one memory out of a billion and far, far from the clearest or most-often visited.

Certainly nothing 'ghoulish' about it and very definitely no 'jollies' have ever been involved at any funeral I've been to.

All that said, I don't really know about viewing an infant. Somehow it doesn't seem like that would be 'helpful' in the same sense I was just talking about.

In the end, people make the decisions that are best for them and deal with life (and death) in the best way they know how, and that's how it should be.

-AA

[kskiska]

30. Have I got a book for you.

Wisconsin Death Trip
by Michael Lesy

It's a very dark collection of photographs with text and news clippings from the last part of the 19th century. Many photos are of children in their coffins, as was the custom. There are news stories of everything from barn burnings to insanity.

(snip)

Wisconsin Death Trip was Michael Lesy's Ph.D. thesis (dissertation). He was inspired when he saw the Van Schaick photographs that Paul Vanderbilt, of the Wisconsin State Historical Society, had found and of which he selected 3,000 for display. But fear not, for Wisconsin Death Trip does not read like a tome from academia. In fact, the publisher eschews page numbers, but it is the type of book that one might consider meandering from page to page, year to year. One can find interesting news nuggets on every page, and these news clips produce a tapestry of life from 1885 to 1899, when this nation experienced a Depression. It was a time when Mr. Lesy felt our nation experienced a profound cultural shift from a rural society to an urban, industrialized society; some may well argue that there are other events and eras that had as much if not a more profound impact, such as the Civil War; the 1929, or "Great," Depression; Vietnam and the 1960's; or even Watergate. But that is a debate that historians inevitably will engage in.

http://bookideas.com/reviews/index.cfm?fuseaction=displayReview&id=43

[HEyHEY]

31. I wouldn't say it's goulish

I mean our culture is way less open about death compared to others. I mean look at the middle east. Many times when someone is killed by violence, they parade the body through the streets.

[arwalden]

32. I Agree... It's Ghoulish.

And when I refused to go to my grandfather's viewing, many family members were deeply insulted.

The old man's death was not unexpected. I didn't need to see his lifeless body to make it any more real or acceptable to me. I had come to terms with his (immanent) death BEFORE his actual death. I preferred to remember him alive and smiling rather than pale and waxy.

In my final arrangements directives, I've specified NO VIEWING. People will just have to trust that I really did die without having to SEE my corpse. (I suppose whenever they scatter my ashes, they will have little choice but to see the ashes... but that's part of scattering I guess.)

-- Allen

P.S. Now what I REALLY REALLY REALLY cannot understand are the photos of LIVING FAMILY MEMBERS standing next to and around the open casket. What the FUCK?? What am I missing?

Why would anyone want to take pictures of themselves STANDING NEXT TO the open casket of their deceased loved on? WHY?

Are you supposed to smile? (Say CHEESE!) That would make you look happy... and the corpse is at a disadvantage... so perhaps we had better just look sad.

NO Thanks!

[supernova]

33. Family and close friends yes; others no

My family, yes and people who are well known to me. I have no problems viewing in the casket. I knew them in life and that final goodbye is very important.

And no, the casket scene is not what is upermost in my mind when I think of those that have died. I think of them as they were; things they said; times we shared, the expressions on their faces.

I do find taking pics of the body to be morbid however. I don't know whoever thought that was a good idea. :shrug:

It presents and air of finality about it all. If I don't see the body, I'm kind of haunted by them. A part of my brain expects to see them any minute.

And too, it's just a body. It's part of the circle of life. I don't know why we feel a need to hide them away. Contrast this to the Mexican Day of the Dead or India where the family prepares the body for the funeral pyre.

Having said that I don't think it serves any purpose if the body is very small, or the person was too ill or perhaps died horrifically.

Sorry for your lost Lazarus. :hug:

[greatauntoftriplets]

34. What I hate is when they say....

"Oh, so-and-so looks SOOO natural."

[kskiska]

35. I had an very deaf, old great aunt

who came to my grandmother's funeral. She went up and looked at the body and said, "Oh, doesn't Loretta look nice!" Then she turned to someone and said very loudly, "It doesn't look a bit like her!!!"

[SpaceCatMeetsMars]

37. At a friend's father's funeral, the make-up job was HORRIBLE,

but of course nobody knows what to say, so everybody said how natural he looked and then later all commented to each other, "OMG, didn't you think they did a terrible job on him!"

Most people where I'm from do the viewing, but I've been to a couple of memorial services where the person has already been cremated and is not there and that seems more dignified to me.

[belladonna]

36. It's a big thing here in the South

And I, for one, have always been put off by it. When I lost my fiance, his mother took photos at the funeral. Forget the fact that it should have been a closed casket and he didn't even look like the same person, she just had to have those photos. Which was fine, if that's what she needed to do to get through. What wasn't fine was being subjected to those pictures when they came in my mail a few weeks later.

I think it's just morbid and for myself, I would much rather remember him as he was when he was alive and smiling and happy. My mother does the same thing with all our relatives who've died, and even takes pictures of their gravesites and keeps them. To each his own, I suppose, but bleh... just not for me.

[Darth_Kitten]

38. Some people need that kind of closure....

at my grandmother's funeral last year, there was a viewing, but I chose not to see her. (I actually saw her after she died in the nursing home so that was enough for me)

It's what you are comfortable with.

[Wapsie B]

39. I've got an uncle

who used to take casket and grave pics. As for me, I subscribe to the Klingon point of view. It's just a carcass now. Do with it what you will. I don't want to remember someone by how I saw them laying in a box.

[arwalden]

40. Group Family Photos Around The Open Casket (WTF?????!!!!!????!!!)

Now what I REALLY REALLY REALLY cannot understand are the photos of LIVING FAMILY MEMBERS standing next to and around the open casket. What the FUCK?? What am I missing?

Why would anyone want to take pictures of themselves STANDING NEXT TO the open casket of their deceased loved on? WHY?

Are you supposed to smile? (Say CHEESE!) That would make you look happy... and the corpse is at a disadvantage... so perhaps we had better just look sad.

NO Thanks!

[KG]

41. a viewed my dad in the coffin. creeped me out.

no more veiwing for me. don't intend to see my mom that way. don't want my last memory of anybody i love to be of them in a coffin.

[geniph]

42. Want to hear a really gross one?

Some years back, I went to the funeral for the daughter of a friend. This was a three-year-old girl who'd died by violence - she'd been battered to death by her mother's boyfriend. Her father (my friend) was all pissed off that his funeral and memorial service didn't have the body - her mother had the body at HER memorial service - because he wanted an open casket so we could all see what had happened to his little girl.

Um. Ugh. It's beyond horrible that that happened. I do NOT need to witness it.

Funerals shouldn't have bodies. I think the whole idea of burial is kind of bizarre, too.