To whomever called the police on me:

[Ladyhawk]

I understand you mean well, but you have to understand that their only recourse would be to take me back to Nurse Ratchet, you know, the psychiatrist who thinks Depression is caused by bitterness and that it is all my fault.

That place is terrible. There are people there who act as if they've been lobotomized, wandering the halls. Some of them open the door to your room and look at you. It's creepy. Some of them are even incontinent and have to wear diapers.

There's another set that are completely out of control, screaming at the top of their lungs (sometimes understandably) about their need for a smoke, or one of their meds. The nurses are slow and can't be bothered.

Basically, it's a warehouse for crazy people. The patients scare me. The staff scares me. The psychiatrist scares me.

There's this 8 X 11 notice that tells about all the activities and therapies of the day. It is a total joke. They feed you and give you your meds and that is all. You're "lucky" if you get to see Nurse Ratchet for five minutes.

I required a week to recover from being in that place. Right after I managed to lie my way out, I went into panic mode. I couldn't sleep or eat for twenty-four hours. I couldn't stop panicking as I finally processed everything I'd been through at that place. While there, you can't do that, or they'll use the reaction to make you stay there longer. It was awful.

The police came *this close* to dragging me there. this morning. I tried to hide the cuts on my wrist, but they saw them anyway. I had another huge panic attack the other day and for the first time in five years I cut myself to end it. Physical pain releases endorphins that can actually make you feel so very much better. I realize this is maladaptive, but the meds weren't working. I was beside myself.

Of course, the police had the basic lecture: nothing is worth killing yourself over. Which is complete bullshit. Anyone who's been there knows that it isn't a matter of a single incident. It's a matter of pain being too great to cope with.

This may help you to understand. Maybe not. http://www.metanoia.org/suicide/

My point is: because I have county-based Medi-Cal, if someone decides to lock me up on a 51/50, I go back to that hell hole, which makes me worse. Please don't do that to me.

[liberalnurse]

1. What's your point?

Thanks for the clarification. You may need to surrender to your limitations and be open to feedback from concerned friends. It's a two way street.

[Ladyhawk]

10. I really don't feel a need to be receptive to a place

that my counselor and doctor both feel is a horrible warehouse for the mentally ill.

For the record, that's what I think too. I've been there three times and each time it took me over a week just to recover from having been there.

[liberalnurse]

20. You were in a space that required intervention for your own safety.

It may not of been the Hilton but you are here today to voice your objections.

[BurtWorm]

2. Ladyhawk, for what it's worth, I am sending you so much white light!

I know you're a "bright" and don't believe in that shit, but it's just my way of saying I'm thinking of you and rooting for you to come through.

It's hard to see someone calling the cops on you as well-meaning. I suppose they were. But, Jesus Christ!

[liberalnurse]

5. Thats a very nice gift......

I hope it comes thru....but she needs to be receptive too.

[Cappurr]

3. A couple of people asked about you yesterday....

We were concerned. I shared what I could with you the other day. All I know is if you are determined to kill yourself, you will do it. But that is really the cowards way out and I don't think you are a coward. You need help and you need it badly. There MUST be a decent treatment center in your area where you can sign yourself in.

We all want to see you make it Ladyhawke.

[Ladyhawk]

13. cowardice???

Why am I even bothering with you people. You obviously have no idea.

http://www.metanoia.org/suicide/

I'm finished with this board. Right now, I can't take being judged on top of what I'm already feeling. Walk a mile in my shoes before judging.

You may say, "Oh, but I've been depressed."

Look, everyone is different. You have no idea what I have been through and where the line exists beyond which I can no longer cope.

Going to the Internet is stupid. You get all kinds.

But I'm so lonely I felt I had no other choice.

Perhaps you are the coward for not facing up the the reality of suicide, what it really means, what a hard choice it is for the one who chooses it, what they are feeling, how they are torn, how they want to stay but the pain is just too great.

This is my last post on this forum.

Some of you are very kind, but throwing my feelings on a group of strangers was a stupid and dangerous move, especially considering the cops that showed up at my door.

I'm through with Internet forums and discussion groups. I'm through with you.

[Name removed]

19. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

22. Please read this before you go

This is exactly what I meant.

Some people respond to tough love..others don't.

When you tell us things people will resort to what they know or what worked for someone else in the past and it MAY NOT COMMUNICATE TO YOU.
I think it is good if you are done posting this on the web ONLY BECAUSE to do so makes it possible for someone to say something to you that makes it worse rather than better.


I only hope that you go get yourself the ear that hears you, can comfort you and gets you back on the right track, medically, psychologically and spiritually.

I wish you the best.

[BurtWorm]

25. That she's looking at the Web site she's posted is a good sign.

Good luck, Ladyhawk.

[Fridays Child]

4. It sounds like a nightmare, Ladyhawk, and you shouldn't be in there.

It also sounds like you know that your other coping strategies aren't working very well, either. But life without the terrible pain you're experiencing is worth living. Please opt for life and please keep trying. If I can help, I'm only a PM away.

[GOPFighter]

6. If the meds weren't working...

...you need new meds. There are so many different ones now available it's sometimes hard to know what will work and what don't Trial and Error sort of. Please try to get your doctor to change your meds.

I've never known pain or depression so bad I would consider suicide. I have trouble imagining how bad you must feel. All I can offer is my advice (above) and my encouragement. I feel nothing but contempt for the stingy, self-centered, selfish conservatives who want to cut, cut, cut, funds to help those with mental illnesses.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

7. LadyHawk..if you are reaching out, you are doing it in the wrong venue

I posted on your thread because I wanted you to know people support you.

By the same token, there are NON hospital oriented support groups for people experiencing depression and there are help lines where you can speak to an actual human being.

If you are going to post that you are suicidal on an internet bulletin board, then people are going to react whether appropriately or inappropriately...that is the risk you take when you tell us what is going on.

Whomever placed the call did so because their conscience told them doing something was better than doing nothing.

You put people in that precarious position by posting about taking your life on this board.

This board is NOT A VIABLE substitute for the help you need.

If you are really considering ending it all you should call a crisis center hotline and speak to a trained professional...one who actually has experience with walking one past those feelings.

Anything you post here runs the risk of either helping you OR MAKING WHATEVER YOUR INCIDENT IS WORSE>

YOU NEED TO KNOW THAT.

[BurtWorm]

8. You make an excellent point as usual NSMA.

:toast:

[liberalnurse]

12. Yes, and I also think it is what she may of wanted too.

It was her way of asking for help, covertly. Maybe this is her way of saying thank you too? It's a thought anyways....

[supernova]

16. Agreed.

Great points, NSMA.

Sorry, Ladyhawk. While I'm glad you are still among the living, I don't believe there are no viable professional options for you in your area. This is what you seem to be saying. If the psychiatrist you don't want to see at present is so bad, I can't believe you can't ask for a referral to someone more compatible. Have you fully explored WHY you dislike this Doc so much? Perhaps its the truth you hate. Tough nut, that.

Just take the time to think about it is all I'm saying.

Though we wish you well, and send all good prayer/vibes your way, it's no substitute for the professional help you need.

Much positive energy your way, Ladyhawk. :grouphug:

[Skinner]

9. Ladyhawk

I am very sorry that you are upset.

People were very concerned about you. If something had happened to you, I know that I and many other people would not be able to forgive ourselves.

We did everything in our power to help you that night. I do not regret it.

I am glad that you are okay.

Skinner
DU Admin

[liberalnurse]

14. Skinner did the absolute correct action.

When the scenario is place into ones laps, choices are to be made and the greater good is always the correct choice. It was a call for help, make no mistake about that.

[AlienGirl]

26. I agree...

When it seems like someone is close to suicide, there's nothing an onlooker *can* do but contact whomever can get there to help. Sometimes it's unnecessary, but sometimes it saves someone's life--and the alternative can be to do nothing and later find out that a person has died.

Tucker

[cally]

21. Thanks

Most of us are not trained professionals and we don't know how to reach out to someone in need. But that is life and I value every human being who chooses to reach out and show our love and compassion for each other. Ladyhawk, I wish I knew you personally so I could offer help. I know you are a compassionate, caring and valuable person. You need to talk to someone, in person, about what's going on.

I respect Skinner for reaching out to those who have more knowledge than most of the rest of us. We are a community and we need to ask for help when we need it. I'm sorry that you felt the folks who responded were not appropriate but I'm glad that folks care and ask for help.

[clar]

11. Ladyhawk,

You sound incredibly understanding. I agree, worried as someone may have been, calling the police is not the answer. I know that runs contrary to what most folks think.

I hope you're hanging in there. I know I don't know you, but I want you to know I'm pulling for you.

[jafap]

15. try to remember what the Doormouse said

Actually that does not work - for many years I thought that song said "keep your head" until a Deadhead ruined it for me by making me see that it is "feed your head". I would stay away from the drugs and try to learn some relaxation techniques.
That's too easy for me to say since the fact that I have always been crazy has kept me from going insane. I would have killed myself years ago, really, but that line from "St. Elmo's Fire" always stopped me. The one where Rob Lowe says: "You ever think of killing yourself" and the girl replies: "Not while I am still a virgin."
So please do not kill yourself while I am still a virgin. If you think about it again just tell yourself - "I have to have sex with Jafap first" and you will realize, like every other woman on the planet, that you are not that desperate.

[searchingforlight]

17. I posted once before and am asking again.

Have you had your blood sugar tested. You could be suffering from hypoglycemia and your panic attacks, depression and suicidal tendencies. Most mental health professionals never think of this and it is a very important component of the diagnosis.

[damnraddem]

18. But others may need the police to be called.

Attempted suicide often is the cliched 'call for help.' For others, no way out appears at the moment other than suicide; but if they have a later moment, other ways do appear.

Suicide prevention should not, however, send uniformed police -- it's a prevention issue, not a law-enforcement issue. The police are not as well trained to deal with this -- as exemplified by their saying things like 'nothing is worth killing yourself over.'

And the rump left of the mental health system is disgusting. Unlike Nurse Ratchet, it's more often no help, the wrong help, or the right help but not enough of it. You seem to be someplace where they actually institutionalize -- many places don't anymore. It's not that they've found a better way, it's that they've given up the pretense of having a way to deal with the costs. Nurse Ratchet has been laid off.

So, encourage people to call the local suicide hot line -- not the people who call the police, those who are thinking of suicide. And by all means, give links like you did.

Keep up the fight, and good luck!

[liberalnurse]

24. Lets not split hairs here....

Intervention was required and to gain access the police were the obvious choice. If a friend or family member does not bring someone into ER for example then the police are the next step. Suicide hotlines are only a connection, and they too utilize the police if deemed necessary and potientially lethal. The same results would occurr.

[prolesunited]

28. If you look at the original thread

Many people offered encouragement and the hot line number was posted several times, once by Skinner. The thread showed increasing despair and Ladyhawk did not seem to be responding to any pleas.

Although calling the police may seem harsh, it was absolutely the right thing to do. I'm sorry to hear the department did not handle it well. In some cities, they would have brought an outside professional into the situation, which probably would have resulted in a better outcome.

In a neighboring town, a teen-ager started posting suicidal thoughts and intentions on a game message board. Sickly enough, his peers encouraged him and he took a bottle of pills and was actually committing suicide while online. The administrator of that board took the situation seriously enough to contact the town's police department. When they arrived, the boy already was unconscious and they said he would not have survived if he did not require immediate medical attention.

I recall reading the boy's tearful father was VERY grateful to the message board operator for intervening and saving his child's life. And I'm once the teen recovers from his depression, he will be thankful as well.

[DemExpat]

23. Ladyhawk....to be honest with you.....

If you don't take your recovery in your own hands......NOW........
you will be the victim of yourself and of the reactions to your messages you send out on the Internet....

I was once in a similar space as you are in now.....a nightmare....but it was not until I took matters into my very own hands that I started to climb out. All the good intentions and offered advice and help did nothing for me until I decided to fight for myself.

I can only hope that you find that fire somewhere within yourself soon to seek the needed ASSISTANCE and guidance.....

I wish you all the very best.

Life is GOOD on the other side, with its sorrows and joys, and not to be missed!!!!!!!!!

:loveya:

DemEx

[Skinner]

27. Ladyhawk, please read this.

You have put me and the members of this message board in a very difficult situation, one which we are not qualified to deal with. So I have called a crisis hotline myself to find out the appropriate respose.

If you are still experiencing problems, you need to call your health care professional, or you need to call a crisis hotline yourself. Here is a phone number where they can help you out: 1-800-784-2433

Unfortunately, I have to lock this thread because the members of this message board are not qualified to help you. You need to find someone who can.

Skinner
DU Admin

[Hubert Flottz]

29. Ladyhawk I read your thread the other night, but did not reply!

I'm very sorry for you and I know exactly what you mean by not wanting to go back there! My mom spent most of her adult life in one of those hospitals! Generally she got so bad off she wanted to go there! I visited Mom there all the time I was growing up and I have seen every horror you described for myself on those visits!

The most shocking thing for me was when Reaganomics turned most of those poor people out on the streets in the eighties, including my Mom! She was lucky she had my sisters and me to keep an eye on her when they turned her out!

I was very worried about you, because when people talk about hurting themselves I believe them! I hope you are taking all your meddies like they told you to, because I know when my Mom would slip around and get off of her meds, because she'd think she didn't need it, she ALWAYS ended up back in the hospital!

Finally after years of trial and error she is on meds that keep her on the right track and she now does fine! If you go to the doctor and tell them your meds aren't working they can help you! The meds they have now days, seem to be far better than those they had 45 years ago and she hasn't had a bad time for over 15 years now! She lives next door to my sister and still mostly takes care of herself at 75!

If you'd ask her today if she is glad she failed to take her own life so many times over the years, I know the answer would be yes! She loves her 6 greatgrandkids and they love her!

If you can find noone else to chat with when you feel bad you come right back to us and I know the great people here will care! BTW I never called the police on you dear, but I do wish you'd do me a favor and call your docks and your family and friends when you're having a bad time! The doctors nowdays do everything they can to help you without putting you in the hospital! If your doctor doesn't regulate your meds and help you, you need to go to another doctor! BTW it's up to you to take your meds that they tell you to take, 'without skipping'!

I send you a great big HUG and a good luck:

Hubert